# 55G Log



## timtest (Apr 26, 2006)

Hi all, Nice to join the forums here. I usually just like to only read forums, but as I'm putting together my new tank it will be more than helpful to start posting







.

Anyway, Here is my 55G: First ever Planted, and first ever Piranha aquarium. Hopefully it will be a pleasent learning experiance, as this tank has to turn out perfect (its in my bedroom, its gotta look great!).

Right now i'm slowly working on getting this baby planted and cycled. I've been doing lots of reading/surfing on plants and plant set ups. So before i start adding piranhas (I plan to keep 2 in the tank) I want this tank to be crystal clear, and have healthy growing plants first.

So far i've only added the gravel, water and had the filter and heater going for a week now (waiting on shipping is a pain)

Here's what i have, and what i plan on getting to complete the setup:

Tank: 55G 48"Lx12"Wx18"H

Gravel: 60lbs Eco-Complete, 20lbs top layer of Regular Gravel

Heater: 200watt submersible

Filter: whisper 60, Pumps roughly x6 the tanks volume per hour. No Filter Media as I know its bad for plants, i figure i can get away with some sponges and thick material for catching debris (and housing bacteria)

Lighting: I've ordered the 2 x 55 watt Bright Kit from AH Supply. It looks like i should be able to fit this into my current canopy (but i'd have to replace the *plastic* shield in which the lights are covered by, by a *glass* sheet (how important is that?).

With this setup i'll have 2wpg, but i've heard nice things about the AH light setups, and their refelctors etc, so i'm expecting a *good* 2wmp setup







(as opposed to something i might get at home depot).

CO2: I'm still reading on this. Since I saved a bit more than i thought i'd be spending on lighting initially (was looking at Tek/t5 light fixtures), i wouldn't mind going all out on CO2. The easier it is to maintain the better for me.

i've been looking at this pack for CO2 (CO2 tank i'd have to get seperate, was thinking of getting a 10lbs tank)

http://www.aquariumplants.com/product_p/pr4026.htm

Its a little pricey, Their regulator is quite nice tho (i've seen it in person compared to the 
Milwaukee and its a little better (don't make me explain why right now, I doubt I could







, more research here obviously!))

any advice you could lay on me regarding CO2 would be appreciated.

Once i have the lighting and CO2 in my hands, I want to have the Lights set up on timers, 11-12 hrs a day, then have the CO2 shut off with the lights. have all this running for a couple days to get the PH balanced etc. before i add plants.

Next we'll be adding plants. No ideas as to what yet. I guess all i want is something that looks pretty, and fast growing plants to have it initially set up quickly.

Then i'll add 1-2 algea eaters (will these survive after the piranhas are added, recommendations?) and 6 goldfish/minnows for the initial cycle (and i guess they'll become my new pets main meal once their added >







).

I'd like to put a nice tall (about half the tanks hight) piece of driftwood right in the center (nice and simple) and then just have plants all around (will this be enough cover for the piranhas?).

i know the tall in the back, small in front (we'll cross that bridge when we come to it).

In regards to ferts, i know nothing







. any help here!?

Anyway i'm rambling, Heres how she looks right now:

View attachment 104061


I'll keep this updated as i move along. Well, as quick as the mail is anyway....
Hope you enjoy.

P.S. If anything i've written here sounds like a good idea/bad idea let me know, i'm learning !!!


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## werdna (Mar 15, 2005)

welcome to the hobby and good luck im sure u will find the people on thos site very friendly and helpful


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## timtest (Apr 26, 2006)

Thanks, I should Also note I've kept a fake decor freshwater aquarium (same 55G tank there) for about a year with its inital ups and downs. I bought a 25G and moved everything that was in my 55G into the 25G (yes the 55G didn't have a lot of fish in it, infact the 25G is perfectly suited for what i had in the 55G), just so i could free up the 55G for this project.


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## Guest (Apr 26, 2006)

I personally dont think you need that co2 system with only 2wpg, as I have had great success with no supplemental co2 at 2wpg. But it will make life easier. Maybe get a smaller tank and a cheaper regulator, then add a bit more lighting (shop lights from home depot would do...you can use a roof gutter as a reflector).

With the ferts, IVe learned through many threads of ignoring Dippy Eggs and learning the hard way (







) that you only need to add what your plants NEED. I think Pottasium has helped my tank the most, and the addition of Iron was definitely noticed. Im still working on getting my Macro levels raised tho, so Im not much help there. Dippy and Han have a link to this great website for fertilizers,hopefully they will post a link for ya.

Either way, good luck.


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

> Gravel: 60lbs Eco-Complete, 20lbs top layer of Regular Gravel
> Heater: 200watt submersible


good.


> Filter: whisper 60, Pumps roughly x6 the tanks volume per hour. No Filter Media as I know its bad for plants, i figure i can get away with some sponges and thick material for catching debris (and housing bacteria)


not the best for what you are trying to do, but it should work if you substitue pressurized CO2 with Flourish Excell. (CO2 is unstable in H2O)
Canisters are best for this


> Lighting: I've ordered the 2 x 55 watt Bright Kit from AH Supply. It looks like i should be able to fit this into my current canopy (but i'd have to replace the *plastic* shield in which the lights are covered by, by a *glass* sheet (how important is that?).


Great choice with the lights for your 55g. I have the 4x55w for my 75g, it screams. Your setup should grow plants very well. And you can always upgrade with a 1x96w, or another 2x55w if you ever get a 75 or a 90 or something.. 
replace plastic with glass will be important because if heat.. I personally would use a canopy that is open on the top so heat can get out. (PC's get hot)


> CO2: The easier it is to maintain the better for me.
> i've been looking at this pack for CO2 (CO2 tank i'd have to get seperate, was thinking of getting a 10lbs tank)
> http://www.aquariumplants.com/product_p/pr4026.htm
> Its a little pricey, Their regulator is quite nice tho (i've seen it in person compared to the
> ...


I would say that a pressurized CO2 setup on your 55 would slam! (you could get away with Excell though, no problem)
But on that particular setup, I would say that you could get a better deal. I paid $150 for a Milwaukee regulator and controller on ebay. I bought a dirt cheap used 20lb CO2 cylander from a welding supply shop. I pump my CO2 directly into my canister filter for a cheap diffuser







and whammo. (except I bought a $3.00 check valve)


> Once i have the lighting and CO2 in my hands, I want to have the Lights set up on timers, 11-12 hrs a day, then have the CO2 shut off with the lights. have all this running for a couple days to get the PH balanced etc. before i add plants


Defenetly don't do that. Wait until you get the plants before using the CO2, and the light. Algea happens very well in that situation.










> Then i'll add 1-2 algea eaters (will these survive after the piranhas are added, recommendations?) and 6 goldfish/minnows for the initial cycle (and i guess they'll become my new pets main meal once their added >
> 
> 
> 
> ...


they could survive, but I did not have any success with this with my compressus.. with my sanchezi, for the time being, but not the other one.. I had to plant very densely, and sneak tons of cherry shrimp in there while he was distracted lol
As for cover for your fish, DW is great for your fish's cover. But I just grew tall plants, and he chills behind them or to the side of them for comfort








Keep us posted


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## Kemper1989 (Feb 14, 2005)

Glad to see you have researched well before, sure you will do fine.


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## Guru (Apr 20, 2004)

Welcome, good luck on your new setup.


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## timtest (Apr 26, 2006)

Thanks for the tips guys, pretty helpful so far.



DiPpY eGgS said:


> > Filter: whisper 60, Pumps roughly x6 the tanks volume per hour. No Filter Media as I know its bad for plants, i figure i can get away with some sponges and thick material for catching debris (and housing bacteria)
> 
> 
> not the best for what you are trying to do, but it should work if you substitue pressurized CO2 with Flourish Excell. (CO2 is unstable in H2O)
> Canisters are best for this


hmm, if i was to forgo Pressurized CO2 and go with the Flourish Excell, i would definately upgrade to a canister filter then. I don't know much about them, i'll look into them today, some questions:

say i went with the Fluval 404.

easy setup? i.e. I guess my only concern is how "plug and play" is it? Do i have to buy extra tubing, drill holes, etc... Or, do I have everything i need in the box.

should i use the filter media it comes with. i didn't plan to since the plants should do most of the chemical filtration. Does the media in the canister filter pose the same problems as the power filters?

What should i use as an alternative inside?

Thats why i like those power filters, hang on the back of the tank, plug it in and its done. I know disturbing the water will help the CO2 escape and prevent some light from getting in, but i also read P's like water current, they love to swim in it and it gives them exercise and helps them grow faster. Isn't there a happy medium!? hehe. (I would guess that adding water current would just be a bad idea for the plants (even if its good for the P's) so i'm not even considering it. Am i right?)

Edit:

One more quick question. I know the 55G is a little tiny, and theres lots of debate on this. I plan on keeping 2 P's in there for life. Some would say i couldn't even get away with that, some say I could fit more. Could I squeeze one more in there and have 3? The more the merrier! Obviously the more room for them the better, and theres a thin line between the tank size and fish size ratio. In the end, if I could get away with 3 i'd like to...

Ultimately its my decision but i'd greatly appreciate the advice.
Thanks.


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

Cool, I'm a guitar player too Here is some of my stuff..

Ill post more soon, i have to get to bed..


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## timtest (Apr 26, 2006)

Nice gear dippy. I'll have to post my rig when i get home today.

Lookin' forward to reading your reply. Another question before you do however







.

What else should i get in the mean time (i like buying stuff!), while i'm waiting for my lights to arrive? (Once those lights arrive i'd like to start planting right away!).

I need my Fluval 404 (maybe, depending on your reply







), my piece of driftwood...

Things i'm not sure about, but know i'll need...

Fertz:
Which should I get? I'd like to have everything on hand just incase, the seacham flourish products sound like a nice line to start with, should i get them all? (its an expensive start, but as i learn more about fertz i can move to the garywatson stuff)

For what i understand about fertz so far: 
You measure your water parameters and add whats needed to reach a certain level, e.g. if i have 14ppm of KNO3 - potassium nitrate in my tank, add some fert to raise it to about 15ppm (I don't know about the numbers i'm just pulling stuff out of the air)

I just need to know what to get to "cover all my bases" (do i need to get my current water parameters before i can know this forsure? even tho the tank is uncycled).

Test kit: 
Which are essential for a planted tank? i'd like to get some nice test kits, the one i have now is cheap and hard to read (not very accurate, or maybe its just me







).

was thinking of picking up one of these bad boys, seems it would take out a lot of the guesswork

http://www.aquariumplants.com/product_p/pr1408.htm

Other then that I think i'm pretty much ready to go....


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

> What would be the best option for cycling?.


How about a bunch of guppies?


> I could also get a few Black Skirt Tetras and add them to my community tank after they've cycled the tank.
> I really like Tiger Barbs, could I throw 6 of them in for the inital cycle (i.e. are they good cyclers), then let them eventually become fishfood?


I have 4 tiger barbs in my sanchezi tank, used to have 5







good to use.
I would say it wouldn't be good with the lobster.. not a great combo..


> What would be a nice algea tank make for a pair of P's? ideally, I'd be very happy with only having the P's in the tank, but i'd be just as happy having one little bottomfeeder to clean out the tank (one that won't destroy my plants! ...or get eaten).


ghost shrimp will eat leftover P food, and cherry reds are great for algea eating, but you will need lots of plants for them to hide in


> easy setup? i.e. I guess my only concern is how "plug and play" is it? Do i have to buy extra tubing, drill holes, etc... Or, do I have everything i need in the box.


everything u need is there


> should i use the filter media it comes with. i didn't plan to since the plants should do most of the chemical filtration. Does the media in the canister filter pose the same problems as the power filters?


I have the ceramic rings in my XP3, and the sponge material.. that is all you need, and should use


> Thats why i like those power filters, hang on the back of the tank, plug it in and its done. I know disturbing the water will help the CO2 escape and prevent some light from getting in, but i also read P's like water current, they love to swim in it and it gives them exercise and helps them grow faster. Isn't there a happy medium!? hehe. (I would guess that adding water current would just be a bad idea for the plants (even if its good for the P's) so i'm not even considering it. Am i right?)


If you are not using pressurized CO2, HOB filters are ok, if you limit water splash. You can use Excell in that situation. I have a power head in my tank, about half way down. water circulation is great for plants, it circulates nutrient rich water past them.
3 is it in a 55. I had 2 in a 75 b4, and they got huge. I would not go over 3
I would get a nitrate, phosphate, and KH test kits. 
Ferts are:
nitrate
phosphate
potassium
micros
iron
You need to have 10-25ppm nitrates always, .5-2ppm phosphates. 20ppm potassium, go by the bottle..
micros and iron are important too.. how much you dose depends on the amount of light you have.
hope this helped.. sorry it took so long for a reply


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## Kemper1989 (Feb 14, 2005)

Danios are tough fish as well for cycling.


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## timtest (Apr 26, 2006)

Thanks for the advise









Couple updates, still waiting for those lights, hopefully monday.

Picked up a Fluval 404 yesterday:

View attachment 104706

View attachment 104707


also bought a feeder tank, but I decided after i set it up I would get a pair of breeding convicts. way better than feeders i guess.

View attachment 104709

View attachment 104708


this tank will be a nice little warm up cycle before i jump into the plants


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## timtest (Apr 26, 2006)

Well, i FINALLY got my plants. My heater broke, so i had to go buy a new one too







. But anyway heres how she looks. Sorry about the crappy web cam pics. i'll get out the real digital camera once i get some piranahs in there







.

Tank shot:
View attachment 106161


Left side:
View attachment 106162


Right side:
View attachment 106163


Center:
View attachment 106164


Some yummy fertz
View attachment 106152


I'll identify them later, i'm all mixed up right now







.

I'm a little scared now, i don't want them to die! When should start added stuff like the flourish? I got my test kits, i was planning on checking all the parameters tuesday, and i'll let you guys know then.

I've also ordered some dry fertz off Gregwatson: KNO3, KH2PO4, K2SO4 and CSM+B.

well tell me what you think, i got a piece of driftwood i'll hopefully have in the middle by tuesday/wednesday.

Edit: changed pics to real digital cam pics from web cam pics.


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

looks good so far, right now it will be quite crucial to get some fast growers in there.. get some hornwart or something that will really take off --you dont have to keep it, but it will help out a lot for now

feed right away. starving your plants is not a great idea. healthy plants==algea control, so feed em. You will need nitrates in there pronto, along with phosphates. 
you have the other stuff, but potassium will help too

is your GW order comming soon??

like in 15 minutes?? lol --sorry but it is very crucial to feed right away


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## timtest (Apr 26, 2006)

eck, i ordered it yesterday :/ might be a week or so... the flourish might have to do till then.

I do have fast growers tho, some cabomba, and pennyroot i think i have hornwart, it sound like something i bought







. I made sure i was getting mostly fast growing plants tho. i didn't care what kind right now as i just want it established right now.

In 3-4 days i'm going to get 3 ottos to help with algea, then in a week i'll get 4-5 tigerbarbs to help with the cycle.


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## timtest (Apr 26, 2006)

55 gallon tank 48x12x18
PH: 8.0
GH: 120 (Moderately Hard)
KH: 70mg/L
Phosphates: 0.25 mg/L
Nitrates: 0? <5, after test water was pretty clear.
Iron: 0.25 mg/L

Co2: None, (daily dose with Flourish Excell)

lighting used:
AH Lights 2x55 watt kit
2xPower Compact bulbs 6700k for 11 hours/day

substrate:
2.5 inches of eco-complete
1 regular gravel

Added 3 ottos and 3 SAE's today to help with the algae/cycle. will add 4-5 tiger barbs next week.

hopefully my greg watson order will be in ASAP.

so, what should i be dosing?


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

> so, what should i be dosing?


How come your pH is so high? do you have crushed coral, or crushed shell in there?

You have to maintain a nitrate level of 10-25ppm at least. You need .5-2ppm phosphates at least. You need to dose micros, iron and potassium on top of that, or you will not beat back the algea that will be comming


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## timtest (Apr 26, 2006)

DiPpY eGgS said:


> How come your pH is so high? do you have crushed coral, or crushed shell in there?


No clue, i don't use crushed corals or shell, just normal tap water. its always been that high. ???



> You have to maintain a nitrate level of 10-25ppm at least. You need .5-2ppm phosphates at least. You need to dose micros, iron and potassium on top of that, or you will not beat back the algea that will be comming


come on greg watson!


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

I just hope you dont get an algea outbreak before they get there... I mix them 1 tblspn to 250 ml's in distilled water


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## timtest (Apr 26, 2006)

Got my GW order this moring, Wow that was fast... 4 days, not too shabby. Looks like i'll beat the algea bloom.

I'm at school all day so i'll get around to reading up on them and dosing till tonight.

Fews questions beforehand.

What is the shelf life of the dry ingredients? Do they need to be refirdgerated or anything like that? Again I ordered:

KNO3, KH2PO4, K2SO4 and CSM+B.

Also, what is the shelf life of the solutions once i mix them with distilled water (would just using boiled water be acceptable? Or what about that distilled water you get in jugs that are safeway brand, are those ok?)

One last thing i can think to ask right now, How fast do the parameters change once I add the fretz. I.E. How long should I wait after dosing to use my test kits to check how much the dose affected the water parameters?

p.s. Big thanks to all you guys through this process. You've all made this process a lot easier







.


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## Pnewb (Apr 10, 2006)

timtest said:


> Again I ordered:
> 
> KNO3, KH2PO4, K2SO4 and CSM+B.


damN!! is all that really necessary... im about to set up a planted tank with Ps... 
and i dont plan on buyin 10 diff dosing products. not only cuz its excessive but cuz it will cost to damn much.

well my question is... 1. what plant food should i get and how often should i feed?
2. what do i need to prevent all the initial algae growth?
tnx


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

> well my question is... 1. what plant food should i get and how often should i feed?
> 2. what do i need to prevent all the initial algae growth?
> tnx


If you dont feed your plants, there is no preventing algea.


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## Pnewb (Apr 10, 2006)

DiPpY eGgS said:


> > well my question is... 1. what plant food should i get and how often should i feed?
> > 2. what do i need to prevent all the initial algae growth?
> > tnx
> 
> ...


i do want to feed them. i just done feel the need to give em a more balanced diet then i have.......

my question is what should i buy to feed my plants.. be it liquid or tablets.


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## timtest (Apr 26, 2006)

Mini update. heres how she looks now. I think i'm the only one with a Led Zeppelin Tank in the city







.

View attachment 107765


Added the Tiger Barbs today. Hopefully in a month she'll be all cycled and ready for a pair of RBPs. I'll post more pics when that happens.


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