# 10 Gallon SaltWater Tank



## SpecialEffect

Well, i've had a 10 gallon aquarium doing nothing for about 1 month... litterly its running with nothing in it but a filter, heater, and gravel lol.
(from when i moved my piranha to my 48 gallon)

I've thought about it and now decided to turn it into a saltwater tank, problem im newb at it and wanting to experiment and get better... start from scratch yah know.

I read ALL the sticks in this board and learned quite abit.
The problem is, i DONT want to spend more then 150$ on this saltwater tank. Is it possible or not?

This is what i have in that aquarium: 
10 Gallon Aquarium
Fluval Elite Heater 
Aqua Clear 20 gallon filter.

What im asking is, what do i need to really buy for this 10 gallon tank? And specific links from bigals or anywhere else would be greatly appreciated! *Remmeber, i dont want to over spend*

Everything that i must buy i am HOPING i will find some person selling on craigslist or even kijiji

Thanks


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## His Majesty

is it possible to set one up for $150? probably

but if you want to be succeful you need to be prepared to put the time in and the money. trying to go cheap on a SW tank wont work the same way going cheap on a fw will.

first things first get your self a big powerful external filter or a skimmer. your 20g filter will be no use for a SW setup

also what sort of SW tank do you want. a mini reef? or a fowlr?


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## 00nothing

If you do decide to do a small tank i recommend a coral only system consisting of mushrooms they can tolerate less than ideal water conditions, especially since it is your first foray into saltwater. You are going to need to add some lighting and LR which if you can handle some DIY can easily be done on a 150 budget

Since I am sitting here killing time heres a quick list with some prices to get u started

$50 Live rock $3 per lb bought from someone taking down there tank 15-20 lbs
$50 Used aquaclear 110 for refugium
$50 For some DIY power compact lighting

i suggest checking out nano-reef.com


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## SpecialEffect

Im looking at the website now. I am just wondering, i have a external canister filter fluval 205 doing nothing, are external canisters good for nano sw or should i find myself an aquaclear 110?

Do i need to gte myself live sand or does silica sand do well?

And from nothing's post i believe ill do a coral only system... Another thing, i saw this on kijiji... Any of these worth it? Specially the french one

http://montreal.kijiji.ca/c-pets-other-pri...QAdIdZ159297419

http://montreal.kijiji.ca/c-pets-other-pet...QAdIdZ162649820 (beware french)


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## 00nothing

skip the prizm u might as well take your money and go flush it down the toilet it would be better for your tank than buying that skimmer, I know sounds kinda harsh and i didnt listen my first time and got one think I ended up throwing it at something in the end


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## Ægir

00nothing said:


> skip the prizm u might as well take your money and go flush it down the toilet it would be better for your tank than buying that skimmer, I know sounds kinda harsh and i didnt listen my first time and got one think I ended up throwing it at something in the end


AND DONT EVER BUY A SEACLONE SKIMMER... they are also garbage

Looks like everything else is a point in the right direction... but DONT skimp on anything, or try to cut corners. it will come back 10 fold in the long run. Take some time to save up some money for good equipment, even things like a skimmer can be "over sized" so when you upgrade (to a 55 gal or something) you can use the skimmer, and the rock, and most other things. Best idea would be to get the tank running with rock, sand, some powerheads, and the HOB fuge if you want to go that route. Then when you can afford a good skimmer, and more rock your cycle will be mostly done, and you can add fish shortly after. best thing now would be READ everything you can, with any spare time you have... the more you know, the less of a learning curve you will experience

Also, you can buy dry base rock, and seed it with a chunk or more of solid live rock. marcorocks.com is a great place for base rock, check it out.

If you dont want to spend money, this is the wrong hobby for you :laugh: once you get bitten by the bug, you will want bigger, better, and more, and then you end up with a money pit like i have at my house.... i started with a 55 gal tank, and then was consumed


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## shiver905

you dont need a skimmer. On a 10g


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## Ægir

shiver905 said:


> you dont need a skimmer. On a 10g


You dont on a 10 gal with 2 small fish, but its going to make your life easier, and require less maintenance... besides, hes not going to stay with a 10 gal for long, trust me. And if the tank is stocked with more fish... well... i wouldnt leave it out, but thats just me.

Thats why i said to set it up, and save some money. Then when you need it, get one.


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## Plowboy

I'm a rucking feef idiot, but how about this?

Turn the 10g into a sump, and drill another bigger tank to be used as the main tank. You can find anything 55g and under for cheap and a lot of times even free. It gives you more water volume right off the start, doesnt cost much more, and keeps it more flexible for the long run. Plus, you get a sump to hide the ugly stuff in!

Then couldn't you just chuck in the live sand and as much rock as you can afford at the time? After a while as money allows you keep adding LR, skimmers, top offs, maybe a bigger sump, and anything else that tickles your fancy?

Like I said, I don't know crap really. I'm just throwing ideas out there.

GL on your reef. Hopefully I can have one to before to long too.


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## His Majesty

Skunkbudfour20 said:


> you dont need a skimmer. On a 10g


You dont on a 10 gal with 2 small fish, but its going to make your life easier, and require less maintenance... besides, hes not going to stay with a 10 gal for long, trust me. And if the tank is stocked with more fish... well... i wouldnt leave it out, but thats just me.

Thats why i said to set it up, and save some money. Then when you need it, get one.
[/quote]

i agree with skunk. you can go without a skimmer. but if your gonna do a reef and have some small fish then a skimmer will be a real good investment. it eill make maintainence that little bit easier

and out of curiosity have you ever kepy a SW tank shiver?


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## Ægir

Plowboy said:


> I'm a rucking feef idiot, but how about this?
> 
> Turn the 10g into a sump, and drill another bigger tank to be used as the main tank. You can find anything 55g and under for cheap and a lot of times even free. It gives you more water volume right off the start, doesnt cost much more, and keeps it more flexible for the long run. Plus, you get a sump to hide the ugly stuff in!
> 
> *Then couldn't you just chuck in the live sand and as much rock as you can afford at the time? After a while as money allows you keep adding LR, skimmers, top offs, maybe a bigger sump, and anything else that tickles your fancy*?
> 
> Like I said, I don't know crap really. I'm just throwing ideas out there.
> 
> GL on your reef. Hopefully I can have one to before to long too.


Exactly, thats the idea... and 99% of people that start small, quickly realize that its not enough room, or they cant keep the fish they want, or its hard to maintain because of evaporation (salinity changes, as water evaporates toxins also become less diluted)... It will have to be manually topped off daily, atleast once (unless you buy a 100$ auto top off). And really the only fish you can keep would be 2 small ones. A clownfish pair (maybe, prob not larger clowns tho!) or maybe a couple chromis, a pistol shrimp/goby pair etc...

Without a skimmer, your livestock and other things are even more limited than that.

Also, even salt mix, and RO/DI water... salt is fairly expensive, but you will only need 50 gals worth to last for a couple months (water changes and filling the tank)

If you are planning on keeping corals, you will need a good light fixture, and even the prices of individual frags can overshoot your budget 2 or 3 times depending what they are.

Like i said before, just start a jar to put spare money in, super glue the lid to keep you out... after a month or 2 (that you should spend reading about saltwater, i use reefcentral.com) you should have a good start. Skip the 10 gal, and go atleast with a 29 tall, and watch local classifieds (craigslist.com) for somebody selling a tank, or equipment. You can also check Ebay for used skimmers and things like that. You could prob find a 90 gal setup for 300$ max, then you need rock and sand, salt and RO/DI water to get it started... Then while it cycles and matures, continue to save and add one piece of quality equipment at a time. The puzzle will come together, and it will be easier to maintain, and more to enjoy (because its not just work)










Feel free to shoot me a PM any time you need help.


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## nismo driver

the problem isnt setting up a nano ona tight budget. you can find cheap stuff on the reef forums and do some DIY.

the real problem is the hundreds to thousnads you will spend once you have the reef bug..

atleaast your doing some research and preparing


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## Ægir

nismo driver said:


> the problem isnt setting up a nano ona tight budget. you can find cheap stuff on the reef forums and do some DIY.
> 
> the real problem is the *hundreds to thousnads you will spend once you have the reef bug.. *
> 
> atleaast your doing some research and preparing


Well said nismo... the "wallet siphon" as i like to call it.

"I just got paid today, what can i buy for my tank?" is an all too familiar thought in my head.


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## xeloR

Skunk you have some sound advice bro!

My nano cost me just as much as a full blown reef by the time I was done with it. You can try to cut corners on some things to save money but as a whole there is nothing cheap about a SW tank. The cheap items that you buy will be replaced down the road with the better quality/ more expensive ones that you should have been bought to begin with. Just take your time and make sure you have the money saved up to build exactly what you want- spending time searching on nanoreef/ reefcentral is a good start. BTW I wouldn't run a tank without a skimmer- even a 10 gallon


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## SpecialEffect

Well for the skimmer thing, I found one that go for 100$ are those any good?

Also, for RO water, i have a metro (grocery store) that sells RO water (fill it yourself...) However, its not RO/DI.... its just RO... does it matter so much?


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## Ægir

mtuttle02 said:


> *Skunk you have some sound advice bro!*
> 
> My nano cost me just as much as a full blown reef by the time I was done with it. You can try to cut corners on some things to save money but as a whole there is nothing cheap about a SW tank. The cheap items that you buy will be replaced down the road with the better quality/ more expensive ones that you should have been bought to begin with. Just take your time and make sure you have the money saved up to build exactly what you want- spending time searching on nanoreef/ reefcentral is a good start. BTW I wouldn't run a tank without a skimmer- even a 10 gallon


Thanks man, i was once in the "using a HOB filter, running a seaclone skimmer, tap water, and not doing any testing" stage, and try to do everything i can to save people the pain, suffering, and misery that will eventually come and that i went through... Its not fun, or any sort of enjoyment when you are always stressed out and see your tank as work, not something that should take 10 min a week to do a water change, and clean the skimmer (minus feeding the fish daily, and checking for visually obvious problems like temp, water level etc) but i spend atleast an hour a day sitting back and enjoying it with a cold beer.

My first salt tank was from a friend, who basically relied on me for fish info because i was into fresh water (but did the exact opposite what i told him?) So i started reading up on his problems... after about 6 months i became addicted, and realized its not by any means harder than fresh water, just completely different set of rules. After his tank was nothing but an algae/aptasia farm, and he wouldnt do water changes, use RO/DI water, test, on and on he gave up and handed it over... I nuked the tank with fresh water after trying to reverse the problems naturally, scrubbed the rock and started over. I dont have any pics, but just imgaine 2" long hair algae covering EVERY surface under water and a copious amount of aptasia... and it smelled like low tide at the beach in his house. Because of my budget i had to run the HOB for a while, and no skimmer or sump... ended up with about the same thing, just a different type of algae (diatoms, and purple slime).

This is the tank after using good water, salt, keeping up on water changes, adding better lighting (2xOver Driven 4 bulb floro fixture) a 10 gal sump with rock rubble, SCWD (wave maker) and some powerheads. Also painted the background. My one mistake was buying a seaclone skimmer because it was all that is available locally... i read reviews after i purchased it, and realized what it really was. After modding the crap out of it (im kinda DIY savvy) i got it to pull a reasonable amount of skimmate and it worked as a temp fix on my small tank.

http://s46.photobucket.com/albums/f118/Sku...nt=DSC01476.jpg

Then i made the jump to the 155 bow... and realized how much easier it was to maintain having a total of 5 times more water volume, a great skimmer, sump, and learning from my past mistakes and impulse buys.


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## Ægir

SpecialEffect said:


> Well for the skimmer thing, I found one that go for 100$ are those any good?
> 
> Also, for RO water, i have a metro (grocery store) that sells RO water (fill it yourself...) However, its not RO/DI.... its just RO... does it matter so much?


What brand of skimmer is it?

RO is different... DI stands for De-ionization which removes way more than just RO (reverse osmosis)

Check your local LFS for RO/DI, or water purification companys that deliver the 5 gals of bottled water... they prob sell it by the gallon


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## xeloR

I would recommend getting a TDS meter and checking your sources water- a lot of the RODI water you buy at shops etc have exhausted filters and you will just be getting crap. Best bet would be buy your own RODI filter that way you know exactly what state your filters are in etc.


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## SpecialEffect

Well, i guess yah can skip this idea.... Reading around, it seems i should just save my money and then eventually buy a new tank, or even turn my 48 gallon aquarium that i already have into a salt water tank....

Till then, i guess i shall wait... However, thanks all for reading my thread and answering my question's and adding to my not so high knowledge on saltwater aquariums... thanks!


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## shiver905

You guys are making this into a big deal.

A nano to me a mini reef on your desktop by your computer or your night table.
You dont need a skimmer for a nano- It has such little water quantity. Your water changes will do enough.

But i do agree a QUALITY SKIMMER is super importains in larger reefs.

---

If you keep it simple and maintain it properly. It shouldnt cost you much at all. You can get it done for 150$
personally if i was on a budget...

10gal tank
lighting (search craigs list) (most expensive part so far)
AC 70 fuge mod
Live rock
Live sand
5galx4 jugs of premixed saltwater form ur LFS
Test kits

Your ready for a cycle.

-
This is making me want to start 1.


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## 00nothing

Agreed If i ever spent what i spent on a 10 gallon on a 50 gallon i would shoot myself, Everyone is overcomplicating the crap out of this my first tank was a 5 gallon with a hob filter no fuge mod and 2 of the screw in coralife 50/50 pc bulbs i had that running for quite some time with notbing but weekly water changes and it taught me a lot about this hobby it eventualy had a meltdown due to summer heats and not knowing what cooling was but I have never looked back since

Looking at doing a minibow 7 for my daughter for xmas as we speak it will be ac110 fuged with a 50 watt heater and 2 t5 bulbs retroe'd into the stock hood

Heres my first tank and the MB7 i did for a buddy both running screw in pc's

tank ran for 8 months that dying donut ended up being my longest kept coral had it for over 5 yrs









If I remember correctly this tank came it at jsut below the 200 mark


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## His Majesty

personally i still would get a decent cannister filter.


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## xeloR

We also have people on the forum that think it’s sufficient to just do water changes on a stocked piranha tank with no biological filtration (maybe it is?). Anything’s is possible it’s just a matter of how long you plan to keep a successful setup- that’s determined from day one.


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## Ægir

shiver905 said:


> We also have people on the forum that think it's sufficient to just do water changes on a stocked piranha tank with no biological filtration (maybe it is?). Anything's is possible it's just a matter of *how long you plan to keep a successful setup*- that's determined from day one.


Exactly... i would way rather be over prepared from square one and make less work for myself


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## Plowboy

mtuttle02 said:


> We also have people on the forum that think it's sufficient to just do water changes on a stocked piranha tank with no biological filtration (maybe it is?). Anything's is possible it's just a matter of how long you plan to keep a successful setup- that's determined from day one.


Yes, but that is a totally different thing and shouldn't be compared with this. W/Cs without a bio filter isn't for nitrate exportation. With a bio filter they would be. The skimmer is just there to lighten the load on the bio filter or live rock, which in turn makes fewer nitrates to export. It's not out of line to think that replacing a skimmer with water changes will work. It will definitely work, but the whole system will be touchier since nitrates will build up faster. Easy cure? There isn't one, but under-stocking the tank will help. That way you won't have to worry as much about missing a water change by a day or 2.

And of course its possible to keep piranhas without a biological filter. People have been keeping fish in aquariums that rely 100% on water changes for thousands of years. Fish tanks with bio filters have only really been viable since the invention of electricity. It's just not the best situation to run without a bio filter.


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## xeloR

Exactly why I said anything is possible for a short period of time- I guess its all in ones mindset and in what your ultimate goal is.


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## 00nothing

In the case of a nano nitrates are easily kept under control with a well done refugium and a lot of biofiltration so lots of LR the reason right off the bat i didnt suggest base rock, add regular water changes to that and nitrates shouldnt even be an issue I am not sure why everyone thinks that skimmers are the be all end all in nitrate reduction no protein skimmer will ever replace regular maintenance for keeping nitrate levels in check my father ran a 300 gallon reef for 15 yrs with no skimmer no sump using canister filter and flourescent lighting. Now I am not saying that the true could hold same for a 10 gallon nano but my point is technology isnt always the answer and that a tank can be done in the budget hes talking about succesfully that MB7 was up for almost year and a half before the owner upgraded to a 30 gallon


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## shiver905

mtuttle- Your basically telling him- If he sets it up that way, Hes cutting corner so in time it will fail.
which is NOT true.

its a 10g tank.

You dont want have more then 1 fish in there anyway.
I woudnt even recomend a clown for a 10g. 
A damsel is what i would put in there if a fish is a must.

In fact
MOST nanos dont have a skimmer.

WHY? - You cant really fit fish in a 10gal
- water changes are easy.

In big reef tanks water changes are very rare coapired to keeping P'
Maybe once/few months.

What i listed above is The RIGHT way to set up a nano.
Most nanos are set up that way.

Shure you can go on and add a ATO,skimmer, HALIDs, T5, all the reactors, auto doseing. ECT.....

But he has 150$ budget- If you do it the way I recommended its not cutting corners-
Because it has been done over n over again with GREAT results.

I woundnt recomend a canister because the point of the AC70 is you can pop the lid-add some light and grow some nice macro.
But you could always do the canister/fuge mod. If you like DIY.


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## Ægir

shiver905 said:


> mtuttle- Your basically telling him- If he sets it up that way, Hes cutting corner so in time it will fail.
> which is NOT true. *from my experience what he said is completely true, you get what you pay for, and cheap comes back to bite you in the ass*
> 
> its a 10g tank.
> 
> You dont want have more then 1 fish in there anyway. *You can have 1000 fish if you wanted, its just a matter of being able to remove waste, which is where a skimmer would help but isnt completely necessary*
> I woudnt even recomend a clown for a 10g. *You can keep clowns in a 10 gal no problem, they arent really active swimmers, but prob not the larger clowns*
> A damsel is what i would put in there if a fish is a must. *Bad idea, damsels are violent, and a PITA every single time. i took out 300lbs of rock to catch an angry tomato clown who was tame compared to a damsel *
> 
> In fact
> MOST nanos dont have a skimmer. *most of the nicer nanos come with one, atleast as an option.... so i would need to see some hard info on that*
> 
> WHY? - You cant really fit fish in a 10gal *.... Uh, already covered this... theres prob a 100 species of fish for a 10 gal tank*
> - water changes are easy. *Salt is more expensive than a skimmer over time... *
> 
> In big reef tanks water changes are very rare coapired to keeping P'
> Maybe once/few months. * Some people do it that way but mainly lazy people, some people like myself use weekly 40 to 80 (8 to 16% of volume)gal water changes to replenish trace minerals, mainly calcium, and magnesium*
> 
> What i listed above is The RIGHT way to set up a nano. *Questionable *
> Most nanos are set up that way. *How is your saltwater tank setup out of curiosity, or ones you have had?*
> 
> Sure you can go on and add a ATO,skimmer, HALIDs, T5, all the reactors, auto doseing. ECT..... *Typically halidEs, OR T5s, unless were talkin about supplemental actinic lighting (mine are T12 which is more common)*
> 
> But he has 150$ budget- If you do it the way I recommended its not cutting corners-
> Because it has been done over n over again with GREAT results. *I would say more average results, and it still takes more work to keep up*
> 
> I woundnt recomend a canister because the point of the AC70 is you can pop the lid-add some light and grow some nice macro.
> But you could always do the canister/fuge mod. If you like DIY.


Once again, nobody told him he _has_ to have all this razzle dazzle equipment... it has been clearly stated he can take the tank, some rock, and sand, add salt water, and a powerhead and be fine... but with extremely limited options in terms of what he can keep... nobody wants to look at just snails and rocks or 1 fish.

If you are thinking of keeping ANY corals, mushrooms, zoas you will have to run a carbon (reactor or somewhere ) to remove toxins... when you are talking a small volume of water, its SOOO much easier to pollute and most corals (not stinging varieties) are capable of killing EVERYTHING in your tank when in "warfare" mode....

Would i run a skimmer... absolutely! It removes organic compounds in your water, which also feed algae and cause numerous other problems from waste or feeding, even minimal amounts build up. You can do weekly 50% water changes, but then again that salt you are burning up will out cost a skimmer in the lifetime of your tank... you could reduce it to monthly 20% and be farrrrr better off. Hell an nano skimmer is easier to build DIY than most things, you need an airstone, a 12oz pop bottle, and a collection cup.. or spend the 35$ for a cheaper one which is prob a smaller seaclone piece of crap, but anything helps.

I just read around on nano reefs for a while, and lots of people are running them, especially the higher end tanks with SPS and LPS

Quick recap, take 10lbs of live rock, some base rock if you want, sand, saltwater and a powerhead... then while cycling, save some money for livestock and extras that will make your life easier... Just a skimmer and ATO would save you money in salt (and over a few years pay for the extras), and keep your salinity perfect... in a 10 gal your daily evaporation could skew the salinity so much it would be highly stressful on your tank and could even kill things if you left for 2 days.

Im not a fan of babysitting and doing extra work that isnt necessary... i would rather enjoy whats going on inside the tank and not think of it as a chore. Nobody has told him he needs to get all this equipment now either, like i said build it up over 4 to 6 months.


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## shiver905

Skunkbudfour20 said:


> mtuttle- Your basically telling him- If he sets it up that way, Hes cutting corner so in time it will fail.
> which is NOT true. *from my experience what he said is completely true, you get what you pay for, and cheap comes back to bite you in the ass*
> TRUE- BUT BUDGET IS ALWAYS A FACTOR. YOU SHOULDNT sh*t ON HIS 150$. IT CAN BE BUILT AND HAS BEEN BUILT OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
> 
> its a 10g tank.
> 
> You dont want have more then 1 fish in there anyway. *You can have 1000 fish if you wanted, its just a matter of being able to remove waste, which is where a skimmer would help but isnt completely necessary*
> I woudnt even recomend a clown for a 10g. *You can keep clowns in a 10 gal no problem, they arent really active swimmers, but prob not the larger clowns*
> I DONT RECOMEND ANY FISH FOR A 10G. PERSONALLY I THINK ITS JUST TO SMALL.
> 
> A damsel is what i would put in there if a fish is a must. *Bad idea, damsels are violent, and a PITA every single time. i took out 300lbs of rock to catch an angry tomato clown who was tame compared to a damsel *
> 
> In fact
> MOST nanos dont have a skimmer. *most of the nicer nanos come with one, atleast as an option.... so i would need to see some hard info on that*
> NOT REALLY TRUE- IV SEEN NICE NANOS W/O SKIMMERS.
> 
> WHY? - You cant really fit fish in a 10gal *.... Uh, already covered this... theres prob a 100 species of fish for a 10 gal tank*
> - water changes are easy. *Salt is more expensive than a skimmer over time... *
> I PERSONALLY WOULDNT SPEND THE MONEY ON A RODI/SALT/TDS/ LEGIT HYDROMETER. IF ITS ONLY A 10G. AROUND HERE I THINK ITS 0.99 A GALLON.
> 
> In big reef tanks water changes are very rare coapired to keeping P'
> Maybe once/few months. * Some people do it that way but mainly lazy people, some people like myself use weekly 40 to 80 (8 to 16% of volume)gal water changes to replenish trace minerals, mainly calcium, and magnesium*
> NOT TRUE AT ALL. I THINK ITS CUZ ITS MORE STABLE.
> 
> What i listed above is The RIGHT way to set up a nano. *Questionable *
> Most nanos are set up that way. *How is your saltwater tank setup out of curiosity, or ones you have had?*
> 
> Sure you can go on and add a ATO,skimmer, HALIDs, T5, all the reactors, auto doseing. ECT..... *Typically halidEs, OR T5s, unless were talkin about supplemental actinic lighting (mine are T12 which is more common)*
> T12S DONT WORK VERY WELL AT ALL. I DONT KNOW A SINGLE PERSON THAT STILL USES T12S ON A REEF.
> 
> But he has 150$ budget- If you do it the way I recommended its not cutting corners-
> Because it has been done over n over again with GREAT results. *I would say more average results, and it still takes more work to keep up*
> GREAT RESULTS. KEY IS PROPER MAINTANENCE AND RESEARCH.
> 
> I woundnt recomend a canister because the point of the AC70 is you can pop the lid-add some light and grow some nice macro.
> But you could always do the canister/fuge mod. If you like DIY.


Once again, nobody told him he _has_ to have all this razzle dazzle equipment... it has been clearly stated he can take the tank, some rock, and sand, add salt water, and a powerhead and be fine... but with extremely limited options in terms of what he can keep... nobody wants to look at just snails and rocks or 1 fish.

If you are thinking of keeping ANY corals, mushrooms, zoas you will have to run a carbon (reactor or somewhere ) to remove toxins... when you are talking a small volume of water, its SOOO much easier to pollute and most corals (not stinging varieties) are capable of killing EVERYTHING in your tank when in "warfare" mode....

Would i run a skimmer... absolutely! It removes organic compounds in your water, which also feed algae and cause numerous other problems from waste or feeding, even minimal amounts build up. You can do weekly 50% water changes, but then again that salt you are burning up will out cost a skimmer in the lifetime of your tank... you could reduce it to monthly 20% and be farrrrr better off. Hell an nano skimmer is easier to build DIY than most things, you need an airstone, a 12oz pop bottle, and a collection cup.. or spend the 35$ for a cheaper one which is prob a smaller seaclone piece of crap, but anything helps. 
ID RATHER UPGRADE THE T12S LOL

I just read around on nano reefs for a while, and lots of people are running them, especially the higher end tanks with SPS and LPS

Quick recap, take 10lbs of live rock, some base rock if you want, sand, saltwater and a powerhead... then while cycling, save some money for livestock and extras that will make your life easier... Just a skimmer and ATO would save you money in salt (and over a few years pay for the extras), and keep your salinity perfect... in a 10 gal your daily evaporation could skew the salinity so much it would be highly stressful on your tank and could even kill things if you left for 2 days. 
ATO IS A GOOD INVESMENT

Im not a fan of babysitting and doing extra work that isnt necessary... i would rather enjoy whats going on inside the tank and not think of it as a chore. Nobody has told him he needs to get all this equipment now either, like i said build it up over 4 to 6 months.
-----
""""Some people do it that way but mainly lazy people, some people like myself use weekly 40 to 80 (8 to 16% of volume)gal water changes to replenish trace minerals, mainly calcium, and magnesium"""" END QUOTE
[/quote]

Sorry for it being hard to read- just cook for the CAPS.

Clearly Skunk and I have different POV - 
End of the day-
Do your research, sign up to a nano reef fourm (nano-reef.com) ask some pros.
And learn b4 you jump into it.


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## Ægir

Im not going to continue to go back and forth... but actually lots of people do use T12 for SUPPLEMENTAL ACTINIC lighting like i stated... theres no reason for me to "UPGRADE THE T12S LOL" because i already get a sunburn if i am in the back room for a few hours at a time

Heres the 110w VHO T12 bulbs i use... Clicky right beside 2 175W, and a single 400w halide (totaling 1080w) I will take pics if you want, or check my build thread

I have also run overdriven T8 bulbs with success... and really it has nothing to do with T12, 8 or 5 the main thing is the bulbs themselves, running improper spectrum will grow major algae and other problems, and typically T5 is used because it runs cooler and is more efficient (lumens per watt)

As for the quote at the bottom, i am really unsure what you are getting at... your caps thing near the original quote, say its more stable to do monthly water changes? IF i didnt dose my calcium and alk additives (Kent marine 2 part) even the coraline algae would deplete my calcium (which is directly linked to mag, and alk!) over the period of a month which isnt "stable" at all. I choose smaller water changes over daily dosing of 2 part and testing.


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## His Majesty

its really up to the OP on how he wants to proceed on this nano tank

but skunk has a very good point. when it comes to SW weather its a big reef tank or a small nano it pays in the long run to do things properly and invest in good equipment. plus it allows you to upgrade easier in the future when you have decent established equipment. its very hard to try and do things cheaply without it coming to haunt you later down the line.

And there definetly is not a 'RIGHT' way to setup a nano. 
with good planning and the right equipment you can set it up however you like. 
You cannot setup a SW tank with the same menatlity as you can with a FW tank.


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## philbert

I love how shiver didn't answer the question about his tank setup and from the way his posts read it doesn't sound like he has one. its all they and other ppl doing things a different way. sounds like just wants to argue.

Just bc ppl are telling him other options that may exceed his budget that is ok. in fact they are just educating him maybe if it was just shiver talkin on the thread nad he sets it up how you suggest and the finds out it doens't work the way he wants and he goes about setting up a bigger tank with the advice the others have given. so in the end this may save him time and money.


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## Wide_Eyed_Wanderer

I have a 10 gallon aswell. I have a little HOB filter with some chaeto in it, a clown, few corals. I haven't done a water change going on 2 months now everything is going smooth, stuff is growing like crazy too!


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