# serrasalmus spilopleura



## piranhageek (Sep 22, 2003)

Does anyone know how to tell the difference between male and female gold spilopleuras?


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## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

I don't think that there is an accurate method of determining sex&#8230;
Some of the information I have found but not tested with accuracy

* 1.	Same size fish Male is more elliptical, and female is more disk shaped
2.	Male has flat anal fin female has hook on anal fin&#8230; (I observed that true with my spawning golds, but can't verify it true to all spilo's...
3.	Look straight @ the fish of same length (Female is more girthy).*

These are just opinions I used these methods in picking a shoal, but no accurate 100% factual sexing method&#8230; If there is I want to know too&#8230;

The size thing is kind of ludicrous&#8230; Like observing people and saying all fat people are women&#8230; Not true with people and probably not true with fish&#8230;Achieving a shoal of 6 or more with all the above methods of acquiring fish may help&#8230;

GOOD LUCK!!!


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## kouma (Sep 1, 2003)

serrasalmus_collector, can you clarify on the first point a little more.


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## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

*Clarification of the 1st point&#8230;*

Two fish that are basically the same length&#8230;The one that is more elliptical (Shaped like a hot dog) is male, and the one more disk shaped (Round like a pancake) is the female&#8230; 
The 3 methods I use for putting together a shoal&#8230; I get 2 from each category&#8230; These are not verified as fact, just information I found in books and online&#8230; Possibly by sorting male and female from the 3 above categories can increase the probability of having both sex spilo's&#8230;I have had success in breeding spilos&#8230; My fish are undergoing a cold water treatment now, to kind of simulate the winter months&#8230; When I attempt to spawn them again, I will try my best to get photos of the mating, and spawning ritual&#8230; Maybe you guys on the forum may see something that will clearly distinguish male from female&#8230; Right now it seems to be luck of the draw&#8230; I can also add that each time my spilo's spawned it was a big fish and little fish&#8230;If you are fortunate enough to know the age of the fish; overall physical size may be a factor in helping sex the fish, but that too opens another can of parameters&#8230;. {Were the fish fed equally?????}
The only 100% way to tell is to cut the fish open, and then all breeding attempts are ruined&#8230;


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## hastatus (Jan 16, 2003)

> serrasalmus_collector Posted on Sep 22 2003, 08:43 PM
> Clarification of the 1st point&#8230;
> 
> Two fish that are basically the same length&#8230;The one that is more elliptical (Shaped like a hot dog) is male, and the one more disk shaped (Round like a pancake) is the female&#8230;
> ...


There is a grain of truth to the sizes differences based on Bill Braker spawning of S. spilopleura and some semi-professional breeding operations. While it would be difficult to use this as "catch all" guide on determining sex for S. spilopleura, it is about the closest any one is going to get. SC, if you have access to microscope you can view the gonads using fry less than 6 mm SL. This might be useful in separating males from females.


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## kouma (Sep 1, 2003)

Great info thanks big time, I am actually going to print all this info out when going to pick my first Spilo. Do you think I can put 2 5-6" Spilo's in a 36x12x18?? with barely any decoration so it wouldn't limit space for them..its a 35G btw


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## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

> Hastus Posted... "If you have access to microscope you can view the gonads using fry less than 6 mm SL. This might be useful in separating males from females."


Thanks for the info Frank&#8230;. You have helped my breeding experiments more than you could imagine. I do have about 50 fry from my 5th spawn and they are about a quarter inch&#8230; I'm going to go out and get a microscope today and attempt a separation process&#8230; If I can figure out the gonad differences I may be able to separate male and female, and possible provide gold spilo's on a sexed basis&#8230; I won't need all the fish but I'm going to keep some with this sexing process&#8230; Hate to bug you Frank but if there is a link that has these appearances under a microscope I would greatly appreciate that too&#8230; If not maybe I can figure out the dissimilarities&#8230;This new knowledge makes me want to bring my golds out of the cold water&#8230;To *SWAWN AGAIN!!* It would be a great thing for all hobbyists if I could provide a quantity of sexed gold spilos???

I will have to agree with someone else's posting&#8230; But I think you are better than an encyclopedia Frank&#8230;

PS&#8230; I will attempt to get some kind of camera hookup on the microscope and provide pics&#8230;


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## hastatus (Jan 16, 2003)

> Thanks for the info Frank&#8230;. You have helped my breeding experiments more than you could imagine. I do have about 50 fry from my 5th spawn and they are about a quarter inch&#8230; I'm going to go out and get a microscope today and attempt a separation process&#8230; If I can figure out the gonad differences I may be able to separate male and female, and possible provide gold spilo's on a sexed basis&#8230; I won't need all the fish but I'm going to keep some with this sexing process&#8230; Hate to bug you Frank but if there is a link that has these appearances under a microscope I would greatly appreciate that too&#8230; If not maybe I can figure out the dissimilarities&#8230;This new knowledge makes me want to bring my golds out of the cold water&#8230;To SWAWN AGAIN!! It would be a great thing for all hobbyists if I could provide a quantity of sexed gold spilos???
> 
> I will have to agree with someone else's posting&#8230; But I think you are better than an encyclopedia Frank&#8230;
> 
> PS&#8230; I will attempt to get some kind of camera hookup on the microscope and provide pics&#8230;


There are no image links to my knowledge on gonads. But I can tell you in order to examine the fry you will need a well slide and the fish must have the yolk sac absorbed. The gonad sac (along the belly between intestine and air bladder), will appear extended and pebbly on females and the males it will be of small. I will see if I can get some photos to place here.


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