# New Plant Setup... And New Light! WOOT!



## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

well lets see how i am with managin a couple topics on different threads at one time..









I just got my 125 gallon as many of you may have heard and i am looking into a sand + live plants combination... but the only problem is... I have no idea where to start...








I have never used live plants before this and am wondering what i should do.. I want a sanded tank because it looks more natural to me and i think a fully planted aquarium would make the RB's feel at home.

I am mainly needing help as to where to start.

I have a list of plants i will use

Thanks for reading and posting!









Steve


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

Post up the plant variants you will be using, and it will help.
Sand works ok, but I would like to share that most planted tank 'gurus' who use sand, use it as negative space up front or wherever, and use a plastic divider to divide where the sand, and plant substrate meet.
Here is a good example:









You can just use sand, but I wanted to share that with you, because Plant substrate works much better *IMO* for growing the best quality plants.
Pressurized CO2 is ALWAYS the best way to go, so consider getting it for your planted tank. Flourish excell comes in 2nd, and DIY yeast/sugar co2 3rd. All will raise the cost of your setup, but well worth it.
Some plants and aquarium inhabitants do not fair well with excell though.

Lighting is important, and should be around 1.5wpg of either a T5, or PC fixture w/ reflectors for best results for a medium lighted tank. Timers are almost absolutely needed to keep lighting cycle the same every day for best results as well, and you should not go over a 12 hr photoperiod. I have a 10hr lighting period at the moment.

Any higher lighting than 1.5wpg, and the need for co2 is a definate must. Filtration is important, and the use of canister filters are recommended, because less co2 can escape the water when using them. lots of water movement really helps things out too.
Nitrate (10-25ppm) phosphate (.5-2ppm) potassium (20ppm) micro nutrients and maybe extra iron will be excellent to have at hand, and keeping above said ppm of each will be optimum.

That is about all I can think of right now, and I hope that helps, although I think you already knew all of this.
Any other questions, feel free to ask away

GL with your tank!


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## redbellyman21 (Jun 27, 2004)

DiPpY eGgS said:


> Post up the plant variants you will be using, and it will help.
> Sand works ok, but I would like to share that most planted tank 'gurus' who use sand, use it as negative space up front or wherever, and use a plastic divider to divide where the sand, and plant substrate meet.
> Here is a good example:
> 
> ...


WOW you asked for suggestions and you got the master, mr dippy eggs! I would def recomend the dual substrate idea if you must use sand.. never thought of that, just always used the plant substrate, which by the way... does usually come fine, so it has the resemblance of a black sand.. FYI and I use a sugar yeast co2 setup with an aerator at night by the one filter and run the lights roughly 9 hours. always slow or stop co2 at night, thats what I have my airstone for nights only. and the plant species would def help...


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## maknwar (Jul 16, 2007)

How much you have to spend come into play with a planted tank. If you want to spend the minimal amount, then you need to let us know so we dont point you in a direction you dont want to go. Just remember, higher light usually means more money. The type of plants you plan to use dictates how much light you need. Post a plant list you want to use and we can direct you from there. Also, check out some pics of planted aquariums and see what kind of setup you like (amazon, show tank, natural, etc....).


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## louisvillain2.0 (May 16, 2007)

I use straight sand substrate in my tank. You will need to add root tabs if you plan on going this route, especially if you are growing heavy root feeders like crypts and swords. Only reason I use all sand is cos I prefer the look over stuff like eco-complete and don't like it when the sand mixes with plant substrate which usually happens eventually, especially during plant maintainance. Really depends on what you want to grow and how fast, I get away with it because I have a lower light/slow growing tank so plants don't require as much nutrients ie root tabs and occasional dosing of ferts is sufficient for healthy albiet slow growth.


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

Ok i'm not very familiar with substraits either... Told you im a noob... Its basically like explaining it to a 4 year old...

BUt i do have a list of plants i would like to have in the tank and they vary greatly so i can drop a couple from the list if needed... i am just getting you a general ideal.

Glossotigma = 
Tape Grass = 
rotala walichi = 
wisteria = 
D. Diandria = 
java fern = 
dwarf sag. =

thanks guys for replies!

Steve


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

ScubaSteve319 said:


> Ok i'm not very familiar with substraits either... Told you im a noob... Its basically like explaining it to a 4 year old...
> 
> BUt i do have a list of plants i would like to have in the tank and they vary greatly so i can drop a couple from the list if needed... i am just getting you a general ideal.
> 
> ...


I put what amounts of light the plants you want to grow next to them.

You will have to go with high light if your mind is made up with those plants, to accomodate for the ones that need it. I'd say 2.5-3wpg of a T5 or PC fixture would fair well.
Make sure you get a pressurized CO2 setup with that, and keep it around 30ppm. And make sure you have all of the nutrients I have mentioned above, and keep the params perfect all the time, because Rotala wallichii doesn't fair well with fluxuating params well at all.
Your best bet with that one, (well tanks seem to do better in general), is to dose smaller amounts of nutrients every day, micros one day, and macros the next, so the levels stay at a constant level.

I hope that helps.


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

im really confused









I dont know anything about plants... i know they need CO2 but i dont know how to keep that at a constant level in my tank and tips on lighting?

Thanks!


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

don't let it confuse you!

Then that would be my fault for not explaining in a good way. Sorry.

Keeping co2 at a constant level is different with each method: pressurized, you would have a bubble count that you would tweak by checking your waters pH and KH levels
Excell is a matter of dosing the same amounts consistently
and DIY is the hardest to maintain consistently, because of the way yeast consumes sugar in the mixture.

The other nutrients can be dosed the same way once you have found a happy medium in your tank from week to week.
Lighting.. hmm. a tip would be to buy a good fixture,(T5, or PCw/ reflectors) and use a timer to keep it running the same every day.

Did that help at all?


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

yeah that helped a little bit... ive also been doing some reading on it so i think i know whats going on now... about the yeast/sugar method... i really want to give it a try because i have a lot of usable items to use... but i know that the regulation is more difficult with homemade reactor/generator. Would it be as big of a deal if there are less demanding plants for CO2 level or is there no such thing? i'll try the homemade in a separate tank to see if i can see any success before i plant in my RB tank.

Thanks for the help Dippy, sorry if i'm a pain!

Steve


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## maknwar (Jul 16, 2007)

125 gallon+ DIY CO2 = useless

Go for low light plants or get pressurized CO2. You can get plants for low light that look just as good as the high light plants. Marselia minuta looks just like glosso but will do fine in a low light tank.

I have two 48" shop lights under my 125 and it grows a lot of things. You could get 4 x 39 watt T5 kit and grow most plants out there.

You can add Flourish Excel in place of CO2 but some plants will melt. Vals are an example of this. My moss doesnt like it much either.


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

can you direct me to a link or links that i can learn more about pressurized CO2? I need a list of things i will need in order to make this pressurized system. I'm a little shaky because i dont want to use money i wont be able to figure out!

thanks!

Steve


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## maknwar (Jul 16, 2007)

http://www.dlink.org/aqua/CO2.html

http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Hills/2637/press_CO2.html

http://www.rexgrigg.com/co2.htm

A lot of people get the Milwaukee Regulator because its one of the cheapest. Dippy uses it with out problems but I didnt like them. Theres a bunch of regulators out there, some better than others. I really like Sumo regulators. I have heard good things also about Rex Grigg regulators too.

You will need:
a co2 tank (from welding supply store)
Regulator
Diffuser or reactor of some sort
bubble counter

A 125 is a little harder than smaller tanks to get the co2 all around, just an FYI.


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

hey thanks maknwar. I have been researching a little about lighting. I have a 48" light right now... but i just realized it is a corallife T12 light... If you go into my topic of my new RB setup under "pics and videos" you can see what my lighting is like now... I am looking at a T5 bulb on foster & smith right now and it has many different energy levels such as 6700'K to 10000'K... what would you advise for a South American level? and how many watts do you think my 125 gallon will require?









Thanks for all the help so far! I'm catching on!

Steve

------------------------
EDIT------------------
------------------------

About the lighting... I am not really interested in the quad lights that run around 200$ for fixtures if that helps anyone out for looking for the right product for me... I have a single light right now 48" and it pumps a very low 40watts... leaving my tank at like .32wpg.. Is there anyway to get 1-2bulbs to pump out a very high amount of watts required by the plants? (2-3wpg)

*Also... My tank is 23" deep and i don't know if that is a factor for anything... but i basically want to be able to grow easy starting amazon plants for now (amazon swords)*

Steve


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## shiver905 (May 27, 2009)

maknwar said:


> 125 gallon+ DIY CO2 = useless
> 
> Go for low light plants or get pressurized CO2. You can get plants for low light that look just as good as the high light plants. Marselia minuta looks just like glosso but will do fine in a low light tank.
> 
> ...


+1

DIY CO2 wont do crap in such a large tank.
I was thinking about a planted tank for some time now, BUt never pulled threw.
Pressuried CO2 with some good light will grow almost anything. By Good light i mean T5. WATTS per gallon was back in the day when t5 wasnt that well known. If you know abt saltwater, Many people can grow out a Clam and hard corals threw T5.
It all depends on the reflectors. For fresh water flants im shure if you throw in any 2bulb T5ho fixtures on top you will be fine. TeK in my oppinion is overkill. Go to aquatraders.com check Or fishneedit.com Check out there 2bulb fixtures if you want no co2 or 4 bulb if you want co2.

Im guessing ur 1 bulb fixture is t12 or t8.
Im not shure but i dont think you can.

I know you can do them with t5 fixtures. All you have to do is change the ballast to a VHO type ballast. I think icecap has them.
I think it gives you 25-50% more light. It over drives your lamps. Then again.

Its cheaper just to buy a 2 bulb T5ho .


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

kk i'll look into that. Im going to build a black top for my new 125gal and will suspend a shoplight holder in there (48"). So i'll be able to place 2 T5 bulbs in there for about 30$!

Thanks guys for the help! More is always appreciated!
Steve


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## shiver905 (May 27, 2009)

Your looking for T5 HO

Im dont even think they have shop light that are t5ho.

:s
could be wrong.


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

no i mean a 48" shop light fixture!


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## Ibanez247 (Nov 9, 2006)

Just sand can work and work very well. I posted a link to an old thread I posted of my tanks stages. Starting with my 33 gallon that I raised my first two reds in. I only used comprehensive thats it for the first year or two then started dosing excel after I moved. I called it the jungle pics are self explanitory. I used two dual 4' shop lights with the 40watt G&E aqurium/plant bulbs. I know only run one shop light and and everything still grows. Not as fast but still grows. When I move I'm goign to add substrate for plants into the mix and se how that goes. For the sand and lighting I spent under $50. Cant beat that.

http://www.piranha-fury.com/pfury/index.ph...mp;hl=time+line


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

Thanks Ibanez.
I have been workin on getting a top for the guys and their new home and i have pictures. I just purchased a 6500K 48" shop bulb for my holder yesterday and hope that the plants i put in there will recover. I bought them to see how they would fair with not much lighting and my sword seems like it is withering away. I'll buy a couple more by tomorrow or friday and note if there is any difference because of the lighting. Besides the lighting, and a CO2 system... what would you advise for the growth process? I dont want to spend alot of money on the plants because i just want them for the piranha's "habitat" sake so they feel more cozy in the tank







...

Thanks again guys!

Steve


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

So heres the pics i promised... sorry that the fishies are blurry... They get excited when i take pics & videos!







*And heres a current video of the new setup/environment... *





Thanks guys for looking and posting comments!

HELP IS NEEDED!!!









Steve


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Hey Steve, looks like your on your way. Don't give up, it will all come with time.

What are your specs now, lighting, etc....

I can't really tell from the pictures, they're small, but you're not over burying the bottom of the plants right. The sword looks a little low in the substrate which can wreak havoc on any plant. My apologies if they're ok.........


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

you may be right... i'll try to bury it more... i can see parts of the roots and i'll bury them better. I currently have those two plants and just got a 48" full spectrum bulb... I put the neew bulb in when the plants were suspected of dead/dying.. so i dont know if it will save them or not...

How long should i leave the light on per day? is too much light a problem?

Thanks!

Steve


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

ScubaSteve319 said:


> you may be right... i'll try to bury it more... i can see parts of the roots and i'll bury them better. I currently have those two plants and just got a 48" full spectrum bulb... I put the neew bulb in when the plants were suspected of dead/dying.. so i dont know if it will save them or not...
> 
> How long should i leave the light on per day? is too much light a problem?
> 
> ...


Steve I meant the other way around. Don't OVER bury them! Make sure the bottom of the plant is above the substrate, for example on the sword make sure none of the leaf stems are under the substrate, just the roots. It's ok if some of the roots show, not a biggie..

Yes, too much light can be a problem, I would leave the light on for no longer than 9 hours a day. Mine are set at 8.5 hours..... I would say 8-9 hours......If you're serious about getting into plants, make sure you have a timer.......


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## His Majesty (Apr 5, 2005)

Great work Steve! :thumsbup:

its really coming on nicely. keep it up


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

i will invest in a timer asap. and the plants seem to be ok with the depth they are buried at.
Thanks a ton! anymore advice will be great!

Steve


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## Lifer374 (Dec 5, 2003)

ScubaSteve319 said:


> I am looking at a T5 bulb on foster & smith right now and it has many different energy levels such as 6700'K to 10000'K... what would you advise for a South American level?


Its not really an energy level. The "K" stands for Kelvin rating. Which is the color of light produced. The higher the number the more blue the light. The lower the more reddish pink...If memory serves me correct.

Plants will grow with any light 5500K to 10000K (maybe even higher)


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

I have a 6500k or a 6700k bulb and i know that should do the trick. i wont need a 10000k light for a while. just need more advice as to help the growth.

Thanks

Steve


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## roccov12345 (Sep 26, 2008)

Are you thinking about picking up any fertz? Excel and some root tabs may help you out to get going........


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

yeah ive been meaning to pick that up but i just dont know where to start with it all. i heard that excel is a really good booster for the plants but i dont know where i can find that locally. Most of my fish stores dont carry specific items... (UGH)

what would/do you guys suggest?

Steve


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## Lifer374 (Dec 5, 2003)

ScubaSteve319 said:


> what would/do you guys suggest?
> 
> Steve


Big Als. 
I can purchase at my lfs but Als online has way better pricing on 2 liters even with the cost of shipping.


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## Trigga (Jul 1, 2006)

Yeah big ALS online.. After like 30 bucks
it's free shipping anyway so I'd grab it from there


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## ru4iowahawkeyes (May 11, 2009)

i actually went out and found some at a lps. it is called "plant grow" and its from newtrafin or however you spell it







. I put a good amount in the tank yesterday. abuot 90 gals worth and see if this will fix some of the problems.

Thanks
Steve


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