# Stocking list For my 72-Gallon Bowfront...???



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

hey guys me again with another crazy stocking list.

this time its for a 72-Gallon bowfront.

so i was thinking.....

1-Oscar
1-Gold Severum
3-Giant Danios
1-Clown pleco
1-Blue Acara

any other fish that i can add and that would live well with the fish in my list?

thanks

CK.


----------



## moeplz (Feb 21, 2005)

Maybe a fancy pleco?


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

no a clown pleco will do fine and other fish you would suggest?


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

a con and a firemouth


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

i guess that would be fine but anything less agressive that willo not kick the oscars a$$?? the cons and the firemouths are very agressive at my LFS.


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

how big an oscar are you getting, because not many fish can kick a large oscar around, mabey if it's a baby but still 5 inch fish won't do anything to a full grown 12-15 inch o :laugh:


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

the oscar is going to be around 4'' to 5'' but still im aiming for a sort of peaceful tank here with big yet peaceful/semiagressive fish.

any ideas?


----------



## furious piranha (Mar 22, 2005)

i think the oscar could easily handle the cons or firemouth as long as they arent breeding. the oscar will outgrow them by alot too so when they are full grown that little convict wont be able to do netrhing


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

no question, oscars grow at an inch a month when young, an o would be fine


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

im know guys but i was looking for something better.

anything else?


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok will this work out well???

1-Oscar
1-Blue Acara
1-Gold Severum
3-Giant Danios
1-Clown pleco
1-Jack Dempsey

will that work for life?


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok will this work out well???

1-Oscar
1-Blue Acara
1-Gold Severum
3-Giant Danios
1-Clown pleco
1-Jack Dempsey

will that work for life?


----------



## furious piranha (Mar 22, 2005)

no way, just the osscar is alot but u could have the oscra wit the danios pleco and acara


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok i hope this is it.......???

1-Oscar
1-Blue Acara
1-Gold Severum
3-Giant Danios
1-Clown pleco
1-Firemouth

Will that work Boba Fett???

i did what you said boba fett accept i added a blue acara instead of a convict. will it work for life?


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

1-Oscar
1-Blue Acara
1-Gold Severum
3-Giant Danios
1-Clown pleco
1-Firemouth

will the fish live together?


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Dude just go with your original idea of the two Red devils. 
That or go with about 20 african cichlids and a rock wall with lots of holes and caves.


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

They will live together but I would nix the gold severum as they get decently big and 75g is really just what a oscar alone should be in.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok oscar119 thanks.

so what do you think my stocking list should be oscar119???


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

an oscar will eat anything smaller than it...i've tried cons, dempseys, firemouths, GTs....they all get eaten...


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

what/ well it depend on the indivigual fish because i have heard people say that their GT and their Convict KILLED their oscar.

so thats not foe every oscar, and most oscars are for the most part peaceful.


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

not true...oscars are aggressive to any and everything...trust me...you should come by and check my oscars out..bring a convict too. hehe.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

yea exactly its only your oscar not everyones.

Oscars are not agressive, they are laid back and some are peaceful.


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

not at all dude...they're peacefull to certain fish, its not an individual thing, if they were peaceful they wouldnt survive, they EAT fish in the wild. you can't keep smaller fish with them. i have 2 oscars by the way...

i've seen oscars do well with jack dempseys before, but the oscar and jack were both the same size. and an oscar in a tank as small as a 72g is going to have territory issues...not enough space etc...so he's going to mug anything in the tank constantly..my oscars harrass my pleco all the time, but he fights back, and i've given him a hiding spot also...as far as SA cichlids go, oscars are not as tough or aggressive as some, but they're still aggressive and will attempt to eat anything that fits in their mouths.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

i know and i relized there are better fish to have.....

so how about this......?

1-Flowerhorn-3'' 
1-Firemouth-3''
1-Blue acara-4''
1-clown Pleco-3''
3-giant danios-4''

will that work?


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

that may work, but remember flowerhorns have gotten pretty big :nod:


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

FH's can get huge, and it will kill everything in that tank except the pleco....POSSIBLY.

i'd go with a jack dempsey and a few GT's. that'd be cool, lots of colors, big enough, and they'll do well together.


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> i know and i relized there are better fish to have.....
> 
> so how about this......?
> 
> ...


FH is waaaaay more aggressive than an oscar IMO. And you stand less of a chance of things getting along than with an oscar. But although my oscars were never fish aggressive they can be agressive.

How about with that list instead of a FH, maybe a green severum or 1 or 2 electric blue dempsey?? One of my favorites less aggressive than a regular jd and max out around 8" http://www.aquascapeonline.com/store/scrip...asp?idproduct=4


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok how about this?????

i hopw this is good........??

1-Oscar-4''
1-Blue acara-4''
1-Firemouth-3''
1-Jack Dempsey-2''
1-Clown Pleco-3''
3-Giant Danios-4''

will they live good together in the 72-Gallon Bowfront For life?


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

that's too much sh*t for a 72 bow dude...take out at least the jack...oscar and firemouth might have issues...but should be ok...


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

when i said this stocking list.......
1-Oscar
1-Gold Severum
3-Giant Danios
1-Clown pleco
1-Blue acara
Boba Fett, and furious piranha said i could add 1 Firemouth and 1 convict.

can i still do that???
..................
1-Oscar
1-Gold Severum
3-Giant Danios
1-Clown pleco
1-Blue acara
1-Firemouth
1-Convict

Now will that work for life?


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

IMO still trying to stuff 10lbs of sh$t into a 5lb bag. Not being pissed off just using that saying to try to show you a point.

Do the second list you posted in the last post but cross off the oscar. So

1-Gold Severum
3-Giant Danios
1-Clown pleco
1-Blue acara
1-Firemouth
1-Convict

That wouldn't be a bad setup. If you really want the oscar, you can have a clown pleco too but scratch off most everything else on that list except ONE of these Acara or Firemouth. Even then you'd still be a little over stocked but probably not so overstocked your changing tank water everyday.

Everyone will suggest different things for stocking lists as different people have different ideas. Some people stay more towards reccomendations for tank size for certain species and some people don't mind bending the rules and overstocking. My .02


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Are you totally stuck on an Oscar?
You have a bunch of fish that are going to max out at about 3-4 in then you have this one thats going to be like 12-13" ditch the oscar then get 2 cons and 2 firemouths. Or another small cichlid. maybe throw an african or two in there instead. I'd say go for haps not mbunas. that will give you a couple more manageable fish not one giant pig and will add some good color to the tank..


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

i really like the oscar tho.

what about taking out the severum and replacing it with the oscar??

1-Oscar
3-Giant Danios
1-Clown pleco
1-Blue acara
1-Firemouth
1-Convict

i hope that works with weekly waterchanges?


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

Blacksunshine420 said:


> Are you totally stuck on an Oscar?
> You have a bunch of fish that are going to max out at about 3-4 in then you have this one thats going to be like 12-13" ditch the oscar then get 2 cons and 2 firemouths. Or another small cichlid. maybe throw an african or two in there instead. I'd say go for haps not mbunas. that will give you a couple more manageable fish not one giant pig and will add some good color to the tank..


Africans aren't a bad idea but I wouldn't mix CA/SA and africans together.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> i really like the oscar tho.
> 
> what about taking out the severum and replacing it with the oscar??
> 
> ...


will it work?


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

You can stock it like that if you wish but you may find it crowded when the fish get bigger. Convicts can have major attitudes. Again I wouldn't suggest it, it would still be way overstocked, but if you want to try it go ahead.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

oscar119 said:


> Africans aren't a bad idea but I wouldn't mix CA/SA and africans together.


Nahh they would be fine so long as the SA/CAs are small to med size. For sure not with some of the big boys. I used to have a mix tank and they were all doing great until I threw the barracuda in. then guys started dissapearing.


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

They might be "fine" but IMO it's irresponisble to knowingly mix fish from two different parts of the world that need different water parameters. Sure both may "live" in the same water but fish are very responsive to water and that can mean the difference between a lively fish and just a fish.


----------



## Mettle (Dec 29, 2003)

I have a 72 gallon bowfront. It's home to a single flowerhorn, a bushynose pleco, a whiptail pleco and 9 clown loaches. The loaches were a huge gamble and could go any day. I know this. The flowerhorn already killed one bushynose pleco. He pays no attention to the whiptail, oddly enough.

A lot of the fish you're talking about get quite large... And it will be a heavy bioload for the tank size you're talking about. A 72 gallon bowfront may seem quite large, but it's really not that big.

Also - you keep mentioning a clown pleco. Do you know what the L# for this pleco is? (L# is the classification for plecos that is more accurate then common names.) If you're talking about this one you might want to be careful. These are small plecos. It may get eaten.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok i guess it will be crowded in a few months especially with the oscar, and the convict being a bad a$$.

so.....
1-Oscar
3-Giant Danios
1-Blue acara
1-Firemouth
1-Gold Severum

how about that???

i took the convict out because they are very agressive, so this might still be a bit crowded but the fish are not overly agressive, and probably will live well with eachother. will they??

Thanks.

CK.


----------



## The Predator (Sep 28, 2005)

how bout:

-1 JD
-1 Texas cichlid
-1 green terror 
-1 black belt


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

well i can get a JD and A GT, but there are no texas or black belts near me,

they never sell im my LFS's

but will this work...?

1-Oscar
3-Giant Danios
1-Blue acara
1-Firemouth
1-Gold Severum


----------



## The Predator (Sep 28, 2005)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> well i can get a JD and A GT, but there are no texas or black belts near me,
> 
> they never sell im my LFS's
> 
> ...


yes it will but i really recomend a JD. I didnt know if you wanted to buy more giant danios or not because you have three already.

Just asking, why would you want more that 1 fish you already have in a different tank like 2 severums? Try something different but i have nothing against you buying those fish again


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

im going to move the blue acara and the gold severum into the 72-G

so im only going to have 1 of each.









thanks for your help guys for this other stocking list...

so its going to be....
1-Oscar
3-Giant Danios
1-Blue acara
1-Firemouth
1-Gold Severum

thanks

CK.


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

I think he's going for all fish he can get from one lfs(correct me if I'm wrong) Or he's moving the fish over from his 55g.

1-Oscar
3-Giant Danios
1-Blue acara
1-Firemouth
1-Gold Severum

^^^ The problem with that list are the two big cichlids, severum and oscar. The severum should probably have a 55g and the oscar should have 75g to itself. You can mix cichlids in larger tanks but 72g even though it seems large isn't when you're talking cichlids. Not just territory room but bio load ,etc. That setup will work but get crowded when bigger. I still wouldn't put much in a 72g with an oscar.

Maybe the best way to learn is to try it out.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok but ill try it out first than ill see.

the only way to find out if they will fight and live together in harmony is bu trying it.

thanks for the help everyone.

CK.


----------



## Mettle (Dec 29, 2003)

A firemouth can be as aggressive or even moreso than a convict. Keep that in mind. If you would like to have a convict in there then get yourself a female. Much easier going fish.

Also - the oscar may eat the giant danios when it's big enough. I'm sure that's already been said.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

yes im sure he can eat them if he wanted to.

but even a Female convict protecting her unfertalized eggs can become very agressive.


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

yeah but....an oscar eats fish smaller than it. its nature. and oscars get HUGE. i've got 2, and they're gigantic...when i started with them i figured a 90 would be plenty big, now they're retardedly gigantic. this summer im getting a 240...yes, thats right, a 240 for my oscars, with a few more oscars and a JD or two and some more pleco's to go along with it. just to give you a grasp of what these fish really need to "thrive". a 72 bow IMO is minimalistic to stuff an oscar AND a bunch of other fish into...that's especially true for smaller fish with an oscar.


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

r1dermon said:


> a 72 bow IMO is minimalistic to stuff an oscar AND a bunch of other fish into...


One of the points I was trying to make...


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

an oscar does not eat smaller fish than it!!!!!!!

it will eat it if it fits in his mouth, But it *Does Not* eat fish that are even half of his/her size,

Once again..... *Oscars* are *NOT* aggressive. If you(r1dermon) have agressive oscars it does *NOT* Mean that i will. Most oscars are Laid Back, and *NOT* Agressive.

CK.


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

accually, oscars can be aggresive or not, but most likey will try to eat most thing that fit in there mouths :nod: ,

My o has tried to eat marbles my brother put in the tank, marbels don't taste good so he didn't eat it :laugh:

and half the time in fish stores the o's are being fed feeder goldfish


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

yea exactly ''THINGS THAT FIT IN ITS MOUTH'' Not any other thing smaller than him r1dermon.

Thanks Boba fett

CK.


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

how long have you kept oscars for??? TRUST ME ON THIS, oscars are AGGRESSIVE SA CICHLIDS. they will beat up on other fish, even their own size, EVEN OTHER OSCARS. my oscars f*ck with my pleco all the time, and the pleco is several inches longer than them! i threw a butterforkori in the tank that was THEIR SIZE and they beat it up and i had to take it out....EVERY PERSON WHO HAS EVER OWNED OSCARS WHO I'VE TALKED TO WILL AGREE WITH THIS POINT. why dont you take this to a cichlid forum and ask them...oscars will beat sh*t up, thats what they do...ESPECIALLY IN A 72 bow tank, they have absolutely no room to establish a territory for themselves, its a shitty tank for an oscar, or really any large SA cichlid. dont listen to me though, stuff an oscar and a bunch of other sh*t into your 72 bow and then call me when everything's dead...also, a firemouth is f*cking aggressive, moreso than an oscar, and at the same size, would beat it to death. fish that get beat up get very stressed, stress causes death. you are inexperienced with these fish, you do not know it all, so dont pretend like you do...you're going to see what happens within a month.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

hey thanks. how about you shut the F*ck up!!!

you know nothing about them. just because your oscars are F*ckin agressive does NOT meant that mine will be.

so how about you get a life and shut up i was not asking you.!!!

buy the way there is a little chance a oscar can beat up a butti, unless your oscar is one of the FEW very agressive ones.

ONCE AGAIN most oscars are peaceful and do not beat up fish, if yours do than too bad but don't come to me and cry about it. im sure myne will not!!

plus if they did beat up the butti it was because they dont want NEW fish in their territory, thats why im buying all of my fish at the same time when they are small!!!!

and if your oscars are 12'' and your pleco is 13'' how can the pleco be several inches biger??? BS!!!!

CK.


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

first of all, chill with the hostility, im simply trying to inform an idiot (which is very hard). a butti was just put in the tank, no time to get used to it...and yes, you indirectly asked my opinion, by posting a question on a public forum which i am a part of.



> ONCE AGAIN most oscars are peaceful and do not beat up fish, if yours do than too bad but don't come to me and cry about it. im sure myne will not!!


this has got to be one of the single stupidest things i've ever read in my entire life...that's like saying a lion is a peaceful animal, something that can live with anything...an oscar is a predator, do you understand what that means? your danios are going to be lunch...your oscar is going to get huge, all the other fish in there WILL fit in its mouth. how long have you been keeping fish for? oscars? dont take my advice...i dont really give a sh*t, i was just trying to help. i hope your tank does well, i really do, but honestly, you should do more RESEARCH on the fish you're buying than to just jump in head first with fish you dont know how to care for.

also, there are plenty of pet stores that sell jack dempseys and GT's in MA, PETCO being one of them...where in MA are you?

oscars are RELATIVELY unaggressive towards fish their same size, but when it comes to territorial issues (which there will be in a 72 bow with 2 huge SA cichlids) the oscar will defend his territory. trust me dude, dont get pissy, i've kept oscars for several years, i know a lot of people with oscars and way more aggressive SA cichlids like jags, butti's, dovii's...etc...i have experience with oscars beyond my 2 and they all exhibit the same behavior. and the fact is, you're overstocking your tank. what filtration do you have?

one more thing...my 90g tank sig hasnt been updated in a while...the pleco is 14", and you're free to come by and measure him up if you'd like...just check the attitude at the door.


----------



## freakgasolinefightaccident (Jan 3, 2005)

I agree with r1der on this one. I would classify oscars as mid-range agressive cichlids when lookin' at the grand scheme of american cichlids. Like he stated they are predatory and are known to be troublesome towards smaller fish and able to hold their own against other large cichlids. My oscar has lorded over all his past tankmates and even killed some. By no means should oscars be considered passive or harmless cichlids.



oscar119 said:


> an oscar does not eat smaller fish than it!!!!!!!
> 
> it will eat it if it fits in his mouth, But it *Does Not* eat fish that are even half of his/her size,
> 
> ...


That is a very bold statement on which I would have to disagree. I've seen enough oscars in my life (I keep one and work at a lps) to know that oscars are agressive and do pose a threat to tankmates of smaller or equal size.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

sorry i was kind of pissed last night.
but when you say it can pose a threat to any fish,... you can not tell me that an oscar can kill a 10'' to 12'' Male flowerhorn, thats just almost impossible.

anyways thanks,

CK,


----------



## freakgasolinefightaccident (Jan 3, 2005)

No, I meant to tankmates of a similar agression range, in any case you would need a pretty big tank to keep any other fish with a 10-12" FH. Point being, in the end, that oscars are not peaceful fish, and you should consider that when stocking your tank.


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

a 12" male flowerhorn would kill anything besides maybe a butti or a midas. they're mean bitches. oscars are not THAT aggressive, but they do have an aggressive temperment, meaning, your firemouth would probably get the occasional bashing, and your danio's would become lunch, they're so peaceful that they would be very tempting for an oscar to chew on. convicts are fast, but i've fed them to my oscars and after an incredible chase (almost an hour) they finally caught them. point im trying to make is that oscars, with their temperment, should not be kept in a small tank with medium sized tankmates, there's no room to establish territory, therefore the oscar will dominate the entire tank. a jd and gt not only look better (visually appealing), they also stay smaller, and both share the oscars temperment, mildly aggressive.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

r1dermon said:


> how long have you kept oscars for??? TRUST ME ON THIS, oscars are AGGRESSIVE SA CICHLIDS. they will beat up on other fish, even their own size, EVEN OTHER OSCARS. my oscars f*ck with my pleco all the time, and the pleco is several inches longer than them! i threw a butterforkori in the tank that was THEIR SIZE and they beat it up and i had to take it out....EVERY PERSON WHO HAS EVER OWNED OSCARS WHO I'VE TALKED TO WILL AGREE WITH THIS POINT. why dont you take this to a cichlid forum and ask them...oscars will beat sh*t up, thats what they do...ESPECIALLY IN A 72 bow tank, they have absolutely no room to establish a territory for themselves, its a shitty tank for an oscar, or really any large SA cichlid. dont listen to me though, stuff an oscar and a bunch of other sh*t into your 72 bow and then call me when everything's dead...also, a firemouth is f*cking aggressive, moreso than an oscar, and at the same size, would beat it to death. fish that get beat up get very stressed, stress causes death. you are inexperienced with these fish, you do not know it all, so dont pretend like you do...you're going to see what happens within a month.


I've owned oscars and I do dissagree with you. Generally Oscars are not "Aggressive" by comparison with most large SA cichlids. My mom kept a tank of 5 LG and even in that group they were generally docile. 
Durring my "lets see what will live" phase I threw an oscar that outsized most the SA's in my 100 gal by about 30-50%. that oscar lived the remainder of its life pinned to the ground out of fear of moving. literally he would lie as flat aganst the rocks as possible so to not get spotted by the other fish. Other fish included a buttokoffi,Red devil, Dovii and Managuense. Now those are aggressive fish. An oscar is not IMO on the same level of aggression as these kinda fish. 
However they are a hungry fish. And that can make them seem aggressive. 
Also in groups they do tend to be alot braver.

But in this case I would say the oscar does have a very good chance of establishing himself as the alpha fish. If he does that he may become territorial. The size of your servum may help this. If the oscar is the same size when introduced to the tank as the others then your chance of having them grow toghether is better. But if he drops into the tank full grown chances are he will up his agression level and remove any competition for food.
Again Generally oscars are not aggressive. But enviromental influances have more to do with the temperment of a fish then just the breed.

The example of throwing a fish into an established tank does not show that one fish is more aggressive then another. theres issues of intimidation, unfamilarity, disorentation and stress that would be on one fish that are not placed on the group. I say this because I know for a fact that a buttokoffi is a much more aggressive fish then a oscar.

Not trying to say anyone is wrong here just trying to point out that there are other factors that are involved with this perceived aggression then just the fact that they are oscars.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

exactly thats why i said some oscars can be agressive and some are Not agressive.

it depends on the indivigual fish so i can not tell for sure unless i buy one, but im thinking of buying some other cichlids that would beat the sh*t out of oscars. and im probably not going to buy an oscar.

CK.


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

you cannot argue the point dude, oscars are aggressive, they're not aggressive when compared to a butti, midas, flowerhorn...etc...but they're still aggressive, a 72 bow with 2 large cichlids is going to spawn territory battles. they're not "community fish" like molly's, danio's, and guppies, they are mildly tempermental, but they're still tempermental, which makes them aggressive. and the reason your oscar layed on the bottom of the tank is because it got the sh*t kicked out of it by its tank mates and was super stressed. all im trying to say is that there are going to be quarrals between fish in a 72 bow particularly a firemouth and an oscar when fully grown. the point of the butti being beaten around was, the butti was just put in the tank, and both oscars have their own territories in the tank, one on the left side, one on the right, basically split down the middle...they barely tolerate the pleco thats in the tank, and randomly take shots at him, the butti was uber stressed from going from a bucket to a tank, obviously, if the butti was put in the tank, and the tank divided and left for a week, the let the butti loose, it'd kick the sh*t out of the oscars, but in this case, he kept on intruding on their territories and they were quite willing to defend. you can't tell me that oscars are peaceful fish...they're peaceful with each other, but try to keep them with a peaceful fish, it generally doesnt work...


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

r1dermon said:


> you cannot argue the point dude, oscars are aggressive, they're not aggressive when compared to a butti, midas, flowerhorn...etc...but they're still aggressive, a 72 bow with 2 large cichlids is going to spawn territory battles. they're not "community fish" like molly's, danio's, and guppies, they are mildly tempermental, but they're still tempermental, which makes them aggressive. and the reason your oscar layed on the bottom of the tank is because it got the sh*t kicked out of it by its tank mates and was super stressed. all im trying to say is that there are going to be quarrals between fish in a 72 bow particularly a firemouth and an oscar when fully grown. the point of the butti being beaten around was, the butti was just put in the tank, and both oscars have their own territories in the tank, one on the left side, one on the right, basically split down the middle...they barely tolerate the pleco thats in the tank, and randomly take shots at him, the butti was uber stressed from going from a bucket to a tank, obviously, if the butti was put in the tank, and the tank divided and left for a week, the let the butti loose, it'd kick the sh*t out of the oscars, but in this case, he kept on intruding on their territories and they were quite willing to defend. you can't tell me that oscars are peaceful fish...they're peaceful with each other, but try to keep them with a peaceful fish, it generally doesnt work...


I think we've all covered the basics of aggressive fish keeping. 
Oscars under the right conditions can be aggressive. Altho not as some other cichlids but more then others. 
I do aggree, I would not call them a community fish. But keeping them with other cichlids of similar or slightly smaller size even in a 72gal is not impossible. Just simply not a good idea for optimal keeping. 
On a scale of 1-10 for cichlids 1 being an angel fish 10 being say a pissed off male dovii. I would personally put the oscar at around a 6-6.5. I dont think they are equiped to ever reach say a 10 but never expect one to be less then a 4.

As far as keeping one in the 72 gal. I will have to side with the demon with the other fish its just going to be a cramped situation. generally its not advised. But hey worse things have been put in smaller tanks. If your ok with losing couple fish in the test then go for it. 
there is a key to keeping a lot of large cichlids toghether. And thats providing them all ample shelter. 
sadly 72 gal makes it hard to create the kind of shelter you will need to pull this off. but once again these are all cheap fish. So if you lose a couple so what, at least there not tigerfish or something expensive like that. just get a bunch of laice rock and build some cool looking caves.


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

amen, i absolutely completely 100% agree with you...


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok guys Thanks

CK


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

1-GT-2''
1-Convict-2''
2-Firemouths-3''
1-JD-2''
1-Bush nose pleco-4''
6-Giant danios-2''
3-corys-2''

ok will that work..??

thanks

CK.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> 1-GT-2''
> 1-Convict-2''
> 2-Firemouths-3''
> 1-JD-2''
> ...


you have a high potential of running into the same issue with the JD as you would with the Oscar only worse. IMO JD's can be a very hostile fish and they are equipped to do something about it. As is the GT. 
But the list looks good. Just make sure to get some rock structures for the firemouths and convicts to seek refuge once the GT and JD get bigger.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok man thanks so you think it will work for life?

CK.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> ok man thanks so you think it will work for life?
> 
> CK.


What really is a fishes life? thats a hard question to answer. honestly no. I think the JD will outgrow everyone and possibly kill everyone off. Or maybe the GT will. 
Maybe they will all live in peace. I can almost gaurentee that some one will get ahold of those danois and eat them. The Firemouths and convicts will wind up killing the coreys. And the pleco will hide under rocks most of the time. 
really I would ditch the community fish altoghether and only have the cichlids. Keep the pleco tho. their armored and have a decent chance. unless somone catches him from the underside.

you know I hear that the electric blue JD's aren't as aggressive and don't get as big as the normal ones. maybe get one of those. they are fairly new to the hobby but they have a cool look to them. I'm not sure what one would look like fully grown.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

i can not get a electric blue JDD because there are none near mr and i do not want to order them online because i do not like them. i think regular JD's are better.

1-GT-2''
1-Convict-2''
2-Firemouths-3''
1-JD-2''
1-Bush nose pleco-4''
3-Giant danios-2''

if i take out the corys and only buy 3 Giant danios, can i add anything else??

CK.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> i can not get a electric blue JDD because there are none near mr and i do not want to order them online because i do not like them. i think regular JD's are better.
> 
> 1-GT-2''
> 1-Convict-2''
> ...


No. I highly suggest you leave it at that. If you want more variety of fish you are going to have to go with an assortment of smaller fish such as affricans or small SA cichlids.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok what about like 1 or 2 ''Eureka Peacocks''- i know they are africans but will it work??

or 1 or 2 Yellow labs instead of the peacocks???

CK.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> ok what about like 1 or 2 ''Eureka Peacocks''- i know they are africans but will it work??
> or 1 or 2 Yellow labs instead of the peacocks???
> CK.


Altho I personally see no major problems mixing. I think alot of "Die Hards" would say thats a bad idea. Afrikan waters tend to be slightly acidic. But chilids being as hearty as they are can adapt to many different water conditions. And this being true I would say throwing them in should be fine. IMO

I think those would add some nice color to your tank. (disclaimer) But down the road the JD and GT may cause some issue with the smaller fish as they will outsize them almost by 2x. If aggression levels get too high the larger guys may tear up the tank hurting themselves and eventually killing and maybe eating the others. SA cichlids are generally more territorial then Afri's.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok so what would you add 2 Yellow labs or 2 Eurica Peacocks??
or can i buy 1 of each?

my Ph is between 7.4 and 7.6..??


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> ok so what would you add 2 Yellow labs or 2 Eurica Peacocks??
> or can i buy 1 of each?
> 
> my Ph is between 7.4 and 7.6..??


Personally I would ditch all the danios. and get two of each.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

Blacksunshine420 said:


> ok so what would you add 2 Yellow labs or 2 Eurica Peacocks??
> or can i buy 1 of each?
> 
> my Ph is between 7.4 and 7.6..??


Personally I would ditch all the danios. and get two of each.
[/quote]

ok man thanks will do.









so i guess this is my final stocking List...
1-GT-2''
1-Convict-2''
2-Firemouths-3''
1-JD-2''
1-Bush nose pleco-4''
2-Yellow labs
2-Eureka Peacocks

thanks for helping me with my final list BlackSunshine420









CK.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> ok man thanks will do.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


No prob man. best of luck. hopefully no one dies.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

well do you think any fish will die?

I do not want them to die.









CK.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> well do you think any fish will die?
> I do not want them to die.
> 
> 
> ...


Depends on the overall temperment of the JD and the GT. Both of those are very aggressive cichlids. 
Like every aggressive fish tank its a gamble. After all most of the fish you are introducing are preditors.

But if it makes you feel better let me list off what I used to have in my 100 gal.
Avg fish size was around 7-9in

1- red Devil
3 Managuenses
3 Buttokoffi
1 Fem Dovii
3 bichirs 2 seng, 1 ornate
1 silver Arrowanna
1 pike cichlid -eaten
3 plecos. 2 eaten
at one time there was a pacu and another time there was an oscar that were used as beat me fish.

This was a VERY hostile tank. but with proper cover they were able to "get along"

I wouldnt howver suggest this assortment cause it was a bitch of a bio load. I was cleaning out my 2 emp 400's every week.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

yea and those are much more agressive fish than the ones that i want, so it did kind of make me feel better.

Does it also help that im geting them all when they are 2'' long? will it help that they are young and will get along with each-other because they were introduced at a young age??

thanks.

CK.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> yea and those are much more agressive fish than the ones that i want, so it did kind of make me feel better.
> 
> Does it also help that im geting them all when they are 2'' long? will it help that they are young and will get along with each-other because they were introduced at a young age??
> 
> ...


*shrugg* ehh. some say it does. most of the fish in that tank of mine were raised from that size. I thnik forcing them to grow as a community makes them more tolerable of other fish because they are used to being around others. Where a solitary fish is going to become alot more territorial.

making sure they all get fed is important too.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

what if i take out 1 firemouth and add 1 more different African or 2?? what would type of african do you suggest?

Plus can the affricans stay in regular water with a 7.4PH??

CK.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> what if i take out 1 firemouth and add 1 more different African or 2?? what would type of african do you suggest?
> 
> Plus can the affricans stay in regular water with a 7.4PH??
> 
> CK.


I dunno. I've allways liked the Haps. electric blues and yellows.

ph- sure.


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

well sorry to interupt, I havent commented on this thread in a while,

what is the current tank list?


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

well as of now the list has totally changed to almost all Africans..

i was thinking........

1-JD
3-Eureks Peacocks
3-Cherry red Zebras
2-Red Scats
2-White tip sharks
1-Snow king Pleco
2-H. Moorii

Im planing on adding some more... any ideas on what other fish???

I might do the overcrowding Method.

CK.


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

wow african cichlid wow I've been missing alot









alright now not an expert on africans but i'll try to help

first of all scratch the jd, I don't relly like the idea that one american cichlid in a group of africans, to replace the jd, I would put a electric yellow cichlid. they are a nice medium size african :nod:

not to mention the small africans you have in the current tank list would be with a 10 inch aggresive cichlid


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

you understand that africans have different requirements right? like some are herbivorous, some omnivorous...if you feed too much protein to the herbivorous ones, they'll bloat and die...they wont get sick, they'll just die...your water must be hard (near 8) you MUST have caves and structure or they'll constantly beat each other up...etc...they're completely different than SA/CA cichlids.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

They make pellets specifically for africans. I think he will be ok there. 
I do aggree still the JD is bound to cause some issue. And Caves would indeed be the best enviroment for these other type fish. They really do appreciate it. If your ditchin the SA's then yeah take the PH up some so its closer to the africans normal tolarance. a little coral in your substrate should do the trick. you might even go with a sand setup. they like that.

I still think you should get an electric blue. Their meatalic blue color is awesome. IMO


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

yep i was going to add some crushed coral and salt to bring the PH and the selinity up. Ill take out the JD.

3-Eureks Peacocks
3-Cherry red Zebras
2-Red Scats
2-White tip sharks
2-H. Moorii
1-Snow king Pleco

I need to add More.. any ideas on what other fish i can add??

Thanks

CK>


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> yep i was going to add some crushed coral and salt to bring the PH and the selinity up. Ill take out the JD.
> 
> 3-Eureks Peacocks
> 3-Cherry red Zebras
> ...


Various other color africans of same type. 
Dimidiochromis compressiceps - kinda cool Young they are a silvery color but grown the males are a neat metalic green blue. these guys get a little big tho








Nimbochromis Venustus- cool golden color with med brn markings in addition to the goldenyellow color males get a blue face as they mature.








Haplichromis Red Empress - metalic blue with orange tipped and spotted fins. AWESOME lookin









And thats it if you want to keep these guys for life. they may seem small now but each of these guys will get around 4-6"


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

I really like those fish but there are none near me and i really do not want to order online.....

3-Eureks Peacocks
3-Cherry red Zebras
1-Blotch Zebra
2-Red Scats
1-White tip shark
2-H. Moorii
1-Snow king Pleco

any thing else that would be good??


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> I really like those fish but there are none near me and i really do not want to order online.....
> 
> 3-Eureks Peacocks
> 3-Cherry red Zebras
> ...


Just go with that for now. Leave room so if something does pop up in your LFS that you will have room for it. 
I feel ya on the online order thing. unless you get like 50 fish its not worth the shipping.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok just had a little changes....

3-Eureks Peacocks-trio
3-Cherry red Zebras-trio
2-Blotch Zebras
2-Red Scats
1-White tip sharks
2-H. Moorii
1-Snow king Pleco

ill go there on monday and see the names of the fish i want and ill tell you guys so hopefully you can tell me if i can add it to the list









CK.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> ok just had a little changes....
> 
> 3-Eureks Peacocks-trio
> 3-Cherry red Zebras-trio
> ...


Its only 72 gal man. Most of those fish will reach 6"+ If you wanna keep these fish for life its already going to be cramped in a year or so. If fish dies you can always get a replacement. At least wait till you get the fish in there then decide.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

what kind of salt should i use??


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

*what kind of salt should i use??*

salt like aquarium salt,

just throwing some other ideas out there fir your tank

you could make an amazing salt water tank in a 72 :nod: 
if you have the money









or a awesome planted discus tank :nod:


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

yea thanks. but i do not have the money. lol.

how much does a bag of salt cost usually like the marine salt??

how long can a bag last for a 72G?

thanks.

CK.


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

:rasp: aquarium salt does not come in bags, little milk carton like contaners
unless your talking about sea salt









I only use aqurium salt after water changes, so a carton should last for awile, i think the rule is one tablespoon of salt for every 10 gallons of water :nod:


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

yea i have to use sea salt not that kind of regilar aquarium salt...


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

why are you useing sea salt for a african cichlid tank?


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

well thats what i was told., but i guess that kind of salt is ok. i have some salt from aquarium Pharmacuticals in a '' milk carton''

so that will work. but i do not know if i should do African cichlids or if i should do American Cichlids..???

CK.


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

who told you sea salt is needed for an african tank, never heard that before, but i'm not an expert on africans


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

nevermind i must have heard wrong. do you think i should do the ''overcrowding'' method??? where i put as manny africans that they can not establish a territory because there is so manny fish and they are confuzed??

CK.


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> nevermind i must have heard wrong. do you think i should do the ''overcrowding'' method??? where i put as manny africans that they can not establish a territory because there is so manny fish and they are confuzed??
> 
> CK.


I don't think there are enough people with africans on here to know for sure. But keep in mind overcrowding means worse water quality and eventually you will have a _really_ crowded tank when they become adults.


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

well as for as overcrowding goes i wouldn't do it









it can be queit stressful :nod: , but if you do decide to do that method make sure you keep up on filtration.

what is you current plan for filtration?


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

no its not that stresful. im planing a AC110.

CK.


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

an ac110

in my opinion not enough









depending on how many fish and there full grown size, mabey a xp3 and a ac110


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

don't have that kind of money, im only 14 and a canister might be too much money. but ill try to get 1 ill look up the xp3.

CK


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

$100 isn't a lot









for the filtration you get it's definetly worth it :nod:


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

i guess its good but its rated for a 175-Gallon and its too much and you said i should have that and the AC110??? thats crazy.

I think a AC110 is very good for the tank even if i have like 30 cichlids in there.?

CK.


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

boba fett said:


> i guess its good but its rated for a 175-Gallon and its too much and you said i should have that and the AC110??? thats crazy.
> 
> I think a AC110 is very good for the tank even if i have like 30 cichlids in there.?
> 
> CK.


Whoa... 30 cichlids... That's alot.. I'm not an expert but that just sounds like alot.. I hope they're all staying at 2"...







I don't think I would suggest getting that many unless you know something about keeping 30 cichlids in a 72g bowfront that I don't. Besides if overstocking even with great filtration you should be doing water changes all the time for things like growth inhibitors that fish naturally put out and filters don't remove..

Even though the ac110 is rated that high it doesn't _really_ support that high of flow..

Too be honest Mettle had a 72g bowfront and was going to setup an african tank so maybe he would have some suggestions. Try pm'ing him.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

i was kiding!!!!!! im not going to have 30 in there. probably like 15 or so.


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> i was kiding!!!!!! im not going to have 30 in there. probably like 15 or so.


Good,,,


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

NVM i do not want africans.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok i had a change of heart...

1-GT-2''
1-Convict-2''
2-Firemouths-3''
1-JD-2''
1-Snow King Pleco-4''
2-H. Moorii-2''
1-Blotch zebra

im only adding 3 African cichlids so i think they can survive without salt.

any thing else i can add??

thanks

CK.


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

I wouldn't mix africans with CA/SA. Hell you're not even supposed to mix the different african lakes together.

Sure they might "survive" other water parameters but those parameters for fish are given for a reason. Such as when they'll be most active, keeping them undiseased, etc. Yes you can physically do it, but it's irresponsible and says "I don't give a sh#t about my fish" to everyone else.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

you were doing so good with the african set up. 
You don't need salt for the Africans just the crushed coral. 
As far as overcrowding. it works sometimes but you HAVE to expect casualties. Thats the bottom line there.

If cost is a factor get an oddysea CFS4. You can get one shipped from off ebay for 60 bucks and it is the same flow rate as the XP3 It is quiet and easy to use. If you need more filtration then get a second one.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

1-GT-2''
1-Convict-2''
2-Firemouths-3''
1-JD-2''
1-Snow King Pleco-4''
2-H. Moorii-2''
1-Blotch zebra

why can't that work??? Black sunshine i had almost the same setup before i went with all african and you said it was fine.????

CK.


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

You'll have a much nicer tank with the africans... It's a tad more work, but I believe africans aren't as "dirty" as ca/sa cichlids...

Like I said there are people who mix these fish but it's irresponsible... So you should stay away from doing that.


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

africans are the ticket for you dude, you'll need a cannister which you obviously can't afford if you do 3 large SA cichlids + pleco's and dithers...africans dont need salt, although it helps a bit to be slightly brackish, limestone and crushed coral will work fine...i just set up my african tank in a 75, i've got like 12-13 cichlids, a clown loach and a pleco...i plan on about 5-6 more cichlids. africans need caves, they're pretty territorial and they like places to hide, but they're also very active, and the rock/coral makes for a bright beautiful tank, as opposed to a dull same old SA cichlid tank. in my freshwater keeping experience, the only tank that looked as good as a salt tank, is my current african tank...it really does look sick. for filtration i've got two aquatech 30-60's which i'll be adding a fluval 204 to shortly.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

Well. I was strongly warning you against the larger S/As mixed with the smaller fish. I warned that it may be successful but made you aware that the GT and JD could potentially cause you some headache with the smaller fish. You seemed pretty set on it so I said to go for it. That sounds like a group that I might attempt to throw together but I wouldn't be surprised if I lose a fish or two along the way. You don't seem to be comfortable taking that risk so that is why I'm suggesting that you go with Africans. But you're now talking about overcrowding. When I warn about overcrowding that is a general rule when overcrowding any fish tank. Fish, especially cichlids can become aggressive and intolerant of others in their personal space. Losing a fish here is something you're just going to have to be ready for. 
So you can do a tank with a reasonable # of fish in it and enjoy watching them grow, or you can put a bunch in there and watch them stay confined to one spot. . But you are taking a risk because some fish won't be happy with that and want more area. That means fighting and fighting means someone might die. 
You can't overcrowd your 72 gal with 2" fish today and expect to keep them for life when they get to an average size of 6"-8" each fish.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

what fish do you think will be the worst?? the GT?? ill remove it from the list.

i guess its a risk im willing to take and it does not mean i will risk a death of 1 of my fish, i mean if i see a fish biting i will take it out. i would never risk killing 1 of my fish unless it was of natural reasons. i know some of you think that just because im a 14 year old i don't care and i just want the fish for the colors, but if you think that you are wrong im hooked on fish and im Addicted like it says under my avatar. im a 14 year old that works in a fish store and gets to see hundreeds of fish almost everyday.

i know that they might fight because they are agressive by nature and want space, but i can not know if they are agressive or not if i do not try it right?

if you guys think the GT or the JD will defenetly be a problem than tell me and ill replace it with something else.l

CK.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok ill think about having africans... just some questions......

do i need salt? i plan to have 2 red scats and 2-Silver tip sharks along with the africans.??? or will the crushed coral do the job??

do i have to make caves or can i leave alot of open space so they can NOT establish territorys in their favorite rocks???

will they fight alot?? at the place i work at they have a 200 gallon with all africans from all lakes and i always see fish get pulled out because they are beaten up. will that happen or is it because they were from different african lakes?

thanks ill think about it tonight and tomorrow and ill tell you guys.

thanks for the help.

CK.


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

this is a pretty well setup tank...a bit small for the fish in there, but with smaller fish, that setup would work fine...

salt, 1 tsp with every 10 gal is what i do with water changes.

you definately need caves/rocks an open african tank is not a well set up one.


----------



## BlackSunshine (Mar 28, 2006)

^R1dermon is that your setup? very nice. nice fish too.

CK- your age isn't an issue. didn't even realize you were 14 till you mentioned it. 
If the fish are going to do any major fighting its usually after the lights go out. 
As too the 200 gal. Some cichlids are not very aggressive some are. sometimes they get mixed toghether because people think a cichlid is a cichlid. I'm assuming that that tank is probably overstocked. Snap some pics of it. I'd like to see it. Hell post a bunch of pics of the store you work at.

Here are a couple more examples of good set ups for africans. 
Even with S/As you are going to have to provide shelters. only bigger ones. 

































I never used salt with my africans. Just had alot of coral mixed in the gravel. But it could be benificial.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

ok so if i add a scat and a silver tip shark i need to add 1 tsp with every 10 gal??? because scats are brackish so i need to add some salt.. or do i need to add more?


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> i know some of you think that just because im a 14 year old i don't care and i just want the fish for the colors, but if you think that you are wrong im hooked on fish and im Addicted like it says under my avatar. im a 14 year old that works in a fish store and gets to see hundreeds of fish almost everyday.


It has nothing to do with you being 14.. But by being 14 we're realizing now you don't have tons of money to spend on a ca/sa tank with alot of large fish because these fish require more filtration because they are "dirtier" than your average african. Nobodys trying to pass judgement because you're young, we're just trying to lead you in the right direction for good/responsible fish keeping.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

i get it but i really do not like Africans. i want a CA/SA tank, with driftwood,Hide outs, plants, rocks and Fish that do not need any special requirements. so i changed my mind about the Africans. i don't want to fill my tank with rocks, and caves everywhere. ill just go with

1-GT
1-JD
2-Firemouths
1-Convict
1-Snow King Pleco
2-h.moorii
1-Blotch Zebra
6-Giant danios

Yes there are 3 africans in the list and its not iresponsibble to put them there.

i think it will work because im going to buy them when they are young and they will have lots of hiding spots.

CK


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> Yes there are 3 africans in the list and its not iresponsibble to put them there.


How'd you come to that conclusion? If you have a valid argument of why it's not irresponsible then I'll agree with you.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

well some people think its good and some people don't and you are one of the people that Don't. i'll try it and find out.

CK.


----------



## The Predator (Sep 28, 2005)

your 14? I dont recommend the american/african mix.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

yes i am.

CK.


----------



## The Predator (Sep 28, 2005)

i thought i was in the hobby early

anyway JDs have awsome color so they are a good choice.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

yea i like JD's, why how old are you?

CK.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

if i do african tank can i add some driftwood to the tank???

CK.


----------



## oscared15 (Feb 3, 2006)

*yea i like JD's, why how old are you?*

vemon is 15


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

1)if i do african tank can i add some driftwood to the tank???

2)and can i just add crushed coral and no salt?

CK.


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

no driftwood in an african tank, it lowers ph and hardness. honestly, you have way too many fish on that list for a 72, every single list you've posted would be "irresponsible" due to the size of the fish, also, with that many fish a jd, gt and 2 firemouths ALONE in a 72, you're not going to have many hiding spots, the fish will be stressed, it's a lose lose situation. you live you learn, africans look way better, as do the tanks. your choice though, stick 50 fish in there, its just a better idea IMO to listen to the people who've done it before.

also, that tank i posted is not mine...sorry to disappoint. lol. those fish look several years old! i'll post pics of mine when i get my camera over here.


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

yea im geting all africans but i really like my drift wood and i want it to be in the tank so that might change my mind.

is it possible for me to put it in there???

do i have to add salt or will the crushed coral do the job?

CK.


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

r1dermon said:


> africans dont need salt, although it helps a bit to be slightly brackish, limestone and crushed coral will work fine...i just set up my african tank in a 75, i've got like 12-13 cichlids, a clown loach and a pleco...i plan on about 5-6 more cichlids.


There's your answer...


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

can i add a small drift wood piece in there??? it will not do a big difference in the tank???

CK.


----------



## oscar119 (Nov 26, 2005)

Cichlid_Keeper said:


> can i add a small drift wood piece in there??? it will not do a big difference in the tank???
> 
> CK.


Yes. I would think driftwood would be fine..


----------



## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

it'll look out of place with africans...rocks and rocky structure is ideal. complex tunneling/caves looks way better than a piece of wood, and rocks are cheap as hell, driftwood from a store is a freaking rip off...


----------



## Cichlid_Keeper (Mar 30, 2006)

i got some driftwood from fishing and i will boil it, and put it in the tank, and caves/rocks.

i was thinking of having sand, so can i add some crushed coral in the bottom and cover the coral with the sand at the top?? will that work??

thanks.

CK


----------

