# Piranha?



## thundergolf

LFS had these little guys listed as Pacu. Im pretty sure they are RBP's.
So i bought them. 
What do think?


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## TheCableGuy

Look like p's to me, otherwise you're stuck with half a dozen pacus and will need to upgrade your tank VERY soon!


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## Ja'eh

You got you a bag full of pacus.


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## Guest

Some better pics would help, I can't tell whether they are reds or pacu's, but judging by body shape they are definitely one of the two.


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## Da' Manster!

LFS was right this time..You got some baby Pacus!..


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## Guest

Either way they are river monsters









I didn't see you mention that the lfs labeled them as pacu, they most probably are then (unless the lfs wants to sell more expensive fish for cheaper prices). Look at the bottom jaw, if it has a pronounced fat lip, then you get rbp's. If not, you got yourself a lot of pacu.


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## Johnny_Zanni

Pacu's...


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## Piranha-Freak101

pacus


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## CLUSTER ONE

Congrats on your bag of pacu...


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## Piranha-Freak101

CLUSTER ONE said:


> Congrats on your bag of pacu...












you shouldve taken a pic of them first then buy them after you found out what they were


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## thundergolf

Ill keep an update going but im pretty sure they are p's and not pacus. Unless pacus have an underbite when babies. 
These dime size babies have already taken out 3 guppies in less than 4 hrs. I eventually want to mix with caribe and other pygos.
If they are pacu i will just bring them back and start over.


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## Sylar_92

The overall body shape is a bit long compared to a red belly, also at that size (just generalizing) they should already have a red anal fin from what I've experienced from buying a alot of baby reds from the time I was a toddler til now. LOL how are you going to keep all those pacu ?


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## BRUNER247

A lot of current when they're babies will make em longer than normal. Couple of them look like serras. Probably are rbp. Red belly pacu.


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## sick of chiclids

i am by no means an expert, but looks like your gonna need about a 4,000g tank soon. LOL. sorry man.


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## thundergolf

I guess time will tell, but im still convinced they are p's.
Ive had little p's this small several times and they look just like these little guys (not much bigger than a large feeder guppie at this point). 
They have what appears to be an underbite and are constantly fin nipping the tank mates.
I can't say for sure because ive never seen pacu this small.


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## BRUNER247

Post another pic


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## Genesis8

They do look like pacus but some clearer shots would be nice.


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## Sylar_92

Aright here are some pics of my reds 2 months ago, The smallest one is the size of a penny and the largest one is the size of a quater. As you can see even at this size the half inch one even has a red anal fin, which are present in all red belly babies. Like I said before, I not trying to mean or not take your word but unless your newly obtained fish are less than half there should be a visable red anal fin. If they are indeed piranhas then the only piranhas they look like are baby serras or albino reds.


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## Guest

Albino reds? Where have you seen them?

Red belly pacu also develop a red anal fin, so using that to distinguish between them isn't useful.

Look at how the back arches with the dorsal fin, and the dorsal fins placement a long the arch. Pacus have a steeper arch and the dorsal fin will be directly with a steep drop, whilst an RBP will have a smooth curve and not much of a drop. Also the slits on the side of the mouth, pacu have very visible slits with the lips forming a beak shape.


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## Sylar_92

Traveller said:


> Albino reds? Where have you seen them?
> 
> Red belly pacu also develop a red anal fin, so using that to distinguish between them isn't useful.
> 
> Look at how the back arches with the dorsal fin, and the dorsal fins placement a long the arch. Pacus have a steeper arch and the dorsal fin will be directly with a steep drop, whilst an RBP will have a smooth curve and not much of a drop. Also the slits on the side of the mouth, pacu have very visible slits with the lips forming a beak shape.


Im not diagreeing with you that they could be reds but, Im just saying IMO they look like pacu to me. As for the albino red bellies I was guessing, but I know they exist somewhere. They could be piranha but like my pics of my reds, clearer ones would be better to confirm wheither they are pacus or reds. Also using the red anal feature can be useful in certain situations, In the case of red belly pacus, all the smaller piranhas which I have bought while developing the red anal fin already had developed a distictive lower jaw. Also not all red pacus develope a red anal fin, I seen alot of those around lately in the LPS. And the statement about the steep drop isnt always true as well, I'll buy one this weekend and post the pic of it up.


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## thundergolf

Sylar_92 said:


> Aright here are some pics of my reds 2 months ago, The smallest one is the size of a penny and the largest one is the size of a quater. As you can see even at this size the half inch one even has a red anal fin, which are present in all red belly babies. Like I said before, I not trying to mean or not take your word but unless your newly obtained fish are less than half there should be a visable red anal fin. If they are indeed piranhas then the only piranhas they look like are baby serras or albino reds.


Skylar thinks for the post!! Your reds in this photo appear to be more mature than the little ones i have.
That brings up another question how small does the lfs get pacu in. They are not bread in aquariums like rbp's. I have never seen
pacu this small in the lfs. These are just under 1/2 inch.


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## Sylar_92

thundergolf said:


> Aright here are some pics of my reds 2 months ago, The smallest one is the size of a penny and the largest one is the size of a quater. As you can see even at this size the half inch one even has a red anal fin, which are present in all red belly babies. Like I said before, I not trying to mean or not take your word but unless your newly obtained fish are less than half there should be a visable red anal fin. If they are indeed piranhas then the only piranhas they look like are baby serras or albino reds.


Skylar thinks for the post!! Your reds in this photo appear to be more mature than the little ones i have.
That brings up another question how small does the lfs get pacu in. They are not bread in aquariums like rbp's. I have never seen
pacu this small in the lfs. These are just under 1/2 inch.
[/quote]

The smallest pacu I've seen through out the years ranged from 1/2 a inch - 2 inches. I recently saw small ones at BigAls which they used to feed the red bellies they had and at Dragon aquarium, If you like I can go buy one and take a pic of to show you, it no problem for as the pacu are fairly cheap and the stores are about 15 minutes from my house. But I guess size ranges depending on the area where you live. I buy one baby pacu and one baby red belly to use a comparison pic. I'll post it back here soon. Take care man, If your fish do turn out to be baby reds thats cool, but if they are pacus your going to need a big aquarium LOL. These pics below are not the fish that I bought but Im just up using these pics to ask wheither your fish look like the first 2 or do your fish look like the one in the second pic?


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## Guest

I wasn't denying your ID, just how you arrived at it because the colour of the anal fin developing is a variable. 
If you could post some new clear pics thundergolf then everyone on here can ID them properly.


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## thundergolf

Thinks guys i appreciate the comments.

I have been trying to take good pics for a couple of days, but just cant get any better pics with my phone. Ill try to get pics with my wifes camera tonight.

Sylar the first photo is definately pacu.

The lfs had two tanks side beside one with about 2-3" piranha and one with about 2-3" pacu. I believe they had these little guys in the pacu tank just to hold them until they made more room for them. They couldnt put them in the tank with the P's because they would have become a meal. However the two ladies working at the time had no clue what they were. I even questioned them but they said they would just sell them as the price on the pacu. $3.99


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## Sylar_92

thundergolf said:


> Thinks guys i appreciate the comments.
> 
> I have been trying to take good pics for a couple of days, but just cant get any better pics with my phone. Ill try to get pics with my wifes camera tonight.
> 
> Sylar the first photo is definately pacu.
> 
> The lfs had two tanks side beside one with about 2-3" piranha and one with about 2-3" pacu. I believe they had these little guys in the pacu tank just to hold them until they made more room for them. They couldnt put them in the tank with the P's because they would have become a meal. However the two ladies working at the time had no clue what they were. I even questioned them but they said they would just sell them as the price on the pacu. $3.99


Thats sick man, I also seen that happen before when I was trying to buy a rhom. The tank had the price labled as $64.99 and when I asked to get the rhom they said it was just the holding tank with a price tag for a sanchezi. In reality the real price tag for the rhom was $120, unlike your petstore mine dint give me a discount so I decided to get 11 penny sized red bellies which were 4.99 each. Good luck with your new P's looking forward to those pics.


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## Spilo26

Yeah look like Pacu to me. You can kind of tell by the even jaw. Piranha have more of an overbite. Sorry dude lol.


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## thundergolf

Spilo26 said:


> Yeah look like Pacu to me. You can kind of tell by the even jaw. Piranha have more of an overbite. Sorry dude lol.


Piranha should have an underbite.


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## Guest




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## Piranha-Freak101




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## thundergolf

Here are updated photos. They are a little over a month old. 
Sorry could not get any better photos. I may try to remove one from the tank and photo it. I just didnt want to stress them at the moment.
Im going to be be introducing a shoal of caribe from AS, hopefully this week.
Let me know what you think.


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## Sylar_92

Yup those are juvenile reds







, I remember when mine were that small. They grow up so fast














, their looking good so far. As far adding cariba it should work but since they are babies there is going to be alot of fin nipping and since cariba are more more aggressive you might lose a few. Hope it goes well for you man and keep those updated pics coming.


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## memento

Sylar_92 said:


> Yup those are juvenile reds
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , I remember when mine were that small.


So you also have "piranhas" with a mouth like a mailbox ?


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## TheCableGuy

memento said:


> Yup those are juvenile reds
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , I remember when mine were that small.


So you also have "piranhas" with a mouth like a mailbox ?








[/quote]

Yeah, those look like pacu's to me.


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## Sylar_92

memento said:


> Yup those are juvenile reds
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , I remember when mine were that small.


So you also have "piranhas" with a mouth like a mailbox ?








[/quote]

LOL, man Iam talking about my pacu. I have red pacu as well as red bellies. I know the difference. Heres a comparison pic, also here are some pics of my red belly "piranhas" when they were babies.


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## Guest

I'm calling BS


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## Sylar_92

Traveller said:


> I'm calling BS


Wana make a bet I was talking about my pacu? I can show you pics if you dont believe me lol.


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## Johnny_Zanni

A pic with a piece of paper with your name on it...


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## Sylar_92

Johnny_Zanni said:


> A pic with a piece of paper with your name on it...


No problem, I'll write down all 15 parts of my name. gunna need to use the entire 8 X 11 peice of paper lol. My pacu lives with my reds, I bought and had him in with my reds since the day this thread started.


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## Guest

Pic


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## Johnny_Zanni

"Sylar_91 May 25th 2011 The World Did Not End."


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## thundergolf

Ill keep trying to get better photos, but im almost possitive that these are RBP's


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## Sylar_92

Johnny_Zanni said:


> "Sylar_91 May 25th 2011 The World Did Not End."


LOL, I was going to write just that. I sat on the couch watching TV when they said the world was going to end in 10mins, and after 10mins nothing happend. The next day the news annouced that the person who said the world was going to end made a miscalulation. I laughed my ass off adn said " Prophet my ass!" lol. Well back on topic, I'll have the pics up friday I dont have my camera on me as of the moment.


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## Guest

Pic?


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## Johnny_Zanni

Tits or GTFO


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## thundergolf

Ok...So i was cleaning out the tank today and decided to try to net a fish and get better photos. I set up a large net with a cube of beafheart insided. It work like a charm. Was able to net one snap a couple of photos with very little stress. This is one of the smaller of the five. Probably right @ 1"
Do you still think they are Pacu??


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## hastatus

P nattereri.


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## Guest

Does appear to be P nattereri, do all of them look like this?
Looks like a lot of the "experts" on here owe you an apology


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## memento

Must be mixed group then, for in the other pics you show pacus


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## CLUSTER ONE

Traveller said:


> Does appear to be P nattereri, do all of them look like this?
> Looks like a lot of the "experts" on here owe you an apology


I apologize. The first set of pics appeared to have large eyes and a pacu crushing jaw but apparently it was just the distortion of the picture that made it difficult to tell which is why clear pictures are always best.

If you want to e sure all of them are piranha then post up pics of each fish or a CLEAR group shot. The ones you netted are piranhas and I would assume the others are the same though post up a good pic and it can be confirmed.


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## thundergolf

memento said:


> Does appear to be P nattereri, do all of them look like this?
> Looks like a lot of the "experts" on here owe you an apology


I apologize. The first set of pics appeared to have large eyes and a pacu crushing jaw but apparently it was just the distortion of the picture that made it difficult to tell which is why clear pictures are always best.

If you want to e sure all of them are piranha then post up pics of each fish or a CLEAR group shot. The ones you netted are piranhas and I would assume the others are the same though post up a good pic and it can be confirmed.
[/quote]

I agree.. Looking at the first pics I can see what looks like large bulging eyes and a round even jaw (Pics were not the greatest, Probably distorted because they were still in the Plastic bag). But even as tiny as they were I could see that they had the underbite lower jaw. 
That is why I decided to snacth them up.


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## sadboy

You know in the first pic some do look like paco's but I guess it's the picture. I hope all like like the one you posted. If they are RBP then congrats on the steal.


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## hastatus

Just remember folks, young pacus and young piranhas look similar. Just look for the key features, such as size of anal fin (pacu are larger) and especially the jutting lower jaw. Pacu do not have this feature. If you are dealing with tank raised specimens, you may be dealing with some abnormality in body and head shape. But the two key features I mentioned usually stay consistent.


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## sadboy

Good point and thanks Frank


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## thundergolf

Thanks Frank.
The lower jaw was the first feature that i noticed. 
I am familar with baby piranha, but just wasnt sure if baby pacu may have similar features at such a young age and then grow out of it.


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## hastatus

thundergolf said:


> Thanks Frank.
> The lower jaw was the first feature that i noticed.
> I am familar with baby piranha, but just wasnt sure if baby pacu may have similar features at such a young age and then grow out of it.


You did well and understood the description too.


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## memento

If they indeed are all the same looking as the one on the last pic, I am happily willing to say you were right and I was wrong








Better then an apology, for I don't think one has to apologize for being wrong









I agree with Cluster One though, could have been the pics but try to make sure they are all natts.


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