# Attempting Cariba



## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

I know Cariba breeding if very secretive&#8230; I am trying to induce spawning in a 120 gallon tank&#8230; I had six that were about 5.5- to 6 inch fish&#8230; One got killed over the weekend







&#8230; I do have 2 more that are 8 inches&#8230; They do look considerably bigger&#8230; I am wondering what will be the result if I add them to the colony???? I don't want them to terrorize the little guys and stop any breeding that may occur&#8230;.
I feel so bad about my loss







&#8230; I actually hand picked the entire colony, hoping for male a female fish&#8230;


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## Young Gotti (Jan 29, 2003)

You should be able to get away w/ putting the 8"er's w/ the 5-6"er's I have a 9.5" Cariba in w/ a 12.5" Cariba and they r fine. Also good luck on getting them to breed.


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## MR HARLEY (Aug 12, 2003)

SC
I would love to see it ....

Good Luck on your venture


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## tecknik (Jul 18, 2003)

Breeding caribas, very interesting topic. I really want to get mine in the mood, good luck with your next big experiment!


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## traumatic (Jan 29, 2003)

What's in the tank w/ them (decos)? You could rearrange plants, or wood for reestablishment of territory. This also may slow down the induced breeding attempt.


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## fishofury (May 10, 2003)

Good luck man! Hope things work out. Keep us all posted


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## munky2000r (Sep 15, 2003)

dude, nothing is gonna breed without the barry white music! proven fact


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## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

Dude my fish don't like Barry White... They prefer som Jack Daniels in the filter with Slayer, Testement , and some early Metallica...

For some reason *my fish rock*


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## FeederFish33 (Jan 22, 2003)

who has bred caribe? please tell me


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## Guest (Oct 18, 2003)

adding a pair of breeding red bellies inwith them might help


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## tecknik (Jul 18, 2003)

SC, so whats the status on your experiment with breeding caribas?


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## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

*tecknik* 
Well for the Cariba&#8230; That is definitely a hard road&#8230; The fish are naturally skittish&#8230; I have given them some privacy. Attempting them with a little more subdued lighting than the golds, and more acidic water&#8230;

Overall looks promising&#8230; I have 3 that stay a grey color with really noticeable humeral spot&#8230; They appear to have black flames like the piraya has yellow&#8230; I am staying optimistic, but no eggs yet&#8230;They are on an extremely high protein diet injected with vitamins&#8230;

Hope no one rips on the vitamins&#8230; Even people get prenatal vitamins...LOL

I just figured I wouldn't post much, and start a thread with what's happening day to day&#8230; I got some cool pictures of the black flames&#8230; If eggs appear I will post the pics in a topic called "Cariba Pre-spawn"

If I do have success winkeey will be my photographer for the forum to validate the species spawned&#8230; I will also give him some fish to observe there growth&#8230;
Thanks for the concern&#8230;From what I have noticed, there being skittish is a big factor to be eliminated&#8230; They also need the light, so total darkness would be cruel to the fish&#8230;


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## B. Scott (Apr 24, 2003)

Allen,

Hello, it's good to hear things are rolling along fairly nicely. I just wanted to give you heads up that if/when your cariba do spawn that they are extremely canibalistic as juveniles (up to 3" TL).

Because of this, you may want to split the clutch into several smaller groups to allow optimum growth of the young.

Also, use a bare-bottom tank and feed pelleted foods or other "prepared" foods right away so you do not need to feed messy foods such as beef heart, liver, lung, or other high-protein foods that are normally ground up for feeding baby piranhas.

Just my 2 cents is all.

Good luck


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## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

Thanks B.Scott… I appreciate the information…It is such a pleasure to get advice from individuals…So many have given me bogus advice…Hopefully with perseverance I will have success with the Cariba…I just don’t understand why my spawning attempts are so different than others… There is absolutely zero aggression in the tank…This fish swim up and down, and touch each other with a subtle grace that’s just remarkable… I will be investing in a video cam soon…


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## B. Scott (Apr 24, 2003)

No problem, glad to offer anything that may be of help.

On that note, remember, cariba are red-bellies with a black spot. Given the right conditions, they will spawn. It's inevitable and should be fairly easy.

Best of success


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## Xenon (Nov 15, 2002)

I agree with Brian, my 1 inch caribes would tear each other to bits. It didnt matter how much i fed them, they would always have tattered fins and body shots.


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## Xenon (Nov 15, 2002)

B. Scott said:


> On that note, remember, cariba are red-bellies with a black spot.


 Is the humeral spot the only thing that seperates the 2 species?


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## B. Scott (Apr 24, 2003)

Xenon said:


> B. Scott said:
> 
> 
> > On that note, remember, cariba are red-bellies with a black spot.
> ...


 No, they are also diagnosable as having 4 supraneurals on average.


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## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

Silver to very light copper Iris around the Pupil...
Never Red.... Red eyes = Redbelly


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## thePACK (Jan 3, 2003)

n3p said:


> adding a pair of breeding red bellies inwith them might help


 caribas would probably kill them...and good luck with the spawning..


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## hastatus (Jan 16, 2003)

> B. Scott Posted on Oct 29 2003, 04:36 PM
> QUOTE (Xenon @ Oct 29 2003, 11:04 AM)
> QUOTE (B. Scott @ Oct 29 2003, 10:06 AM)
> On that note, remember, cariba are red-bellies with a black spot.
> ...


Brian you never told me you had X-ray eyes j/k LOL.









They are much nastier critters on biting each other. They certainly coined the phrase "cannibal".


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## thoroughbred (Mar 14, 2003)

the toffee wil be the one to breed caribas







well i hope ive decided to keep my beautful specimens and scrap my bare bottom tank and go with small black gravel with slate rock on the floor of most of the tank the toffee will be successful u have to beleive in the toffee lol well ima try anyway good luck sc


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## tecknik (Jul 18, 2003)

Hope everything works out for you SC and toffee. I'll be checking back to see how your experment has been coming along. SC, on OPEFE website it clearly shows the PH levels and water hardness of the rivers in South America. Are you trying to copy water conditions where the cariba are collected or are you pretty much following your past experience dealing with spilos?


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## khuzhong (Apr 11, 2003)

thoroughbred said:


> the toffee wil be the one to breed caribas
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 give em some of that pimp juice.. good luck Pimp.

and SC... good luck as always.!!


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## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

tecknik said:


> Hope everything works out for you SC and toffee. I'll be checking back to see how your experment has been coming along. SC, on OPEFE website it clearly shows the PH levels and water hardness of the rivers in South America. Are you trying to copy water conditions where the cariba are collected or are you pretty much following your past experience dealing with spilos?


 I am trying 100% to re-create their native biotope, and then simulate dry, and wet seasons...


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## Outie (Feb 19, 2003)

Good luck, (also i want some fry) i also think the main trouble your gonna run into is raising the fry without them killing each other. Hope you have plenty of small tanks or containers for them. Also i would think if you have 4-5 in a tank that it should be enough.


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## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

Outie said:


> Good luck, (also i want some fry) i also think the main trouble your gonna run into is raising the fry without them killing each other. Hope you have plenty of small tanks or containers for them. Also i would think if you have 4-5 in a tank that it should be enough.


 OMG.... If they spawn like reds and hove over a thousand eggs... I wont be able to do 4-5 in a tank... Let natural selection being... Mine will be just as big and bad and the wild one...

Well Pending success


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## Sir Nathan XXI (Jan 29, 2003)

I tried to breed my shoal of large cariba in a 125g tank. I had 5 that were 9-11"

Thigns started pretty well. I got a pair for aa week or two, then nothing. A few weeks later a pair formed again and I had a nest blown, and even had the body wagging and chasing the female to the nest, but no eggs. Then all hell broke loose and I ended up losing 3 fish in a matter of 10 days. At that point I threw in the towel and sold the survivors which I believe to be a male and female. What I did to help things along

I reduced lighting to very very little.
temp of 83
lots of peat in the sump, you will find that rio orinoco is high in peat content, I did research on water conditions and one report made a big deal about that.
and a few large spaces to allow them to circle easily

I also have an auto water changer to keep water perfect which is pretty important from what most breeders tell me.

I am thinking about trying an experiment to see if its possible to breed fish through a egg crate divider. as wide as the holes are they can see eachother and get rather close with out being able to kill eachother.


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## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

Very interesting concept on the divider breeding&#8230; That is the method used for betas; Siamese fighting fish&#8230; The fish are allowed to see each other, and when the male is ready to mate, he blows bubbles&#8230;. Upon blowing bubbles the fish are introduces&#8230; There is a possibility you could be onto something that may work with very aggressive piranha&#8230;.

Hey&#8230; Can you post the link with river conditions&#8230;? I to am constantly researching water ways&#8230; I have gone to the point of using yahoo to find people from South American countries&#8230; Once I find them I use Systran Pro, for language translation&#8230; I have found some really cool people from Brazil and Peru&#8230;


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## B. Scott (Apr 24, 2003)

Sir Nathan XXI said:


> I am thinking about trying an experiment to see if its possible to breed fish through a egg crate divider. as wide as the holes are they can see eachother and get rather close with out being able to kill eachother.


 Your on the right track with that one.

There is a complete-divider method and an incomplete-divider method.

Piranhas would need the complete-divider method.


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## hastatus (Jan 16, 2003)

> B. Scott Posted on Oct 30 2003, 07:25 PM
> 
> Your on the right track with that one.
> 
> ...


The only problem with that Brian is getting a false reading. Keeping different species of piranas will exhibit "breeding or pre-neptual" behavior when separated by clear plexiglas. I kept a couple different species separated by this method and found them to tail wag and all sorts of "breeding type behavior". While this made my mind jump to the conclusion....wow different species want to breed.... it instead caused a massive finbiting exercise when the sheet was removed. Certainly made me believe instead they were "feining" the activity than actually wanting to in order to confuse what their real intension was.

Just some food for thought.


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## Sir Nathan XXI (Jan 29, 2003)

plexiglass with fairly large holes, just small enough to where your fish cannot get through is a possiblility. I may try this out.


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## Sir Nathan XXI (Jan 29, 2003)

oh, I believe this is the link, cant remember for sure though

Orinoco Link


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## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

Wow!!! Thanks Nate... I will add that to my collection of SubAmerican water ways... Very informative...


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## Salvinni (May 18, 2003)

Sir Nathan XXI said:


> plexiglass with fairly large holes, just small enough to where your fish cannot get through is a possiblility. I may try this out.


 I just had an experience w/ same material.
Plexi w/ bout 1.25" holes.
Brandti 1 side 
Manny other.
Those fools were biting ea other mouths through the holes.
Something i didnt foresee.
scraped that and bought another tank.
may work w/ half inch holes, just have a light current towards bottom running from males side 
to females side to carry spermies through holes.


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