# How old are you and what is your income?



## Xenon (Nov 15, 2002)




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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

Much better.

"Voted."


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## Trigga (Jul 1, 2006)

Voted


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

24
Under 30K
2 Part-time Jobs.

Law Enforcement applications take a long time to process, is what I've noticed.


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## mdmedicine (Dec 20, 2004)

voted


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## jmax611 (Aug 6, 2006)

24 and 30-40k


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## gatrfish (Feb 11, 2008)

what a pole.


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## PacmanXSA (Nov 15, 2004)

Voted.

Pac


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## b_ack51 (Feb 11, 2003)

Xenon is the pole master.

<kelso>BURN!</kelso>


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)




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## joey'd (Oct 26, 2005)

my income might be higher if xenon replied to my PM's regarding business transactions, but alas my commission check will only have that much less on it


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## PinKragon (Dec 28, 2005)

1983
income i dunno how much a year but i make $27.00 an hour 
I use to make more then that







but i am more happy with my job now


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## fishguy1313 (Feb 19, 2007)

$18.00/hr. Grossed 38K - Who makes 150K plus, 06??? What the hell do you do? Selling cocaine doesn't count.


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

fishguy1313 said:


> $18.00/hr. Grossed 38K - Who makes 150K plus, 06??? What the hell do you do? Selling cocaine doesn't count.


I'm interested in who's the one bringing in over $300,000 personally...


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## lament configuration (Jun 22, 2003)

i bet it is mdmedicine.


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## Doktordet (Sep 22, 2006)

voted


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

lament configuration said:


> i bet it is mdmedicine.


Why, what does he/she do for a living?


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## scent troll (Apr 4, 2005)

/wonders who makes OVER 300,000


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## lament configuration (Jun 22, 2003)

mdmedicine is a doctor.


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## scent troll (Apr 4, 2005)

what kind of doctor?


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## lament configuration (Jun 22, 2003)

i thought he was some type of surgeon.


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

Okay, so now we have 2 people claiming $300,000+...
May I be so bold as to ask them to identify themselves?
Just curious...


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## cueball (May 24, 2005)

$300,000 a year ,,no way,,,! cuz if anyone made that much they wouldnt have time for piranha fury,,,,lol


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

cueball said:


> $300,000 a year ,,no way,,,! cuz if anyone made that much they wouldnt have time for piranha fury,,,,lol


I actually know many people that make 7 figures a year, one client of mine made 50 million last year alone.
I was just curious (as I'm sure most of us are...) who here is claiming >$300,000.


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## cueball (May 24, 2005)

like they say it takes money to make money....

i know its none of mine,, but ,,, what are you into stock market....oil.... what makes 50 millz yearly?


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

cueball said:


> like they say it takes money to make money....
> 
> i know its none of mine,, but ,,, what are you into stock market....oil.... what makes 50 millz yearly?


The client of mine who made that figure owns commercial realestate all over the country.

It's all relative.
Come to think of it, I have another client who started up a bank decades ago in California, and ended up selling it for appx. $800 million.


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## cueball (May 24, 2005)

so you own a realestate chain? must be good to live ware theres money,, um a dum fisherman and i make top dollar around my nabour hood.. its a shame if i ever want to realy get rich i well have to move out west mabe alberta canada is ware the moneys at now


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## notaverage (Sep 10, 2005)

Voted. 
Im 28 was at 55k...my company was bought out...the new company dropped all my benefits and expenses...( my insurance and wifes, car allowance, company credit card which paid for my vehicle maintenance and gas for my Navigator and wifes Ford Escape).....now the company brought me in to their company in which the managers supposedly start at 30k!!!! F that...they dropped my salary under 40k!!! they are giving me a company car that I have to PAY 100-200 a month for and its either a ford fusion or chevy cobalt
Needless to say im looking for a new JOB and buying a house at the same time in NJ (just had it inspected yesterday NO big issues!) Shitty times but I still have a job unlike many other managers in my old company so I guess I cant really complain can I?
Yeah anyway sorry for the rant and complaining!


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## joey'd (Oct 26, 2005)

fishguy1313 said:


> $300,000 a year ,,no way,,,! cuz if anyone made that much they wouldnt have time for piranha fury,,,,lol


I actually know many people that make 7 figures a year, one client of mine made 50 million last year alone.
I was just curious (as I'm sure most of us are...) who here is claiming >$300,000.








[/quote]
do any of these people own business and need computers and IT solutions? i work for a fortune 500 that is a major IT vendor to B2B


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

cueball said:


> so you own a realestate chain? must be good to live ware theres money,, um a dum fisherman and i make top dollar around my nabour hood.. its a shame if i ever want to realy get rich i well have to move out west mabe alberta canada is ware the moneys at now


No no no.
I don't own a realestate chain.
The client to whom I refer owns commercial realestate across the country.

Me, I own a company that has a carpet cleaning division, duct cleaning division and an oriental rug cleaning shop.
I also own the patent to a duct cleaning system that I manufacture and distribute to the US, Canada, Mexico, Australia and England.


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## Boobah (Jan 25, 2005)

jiggy must've comee back on the site to vote


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## Nevermind (Aug 16, 2007)

im 21 and put down 50-60 assuming the american and canadian dollar are on par. Got my t-4 the other day and it was 51300


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## C0Rey (Jan 7, 2006)

Boobah said:


> jiggy must've comee back on the site to vote












cant we unban him?!??!


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## kfreeman (Feb 14, 2008)

I Voted Today


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## C0Rey (Jan 7, 2006)

heres a cookie!


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## joey'd (Oct 26, 2005)

C0Rey said:


> jiggy must've comee back on the site to vote












cant we unban him?!??!
[/quote]
i second the notion and say we put it to a site vote


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## C0Rey (Jan 7, 2006)

do it!


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## PinKragon (Dec 28, 2005)

I agree we need jiggy back


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## [email protected]° (Jun 16, 2004)

31, and I make just under 80K

Pretty good for not having a degree...


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

Bake at 98.6° said:


> 31, and I make just under 80K
> 
> Pretty good for not having a degree...


Agree.
The most successful people I know have zero college education.

No degree here either... did $197,000 last year.


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## CorGravey (Feb 13, 2007)

Ahaha i am axctually a xcollege student, so i just voted for the amount i should be making when i graduate.


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## nismo driver (Jan 27, 2004)

im old and broke..

j/k but not really


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## cueball (May 24, 2005)

CorGravey said:


> Ahaha i am axctually a a xcollege student, so i just voted for the amount i should be making when i graduate.


a xcollege student???? you droped out...


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## StuartDanger (Aug 7, 2003)

21 and on about £23k so about $46k
i do work about 60hrs a week


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## armac (Nov 28, 2002)

on the last poll we had a couple that commented they made over 100k, personally I make about 88k, our cost of living down south is dirt cheap.


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## CorGravey (Feb 13, 2007)

cueball said:


> Ahaha i am axctually a a xcollege student, so i just voted for the amount i should be making when i graduate.


a xcollege student???? you droped out...
[/quote]

lol cue naw bud thats just a typo


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## lemmywinks (Jan 25, 2004)

19 yrs old. College student. Pullin just under 25k last year.

Should be makin a bit more in 6 years when I get out of fuckin school


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## [email protected]° (Jun 16, 2004)

armac said:


> on the last poll we had a couple that commented they made over 100k, personally I make about 88k, *our cost of living down south is dirt cheap.*


Thats my major problem...

I live in Northern New Jersey, and work in NYC

EVERYTHING costs so much!!

I spend nearly 40 dollars a day in Gas, Tolls, Parking, and if I dont bring food it runs even higher..


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

Bake at 98.6° said:


> on the last poll we had a couple that commented they made over 100k, personally I make about 88k, *our cost of living down south is dirt cheap.*


Thats my major problem...

I live in Northern New Jersey, and work in NYC

EVERYTHING costs so much!!

I spend nearly 40 dollars a day in Gas, Tolls, Parking, and if I dont bring food it runs even higher..
[/quote]

the only toll around me is if I cross into Iowa.

it's about $1.25.

cost of living is fairly inexpensive in Omaha area(NE)


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## [email protected]° (Jun 16, 2004)

It costs $6. to go thru the Lincoln Tunnel ($5. w/Easy pass)

I drive 80 miles round trip a day

Parking is $10. plus tip

A sandwich and a drink runs over $10.

The list goes on and on...


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## Mettle (Dec 29, 2003)

I think my income might be negative, haha.










Ahh yes, the life of a student.



Bake at 98.6° said:


> It costs $6. to go thru the Lincoln Tunnel ($5. w/Easy pass)
> 
> I drive 80 miles round trip a day
> 
> ...


Make a sandwich and bring a can of soda or a bottle of water or juice. BAM. You just saved $8.


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## [email protected]° (Jun 16, 2004)

Mettle said:


> It costs $6. to go thru the Lincoln Tunnel ($5. w/Easy pass)
> 
> I drive 80 miles round trip a day
> 
> ...


Make a sandwich and bring a can of soda or a bottle of water or juice. BAM. You just saved $8.
[/quote]

I do!!

Sometimes I forget, but most of the time I make extra food for dinner and bring in leftovers the next day...


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

Mettle said:


> It costs $6. to go thru the Lincoln Tunnel ($5. w/Easy pass)
> 
> I drive 80 miles round trip a day
> 
> ...


Make a sandwich and bring a can of soda or a bottle of water or juice. BAM. You just saved $8.
[/quote]

Bingo!
Excellent advice.

I have an employee that makes $12 an hour and tries to keep up with me when it comes to spending.
Espressos at every break, ordering lunch, this and that...

He's 25 years old!
When I was his age, I was eating Top Ramen and making peanutbutter sandwiches for lunch... and spreading the peanutbutter thin even!

My unsolicited advice:
Spend within your means... Think big, motivate toward the huge and spend small on the way there, investing every dollar you have toward your goal.
(And no, a $20 lunch is *not* your goal!)

p.s. Like 'Tom Cruise with an axe' said...
If you save $8 every day, that's almost $3,000 a year.
That's $15,000 in 5 years.
And that's enough to start your own business with.
(Especially if you invest it in a high-yield account!)


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## Ironhead (Nov 25, 2007)

Voted! Anyone gonna claim the 300k a year? If i made half
of that i'd skip to work I pulled in 47k this year, which is
less than last year cuz we didn't have sh*t for overtime,..


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## Guest (Feb 20, 2008)

lemmywinks said:


> 19 yrs old. College student. Pullin just under 25k last year.
> 
> Should be makin a bit more in 6 years when I get out of fuckin school


sh*t, you make 25k while attending your studies? What do you do?

I'm 19 and make around 12k these days. Although this year that will go down because of a larger class load, and 2 months in Africa.


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

Ironhead said:


> Voted! Anyone gonna claim the 300k a year? If i made half
> of that i'd skip to work I pulled in 47k this year, which is
> less than last year cuz we didn't have sh*t for overtime,..


Several times the $300,000+ people have been called out to identify themselves, and nobody has stepped forth.
The only conclusion I can make of this is that it's B.S.


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## armac (Nov 28, 2002)

expressos at every break, wow that must be the good life


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## lament configuration (Jun 22, 2003)

i was looking thru my old W2 from when i was a senior in college and i made 952 dollars for the whole year.


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## Mettle (Dec 29, 2003)

lament configuration said:


> i was looking thru my old W2 from when i was a senior in college and i made 952 dollars for the whole year.


I know people that do that... Up to $20/day at Starbucks. $5-$15/day for parking. Lunch out all the time. And then add on the drug habits that some have. (Up to $80/day for a couple.) It's rediculous when they complain they have no money. AND. The stupid amount of debt so many of them carry as well... If you're making $50k or more a year, there's no reason why you should be 'poor'.

One friend of mine got a job right out of college making $80k+ a year. At first she was BROKE. She had no idea how to manage her money. Living in a remote, northern town she would take tons of road trips and flying places and blah blah blah. Never had money. Always complaining about being poor... Then she got her head on right. In a year of proper finance management she has paid off about 80% of her student loan, paid off half of her new car, and has money invested as well as a "safety $5000" in the bank. It's pretty amazing what a little level-headedness can do...


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## lemmywinks (Jan 25, 2004)

DannyBoy17 said:


> 19 yrs old. College student. Pullin just under 25k last year.
> 
> Should be makin a bit more in 6 years when I get out of fuckin school


sh*t, you make 25k while attending your studies? What do you do?

I'm 19 and make around 12k these days. Although this year that will go down because of a larger class load, and 2 months in Africa.
[/quote]
Hah, I worked at a menards as an assistant manager. Menards is a lumber / home improvement store for those of you who dont know what one is. I only pulled in 19k from there and work on average 30+ hours a week now. During the summer I did alot of landscaping work and that helped me bring in quite a bit more


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## muskielover1 (Dec 7, 2004)

28 in april,welder.

brandon,welcome back from the dead.


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## hays98 (Mar 8, 2003)

27 income = enough for toys and the family


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## cueball (May 24, 2005)

30===hope for a raise next winter when dad retires ill make double that....( next year hopefuly)

nova scotia lobster fisherman,, Duh...!


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## Puff (Feb 14, 2005)

im 24 and am making under 30k...but i have a shitload of stocks...but that doesnt really count as income.


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## eddyhead (Nov 6, 2007)

Piranha_man said:


> 31, and I make just under 80K
> 
> Pretty good for not having a degree...


Agree.
The most successful people I know have zero college education.

No degree here either... did $197,000 last year.
[/quote]
Maybe i should quit college then lol

Congrats on your sucess


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

28, made about 120 last year...


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## Ja'eh (Jan 8, 2007)

Voted! I'm 29 and my income is in the $40,000 - $50,000 CDN range lol!


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## Dr. Giggles (Oct 18, 2003)

Ok, I'll admit it > 300,000 at 47 yo.

j/k My retirement nest egg is > 300,000 but my income currently is around $60K.


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

i'm 22 and according to my w-2, i made around $3,000 last year, which is less than i made when i was 15... i'm pretty much on the fast track to success.


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## Scrappy (Oct 21, 2004)

Piranha_man said:


> Agree.
> The most successful people I know have zero college education.
> 
> No degree here either... did $197,000 last year.


I agree too. I have a degree but it didn't help me get my current job and doesn't help me with my job performance in any way. The average wage at my work is $110k, but I'm on track for $138K. I might get lazy in the summer though and not work as much.


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## asian_redtail_catfish (Sep 25, 2003)

Scrappy said:


> Agree.
> The most successful people I know have zero college education.
> 
> No degree here either... did $197,000 last year.


I agree too. I have a degree but it didn't help me get my current job and doesn't help me with my job performance in any way. The average wage at my work is $110k, but I'm on track for $138K. I might get lazy in the summer though and not work as much.
[/quote]

Never knock a college degree off...If you get educated in a field, such as engineering, accounting, social services, teaching, etc, that person would be better off than a person without a college degree.

Also, some people learn a trade at school or go to some type of vocational school for some training..The thing is education is important and it does not have to be a college degree.

"The most succesful people I know have a zero college education." That is non sense..You should be talking about common everyday people and not bill gates or people who think outside of the box.


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## Wide_Eyed_Wanderer (Aug 22, 2006)

^ Thanks Mom.


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

29
has degree
makes enough to live extremely comfortably


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## User (May 31, 2004)

I'm doing better than the majority, I hope to open a second business this year.

Not bad for someone who started at $3.60 hr


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## Scrappy (Oct 21, 2004)

asian_redtail_catfish said:


> Never knock a college degree off...If you get educated in a field, such as engineering, accounting, social services, teaching, etc, that person would be better off than a person without a college degree.
> 
> Also, some people learn a trade at school or go to some type of vocational school for some training..The thing is education is important and it does not have to be a college degree.
> 
> "The most succesful people I know have a zero college education." That is non sense..You should be talking about common everyday people and not bill gates or people who think outside of the box.


I *am* knocking a college education. It's drilled into today's youth that they need it or they're worthless. All it means to most Americans today is a ton of debt for a worthless piece of paper. If you're already working and you use it for advancement or if you know for sure you'll have a job after you graduate, then it's great.

Maybe you should go back through this thread and count how many people make $75k+ with a degree and without.


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

Degree = less work, more pay...


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## Nick G (Jul 15, 2007)

Scrappy said:


> Never knock a college degree off...If you get educated in a field, such as engineering, accounting, social services, teaching, etc, that person would be better off than a person without a college degree.
> 
> Also, some people learn a trade at school or go to some type of vocational school for some training..The thing is education is important and it does not have to be a college degree.
> 
> "The most succesful people I know have a zero college education." That is non sense..You should be talking about common everyday people and not bill gates or people who think outside of the box.


I *am* knocking a college education. It's drilled into today's youth that they need it or they're worthless. All it means to most Americans today is a ton of debt for a worthless piece of paper. If you're already working and you use it for advancement or if you know for sure you'll have a job after you graduate, then it's great.

Maybe you should go back through this thread and count how many people make $75k+ with a degree and without.
[/quote]
i can agree with both of you.
i have a degree, but i had a job in my field before i even graduated (under the assumption that i would finish)
a college degree does open doors. 
But hard work and determination does too.
I think it depends what you want to do. different strokes for different folks.


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

Nick G said:


> Never knock a college degree off...If you get educated in a field, such as engineering, accounting, social services, teaching, etc, that person would be better off than a person without a college degree.
> 
> Also, some people learn a trade at school or go to some type of vocational school for some training..The thing is education is important and it does not have to be a college degree.
> 
> "The most succesful people I know have a zero college education." That is non sense..You should be talking about common everyday people and not bill gates or people who think outside of the box.


I *am* knocking a college education. It's drilled into today's youth that they need it or they're worthless. All it means to most Americans today is a ton of debt for a worthless piece of paper. If you're already working and you use it for advancement or if you know for sure you'll have a job after you graduate, then it's great.

Maybe you should go back through this thread and count how many people make $75k+ with a degree and without.
[/quote]
i can agree with both of you.
i have a degree, but i had a job in my field before i even graduated (under the assumption that i would finish)
a college degree does open doors. 
But hard work and determination does too.
I think it depends what you want to do. different strokes for different folks.
[/quote]

Agreed.


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## Boobah (Jan 25, 2005)

i'm 24 and did around $90k this year. Was a Slloooooow year in real estate (no sh*t, right?) I always tell all the kids in college who hear that and want to drop out to do real estate that it's not as easy as it looks. Unless you have an in (my aunt owns #1 real estate firm in our area). I really wish I'd stayed in college just so I could have some options one day if I wanted.


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## armac (Nov 28, 2002)

Boobah said:


> i'm 24 and did around $90k this year. Was a Slloooooow year in real estate (no sh*t, right?) I always tell all the kids in college who hear that and want to drop out to do real estate that it's not as easy as it looks. Unless you have an in (my aunt owns #1 real estate firm in our area). I really wish I'd stayed in college just so I could have some options one day if I wanted.


I know a lot of agents who are having to abandon the real estate market, with the drop in real estate prices, the tightening of credit and the general direction the economy is taking.

Kindo of a scary time for any sales position.


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## Boobah (Jan 25, 2005)

armac said:


> i'm 24 and did around $90k this year. Was a Slloooooow year in real estate (no sh*t, right?) I always tell all the kids in college who hear that and want to drop out to do real estate that it's not as easy as it looks. Unless you have an in (my aunt owns #1 real estate firm in our area). I really wish I'd stayed in college just so I could have some options one day if I wanted.


I know a lot of agents who are having to abandon the real estate market, with the drop in real estate prices, the tightening of credit and the general direction the economy is taking.

Kindo of a scary time for any sales position.
[/quote]

yeah i love it and hate it honestly. it sucks not having a ridiculous year like 2 years ago, but we're doing alright b/c we're second home/investment/vacation type property. on the flip side nothing makes me happier than seeing all these bored soccer mom's and people that got going b/c they thought they'd make a quick buck during the boom drop out. At the end the only people left are the good ones who don't mind working hard (or the homeless)


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

asian_redtail_catfish said:


> Agree.
> The most successful people I know have zero college education.
> 
> No degree here either... did $197,000 last year.


I agree too. I have a degree but it didn't help me get my current job and doesn't help me with my job performance in any way. The average wage at my work is $110k, but I'm on track for $138K. I might get lazy in the summer though and not work as much.
[/quote]

Never knock a college degree off...If you get educated in a field, such as engineering, accounting, social services, teaching, etc, that person would be better off than a person without a college degree.

Also, some people learn a trade at school or go to some type of vocational school for some training..The thing is education is important and it does not have to be a college degree.

"The most succesful people I know have a zero college education." That is non sense..You should be talking about common everyday people and not bill gates or people who think outside of the box.
[/quote]

Don't tell me that my statement about the most successful people I know have zero education is nonsense.
You don't know me, and you don't know the people I know.

I live in a city where 10% of the population is comprised of millionaires.
I have sat on boards and councils in this town, and being the founder/president/CEO of 2 successful companies myself, I rub elbows with other mega-successful business owners on a daily basis.
When I say "People I know," I'm not refering to people I read about in magazines or see on the news, I mean "People I know."

I barely graduated high school because I didn't give a sh*t and didn't spend a single minute in college.
I've found this to be the norm, not the exception amongst millionaires.

I don't like going around bragging about my successes, but ya kinda urk it outta me.
Yeah, I did $197,000 last year and am projected to do upwards of $500,000 in 2008 due to the launch of my invention.


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## armac (Nov 28, 2002)

Piranha_man said:


> Agree.
> The most successful people I know have zero college education.
> 
> No degree here either... did $197,000 last year.


I agree too. I have a degree but it didn't help me get my current job and doesn't help me with my job performance in any way. The average wage at my work is $110k, but I'm on track for $138K. I might get lazy in the summer though and not work as much.
[/quote]

Never knock a college degree off...If you get educated in a field, such as engineering, accounting, social services, teaching, etc, that person would be better off than a person without a college degree.

Also, some people learn a trade at school or go to some type of vocational school for some training..The thing is education is important and it does not have to be a college degree.

"The most succesful people I know have a zero college education." That is non sense..You should be talking about common everyday people and not bill gates or people who think outside of the box.
[/quote]

Don't tell me that my statement about the most successful people I know have zero education is nonsense.
You don't know me, and you don't know the people I know.

I live in a city where 10% of the population is comprised of millionaires.
I have sat on boards and councils in this town, and being the founder/president/CEO of 2 successful companies myself, I rub elbows with *other mega-successful business owners *on a daily basis.
When I say "People I know," I'm not refering to people I read about in magazines or see on the news, I mean "People I know."

I barely graduated high school because I didn't give a sh*t and didn't spend a single minute in college.
I've found this to be the norm, not the exception amongst millionaires.

I don't like going around bragging about my successes, but ya kinda urk it outta me.
Yeah, I did $197,000 last year and am projected to do upwards of $500,000 in 2008 due to the launch of my invention.
[/quote]

Mega successful................., you ever hurt your elbow patting yourself on the back?


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## Boobah (Jan 25, 2005)

Piranha_man said:


> Agree.
> The most successful people I know have zero college education.
> 
> No degree here either... did $197,000 last year.


I agree too. I have a degree but it didn't help me get my current job and doesn't help me with my job performance in any way. The average wage at my work is $110k, but I'm on track for $138K. I might get lazy in the summer though and not work as much.
[/quote]

Never knock a college degree off...If you get educated in a field, such as engineering, accounting, social services, teaching, etc, that person would be better off than a person without a college degree.

Also, some people learn a trade at school or go to some type of vocational school for some training..The thing is education is important and it does not have to be a college degree.

"The most succesful people I know have a zero college education." That is non sense..You should be talking about common everyday people and not bill gates or people who think outside of the box.
[/quote]

Don't tell me that my statement about the most successful people I know have zero education is nonsense.
You don't know me, and you don't know the people I know.

I live in a city where 10% of the population is comprised of millionaires.
I have sat on boards and councils in this town, and being the founder/president/CEO of 2 successful companies myself, I rub elbows with *other mega-successful business owners *on a daily basis.
When I say "People I know," I'm not refering to people I read about in magazines or see on the news, I mean "People I know."

I barely graduated high school because I didn't give a sh*t and didn't spend a single minute in college.
I've found this to be the norm, not the exception amongst millionaires.

I don't like going around bragging about my successes, but ya kinda urk it outta me.
Yeah, I did $197,000 last year and am projected to do upwards of $500,000 in 2008 due to the launch of my invention.
[/quote]

well jeez come buy a beach house or deepwater house from me. that'll show all those college boys


----------



## Enriqo_Suavez (Mar 31, 2004)

Funny, I also know a sh*t-ton of millionaires... And not a single one of them has LESS than an undergrad degree....

You may know some sucessful people with no degree, but by NO MEANS is that typical. You seem to have Kanye West Syndrome... An education is the only thing that NOBODY can take away from you, that you will ALWAYS have, and will open doors for you your entire life. You are an idiot to try and dissuade people from bettering themselves...


----------



## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

Enriqo_Suavez said:


> Funny, I also know a sh*t-ton of millionaires... And not a single one of them has LESS than an undergrad degree....
> 
> You may know some sucessful people with no degree, but by NO MEANS is that typical. You seem to have Kanye West Syndrome... An education is the only thing that NOBODY can take away from you, that you will ALWAYS have, and will open doors for you your entire life. You are an idiot to try and dissuade people from bettering themselves...


Okay, let me explain.
Pay attention. Take notes if you have to, 'cause you might learn something.

1.) Yes, it is very typical. The higher education system is a very expensive lesson on how to think a certain way. How to do things a certain way.
The most successful people in this world think for themselves.

2.) An education is not the only thing people can't take away from you. A high IQ is something people can't take away. Determination is another thing. So is intrinsic motivation. Courage. Creativity. The list goes on and on...

3.) There are countless people with "Impressive" degrees that are working labor jobs, working fast food and downright unemployed because of all the "Doors" that "Opened for them their entire life," as you put it.

4.) As for me being an "Idiot," no, I'm not. I am a highly intelligent individual. The military tested my I.Q. at 146 which is well above "Genius level."
Furthermore, I am not trying to "Dissuade" people from getting a college education, there is nothing in any of my earlier posts that even remotely hints at that.
If somebody wants to go to college, then great! Many careers require a degree.

All I'm saying is that the road to financial success is not paved with college degrees, it's paved with imagination, creativity, focus and drive.


----------



## nismo driver (Jan 27, 2004)

Scrappy said:


> Never knock a college degree off...If you get educated in a field, such as engineering, accounting, social services, teaching, etc, that person would be better off than a person without a college degree.
> 
> Also, some people learn a trade at school or go to some type of vocational school for some training..The thing is education is important and it does not have to be a college degree.
> 
> "The most succesful people I know have a zero college education." That is non sense..You should be talking about common everyday people and not bill gates or people who think outside of the box.


I *am* knocking a college education. It's drilled into today's youth that they need it or they're worthless. All it means to most Americans today is a ton of debt for a worthless piece of paper. If you're already working and you use it for advancement or if you know for sure you'll have a job after you graduate, then it's great.

Maybe you should go back through this thread and count how many people make $75k+ with a degree and without.
[/quote]

the problem isnt that business world requires a degree its that stupid people are not any lesss stupid just because they have a degree and pleople get stupid useless degrees. i see kids out of school stating at my company every year and id say maybe half of tehm left college with the ability to work in a professional environment and perform a trade of some kind.. the rest just have to bs there way through and struggle to learn how to do there jobs that in many cases they dont deserve. i hate seeing young managers leach off of the hard work of the older more skilled guys at the company but the corporate world is cut throat and the higher ups would rather pay younger more easily molded and manipulated less skill college grads to be managers then the older more skilled more stubborn people.. ( not always but this does happen or atleast i would do it that way if i was higher up )


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## scent troll (Apr 4, 2005)

theres a good rule of thumb some of you lesser experienced workers might not know. it is always who you know more than what you know. what you know gets you noticed, gets you in. but so does who you know. but who you know always moves you up! i have tasted success in fields i am highly unqualified for because i showed ambition, dependability, a good personality and a mature nature about my work. 
i am interviewing with my corporate managers tomorrow morning for a managerial job. i have no real previous exerience, but i wanted it, i met a few people, planted a few seeds, and wala.

i dont believe college is for everyone. obviously, the more people that attend college the less relevant and important it will be to furthering your future. if everyone has a bachelors degree, employers will always default to interviewing for level minded candidates. something they will not teach you in liberal college.


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## armac (Nov 28, 2002)

mega successful and a genius

can't argue with that

maybe you should run for President


----------



## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

armac said:


> mega successful and a genius
> 
> can't argue with that
> 
> maybe you should run for President


I appreciate the compliment, but I have no interest in politics.


----------



## hyphen (Apr 4, 2004)

keep it civil guys.

personally, money doesn't mean THAT much to me. i'd rather be doing what i enjoy. if that means i can't make become a mega-millionaire, oh well. if i can produce a product that people enjoy and celebrities love, that's good enough for me. as long as i'm well off, i'm fine. i don't need a ferrari, 5 bedroom house, or a wardrobe of armani suits to validate my existence or worth. that's for chumps.

also, to say that education is worthless or not needed...totally erroneous. spielberg (dropped out 1 year before graduating), katzenberg, lucas and some of the biggest filmmakers of all time are well educated in their field of study. good luck trying to become a successful visual effects artist or filmmaker without some sort of education.

iq and being able to think outside of the box also cannot be attributed to someone's success. there are too many factors to give credit to that alone. for every 1 successful high school dropout there will probably be 10 more successful graduates/educated people. this does not limit education to a university. there are trade schools and other forms of education.


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## Nick G (Jul 15, 2007)

hyphen said:


> keep it civil guys.
> 
> *personally, money doesn't mean THAT much to me. i'd rather be doing what i enjoy. if that means i can't make become a mega-millionaire, oh well. if i can produce a product that people enjoy and celebrities love, that's good enough for me. as long as i'm well off, i'm fine. i don't need a ferrari, 5 bedroom house, or a wardrobe of armani suits to validate my existence or worth. that's for chumps.*
> 
> ...


agreed. 
happiness is much more important than money any day of the week.


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## armac (Nov 28, 2002)

Piranha_man said:


> mega successful and a genius
> 
> can't argue with that
> 
> maybe you should run for President


I appreciate the compliment, but I have no interest in politics.
[/quote]

I was being sarcastic


----------



## Boobah (Jan 25, 2005)

it's equally as ignorant to say "you have to go to college to be successful" as it is to say "going to college is a waste of time" If the person has it in them they're going to be successful regardless.


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## C0Rey (Jan 7, 2006)

well in the "developed" world knowledge is being rendered useless and creativity, new invention and ideas are whats valuable.

but it doesnt hurt to know stuff either....


----------



## hyphen (Apr 4, 2004)

C0Rey said:


> well in the "developed" world knowledge is being rendered useless and creativity, new invention and ideas are whats valuable.
> 
> but it doesnt hurt to know stuff either....


that doesn't make any sense. any joe shmoe can "invent" something. but who is going to market it? who is going to produce it? who is going to engineer its practical functionality? it definitely isn't going to be that high school drop out with an IQ of 150. sure, there are creative designers and conceptual artists for car companies. but it takes educated people to make it work. and those engineers and developers, i guarantee, will be very educated.

knowledge will never be useless, but neither will creativity. just remember that anyone can come up with a good idea but not anyone can make it.


----------



## C0Rey (Jan 7, 2006)

hyphen said:


> well in the "developed" world knowledge is being rendered useless and creativity, new invention and ideas are whats valuable.
> 
> but it doesnt hurt to know stuff either....


that doesn't make any sense. any joe shmoe can "invent" something. but who is going to market it? who is going to produce it? who is going to engineer its practical functionality? it definitely isn't going to be that high school drop out with an IQ of 150. sure, there are creative designers and conceptual artists for car companies. but it takes educated people to make it work. and those engineers and developers, i guarantee, will be very educated.

knowledge will never be useless, but neither will creativity. just remember that anyone can come up with a good idea but not anyone can make it.
[/quote]

you missed the the fact that i stated "developed" world. why would a business man in Norway pay a Norwegian technician, engineer, manufacturer, service man or any "knowledge based worker, when i can pay 1/10 to a Chinese, polish or Indian guy. the developed countries need ideas not grunts. ofc ofc this is a very wide statement and does not apply to the entire population, we need someone with ground knowledge, but the real value is in new invention, business ideas etc. 1 example is two Swedish guys, that got an idea for Internet phone service. set up shop in eastern Europe, expanded their business in "developing" countries. and when the had some million customers sold the whole thing. every business in the world these days are seeing an extreme development in different technologies, but they have yet the ideas to apply them to any marked. they are willing to throw money at you if you give them a great idea.


----------



## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

College can increase the income potential in most cases*

*unless you are a "genius" - in which case you are already mega-successful and it is not needed


----------



## mdmedicine (Dec 20, 2004)

Piranha_man said:


> Funny, I also know a sh*t-ton of millionaires... And not a single one of them has LESS than an undergrad degree....
> 
> You may know some sucessful people with no degree, but by NO MEANS is that typical. You seem to have Kanye West Syndrome... An education is the only thing that NOBODY can take away from you, that you will ALWAYS have, and will open doors for you your entire life. You are an idiot to try and dissuade people from bettering themselves...


Okay, let me explain.
Pay attention. Take notes if you have to, 'cause you might learn something.

1.) Yes, it is very typical. The higher education system is a very expensive lesson on how to think a certain way. How to do things a certain way.
The most successful people in this world think for themselves.

2.) An education is not the only thing people can't take away from you. A high IQ is something people can't take away. Determination is another thing. So is intrinsic motivation. Courage. Creativity. The list goes on and on...

3.) There are countless people with "Impressive" degrees that are working labor jobs, working fast food and downright unemployed because of all the "Doors" that "Opened for them their entire life," as you put it.

4.) As for me being an "Idiot," no, I'm not. I am a highly intelligent individual. The military tested my I.Q. at 146 which is well above "Genius level."
Furthermore, I am not trying to "Dissuade" people from getting a college education, there is nothing in any of my earlier posts that even remotely hints at that.
If somebody wants to go to college, then great! Many careers require a degree.

All I'm saying is that the road to financial success is not paved with college degrees, it's paved with imagination, creativity, focus and drive.









[/quote]
Dude...You are 100% correct. 
My buddy made millions in Burger King, Taco Bell, and Applebeas. His First Burger King came when he was 19 years old. At age 30, he was convinced that most people thought he was just lucky and not smart so he proceeded to get a law degree, MBA, and medical degree (which is where I first met him). He now regrets all of it and wishes he spent that time continuing to make deals/money. Restaurant industry sucks now so he is slowly getting out of it in favor of hard money lending. 
College is wonderful and should be experienced by everyone because in our society, people really won't take you as seriously and also because more education is a good thing. To say that you need it to make money in this country is a crock of sh*t. Rich Dad Poor Dad, The Millionaire Next Door, The Accounting Game....all excellent books for people interested in becoming wealthy.


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom said:


> College can increase the income potential in most cases*
> 
> *unless you are a "genius" - in which case you are already mega-successful and it is not needed


Not all geniuses are successful.
Some run huge corporations, some work at McDonalds and I'm sure some are standing out on the sidewalk holding a sign that says "Hungry."

"Genius" only means a high degree of learning potential. Not everybody lives up to their potential.

p.s. If some on here are bothered in some way that I have a genius I.Q... then I'm really sorry that it upsets you so.
The odds are that I'm not the only one here with an I.Q. over 140.


----------



## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

Piranha_man said:


> College can increase the income potential in most cases*
> 
> *unless you are a "genius" - in which case you are already mega-successful and it is not needed


Not all geniuses are successful.
Some run huge corporations, some work at McDonalds and I'm sure some are standing out on the sidewalk holding a sign that says "Hungry."

"Genius" only means a high degree of learning potential. Not everybody lives up to their potential.

p.s. If some on here are bothered in some way that I have a genius I.Q... then I'm really sorry that it upsets you so.
The odds are that I'm not the only one here with an I.Q. over 140.
[/quote]

You upset me... my 40 IQ doesnt compare


----------



## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom said:


> College can increase the income potential in most cases*
> 
> *unless you are a "genius" - in which case you are already mega-successful and it is not needed


Not all geniuses are successful.
Some run huge corporations, some work at McDonalds and I'm sure some are standing out on the sidewalk holding a sign that says "Hungry."

"Genius" only means a high degree of learning potential. Not everybody lives up to their potential.

p.s. If some on here are bothered in some way that I have a genius I.Q... then I'm really sorry that it upsets you so.
The odds are that I'm not the only one here with an I.Q. over 140.
[/quote]

You upset me... my 40 IQ doesnt compare








[/quote]

Ahhh... don't feel bad man...
I would have guessed you at almost twice that!


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## smokinbubbles (Mar 25, 2005)

21 just over 30,000 a year


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

smokinbubbles said:


> 21 just over 30,000 a year


Excellent.
Nice to see us getting back on topic.


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## Enriqo_Suavez (Mar 31, 2004)

Piranha_man said:


> Okay, let me explain.
> Pay attention. Take notes if you have to, 'cause you might learn something.
> 
> 1.) Yes, it is very typical. The higher education system is a very expensive lesson on how to think a certain way. How to do things a certain way.
> ...


I listened closely, and you have some good points, however, it is still NOT TYPICAL.

True, a high IQ, determination, courage, creativity can't be taken away from you, and these are fantastic qualities that some people are BORN with (including myself, now that we are all blowing our own horns). But by themselves they aren't likely enough to bring in a huge income. However, coupled with an education in a relevant field they = guaranteed success. (By the way, which test did you take, and how does it compare to the Stanford-Binet? A 140 on the BCT/BT would be about a 135... Have you ever thought about joining Mensa?)

"Impressive" degrees? I assume you were being facetious. You're right, if you go to school for underwater basketweaving you probably won't get too far with it.

Anyways, yeah, I really don't fundamentally disagree with you, but it is a rare breed of person who actually has those intrinsic qualities and DOESN'T go to school. And for the lazy/stupid, college won't help much. But for all those in the middle, a real degree (e.g. don't go to school unless you know WHY you are going) is going to give them opportunities that would otherwise be unavailable to them.

They key to building wealth, at any income level, is really to stop being so f*cking stupid with your money. I agree with md, Rich Dad Poor Dad and The Millionaire Next Door are great books. Don't ever take out a loan on a depreciating asset etc... INVEST your money don't blow it on jewelry, clothes, etc...

I could talk about this for hours... You know there are problems when people making half as much money as me have bought themselves twice as much nice sh*t.


----------



## hyphen (Apr 4, 2004)

C0Rey said:


> well in the "developed" world knowledge is being rendered useless and creativity, new invention and ideas are whats valuable.
> 
> but it doesnt hurt to know stuff either....


that doesn't make any sense. any joe shmoe can "invent" something. but who is going to market it? who is going to produce it? who is going to engineer its practical functionality? it definitely isn't going to be that high school drop out with an IQ of 150. sure, there are creative designers and conceptual artists for car companies. but it takes educated people to make it work. and those engineers and developers, i guarantee, will be very educated.

knowledge will never be useless, but neither will creativity. just remember that anyone can come up with a good idea but not anyone can make it.
[/quote]

you missed the the fact that i stated "developed" world. why would a business man in Norway pay a Norwegian technician, engineer, manufacturer, service man or any "knowledge based worker, when i can pay 1/10 to a Chinese, polish or Indian guy. the developed countries need ideas not grunts. ofc ofc this is a very wide statement and does not apply to the entire population, we need someone with ground knowledge, but the real value is in new invention, business ideas etc. 1 example is two Swedish guys, that got an idea for Internet phone service. set up shop in eastern Europe, expanded their business in "developing" countries. and when the had some million customers sold the whole thing. every business in the world these days are seeing an extreme development in different technologies, but they have yet the ideas to apply them to any marked. they are willing to throw money at you if you give them a great idea.
[/quote]

i wasn't aware that china and poland were considered "undeveloped" countries. the only fact is that we outsource cheap labor. you're not going to find an engineer with a master's anywhere that will work cheap. you outsource your labor, not your design and engineering. labor requires very little education, hence they get very little pay. you don't see honda, ford, gmc or toyota outsourcing their engineers and designers. no, they all work in-house. you don't see infinity ward, blizzard or naughty dog outsourcing their programmers and level designers. pixar doesn't outsource their animators. because those are fields that require education or an extremely high level of skill.

you have a slightly skewed idea of what outsourcing is but i understand your point. new ideas and creativity is something everyone wants. but to say that "knowledge is being rendered useless" is silly. and again, a good idea is nothing but a good idea without someone who can make it reality.


----------



## mdmedicine (Dec 20, 2004)

Enriqo_Suavez said:


> Okay, let me explain.
> Pay attention. Take notes if you have to, 'cause you might learn something.
> 
> 1.) Yes, it is very typical. The higher education system is a very expensive lesson on how to think a certain way. How to do things a certain way.
> ...


I listened closely, and you have some good points, however, it is still NOT TYPICAL.

True, a high IQ, determination, courage, creativity can't be taken away from you, and these are fantastic qualities that some people are BORN with (including myself, now that we are all blowing our own horns). But by themselves they aren't likely enough to bring in a huge income. However, coupled with an education in a relevant field they = guaranteed success. (By the way, which test did you take, and how does it compare to the Stanford-Binet? A 140 on the BCT/BT would be about a 135... Have you ever thought about joining Mensa?)

"Impressive" degrees? I assume you were being facetious. You're right, if you go to school for underwater basketweaving you probably won't get too far with it.

Anyways, yeah, I really don't fundamentally disagree with you, but it is a rare breed of person who actually has those intrinsic qualities and DOESN'T go to school. And for the lazy/stupid, college won't help much. But for all those in the middle, a real degree (e.g. don't go to school unless you know WHY you are going) is going to give them opportunities that would otherwise be unavailable to them.

They key to building wealth, at any income level, is really to stop being so f*cking stupid with your money. I agree with md, Rich Dad Poor Dad and The Millionaire Next Door are great books. Don't ever take out a loan on a depreciating asset etc... INVEST your money don't blow it on jewelry, clothes, etc...

I could talk about this for hours... You know there are problems when people making half as much money as me have bought themselves twice as much nice sh*t.
[/quote]

Exactly man. I don't always follow it as closely as I should though. We all have our weaknesses. Mine is electronics and gadgets. My buddy will MAKE SURE he buys the cheapest piece of sh*t laptop (he just paid $299 for one that sucks in my opinion) but, his weakness being food, he will spend $100/day taking him and his friends to lunch. I have to have the top of the line laptop when I buy one. But, for the most part, I try to follow the Rich Dad Poor Dad/Millionaire Next Door model....as does my friend. Of course, he is about $15 million ahead of me....but I am trying.


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

we all know having a degree means your destined to be on well fair or homeless while those that didn't graduate high school will end up making millions.

some of these posts are ssa sdrawkcab.


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

Based on the last few posts, it appears that for the most part, we agree on the key points.
(Except for the post right above this one that talks about "Well fair," whatever that is...) I would guess he's refering to some kind of a carnival?


----------



## Puff (Feb 14, 2005)

IQ tests are flawed.

i wrote one one time stoned out my mind, and got a 134.

'nuff said


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## Nick G (Jul 15, 2007)

06 C6 LS2 said:


> *ssa sdrawkcab*


?

/backwards ass
NM


----------



## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

Nick G said:


> *ssa sdrawkcab*


?

/backwards ass
NM
[/quote]

or ass backwards


----------



## C0Rey (Jan 7, 2006)

hyphen said:


> well in the "developed" world knowledge is being rendered useless and creativity, new invention and ideas are whats valuable.
> 
> but it doesnt hurt to know stuff either....


that doesn't make any sense. any joe shmoe can "invent" something. but who is going to market it? who is going to produce it? who is going to engineer its practical functionality? it definitely isn't going to be that high school drop out with an IQ of 150. sure, there are creative designers and conceptual artists for car companies. but it takes educated people to make it work. and those engineers and developers, i guarantee, will be very educated.

knowledge will never be useless, but neither will creativity. just remember that anyone can come up with a good idea but not anyone can make it.
[/quote]

you missed the the fact that i stated "developed" world. why would a business man in Norway pay a Norwegian technician, engineer, manufacturer, service man or any "knowledge based worker, when i can pay 1/10 to a Chinese, polish or Indian guy. the developed countries need ideas not grunts. ofc ofc this is a very wide statement and does not apply to the entire population, we need someone with ground knowledge, but the real value is in new invention, business ideas etc. 1 example is two Swedish guys, that got an idea for Internet phone service. set up shop in eastern Europe, expanded their business in "developing" countries. and when the had some million customers sold the whole thing. every business in the world these days are seeing an extreme development in different technologies, but they have yet the ideas to apply them to any marked. they are willing to throw money at you if you give them a great idea.
[/quote]

i wasn't aware that china and poland were considered "undeveloped" countries. the only fact is that we outsource cheap labor. you're not going to find an engineer with a master's anywhere that will work cheap. you outsource your labor, not your design and engineering. labor requires very little education, hence they get very little pay. you don't see honda, ford, gmc or toyota outsourcing their engineers and designers. no, they all work in-house. you don't see infinity ward, blizzard or naughty dog outsourcing their programmers and level designers. pixar doesn't outsource their animators. because those are fields that require education or an extremely high level of skill.

you have a slightly skewed idea of what outsourcing is but i understand your point. new ideas and creativity is something everyone wants. but to say that "knowledge is being rendered useless" is silly. and again, a good idea is nothing but a good idea without someone who can make it reality.
[/quote]

but there is no lack of programmers nor engineers anymore. and ofc knowledge will never be useless, i didnt mean for that to be taken literally, more to make a point. 
were i got this from was a dude that won speech of the year in 2007, id show it to you but you wouldnt understand it (in swedish). he probably makes more sense than me. now every base of operation needs people with extreme skills and great amounts of knowledge, but i bet blizzard is looking harder for some guy/girl with new ideas that will bring their gaming to the next level, rather then another programmer. ( i bet china can give them programmers that will work for 1 buck an hour) (and polan might not be characterized as a developing country but its not far from it)


----------



## armac (Nov 28, 2002)

M0RpH said:


> theres a good rule of thumb some of you lesser experienced workers might not know. it is always who you know more than what you know. what you know gets you noticed, gets you in. but so does who you know. but who you know always moves you up! i have tasted success in fields i am highly unqualified for because i showed ambition, dependability, a good personality and a mature nature about my work.
> i am interviewing with my corporate managers tomorrow morning for a managerial job. i have no real previous exerience, but i wanted it, i met a few people, planted a few seeds, and wala.
> 
> i dont believe college is for everyone. obviously, the more people that attend college the less relevant and important it will be to furthering your future. if everyone has a bachelors degree, employers will always default to interviewing for level minded candidates. something they will not teach you in liberal college.


wala!

did you get the job?


----------



## Guest (Mar 5, 2008)

It's such a silly thing to argue about life decisions like this, we are all living completely different lives, with different interpretations of what's happening and what has meaning.

I would say that from what I've learned, the top four variables which make people successful AND grounded/balanced are:

1. Passion
2. Commitment
3. Knowledge
4. Perspective

That is what I have learned in 19 years, I don't think it will be much different after another 19.


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## mdmedicine (Dec 20, 2004)

DannyBoy17 said:


> It's such a silly thing to argue about life decisions like this, we are all living completely different lives, with different interpretations of what's happening and what has meaning.
> 
> I would say that from what I've learned, the top four variables which make people successful AND grounded/balanced are:
> 
> ...


Except that for gaining wealth (usually involving a level of risk) too much knowledge can be a deterrent.....called paralysis of analysis. Knowing what I know now, I may never have entered into the business decisions I did when I was younger (which were plenty successful).


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## Guest (Mar 5, 2008)

So what does that have to do with what I said?


----------



## mdmedicine (Dec 20, 2004)

DannyBoy17 said:


> So what does that have to do with what I said?


Do I really have to explain your post to you? I took one of your four listed (likely googled) variables...variables you believe require balance if one is to be successful...and then I commented on it. Are you perplexed? Did you believe your post to be so well thought out as to make unnecessary any further discussion?


----------



## hyphen (Apr 4, 2004)

C0Rey said:


> but there is no lack of programmers nor engineers anymore. and ofc knowledge will never be useless, i didnt mean for that to be taken literally, more to make a point.
> were i got this from was a dude that won speech of the year in 2007, id show it to you but you wouldnt understand it (in swedish). he probably makes more sense than me. now every base of operation needs people with extreme skills and great amounts of knowledge, but i bet blizzard is looking harder for some guy/girl with new ideas that will bring their gaming to the next level, rather then another programmer. ( i bet china can give them programmers that will work for 1 buck an hour) (and polan might not be characterized as a developing country but its not far from it)


what i'm getting at though, is that generally speaking, a company will not hire you just because you can come up with a cool idea. blizzard will not hire some random fan that has some uber sweet ideas for a game, there are plenty of those. they will however hire an art director with a keen sense of what is eye catching and attention drawing. you may or may not know, but art directors are not your average uneducated, under experienced worker. they want innovation just as much as functional creators.

if blizzard or my company wanted a cheap programmer or designer they would have already gotten them. but instead they choose to pay experienced, well educated people. you get what you pay for in the entertainment industry. if you want a $1 a day programmer from india then i can guarantee you will not be producing a multi-million dollar game, win consecutive game of the year awards or be recognized as a studio that has moved the industry forward in innovation.

look at call of duty 3 compared to call of duty 4. cod3 got crap reviews, crap acknowledgment, and won no awards as far as i know. coincidentally, treyarch outsourced a great deal of their assets and used unpaid college interns to clean them up. then look at cod4, more awards than i count with both hands, international recognition and acclaimed at the past GDC. everything was in-house.

when you go into an interview the interviewers are not going to say, "so, what uber ideas do you have?" no, they will look at your experience and quality of work. once you're hired you can pitch ideas, but it's just not as simple as you're making it out to be. a studio that produces AAA titles is not going to hire you based on what ideas you have in your head alone, they will hire you based on what you can produce...and you can't just produce award winning quality work without some sort of education. there are always exceptions, but education is education, you have to learn the ropes one way or another.


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## nameless (Oct 17, 2006)

Voted...


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## C0Rey (Jan 7, 2006)

hyphen said:


> but there is no lack of programmers nor engineers anymore. and ofc knowledge will never be useless, i didnt mean for that to be taken literally, more to make a point.
> were i got this from was a dude that won speech of the year in 2007, id show it to you but you wouldnt understand it (in swedish). he probably makes more sense than me. now every base of operation needs people with extreme skills and great amounts of knowledge, but i bet blizzard is looking harder for some guy/girl with new ideas that will bring their gaming to the next level, rather then another programmer. ( i bet china can give them programmers that will work for 1 buck an hour) (and polan might not be characterized as a developing country but its not far from it)


what i'm getting at though, is that generally speaking, a company will not hire you just because you can come up with a cool idea. blizzard will not hire some random fan that has some uber sweet ideas for a game, there are plenty of those. they will however hire an art director with a keen sense of what is eye catching and attention drawing. you may or may not know, but art directors are not your average uneducated, under experienced worker. they want innovation just as much as functional creators.

if blizzard or my company wanted a cheap programmer or designer they would have already gotten them. but instead they choose to pay experienced, well educated people. you get what you pay for in the entertainment industry. if you want a $1 a day programmer from india then i can guarantee you will not be producing a multi-million dollar game, win consecutive game of the year awards or be recognized as a studio that has moved the industry forward in innovation.

look at call of duty 3 compared to call of duty 4. cod3 got crap reviews, crap acknowledgment, and won no awards as far as i know. coincidentally, treyarch outsourced a great deal of their assets and used unpaid college interns to clean them up. then look at cod4, more awards than i count with both hands, international recognition and acclaimed at the past GDC. everything was in-house.

when you go into an interview the interviewers are not going to say, "so, what uber ideas do you have?" no, they will look at your experience and quality of work. once you're hired you can pitch ideas, but it's just not as simple as you're making it out to be. a studio that produces AAA titles is not going to hire you based on what ideas you have in your head alone, they will hire you based on what you can produce...and you can't just produce award winning quality work without some sort of education. there are always exceptions, but education is education, you have to learn the ropes one way or another.
[/quote]

i think were i got off a bit wrong was its more meant as a general statement to developed countries as a whole. things have stagnated alot in many countries over the last years, so we need people with ideas and inspirations to adapt all the new technology to society. while we rut in the same "already developed standards that go back 30 years" the developing countries are flying by us. if we had the ideas, getting the job done would be simple, outsource it. 1 example was a huge paint production company, they had invented a way to make paint look a different color than what it really was, ok great so you have green color that looks absolutely black. what do you do with it? what good is this paint if you have no where to apply it? an idea was to paint cars with this color seeing it would react as a green color to sunlight and not overheat the car as a black paint would. 
anyhow this man the speaker had spoken do alot of executives and they all said the same, you wont believe the what has happened to us over just the last 5 years, we are making so much progress, but we need ways to apply it to our markets. anyhow i thought the goofy looking swede made alot of sense. guess i just suck at relaying it.


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## Guest (Mar 6, 2008)

mdmedicine said:


> So what does that have to do with what I said?


Do I really have to explain your post to you? I took one of your four listed (likely googled) variables...variables you believe require balance if one is to be successful...and then I commented on it. Are you perplexed? Did you believe your post to be so well thought out as to make unnecessary any further discussion?
[/quote]








Googled? Haha. That's just silly.


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## boxer (Sep 11, 2003)

22, i make under 12k a year serving tables. when i graduate, my starting average salary is 70k. i will be a physical therapist. i have a long way to go because i need a doctorate.


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

boxer said:


> 22, i make under 12k a year serving tables. when i graduate, my starting average salary is 70k. i will be a physical therapist. i have a long way to go because i need a doctorate.


So what... keep chugging along man...!


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