# Turface What?



## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

I had a quick question about Turface. I just ordered 2 bags of the turface pro league. Is this the corrct stuff. B/c ive heard ether this or the MVP is the same as the old Soilmaster Select.

Also I want to try getting a carpet of dwarf hairgrass going. How much should I start with? 125G

Thanks guys


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## maknwar (Jul 16, 2007)

Turface pro league is the right stuff.

The hair grass spreads rather quickly depending on your setup, and how much you need depends on what areas you want to cover.

I would find someone selling it either locally or a bunch of it from a member in the classifieds on a plant forum.


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

thanks man. Also If anyone if having trouble finding this stuff order it from lesco.com. I have also seen concern that you have to create a account for business use. No worries just make one, its free. Just make up a company name and have it shipped to your local store. Two bags ran me 35 bucks shipped.

So Ill take some pics to show of the new substrate when it comes it. Any ideas the best way to change the substrate. Its play sand now. And if at all possible any ideas how to do it with fish in the tank. It will take forever to catch my 10 guys.


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## Piranha Guru (Nov 24, 2005)

2 bags will be plenty...the stuff is pretty light weight and moves around easily with water currents and big fish. You will have to rinse the heck out of it if you are leaving your fish in there. I always started with an empty tank...filled and drained, filled and drained, filled and drained and usually used a mechanical filter in between the last changings overnight. You can't do that so you will have to prerinse. The easiest way to suck the sand out is with a gravel vac...you may need to keep the tank filling with a hose while you get it all.


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

ehhh...is it lighter than SMS? Should I be worried? My 10 caribe make quite a stir when its feeding time. I might be able to cancel the order if this is gonna be a problem.


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## Piranha Guru (Nov 24, 2005)

SeedlessOne said:


> ehhh...is it lighter than SMS? Should I be worried? My 10 caribe make quite a stir when its feeding time. I might be able to cancel the order if this is gonna be a problem.


My rhom and geryi were always making divots in their Soilmaster tanks...unless you have it carpeted with plants, it will get stirred all up. It only gets messy if you have a build up of detritus in it though.


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

So do you think I should just go with the flow and stick with it. I am looking into starting a carpet of dwarf hair grass. I was under the impression this will help my planted tank vs. using play sand....correct? Plus Im over the look the sand has.


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## Piranha Guru (Nov 24, 2005)

SeedlessOne said:


> So do you think I should just go with the flow and stick with it. I am looking into starting a carpet of dwarf hair grass. I was under the impression this will help my planted tank vs. using play sand....correct? Plus Im over the look the sand has.


Hair grass will do better in sand IMO...the finer the substrate the better in that case.

I got a pretty good carpet of chain sword in my Rhom's Soilmaster tank until the algae got out of control...my classroom water is not the best for growing plants and I had a slippery pair of convicts tearing up the tank. Dwarf sag works too, but takes a long time to fill in without CO2. My 40g irritans tank with Soilmaster has an okay carpet going.


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

I had trouble growing hairgrass in a lighter substrate.
Any time I needed to take some crap out of the carpet, it would start comming out, and 
look messy.
I would go with Flourite with hairgrass. I had a carpet of hairgrass with it, and you had to TUG to get a chunk out lol


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

geez...good replies from two very top sources. Well it looks like the Turface is already on its way. I really want to change from the sand. It just looks like crap 10 mins after you clean. So if I am going to stick with the turface should I scrap the carpet idea? Or could it still possibly work? From what I gathered it could be done......but good luck


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

what about mixing it with Flourite black? Would this help matters?


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

You con't have to scrap hairgrass at all

You can grow it fine. It's just I had some problems when I got a bunch of detritus stuck in the mat is all. Eh, it's good to re-plant from time to time anyway

Flourite black is heavier, so it will find it's way to the bottom of the tank, and stay there. So there really isn't a good reason to use it unless you go with just the Flourite.

You will be fine, just maybe try to establish the mat of hairgrass before introducing your piranhas to the tank. Well, if you have that option lol


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## maknwar (Jul 16, 2007)

There are other alternitives to hairgrass, that are similar.

How about dwarf sag?


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

maknwar said:


> There are other alternitives to hairgrass, that are similar.
> 
> How about dwarf sag?


Believe it or not, if left to grow in a mat, the dwarf sag gets TALL. About 14-18"

I would try E. tenellus 'micro' or something similar to that.


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

Well I need something that will do okay in low light. I plan up bumping my lighting to 1.5wpg of t5. I have seen some tanks with crazy nice carpets of dwarf hair grass with the same light. With no Co2. I really need to stop being a noob and stop be intimidated with Co2. I also want something with the grass look...micro swords. hair grass, etc. Is there anything that will suit me better than hair grass that meets my specs? I know I'm a picky one.

Well hell while you are here. I have a small algae problem. I have green slime algae on some of my plants. What causes this? How to rid? Also diatoms. All my non planted tanks never have a problem. I've tried everything and I can't seem to get rid of it. Tank gets 10 hours of light, no sunlight, and good water parms. What are some good game plans?

Thanks a million times!!


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

SeedlessOne said:


> Well I need something that will do okay in low light. I plan up bumping my lighting to 1.5wpg of t5. I have seen some tanks with crazy nice carpets of dwarf hair grass with the same light. With no Co2. I really need to some being a noob and stop be intimidated with Co2. I also want something with the grass look...micro swords. hair grass, etc. Is there anything that will suit me better than hair grass that meets my specs? I know I'm a picky one.
> 
> Well hell while you are here. I have a small algae problem. I have green slime algae on some of my plants. What causes this? How to rid? Also diatoms. All my non planted tanks never have a problem. I've tried everything and I can't seem to get rid of it. Tank gets 10 hours of light, no sunlight, and good water parms. What are some good game plans?
> 
> Thanks a million times!!


I think it's all in what you want to see in your tank. I like the hairgrass. I like Micro swords and E. tenellus too. And if the tank is run well, they should all grow fine. So get what you want for sure.

Does the green slime smell? If it does, keep removing it, keep up with your water changes, and make sure your filters are always clear. It's a type of bacteria. Also, if you have plants in there already, make sure the nitrates are present in the water. When it reaches 0 or close to it, there sometimes is a problem. (NO3 10-25ppm)
If you remove the brown and green stuff when you see it, and have good maintenence every week, there _should be _no reason why it wouldn't go away in a few weeks.


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

Well my local Lescos is acting like a giant douche...so, it looks like no Turface for me. Even though I paid for it they said no deal. Anyway, how about 3m Colorquartz as a substrate. Will Turface and Colorquartz grow plants equally as well? One better than the other? Thanks


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## maknwar (Jul 16, 2007)

A local plant guy uses it and grows plants just fine in it. Its kinda expensive though.


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

maknwar said:


> A local plant guy uses it and grows plants just fine in it. Its kinda expensive though.


 For about 110bucks I can fill my 125g and have some left over. Whatcha think?


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## maknwar (Jul 16, 2007)

I would do it. If you want I can post some info on my local site and see what the guy says about it (pros, cons, etc). Just let me know.


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

maknwar said:


> I would do it. If you want I can post some info on my local site and see what the guy says about it (pros, cons, etc). Just let me know.


yeah that would be great. I really want a good plant substrate. Ask if he has used SMS or turface also. Thanks a ton you are always a huge help.

Hey I know you stated before that one day you plan to redo your tank with diy t5 lighting. how many wpg where you planning on shooting for. I was thinking of getting 2x80 t5 retrofit kit. Then I could always add another bulb for right under 2wpg. Do you know if the workhorse ballast can run 3x80 bulbs?


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## maknwar (Jul 16, 2007)

I posted the question and got this response



> Matt grows some pretty impressive plants in the stuff. Look in the gallery, several of the plant tank shots are colorquartz.
> 
> It is inert so you'll have to fertilze the water column or substrate if you wish.
> 
> The plus side is that there is no better looking media, in my opinion, for a planted tank than the black color quartz. It makes the plants colors pop plus the price is very affordable in comparison to some of the other "planted tank" substrate media out there.


So I would go for it, and there is a lot of people that use soilmaster and turface. Most complaints about it is the weight of the stuff. I guess is is light and would not be too great for pygos? Blacklabel used the stuff, you might want to pm him and see what he says.

As far as the lights, I dont want to get a lot of it so I will probably will stick to 1-1.5 wpg. Sunlight supply has a kick ass retro kit they are selling http://www.aquacave.com/60-tek-2-t5-retro-...upply-2177.html which comes with a workhorse ballast and optional lengths. I was thinking about 2 36" kits. Plus you could always add more under the canopy with these.

The workhorse 7 can only run 2x80, check out the site: http://www.fulham.com/


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

Man thanks for the info. I am for sure going to use Colorquartz. Now I am stuck....do I wanna use 100% colorquartz or layer it under a inch of topsoil. So many choices. .....


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