# Bringing a Newbie to Novice (Updated 2-3 - re-scaped)



## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Hi all, I know there are a decent amount of people here who really know there stuff when it comes to planted tanks hence why I am confident that with your help we can make this work. I had started about 2 months back with a few plants after falling in love with some planted rbp tanks and decided that I wanted to tackle this project. I figured with such a great resource for information out of the Aquatic Plants section out of P-Fury that there should be no reason why I could not make this work.

Anyway, with your help, I will be posting the phases of the tank, readings, and life cycle most likely once a week. I will snap a pic every saturday so we can all view progress.

Now, the tank is not newly planted, its been going for about a month although there have been a lot of changes in the interim.

Let me first describe the setup:

55 gallon tank - standard 48"
-fluval 305 canister filter
-temp is currently 79
-ph is 6.4
-nitrate 40
-nitrite 0
-ammonia 0
-the last reading I had on CO2PPM was 22
-Powerhead
-co2 running at 3bps
-Black fine gravel substrate with flourish root tabs
-Currently only dosing API leaf zone and Flourish Comprehensive weekly
-The CO2 setup consists of a 5lb tank, bubble counter, and glass diffuser
-Coralife 48" 130 watt 6700K light 
-The CO2 and lights are on a 12 hour cycle, on during the night off during the day
-During the 12 hour day shift I'm running a O2 bubbler to give the P's some breathing water. Seems like at the last 2 hours of the night (CO2 cycle) shift they are gasping, not at the surface, actually not gasping, just breathing more heavily.
- There are currently 2 RBPs at about 4 to 5 inches and 15 cardinal tetras
- Tank has been up and running for about 5 months, about a month with plants.
- The filter and power head are running 24/7 currently.
I'll have to do a double check again to see what plants I physically have but some that I know are chain swords, amazon swords, ludwigia, java moss.

Here are some crappy pics of the past week's growth with the new Coralife, CO2 and ferts. Prior to last week I was running about 70 watts, no CO2 and no ferts.

Last week:
View attachment 176759


This week:
View attachment 176760


As you'll notice the Pacu has been moved to a different tank, and I tried to rescape a little bit. I did run into some problems with Diatoms which seem to be halting although still around. I did add some algae med which was safe for fish and plants. Not sure if that was the way to go....

Ok now, where do I start and go from here, what do I need in addition, your efforts will not go unrecognized!!!!


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## Piranha Guru (Nov 24, 2005)

Turn off the bubbler during the day...the plants should be releasing plenty of O2 then and all you are doing is adding surface agitation which will cost you to lose more CO2. You only would need to run the bubbler at night, but instead I would put your CO2 regulator on a the timer with your lights since CO2 really isn't needed at night. I usually don't run my lights and CO2 for more than 10hours as it helps prevent/control algae outbreaks, but 12 is fine.


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

BioTeAcH said:


> Turn off the bubbler during the day...the plants should be releasing plenty of O2 then and all you are doing is adding surface agitation which will cost you to lose more CO2. You only would need to run the bubbler at night, but instead I would put your CO2 regulator on a the timer with your lights since CO2 really isn't needed at night. I usually don't run my lights and CO2 for more than 10hours as it helps prevent/control algae outbreaks, but 12 is fine.


I have them on a 12 12 schedule right now, only thing is the schedule is reversed with actual day and night. I'm not home until about 10PM everynight where I usually spend most of my time with the tank. Right now the CO2 and lights come on at 7PM and run to 7AM at which time they turn off and go into "night mode" which would really be during the day. Are you saying I should switch this over? I get kind of worried during the day with things switching over, too worried about electrical fires while I'm away. Especially living in an apartment.....


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## ryanimpreza (Jul 19, 2006)

roccov12345 said:


> Turn off the bubbler during the day...the plants should be releasing plenty of O2 then and all you are doing is adding surface agitation which will cost you to lose more CO2. You only would need to run the bubbler at night, but instead I would put your CO2 regulator on a the timer with your lights since CO2 really isn't needed at night. I usually don't run my lights and CO2 for more than 10hours as it helps prevent/control algae outbreaks, but 12 is fine.


I have them on a 12 12 schedule right now, only thing is the schedule is reversed with actual day and night. I'm not home until about 10PM everynight where I usually spend most of my time with the tank. Right now the CO2 and lights come on at 7PM and run to 7AM at which time they turn off and go into "night mode" which would really be during the day. Are you saying I should switch this over? I get kind of worried during the day with things switching over, too worried about electrical fires while I'm away. Especially living in an apartment.....
[/quote]
12 hours to me is to much. you really only need 8 hours of light with 8 hours of co2.


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## maknwar (Jul 16, 2007)

8 hours is good enough. Doesnt matter what time you have it come on and off, just keep it constant. I have mine come on at 3pm and go off at 11pm. When you say that they are struggling for air during the last 2 hours, that tells me that co2 is being built up and not being used fast enough. How do you know your co2 level is at 22 ppm? I am thinking that you need to 1) get a drop checker for the co2. 2)turn down the co2 a bit. 3)leave the light and co2 on for 8-10 hours max.

Your nitrates are a little high, so keep an eye on them. They should go down pretty fast, usually about 5-10 ppm a day, if not check your nitrate test. What kind of ferts you using?


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## Piranha Guru (Nov 24, 2005)

maknwar said:


> When you say that they are struggling for air during the last 2 hours, that tells me that co2 is being built up and not being used fast enough.


It's the last 2 hours of night (darkness)...the CO2 is building up over night because it isn't being used (no photosynthesis). If he's going to leave the CO2 on at night, then that is when he needs to run the bubbler. IMO that is a waste and the CO2 should go on and off with the lights.


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## maknwar (Jul 16, 2007)

Bio, I think he is saying that he has the lights and co2 on at night and the lights and co2 off during the day.


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## Piranha Guru (Nov 24, 2005)

maknwar said:


> Bio, I think he is saying that he has the lights and co2 on at night and the lights and co2 off during the day.


Gotcha...his day shift is really a night shift and vice/versa. Sometimes too much information is bad!


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Yes that's accurate, sorry for the confusion yes night and day cycles are reversed with actual night and day. I was actually thinking that the 12 hour light cycle was too much. I lowered the cycle down to 9 hours light and co2. Yes, the CO2 and lights are on a timer, thus when timer goes off co2 and light are off.

On the CO2, I actually have the test kit. Two droppers in 10 ml of water. Basically count the 2nd dropper and multiply by 2. I'll take a co2, kh and ph reading right now.


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Well took a co2 test and I'm at 38PPM....PH was a little on the low side at 6.2...

View attachment 176775


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## maknwar (Jul 16, 2007)

whats your ph from the tap? Whats your kh?


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

maknwar said:


> whats your ph from the tap? Whats your kh?


PH from tap is 6.8, I'll have to take a KH reading when I get home later on tonight when I get out of class. The last KH reading I had was 4. That was mid week last week.


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Still having a pretty difficult problem with these damn brown diatoms.......GRRR


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## ryanimpreza (Jul 19, 2006)

are those browns things on java ferns if so can you get a pic of it. It could be reproducing more ferns if so. are those java ferns or amazon swords


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

ryanimpreza said:


> are those browns things on java ferns if so can you get a pic of it. It could be reproducing more ferns if so. are those java ferns or amazon swords


No I have a fern in there but I luckily read my plant hand book before I started pulling off the dead leaves. Amazon swords are the large ones in the middle. I'll take some close ups of my issue tonight.


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## Trigga (Jul 1, 2006)

sorry to derail but man that tank is awesome good job with it


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Trigga said:


> sorry to derail but man that tank is awesome good job with it


Thanks brotha!


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

ryanimpreza said:


> are those browns things on java ferns if so can you get a pic of it. It could be reproducing more ferns if so. are those java ferns or amazon swords


I think I read your question wrong. I do have a fern although you can't see it in these pics its in the back, if you're thinking about the brown in the front, it's actually a small piece of driftwood which is anchoring the java moss, the other brown pieces are actual leaves from the swords that have turned brown not because they are dead but they are brown because of the diatoms... ugh


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)

Tank Looks great keep it up, If keeping plants is something your going to do for a long while this will save you some Money , As far as the diatoms try a bnp or some otto's


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Ok so I was fooling with the settings on the camera and I was able to get some more descriptive pictures so to speak.

Decent side shot of the tank:
View attachment 176878


You'll start to notice the plague of brown algae
View attachment 176879


Little bit closer
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Closer shot of the algae and these undefined white spots
View attachment 176881


These are the plants I could not identify, again covered in this annoying crap...
View attachment 176882


I'm obviously having some hills to get over but I figure once I can get these things figure out I should be good to go.....



Ba20 said:


> Tank Looks great keep it up, If keeping plants is something your going to do for a long while this will save you some Money , As far as the diatoms try a bnp or some otto's


Just what I was looking for, thank you!!!!


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)

n/p hit me up if you need anything im sure i can get you pointed in the right direction, This one will give you a good algae list and how to solve em !


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Quick update pic from the camera phone. Just got done cleaning the tank so the water is a little cloudy...

View attachment 176923


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

I think that looks very nice

Good job!


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Having troubles getting a decent pic ahh well.

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DiPpY eGgS said:


> I think that looks very nice
> 
> Good job!


Thanks!


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Here's some updated pictures approximately 5 days since my last post above. Seems like the brown algae has completely stopped spreading, did have some hair algae but that was pretty easy to take care of. The swords are growing at a rate a lot quicker than the others. Seems like everything is finally going a little bit smoother. I will add that it seems like with the large amount of plants that my water is crystal clear. A lot clearer than it has been in the past!









Forgive me for the camera phone pics.....

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## ju5tin95 (Nov 25, 2008)

what did you do to control the brown algae?? i got some thats been on my plants not much but some


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

ju5tin95 said:


> what did you do to control the brown algae?? i got some thats been on my plants not much but some


Basically rubbed it off every leaf as much as I could and hit the tank with a week of "Tetra Algae Control" which reads safe for plants and fish. Picked it up at petsmart without any hopes and I was surprised by the outcome.


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## lo4life (Aug 12, 2008)

You got some nice growth roccov!!


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

So I moved into a new apartment last weekend and what better time to redecorate than when moving the tank?

I had added 4 bags of seachem black sand and that wasn't enough so I added another bag of eco-complete (nobody had any seachem in stock). I thinned out probably 2 lbs of amazon sword leaves as it was getting out of control. I'm hoping that it starts to fill in nice, we'll see what happens........I think I need something else, it's just not getting the extra wow that I'm looking for.

I also ditched the black back drop, looks cleaner without it......

































Any ideas on how to make this look legit? Or keep everything as is. I did move the Java Fern to the center and pushed the grass up a bit.....


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

What I'm hoping for......any other ideas?


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## Murphy18 (Oct 17, 2008)

I really like your setup, good job







. How long have you had those tetra in there for? my record so far is about 9 days


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Murphy18 said:


> I really like your setup, good job
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I think I hit 14 days total. LOL They were slowly disappearing. Every time after the lights went off for the night cycle and came back on there were about 3 missing..... Oh well, they were nice while they lasted!


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## lo4life (Aug 12, 2008)

New setup looks great rocco!!


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## Ibanez247 (Nov 9, 2006)

I like it! Im thinkign of doing a lot of swords again. A few years ago my tank looked similar. Swords and vals everywhere. Looked like a jungle. Only saw my reds during feedings then they disappeared into the green jungle lol. I never had algae problems when I had large amounts of plants. Ever since I thined them out its been an issue. My LFS just got a huge stock of plants so Im thinking of going back tonight and getting more swords. Looking good. Hopefully it grows in like you're planning.


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Thanks guys, things are coming along, seems like I'm going through a growth stunt, possibly from moving things over and disrupting the roots. Other than that, did see some brown diatoms coming back again after thinning the swords out heavily. We'll see how that goes.......


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

well for some odd reason how half of my swords decided to kick the bucket.....wtf!!!!! the only thing I can think of is that I may have buried them a little too deep when I put them in.....they were starting to turn translucent from the centers out, then yellow and crunchy....damnit! I did run out of CO2 for a day but I don't think that could of done it. The only other thing I can think of is I was treating my P with salt and melafix for three days...maybe that was the culprit? No idea. Anyway had to rescape again because it was too bare. I'll shoot some updated pics.


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## maknwar (Jul 16, 2007)

Possibly ran out of nutrients? Few of my Echinodorus Uruguayensis did the same, but I an thinking they dont like the lower light and non co2. Good thing to do also, is make sure you have some nutrients in there with clay substrates like flourite cause they soak up nutrients to store them.


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

roccov12345 said:


> well for some odd reason how half of my swords decided to kick the bucket.....wtf!!!!! the only thing I can think of is that I may have buried them a little too deep when I put them in.....they were starting to turn translucent from the centers out, then yellow and crunchy....damnit! I did run out of CO2 for a day but I don't think that could of done it. The only other thing I can think of is I was treating my P with salt and melafix for three days...maybe that was the culprit? No idea. Anyway had to rescape again because it was too bare. I'll shoot some updated pics.


The salt and melafix could have been the source of the problem..

Sorry to hear, the tank was looking so nice.. bummer


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Thanks for the replies, I stopped the salt and melafix for my p's burn wound about 2 days ago now since I was assuming this may of been the issue. I need your help do come up with a steady nutrient dosing schedule

PLEASE CHIME IN: If you were a chef, what are your recommended ingredients. I think this is still the area that I'm not doing as good as I could be.

Here are some crappy updated pics of the rescape since the die off....


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

I think that looks really nice, man

Not sure if you know this, but since you rescaped recently, doing 50-60%
weekly water changes, and cleaning the filters really helps things out in a planted tank


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

DiPpY eGgS said:


> I think that looks really nice, man
> 
> Not sure if you know this, but since you rescaped recently, doing 50-60%
> weekly water changes, and cleaning the filters really helps things out in a planted tank


Are you talking about as it effects the clarity of the water or the well-being of the plants?


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