# catfish in pirahna tank



## CuzIsaidSo (Oct 13, 2009)

I just got 10 nickel sized pirahna and a pleco last week. I want to get a catfish to clean up all the scraps at the bottom of the tank from feeding. What catfish would be best? One that won't get more than 8 to 10 inches.


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

it will probably become a meal for your natts at some point, but people have had decent luck with raphael and pictus cats as long as they provided a spot for them to hide out during the day.


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## Plowboy (Apr 9, 2008)

How about breeding cherry shrimp? You can keep adding the little guys as they're needed. They eat scraps and algae, and there good for the piranha if they do ever get ate.

I've heard basically the same thing as Joe. You can get one, but no matter what kind it is, I wouldnt get your hopes up.


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## FretsOnFire00 (Sep 10, 2009)

I need to replace my two common plecos, to much sh*t, too much frowth. I was looking at those raphaels and the pictus those looks pretty dam tough, the raphaels were completely spined and i like how they top off at 5-7 inches, any other bottom feeders tha would work? I'm looking for tank floor and algae cleaners with as small of a bio load as possible.


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

plecos, for the most part, are terrible as "cleaner" fish, they don't eat much algae and they produce more waste than they clean up, i really don't even know where they got that reputation. for cleaning up extra bits of food, the cats i mentioned will do a great job although i think the raphael cats are a bit better at hiding during the day. as far as algae clean up, oto cats are tiny but a few of them in the tank will keep it looking clean.


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## FEEFA (Nov 19, 2007)

Otto cats are awesome lil cleaners, wish I could keep some in my 150gal


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

i'm gonna get some otocinclus vestitus for my 75 after i get it planted, they do an amazing job of keeping tanks algae free


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## FretsOnFire00 (Sep 10, 2009)

Won't the piranhas eat them? And about the cherry shrimp, how big do they get and how good of cleaners are they. Also might they possibly infest my tank?


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

they'll probably get picked off over time, but the otos are tiny and they don't move around much, they stay stuck to things a lot sort of like plecos do.

shrimp would be good, but if you are gonna go that route, i would suggest setting up a breeding colony in a ten gallon or something so that you can keep stocking them in your tank, otherwise the price will really add up. they stay really small but they are bright red and they just wander constantly, so they are an easy target.


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## FretsOnFire00 (Sep 10, 2009)

Now that i got that 10 gallon setup with is a good possibility, how much are they and how hard are they to breed? Do they need to be fed more than what the piranhas leave? Would that eat algae and waste food? These guys seem like the best route, I'm imagining a tank with a bunch of littel shrimp runnin around would look really cool. In the big scheme would the shrimp or the ottos be better cleaners? And how much waste do they make? Im guessing they'd be a hell of alot cleaner than plecos with teh same amount of waste managment.


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## Plowboy (Apr 9, 2008)

The ottos would probably be better at the algea part of it, but the shrimp would probably have them on the scavenging end of it. The waste off some ottos or a ton of shrimp would be negligible. You deffinitely need to set up the breeding colony though.

and they only get about 1-2"


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

you can find cherry shrimp on the aquatic plant forums for a buck apiece with free shipping if you order 20 or more, but if you buy them at your lfs, they will probably want a few bucks apiece. you don't have to feed them much in their own tank, but if they are in with your piranhas, they shouldn't need to be fed at all except for the occasional treat (unless there are tons of them in there), they should be able to eat just fine off the algae and leftover food from your p's.

the otos and shrimp will perform pretty much the same job in keeping algae off of plants and the substrate, but the otos can also keep your glass clean.

oh, and cherry shrimp breed like crazy as long as you keep excellent water quality


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## FretsOnFire00 (Sep 10, 2009)

So for my 55g right now i've got 7 piranhas 3 scissortails and 2, 6 inch plecos. If i Sell the plecos And got lets say 10 ottos and like 40 shrimp. Would that have less of a bio load and be better at cleaning than my two plecos? I'm thinkin ill put 30 shrimp in teh tank and leave the other 10 to breed or something.

I'm just thinkin more fish that look better > two large boring brown hiding sh*t machines

Oh and are there any cheaper better shrimp or are cherries teh best.

Sorry for all teh questions guys I just really don't wanna waste money


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

you wouldn't need 10 otos in a 55 if you are just using them as a clean up crew... try to keep three in there. for shrimp, you could start with 40 and put 10 in the tank and 30 for your breeding colony, if you want to keep a constant supply, its smarter to put the larger number in the 10 gallon to get your colony started. cherrys are probably the best option.


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## FretsOnFire00 (Sep 10, 2009)

I thought ottos only grew up to 2 inches, would 3 have enough cleaning power, and what do you think about the bio load on the tank? Better than teh plecos? That's really what I'm shooting for. I'm tryign to get down on waste so that I can keep more piranhas in a smaller tank.


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## Plowboy (Apr 9, 2008)

There are different color forms like blue and yellow, i think. I'm sure they're quite a bit more money since the cherries have been around far longer.

Ill see if I cant find a list quick.

I guess there isnt blue. Woulda swore I saw some though.


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

the plecos are sh*t machines, so yeah, a few small otos and some cherry shrimp will produce far less waste... you don't need that many otos because they do such a good job at cleaning up algae that if you have a ton in there, they will run out of food quick. i once had a bad algae outbreak in my 75 and i bought three otos because thats all the store had, 3 days later, my tank was spotless. you can put as many in there as you want, i'm just saying that you wouldn't NEED to have 10 in there to keep things clean.

if you put too many otos in there, they will run out of algae to eat and will be constantly on the move looking for food, which would make them much easier targets


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## FretsOnFire00 (Sep 10, 2009)

Cool 3 sounds good then. Wish there was a cheaper solution than $1 a shrimp since chances are high they will be eaten. If I get a good breeding colony going I guess they'll be fine. I'm guessing ottos arnt really at risk, those spines are pretty nasty. Anyone every kept cherry shrimp? Just curious how many they had in what size of a tank and how effective they were. I also just learned if i get too much of an outbreak a lil bit of copper in the tank would end them all







I live close to a nice lfs do you think they'd trade me some ottos and mabey some cherry shrimp for my plecos?


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

you don't have to worry about an "outbreak", if you find that you have too many, net some out and sell them... a good breeding colony in a ten gallon can actually put a decent amount of cash in your pocket each month considering the minimal effort involved


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## Plowboy (Apr 9, 2008)

I don't know if they would give you much trade in for some plecos, but its always worth a shot.

I doubt like hell that you would have to worry about an outbreak with 7 little red belly pigs in the tank. Especially if there isn't much cover for them. Here, Winkyee had a ton in a tank. He doesnt say much about them in that thread, but he has some great pics of them.


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## FretsOnFire00 (Sep 10, 2009)

One thing I have trouble with is how do you know when bottom feeders like plecos, corys, shrimp, or ottos are fed enough? I'm leanin towards 5 ottos for teh extra cleaning power and i want to make sure that they are all well fed.


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## FretsOnFire00 (Sep 10, 2009)

Hmm i'm thinkin about savin up for these Crystal Red Shrimp instead, not to mention if i'm going to breed and sell this will make me some more $$$. They look WAY better too.


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

FretsOnFire00 said:


> One thing I have trouble with is how do you know when bottom feeders like plecos, corys, shrimp, or ottos are fed enough? I'm leanin towards 5 ottos for teh extra cleaning power and i want to make sure that they are all well fed.


throw some zucchini or cucumber slices in once or twice a week... that'll provide plenty of food and it won't mess your water up


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## Soul Assassin (Nov 21, 2006)

Like joe mentioned earlier I think three is a better #, they really do a great job and you can always get more. One way of checking if they are getting enough food is to look at their bellies when they are on the glass, a nicely round belly is a good sign, concave not a good sign. Although your Ps could *clean* both your otos and shrimp in no time, lol.


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

FretsOnFire00 said:


> Hmm i'm thinkin about savin up for these Crystal Red Shrimp instead, not to mention if i'm going to breed and sell this will make me some more $$. They look WAY better too.


here's a link to a guy selling those cheap, plus there's free shipping...

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/swap-n-s...e-shipping.html


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## T-wag (May 21, 2009)

wat cleaner fish would live best with my compressus....hes lonely he wants a friend and doesnt like goldfish or guppies very much


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

the same fish that i mentioned earlier would work the "best", but even the "best" tankmate for a piranha is only guaranteed to live as long as it takes you to drop it into your tank, anything beyond that is just luck of the draw.


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## alyt (Oct 16, 2009)

I have a spotted raph cat in with my 6 rbp's...I have seen him move from his nook in a piece of drift wood....ohhh like 5 times...and 2 of those were because I was moving the drift wood haha

I suppose he is moving at night though or i'm sure he'd be dead from starvation if he didn't...I have a gourami as a bit of a clean up crew...wasn't meant to be that but hey it just kinda happened


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## philbert (Mar 8, 2007)

how hard is it to breed shrimp?


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

as long as you keep excellent water quality, it's really easy... you just throw em in a tank and they do the rest.


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## FretsOnFire00 (Sep 10, 2009)

Hmm i'm worried about buying otos to replace my plecos, like you said they might become instant dinner. I'm hoping they're small enough and fast enough to stay outa the way. I have 3 about 2 inch long little silver fish in my tank, they were there before I got the piranhas. I expected them to be gone within in days but 5 months later I guess they're part of the clan.


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## mose (Oct 12, 2009)

FYI my 2-3'' reds (when i bought them) were tearing apart a pleco that someone at the pet store had left in their tank. and it was definitely bigger.

the pleco is just lucky i bought them within hours of them being shipped to the pet store.


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