# My 13" Tern Died *PICS*



## RhomZilla (Feb 12, 2003)

Tern was pretty malnutritioned. Became one of the greediest eatters in my tank, and became ALPHA over my other 13" Tern. Days after, he just kept swimming in circles, eyes begining to sink in. Asked the Water Guru (DonH) for advice and followed as told... put in ICU tank, isolate with same water but add some new to keep fresh and prevent going in shock, feed feeders, keep in the dark, use salt treatment, and monitor tank perimeters. Days after the bacteria got worse and eyes began to sink even deeper. No way I could save him, and found him dead after work.

Heres pics of his sunken eye..


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## RhomZilla (Feb 12, 2003)

Day 2...


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## RhomZilla (Feb 12, 2003)

Day 3.. Eyes so sunked in that it looked as he didnt have eyes and only had eye sockets


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## RhomZilla (Feb 12, 2003)

Isolated under the 240, in a 20 gal.. saw this before I left for work.


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## RhomZilla (Feb 12, 2003)

Closer look after he died...


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## RhomZilla (Feb 12, 2003)

Tried placing him in the 240 again to see if he'll recover...


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## lemmywinks (Jan 25, 2004)

that sux


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## RhomZilla (Feb 12, 2003)

NO success..


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## RhomZilla (Feb 12, 2003)

RIP


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## RhomZilla (Feb 12, 2003)

Sorry, wrong Forum..

_*Moved to Disease, Parasite, and Injury*_..


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## fishofury (May 10, 2003)

OMG, that sucks major balls. Sorry about your loss Rhom. Didn't you just get him?


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## LiLMic (Apr 14, 2004)

Rip


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## Red Eyes (Nov 25, 2003)

Sorry to see/hear







How are the other p's doing?


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## RhomZilla (Feb 12, 2003)

The other Ps are doing great.. shoaling, no fights, and eatting regular


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## x420xNick (Mar 6, 2004)

Damn. Sorry for your loss.


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## Death in #'s (Apr 29, 2003)

f*ck that sucks
i loved your monster shoal as it was
are u getting another monster for that tank
and that sucken eye looks really bad


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## Outie (Feb 19, 2003)

Man







that! Sorry to hear and see. And such a great sized tern to boot.


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## HOLLYWOOD (Feb 6, 2003)

Sorry to hear about that.

This stresses the point that external apperances can never guarantee that you have a healthy piranha. A piranha can look healthy on the outside but could be suffering from a harmful bacteria internally.


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## joefromcanada (Apr 16, 2004)

sorry for ur loss dude. looked like a very nice fish indeed.


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## MR HARLEY (Aug 12, 2003)

SORRY MAN ........
daM ....iM SO SORRY


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## Winkyee (Feb 17, 2003)




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## tecknik (Jul 18, 2003)

I have never seen anything like that before. Was this internal bacteria affecting only his eyes? Damm Al, sorry to hear







Hope all your others are doing okay.


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## pamonster (Jun 26, 2003)

sorry to hear about that


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## Hypergenix (Dec 17, 2003)

sorry to hear that bro


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## Runningmad (Aug 13, 2003)

wow, sorry for your loss. amazing looking fish


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## x-J-x (Nov 28, 2002)

sorry for the lost...ouch...wat r u gonna do w/ the body?


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## phensway (Apr 7, 2003)

mount his jaws


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## RhomZilla (Feb 12, 2003)

x-J-x said:


> sorry for the lost...ouch...wat r u gonna do w/ the body?


 Sending the fish to Frank to see what infection/bacteria caused this.


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## DonH (Jan 25, 2003)

The fish is very thin, but I don't think its emaciated state is the cause of the sunken eyes. (This is the first time I've seen pics of this fish.) It's more likely a systemic bacterial infection. I will be curious to see what Frank finds and through what methods he will use to identify if it is indeed a bacterial infection and what strain.


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## chewwie419 (Mar 29, 2004)

sorry for your loss


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## Atlanta Braves Baby! (Mar 12, 2003)

Sorry for the loss Al!








You should mount that monster.


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## hastatus (Jan 16, 2003)

> DonH Posted on May 18 2004, 04:26 AM
> The fish is very thin, but I don't think its emaciated state is the cause of the sunken eyes. (This is the first time I've seen pics of this fish.) It's more likely a systemic bacterial infection. I will be curious to see what Frank finds and through what methods he will use to identify if it is indeed a bacterial infection and what strain.


I have a book by Dr. Bob Goldstein, a well-respected parasitologist and Dr. Earl Wiedner is a parasitologist that I mostly converse with on this type of bugs. What I will do is make a incision and remove part of the tissue, stain it and put it under microscope. I will use a comparison of bacteria jpegs to see if I can narrow it down. Failing that, I will take a photo and then email it to both those guys and see if I get any feedback on what it might be. I've known Bob Goldstein for some time. He is big into the fish hobby. Wiedner is retired but still active at the University he taught at.

BTW, anyone handling diseased fishes should do so only with gloves. You don't want to transfect yourself with a bug that could make you sick as well. *Just a word of caution.*


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## hastatus (Jan 16, 2003)

I also should add here, much of the problems associated with diseased piranas is because another fish was introduced that might have been sick; goldfish or wildfishes. One of the key reasons why I strongly suggest never feeding live fish.


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## thePACK (Jan 3, 2003)

just wondering..you guys dont think this could of been a case of T.B and not bactarial infection?had a saltwater fish(scribble angel to be exact) and it went the same way as rhom's fish.just al got the fish like this(skinny) and didn't have it that long as i had my fish.little by little the scribble started to get bony,lost of appetite and eventually the eyes started to shrink into its head.look very terrible..i want to put it out of its misery but i couldn't get the nerve to.. anyways a few days later it died .i talked to a few fish store owners during this ordeal and they all suggest it could of been t.B?any thouights?


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## xt12ap5peedx17x (Oct 20, 2003)

That really sucks to see that. sorry bro!


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## traumatic (Jan 29, 2003)

I hope you can find out what this is, and hope your other fish do not get this as well.


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## DonH (Jan 25, 2003)

thePACK said:


> just wondering..you guys dont think this could of been a case of T.B and not bactarial infection?


 Fish tuberculosis is a type of bacterial infection (Mycobacterium to be exact) and very difficult to diagnose. The symptoms in its advanced stage are usually lack of appetite, wasting away, and protruding eyes (not sunken eyes). This disease IS transmissible to humans so, as Frank as stated, handle with care.

I only recommend the use of quarantined feeders in the case of acclimating a newly wild caught fish. As soon as they are eating and settled down, I switch them over to prepared foods and they never see live feeders again (unless it's their tankmate








).


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

Oh damn, that's very sad, Zilla








I'm sorry to hear about this....


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## RhomZilla (Feb 12, 2003)

Thanks for all the kind words you guys.







Frank the Tern is on its way, shipped with the procedure mentioned. Thanks for doing an autopsy on it. Cant wait to know the results.


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## hastatus (Jan 16, 2003)

The sunken eyes and other maladies are the after effects of what ails the fish to start with. "Dropsy" the most common for pregnant looking fish leads to sunken eyes, etc. But even that disease came into being from an originating source. Usually injury that became infected or an oral source.


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## pirayaboy (Feb 24, 2004)

sorry for the loss....that f*ck'n sucks dude..to see a monster like that die


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## Raptor (Jan 3, 2003)

Woulden't there be more of an indication in a internal bacterial infection? I am just curious because i have three of the same lot of fish. Would they eat? Bloat or have any signs of a problem? One of mine was listless for three days after i got him from taking him home too soon. I knew better to take him before he was treated by ash(What i mean by treated is let them get back to health from being shipped from argentina, But that was a over a week before rhoms went out) but i had to grab them before someone else did.
The stress from being packed 2 times in one week i bet was the cause for mine getting like that
. But as don h knows mine was an common external fungus, cured by fungus clear by jungle. I am not making light of this rhom







Just scarry to think of mine catching it.
But mine are eating so i think i am safe.
My regrets rhomzilla
Edited for explainations in parinthesis
Also i notice all wild piranha are thin to out standards. I have not seen a fresh wild caught p that was as in good of condition as one held captive even for a month or two.


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## the grinch (Feb 23, 2004)

those hugh terns are sweet as hell. sorry to hear the loss.


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## hastatus (Jan 16, 2003)

> Raptor Posted on May 18 2004, 10:03 PM
> Woulden't there be more of an indication in a internal bacterial infection? I am just curious because i have three of the same lot of fish. Would they eat? Bloat or have any signs of a problem?
> *Many questions to reply to so will sum it up this way; Just because you don't see a problem, doesn't mean its not already there. The main thing to watch for when buying a fish is:
> 
> ...


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## kouma (Sep 1, 2003)

I am really sorry about your loss







rhomzilla


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## Xenon (Nov 15, 2002)

Yo Al, man thats a killer loss.... sorry


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## jovons (Jul 28, 2003)

yeah, that was a big loss... i saw it yesterday... and it was a huge tern... i was like "holy s..."

sorry for your loss, bro... and thanks for your 9" piraya...


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## Genin (Feb 4, 2003)

wow sorry for your loss, it was quite a large loss indeed.

Joe


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## DirtyJersey (Apr 28, 2004)

a shame to see something like that go.


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## Dr. Giggles (Oct 18, 2003)

Sorry to hear man. Definitely keep us posted on the test results.


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## DiXoN (Jan 31, 2003)

sorry RZ that was big one.
dixon


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## alexm (Aug 18, 2003)

Any updates on what infection caused this?


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