# Amazonian Set-up



## CraigStables (Oct 5, 2003)

OK, Im looking to recreate as close as posisble the natural habitat of Piranhas, so haven been doing some reading of past topics on a couple of boards. I've noted down some points and was just wondering what everyones opinions are of them...

- On one post I read it suggested using peat to lower the PH to a more acidic level for P's, of around 6.0-6.5. It also has the added benefits of darkening the water, which again mimics the natural habitat. Has anyone every used peat, and could give their experiences?

- Also, there was a post on here that I found talking about using peat and dead leaves (so all the harmful chemicals are gone) as a substrate in a P tank. Other than the obvious problem of possible clogging up the filter are there any others? Also, would there be any great benefit to this?

- Lastly, has anyone got any more opinions on how to closely replicate the natural habitat? Such as decoration, water parmeters. etc?

Cheers


----------



## Xenon (Nov 15, 2002)

CraigStables said:


> OK, Im looking to recreate as close as posisble the natural habitat of Piranhas, so haven been doing some reading of past topics on a couple of boards. I've noted down some points and was just wondering what everyones opinions are of them...
> 
> - On one post I read it suggested using peat to lower the PH to a more acidic level for P's, of around 6.0-6.5. It also has the added benefits of darkening the water, which again mimics the natural habitat. Has anyone every used peat, and could give their experiences?
> 
> ...


 How do you anticipate the Nitrate levels with a contant bed of rotting organic matter? I know this has been done before by zoos and the like, yet I am not quite sure the procedures necessary to replicate this in the home aquaria and maintain it with good water.

What size tank were you planning on using?

What type of filtration?

Lots of members have used peat on this site and do claim it is not bad for the piranha. Also some people said that the darkening of the water makes the piranha less skittish.


----------



## CraigStables (Oct 5, 2003)

Xenon said:


> How do you anticipate the Nitrate levels with a contant bed of rotting organic matter? I know this has been done before by zoos and the like, yet I am not quite sure the procedures necessary to replicate this in the home aquaria and maintain it with good water.
> 
> What size tank were you planning on using?
> 
> ...


 The tank is a 265 Gal, and Im using a very large wet/dry filter running at roughly 2000 Gal per hour.

From what Ive been reading up on, with the few posts I could find, as long as you use already dead leaves that have naturally fallen the levels of nitrates shouldnt be affected much at all. This is becasue all the harmful nitrates, sugars, etc. are taken out of the leaf before it falls from the tree. So even when its breaking up in the tank it does very little harm.

The one thing Im not too sure about is the amount of peat. If its being used as a substrate would there be too much for the tank, as I know there are certain levels which should be used.


----------



## Pseudotropheus (Feb 14, 2004)

rotting leaves cause nitrate.


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

i think that would be like throwing a pile of dog sh*t in your tank


----------



## Xenon (Nov 15, 2002)

illnino said:


> i think that would be like throwing a pile of dog sh*t in your tank


What an intelligent comment.









I dont know Craig. I have seen it done before but I would be scared about the dead leaves rotting. I have seen leaves rot afte rthey fall from trees and that is not something I would want to put in my aquaria. Also how are you going to do syphoning?  I dont know. Maybe if you developed some in line nitrate reducer this would be possible, like a huge tank filled with plantlife, etc.


----------



## CraigStables (Oct 5, 2003)

illnino said:


> i think that would be like throwing a pile of dog sh*t in your tank


 firstly







f*ck off if your just going to come up with shitty useless comments and dont bother replying to my threads!

Xenon- I'll try to find the thread that goes on about the leaves in the tank. Its a guy who is fairly knowledgable talking about it, has written a few columns for fish keeping magazine, etc.


----------



## CraigStables (Oct 5, 2003)

Took a bit of finding but got them both.

This one is the initial thread I found of P-Fish, it goes into some detail thread here

This is the article that is linked in the thread above, its from the guy I mentioned in my that post thread here


----------



## ctarry (Nov 29, 2003)

i've used oak leaves in my tanks before with no problems.


----------



## CraigStables (Oct 5, 2003)

ctarry- were they already dead that you collected off the floor, or off the tree?

Does anyone know what it is that they use in zoo's and such that is like a muddy substrate, is it peat or something else?


----------



## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

I personally wouldn't use the dead leaves unless you are simulating the dry season in the tank. During the dry season the river kind of dies. When the rainy season comes it is reborn. All the dead decay, are swiftly diluted with an abundance of clean fresh water.

But if you must use the dead decaying leaves. Look for some of the resins that can be utilized as a filtration media. Most I have seen are very small beads. They will remove most harmful chemicals, and keep you water chemistry sufficient for piranhas. Seachem, and Kent manufacture some the resin media. The good thing about the resins is they can be regenerated with salts, and reused.

You may want to look in too horse fiber, or Coconut fiber with peat blocks in place for plant growth, and Amazon water clarity. I am a little unsure what you are trying to do. But my aquariums are as close to Amazon Rivers as I can make them.

Based on you gallons per hour filtration, I think your fish will be fine.


----------



## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

CraigStables said:


> ctarry- were they already dead that you collected off the floor, or off the tree?
> 
> Does anyone know what it is that they use in zoo's and such that is like a muddy substrate, is it peat or something else?


 I believe Mac Wiess makes a product called river mud... I will reseach the name of the product and post a link for ya.


----------



## CraigStables (Oct 5, 2003)

the dead leaves really werent part of what I was intending to do, it was something I was just looking into!

I am more interested in the type of substrate used, as this is what I want to try to replicate as close as possible!


----------



## ctarry (Nov 29, 2003)

CraigStables said:


> ctarry- were they already dead that you collected off the floor, or off the tree?


 dead ones off the floor


----------



## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

Well perhaps small earth colored aquarium rock, to medium sand may give you the consistency you are looking to. Tangles of driftwood along with peat in the filter will give you adequate clarity, and ph. Floating water sprites, and or lilies will give you fish the illusion of shelter from the sun. You can get bags to fill with peat pellets and fiber to add to your filtration unit. Watch you PH daily until you get an understanding of how it fluctuates with water changes, and replenishing peat in the filters.

The above set-up is identical to my Cariba set-up. The water is always dark, lighting is very subdued, and floating plants give areas of almost constant darkness. If you get into fibers for a substrate, you will run into constant cleaning problems. Food and mutilated prey will stick to the fibrous material. But my Cariba love the large bush of peat, and coconut fiber. I will try to post a pic of my Cariba set-up for ya.

Oak leaves are are probably the leaves you want to use. Oak and peat produce Tannis acid. Tea leave produce Tannic Acid. Watch the leave you use, or you may create a chemistry that is foreign to the piranha.


----------



## CraigStables (Oct 5, 2003)

cheers ctarry and serra collector, I'll look forward to seeing the pic of your caribe tank!


----------



## tecknik (Jul 18, 2003)

serrasalmus_collector said:


> I believe Mac Wiess makes a product called river mud... I will reseach the name of the product and post a link for ya.


 Very interesting, looking forward to the link


----------



## serrasalmus_collector (Mar 9, 2003)

tecknik said:


> serrasalmus_collector said:
> 
> 
> > I believe Mac Wiess makes a product called river mud... I will reseach the name of the product and post a link for ya.
> ...


 I sincerly appologise. The product is for a saltwater aquaruim. I have seen it in fish stores and wasn't aware of what it did.

*Marc Wiess does not produce a product called river mud*

THe product is for a corel reef...

Sorry.. We all make mistakes. Looks like you may have to work with sands, and small pebbles.


----------

