# ammonia, nitrite, and ammonia burn



## TripDs (Oct 11, 2004)

I don't get it. I don't get it at all.








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Scenario:_ I have 2 small ps in a 30long. I test water one day to find 0.5 ammonia. Ammonia won't drop. To make matters worse, I thoroughly wash out my bio-bag in tap water. Ppl tell me I lack enough biological filtration. I add an additional filter (total filtration of 2 power filters: 355 gph, + powerhead: 160 gph) I add ammo chips to one bio-bag. Ammonia still not dropping even with previously adding 2 small bottles of amquel and 1 small bottle of ammo-lock.

_Questions:_
Q1) Do you think I'm going through a mini-cycle? How long would that take? I didn't think ALL beneficial bacteria was in my bio-bag.

Q2) If you have extremely high ammonia, wouldn't you have extremely high nitrite, or at least some nitrite?
Because my ammonia is extremely high whereas my nitrites are @ zero.

Q3) If you have extremely high ammonia, wouldnt your sensitive ps have ammonia burn?
Because my ammonia is extremely high, and my ps are acting "better" than ever. They are very active and hungry. They aren't skittish anymore. They have no signs of ammonia burn.

Q4) Is it possible that my testers are wrong?
Because I have the ammonia tester that ranges from yellow to green (I am told that is the one that doesn't give false even when you use products such as ammo-lock).

Q5) Can the fact that I have ammo chips in my bio-bag be a problem?
Because I added them just in case.

PS: I am currently doing small water changes every 3 days.


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## tigger (Mar 19, 2004)

try and use nitrazorb in your filter. amquel and ammo-lock detoxify ammonia into nitrates. nitrazorb absorbes nitrates and changes it into nitrites. testers will always read ammonia in the water but it will be detoxified by amquel and ammo-lock. always test for nitrates and nitrites. please correct me if im wrong anybody. i had the same problem with my tank for my sabretooth characin. also make sure that you dont overfeed your p's. your ammonia will spike if you overfeed. water changes help also. hope this helps you out.


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## TripDs (Oct 11, 2004)

tigger said:


> try and use nitrazorb in your filter. amquel and ammo-lock detoxify ammonia into nitrates. nitrazorb absorbes nitrates and changes it into nitrites. testers will always read ammonia in the water but it will be detoxified by amquel and ammo-lock. always test for nitrates and nitrites. please correct me if im wrong anybody. i had the same problem with my tank for my sabretooth characin. also make sure that you dont overfeed your p's. your ammonia will spike if you overfeed. water changes help also. hope this helps you out.
> [snapback]890880[/snapback]​


_
no offense_ man, i know you mean well, but no, you didnt help. i already know about amquel and ammo-lock and that some testers dont read them right, but i heard others do. i know not to overfeed my ps and that ammonia will spike if i did so....._no offense_

so if i sound rude, ive just had this problem for a while and its irritating

someone plz answer my questions.


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## Soldat (Aug 28, 2004)

So you have already been told that it is bad to wash out your filters in the tap water, right? Use tank water instead. Also, if you just have an ammonia problem than I don't think you have enough bacteria to convert the ammonia. So, you are probably in the cycling process. All ammo lock does is make the ammonia safe for your fish to be in. It doesn't eliminate it by any means, but you already know that.

I am pretty sure your tank is still cycling. Try to borrow an established filter pad or filter from one of your buddies or your LFS. You may think you have lots of filtration, but sometimes you need to overdue it. Is feeding normal? Are you changing the water?


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## TripDs (Oct 11, 2004)

> So you have already been told that it is bad to wash out your filters in the tap water, right? Use tank water instead.


Yup, I now know that.


> Also, if you just have an ammonia problem than I don't think you have enough bacteria to convert the ammonia. So, you are probably in the cycling process.


Alright, so you think I'm in a mini-cycle.


> All ammo lock does is make the ammonia safe for your fish to be in. It doesn't eliminate it by any means, but you already know that.


Yup


> I am pretty sure your tank is still cycling.


Still cycling? It _was_ cycled, but as my ps got bigger, it seemed that i didnt have enough biological filtration.



> You may think you have lots of filtration, but sometimes you need to overdue it.


That is what I did brother. I had one whisper 30, but added an addional whisper 40.



> Is feeding normal? Are you changing the water?


As I stated in my first post, I am currently doing small water changes every 3 days. And feeding is normal now, but was not the first few days after i first noticed the problem.


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## Soldat (Aug 28, 2004)

You have enough mechanical and chemical filtration, but it sounds like not enough biological. I would get something with a bio-wheel. Like a penguin 330 or something a little smaller. I don't think that your p's growth would cause this to happen. If that were the case, then most of us would have this problem. It has to be the filter media and the fact that it was washed in tap water. Is this the same thing that everybody else has told you?


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## TripDs (Oct 11, 2004)

> I don't think that your p's growth would cause this to happen.


Well actually, it makes sense. Because ps are messy. They eat and crap a lot. When your p grows, it eats and craps more. My power filter was rated for 10-30 gallon tanks, so its at the minimum. It was fine @ first when my ps were smaller and ate less, but now it's apparently not.



> It has to be the filter media and the fact that it was washed in tap water. Is this the same thing that everybody else has told you?


Initially, my ammonia was staying at a constant 0.5. After i rinsed my media in tap water, it went through the roof. So yes, it's a factor.
What people told me was to get another filter, so I did.


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## Soldat (Aug 28, 2004)

You are talking about the two whisper filters? Yes, your p's growth has something to do with it, but not all of it. I am trying to say that no matter how many new whisper filters you buy you will need just one with a good biological filter built in. Obviously the two whisper filters aren't doing the trick. I would ditch those and get something else with better media meant for bio filtration. How long has the second filter been on your tank?


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## TripDs (Oct 11, 2004)

kevinhaeb said:


> You are talking about the two whisper filters? Yes, your p's growth has something to do with it, but not all of it. I am trying to say that no matter how many new whisper filters you buy you will need just one with a good biological filter built in. Obviously the two whisper filters aren't doing the trick. I would ditch those and get something else with better media meant for bio filtration. How long has the second filter been on your tank?
> [snapback]891903[/snapback]​


I've had the second filter on since January 26. But given that I thoroughly washed my 1st filter in tap water, bacteria must grow on that one too. Remember, my ammonia was @ a constant 0.5 @ first with one filter. So I don't think that with 2 filters combined, my ammonia would be higher that that. It's the fact that my first filter is bacteria-less too.


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## Soldat (Aug 28, 2004)

So, problem solved?


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## TripDs (Oct 11, 2004)

kevinhaeb said:


> So, problem solved?
> [snapback]892580[/snapback]​


nope. my ammonia is still extremely high.


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## DominatorRhom (Jan 28, 2005)

go to your lfs and get bio-spira. this is bacteria that you just dump into your tank and it should cycle a lot quicker than letting it cycle on its own.


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## Mack (Oct 31, 2004)

Bio-Spira. Call every LFS and see if they have it. Bio-Spira is an instant cycle, it has all the bacteria you need.


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## compton ass steve (Nov 12, 2004)

what did you cycle your tank with initially? if the amount of waste in your tank now is more then it was during your cycle, then the bacteria cant get rid of everything fast enough, causing and ammonia spike. i had the same problem on my 40 breeder. to solve this problem, i did small water changes every day for about a week, and everything went back to normal. hope i helped if not im sorry


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