# Guppies Suck!



## wartooth (May 11, 2007)

Guppies are small and they hide in your decor and you probably won't be there to witness the feeding. I had to remove my large plants to give my reds a chance at getting them. Same goes for Tetras. The only time I was able to witness a live feeing was with two small minnows. I finally got fed up and bought a dozen goldfish which are in quarantine with salt and PraziPro.

Besides goldfish, I was wonder what other live feeders most pygo owners use. I'm talking about ones that you can actually witness. And yes, I enjoy watching. I think it's exciting and facinating.


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## Rice & Beanz (Oct 30, 2006)

Sometimes i use convicts and platys


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## Dav657 (May 23, 2007)

Crayfish. I dont know if its bad my p's seem to love it. Also never get rosie reds as feeders. Too small to see anything.


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## taylorhedrich (Mar 2, 2005)

If that's all you are in the hobby for, then get rid of your piranhas. These fish are not meant for your entertainment, so as a responsible pet keeper, you need to do some research and find foods that are BEST for your fish. Feeders are borderline worthless to them and offer very little nutrition.
~Taylor~


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## wartooth (May 11, 2007)

taylorhedrich said:


> If that's all you are in the hobby for, then get rid of your piranhas. These fish are not meant for your entertainment, so as a responsible pet keeper, you need to do some research and find foods that are BEST for your fish. Feeders are borderline worthless to them and offer very little nutrition.
> ~Taylor~


No Taylor, that is not all I'm in the hobby for, but I'm not going to back down and say that I don't enjoy watching them feed. I enjoy every aspect of the hobby, especially putting together the tank and gear. Not everyone is going to enjoy their hobby exactly the way you want them to, so there's no point in getting touchy. Not that I'm obligated to justify myself to you, but I care a great deal for my pygos.


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## ILLdose13 (Nov 25, 2004)

i buy ps for the entertainment..i want to make sure that they are aggressive and rip apart anything i feed to them..fish are fish and i eat fish..

yeah i know alot of you disagree but people have their own reasons why they buy piranhas..if i just wanted a fish i would have gotten a goldfish..lol..

i know i speak for alot of people..most people buy them because of their reputation of being crazy fish..

just by saying all this doesnt mean i treat my ps bad..i still do my best to keep them healthy and do whatever it takes to make them happy..


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## wartooth (May 11, 2007)

ILLdose13 said:


> i buy ps for the entertainment..i want to make sure that they are aggressive and rip apart anything i feed to them..fish are fish and i eat fish..
> 
> yeah i know alot of you disagree but people have their own reasons why they buy piranhas..if i just wanted a fish i would have gotten a goldfish..lol..
> 
> ...


Well put, brother.


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## blackmaskelongatus (May 25, 2007)

taylorhedrich said:


> If that's all you are in the hobby for, then get rid of your piranhas. These fish are not meant for your entertainment, so as a responsible pet keeper, you need to do some research and find foods that are BEST for your fish. Feeders are borderline worthless to them and offer very little nutrition.
> ~Taylor~


i am with you i never feed my piranhas feeder i just feed my black mask elong a tiger barb yesterday it's his first one he looked at me as he held the barb in his mouth it seemed to he waz saying to me what am i supost to do with this! i just left him to eat it he just killed it and left it alone! he likes to eat everything but not live!


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## kilicar (Nov 3, 2006)

taylorhedrich said:


> If that's all you are in the hobby for, then get rid of your piranhas. These fish are not meant for your entertainment, so as a responsible pet keeper, you need to do some research and find foods that are BEST for your fish. Feeders are borderline worthless to them and offer very little nutrition.
> ~Taylor~


i dont agree with "These fish are not meant for your entertainment" lol i love the entertainment i get from my fish but its cruel to do something to them that u KNOW is going to hurt them. guppies are great. the rare feeder is ok i do it once every blue moon but i hope that at the least least least you do keep them for awhile and treat for any parasites they might have....although that still doesnt mean they are safe......i agree with the rest of what you said taylor lol


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## ILLdose13 (Nov 25, 2004)

yeh feeders are just once in a while..just like for us humans..we eat stuff not good for us once in while like going to burger king or mcdonalds..but i know alot of you go everyday!..haha


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## wartooth (May 11, 2007)

ILLdose13 said:


> yeh feeders are just once in a while..just like for us humans..we eat stuff not good for us once in while like going to burger king or mcdonalds..but i know alot of you go everyday!..haha


Yeah, I enjoy feeding them raw shrimp, scallops, and tilapia. But after tending to my guppy tank for a few weeks, then placing them into the main tank, only to have them hide in my plants forever, was a real let down. Pardon me for venting.

I avoid McDonalds & Burger King for environmental reasons, but damn when someone brings some fries or hashed browns to the office, I swear it is sooooo tempting. Evil.


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

My .02$

I have fairly large schools of guppies and cherry shrimp in my compressus tank. 
He only eats them when there are too many in the tank for them to hide, or they get too adventurous.

He thins the crowd just enough to keep their numbers at bay. I think it is like my own little eco-system in there. 
I, personally, love it like that. He gets his share of live food, (for him to chase or whatever) and he gets the bulk of fresh fish fillets, shrimp, and/or scallops.

Perfect IMO


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## nomoneyx (Feb 14, 2007)

I just put three guppies in with my rhom last night. I've had my rhom since April and the guppies are the first live fish I have put into the tank. I thought it was very entertaining seeing the rhom trying to hunt down the guppies through all of my plants. I watched the chase for about an hour before I went to sleep, all three guppies were still alive. Woke up this morning and only 2 guppies were left.


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## wartooth (May 11, 2007)

DiPpY eGgS said:


> My .02$
> 
> I have fairly large schools of guppies and cherry shrimp in my compressus tank.
> He only eats them when there are too many in the tank for them to hide, or they get too adventurous.
> ...


That sounds like a great idea. I might do something similar, but with tetras. The pygos can have some tank mates for a while and if they get too aggressive, they could snack on those instead of each other. Thanks for the tip.


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## Pitbullmike (Feb 14, 2006)

I like feeding mine crawfish to it awesome watching them tear them apart fricking sweet


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## kmart189 (May 24, 2007)

I think I might go to the bait shop tomorrow and be entertained by seeing some crawfish death. Are the crawfish less risky for parasites? or do I need to treat those to?


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## wartooth (May 11, 2007)

kmart189 said:


> I think I might go to the bait shop tomorrow and be entertained by seeing some crawfish death. Are the crawfish less risky for parasites? or do I need to treat those to?


I'd quarantine and treat anything live before feeding to my pygos, at least for a week. Crawfish are bottom feeders, so it would be good to flush out their system of all foreign matter, IMHO.


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## kmart189 (May 24, 2007)

Thanks Wartooth appreciate it. What do you recommend treating them with just salt or should I do more?


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## Trigga (Jul 1, 2006)

taylorhedrich said:


> If that's all you are in the hobby for, then get rid of your piranhas. * These fish are not meant for your entertainment*, so as a responsible pet keeper, you need to do some research and find foods that are BEST for your fish. Feeders are borderline worthless to them and offer very little nutrition.
> ~Taylor~


no disrespect taylor but if they arent entertaining you why keep them? im not sayin feeders are a good or bad thing but theres no point in keeping piranha if your not entertained by them...it shouldnt be a chore...just my 2 cents.

Also in the wild they eat plenty of sick/diseased and LIVE fish. so i mean if you can provide healthy fish clean and proper...try to recreate there natural diet with maybe some angelfish and other native species...its expensive but if you want to watch ur ps kill and want them to be healthy...do what u gotta do.

Also, he is treating the goldfish before they are fed so they will be in better condition. Just make sure that you feed them a quality fish food and they should be pretty healthy and an ok source of food.


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## wartooth (May 11, 2007)

kmart189 said:


> Thanks Wartooth appreciate it. What do you recommend treating them with just salt or should I do more?


No problem. I'm fairly new, but I like to help all I can. Salt is for external parasites and to prevent bacterial infections of external injuries. I'm not sure what kind of external parasites shellfish might have. You can use salt in combination with PraziPro or any other water treatment for internal parasites. Make sure to remove any carbon filters before starting treatment.


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

wartooth said:


> My .02$
> 
> I have fairly large schools of guppies and cherry shrimp in my compressus tank.
> He only eats them when there are too many in the tank for them to hide, or they get too adventurous.
> ...


That sounds like a great idea. I might do something similar, but with tetras. The pygos can have some tank mates for a while and if they get too aggressive, they could snack on those instead of each other. Thanks for the tip.
[/quote]
The next time I do this, Imma go with endlers live bearers instead of regular guppy's. They look good, and they reproduce like crazy.. hey, Great idea


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## CorGravey (Feb 13, 2007)

trry mollies. Quarentine em and fatten em rite up. The orange ones drive my ps CRAZY! the sailfin mollies (orange) are the best feeder i have found so far.


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## joefish219 (Feb 8, 2005)

zebra danioes are the best yes they are small but very quick i watch as the p chase them all over back and forth. it is like a car chase


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## CorGravey (Feb 13, 2007)

Danios are cyprinids and contain grwowth stunting hormones that should not be fed to piranhas


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## wartooth (May 11, 2007)

I've read so many conflicting theories on thiaminase. Some articles casually mention goldfish as being acceptable, some say not at all, and others say once in a while. I've read posts of people feeding nothing but goldfish with no ill effects, and I've read one post that said the whole thiaminase notion was hype. At this point I just make sure the feeders are quarantined and as disease-free as possible regardless of what they are. And of course, I make sure it's the right feeding portion for a quick kill and less suffering for the prey - for all you sensitive people.


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## Aaronic (Apr 22, 2005)

taylorhedrich said:


> If that's all you are in the hobby for, then get rid of your piranhas. These fish are not meant for your entertainment, so as a responsible pet keeper, you need to do some research and find foods that are BEST for your fish. Feeders are borderline worthless to them and offer very little nutrition.
> ~Taylor~


If the fish are not meant for our entertainment, then why do we spend so much money and put so much effort into keeping them? I am entertained just watching them, not neccessarily feeding them live food. But that is also entertaining....


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## boxer (Sep 11, 2003)

Wartooth, if you are feeding your P's guppies and the P's can't even get to the spot, probably upgrade to a feeder of their size if you are trying to watch them feed. I only have 2-3 rosies in my tank because I have 16 babies and the rosies are the same size as the natts. I want my P's to work for their food because swimming up to the top of the tank for their bloodworms isn't much of a workout so imagine a rosie that is faster and more powerful than the baby natts, it will take a couple of them but it is a good workout and teamwork.. i guess lol. I know the bigger the food, the longer the struggle but that's just how things go. Also, you are looking for entertainment and be real, the harder the fight, the more entertaining it is. One of the huge drawbacks besides no nutritional value is the Vitamin B1 Inhibitor that slows/stunts growth on RBPs so don't have too much fun.

Most piranha owners were not fish people I would assume since someone who knew a bit more about fish would know the real nature of piranhas as there are far more aggressive fish out there that are entertaining. Most average joes got their piranha for entertainment like me and wanted to give our Piranha a good life while it keeps us entertained; we can have our occasional fun while still keeping the P's in good shape. Some people just come at people in harsh ways not giving them a chance..


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## cueball (May 24, 2005)

stay away from feeders ive been battleing hole in the head for almost a year since i gave him 30 cons that took him a month to chomp down he never had hole in the head befor that...and i keep my water %100 clean daliy


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## wartooth (May 11, 2007)

boxer said:


> Wartooth, if you are feeding your P's guppies and the P's can't even get to the spot, probably upgrade to a feeder of their size if you are trying to watch them feed. I only have 2-3 rosies in my tank because I have 16 babies and the rosies are the same size as the natts. I want my P's to work for their food because swimming up to the top of the tank for their bloodworms isn't much of a workout so imagine a rosie that is faster and more powerful than the baby natts, it will take a couple of them but it is a good workout and teamwork.. i guess lol. I know the bigger the food, the longer the struggle but that's just how things go. Also, you are looking for entertainment and be real, the harder the fight, the more entertaining it is. One of the huge drawbacks besides no nutritional value is the Vitamin B1 Inhibitor that slows/stunts growth on RBPs so don't have too much fun.
> 
> Most piranha owners were not fish people I would assume since someone who knew a bit more about fish would know the real nature of piranhas as there are far more aggressive fish out there that are entertaining. Most average joes got their piranha for entertainment like me and wanted to give our Piranha a good life while it keeps us entertained; we can have our occasional fun while still keeping the P's in good shape. Some people just come at people in harsh ways not giving them a chance..


Thanks Boxer. I truly appreciate it. I agree that feeders should be occasional. It is very entertaining, but a bit stressful because of the possibility of diseases and/or parasites. I'm already entertained just watching them tear into raw shrimp and other non-live foods.


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## joefish219 (Feb 8, 2005)

CorGrav420 said:


> Danios are cyprinids and contain grwowth stunting hormones that should not be fed to piranhas


danios are yes cyprinids but they do not contain your "grwowth stunting hormones" you speak of. the hormone is unnatural yes some dickfors add it but they can add it to any fish. just have to buy from a quality place and QT them and let illness can be evaluated


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## CorGravey (Feb 13, 2007)

joefish219 said:


> Danios are cyprinids and contain grwowth stunting hormones that should not be fed to piranhas


danios are yes cyprinids but they do not contain your "grwowth stunting hormones" you speak of. the hormone is unnatural yes some dickfors add it but they can add it to any fish. just have to buy from a quality place and QT them and let illness can be evaluated
[/quote]

Actually you are wrong thiaminese is a naturally occuring hormone in fish in the wild. Do some research b4 posting.


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## jestergraphics (May 29, 2007)

cueball said:


> stay away from feeders ive been battleing hole in the head for almost a year since i gave him 30 cons that took him a month to chomp down he never had hole in the head befor that...and i keep my water %100 clean daliy


what did you give him 30 at a one time for?


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## jestergraphics (May 29, 2007)

cueball said:


> stay away from feeders ive been battleing hole in the head for almost a year since i gave him 30 cons that took him a month to chomp down he never had hole in the head befor that...and i keep my water %100 clean daliy


could this have been the problem with your P ? I stumbled upon this while reading about my oscars...its talking about an oscar in this case but seems it could be possibly related to your case...or maybe not I read this and just remembering you mention the hold in your P's head.

The only disease they are particularly vulnerable to is Head and Lateral Line Erosion (HLLE), which use to be called "hole-in-the-head" disease. This looks like cavities or pits on the head and face. It is believed this may be a nutritional deficiency of one or more of: Vitamin C, Vitamin D, calcium, and phosphorus. It is thought to be caused by a poor diet or lack of variety, lack of partial water changes, or over filtration with chemical media such as activated carbon.

*Head and Lateral Line Erosion Disease (HLLD or HLLE)*
Also known as: Lateral Line Erosion (LLE), Lateral Line Disease (LLD), and Hole-in-the-Head Disease

Symptoms: Begins as small pits on the head and face, usually just above the eye. If untreated, these turn into large cavities and then the disease progresses along the lateral line.
Head and Lateral Line Disease is attributed to a nutritional deficiency of one or more of: Vitamin C, Vitamin D, calcium, and phosphorus. Though its cause is not definitively determined, it is thought to be caused by a poor diet or lack of variety, lack of partial water changes, or over filtration with chemical media such as activated carbon.
HLLE has been reversed by one or more of the following treatments:

* Increase frequent water changes.
* Add vitamins to frozen foods.
* Add the addition of flake foods, as they are enriched with vitamins.
* Add greens, either frozen or in leaf form, to the diet.
* Decrease the amount of beef heart as it lacks many critical nutrients.
* Remove activated carbon filtration.

(This disease is often confused with another disease called 'Hexamita', because both these diseases are often seen simultaneously in the same fish. Hexamita is a protozoan disease that attacks the lower intestine. Discus and other large cichlids, especially Oscars, are especially prone to Hexamita.)


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