# Healthy Feeders



## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

I'll buy 2 dozon tropical/amazon fish (pacu's/convicts/tetra) and give them 2 nights in my hospital tank...prazi pro/salt etc...

during witch I am crushing up "cichlid gold" pellets and they LOVE THEM, I mean they really eat them up, so....

taking all that into account, and the fact that these fish are healthy to begin with because they ain't cheap, and they aint cold-waterfish (like goldfish) creating a risk for disese in a 80 degree tank...

if they are dosed(and healthy) and eating nutrient rich food, how bad can they be for my P's??

this is an easier way of feeding cause if they arent hungary, i dont have to take them out because they wont rot, creating ammonia. not only that but they help serve as "punching bags" for my pygo's helping prevent fin nipping...feel me??

and not only all of that but they look nicer, and more natural in the tank, its actually really cool having alot of life in the tank...


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## 77gp454 (Feb 18, 2007)

I heard Danios are a safer feeder and would assume anything is better than those 10 cent shty gold fish. Hopefully someone else has more input on this.


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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

bumpitty bump bump


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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

what the BUMP???


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## RB 32 (Mar 2, 2005)




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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

RB 32 said:


>


throw me a freakin bone here


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## MONGO  (Feb 7, 2006)

I would breed convicts but it does cost money and takes time. Feeders are good (except for the common goldfish sold in the disease infested tank at the LFS) as long as they are appropriate size, quarantined, and not on the list of fish that contain growth inhibitors.

I would stick to (white)fish fillets and shrimp. Its cheapers and you can throw a stash of it in the freezer so you have food for a while.


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## taylorhedrich (Mar 2, 2005)

I do the same thing you do once in a while for a 'treat' for my piranhas. I will just buy some small fish like tetras at the local fish store (the cheapest I can find) and throw them in the tank, even without quarantining. Chances are they are healthy since they are being sold as pets, but of course it's still a risk, it's just one that I'm more willing to take I guess.
~Taylor~


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## piranah4life44 (Oct 29, 2006)

I thought PraziPro says don't use it on fish that will be used as food for other fish? I thought I remember reading that somewhere...


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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

piranah4life44 said:


> I thought PraziPro says don't use it on fish that will be used as food for other fish? I thought I remember reading that somewhere...


really??? oh man....


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## cueball (May 24, 2005)

iam anti-feeder now after i battled with hole in the head for almost 3 months ,,, well you can use feeders but just dont some day get lazy like i did and dump in 30+ cons (home breed ) it took him over a month to catch almost all of them some were real fast he couldnt get at them,,i think he got the hole in the head cuz of the food change he went from shrimp for 2 years to a feeder every other day,,, for a month thats enuf to stress there system ..


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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

RockinTimbz said:


> I would breed convicts but it does cost money and takes time. Feeders are good (except for the common goldfish sold in the disease infested tank at the LFS) as long as they are appropriate size, quarantined, and not on the list of fish that contain growth inhibitors.
> 
> I would stick to (white)fish fillets and shrimp. Its cheapers and you can throw a stash of it in the freezer so you have food for a while.


I know, but that makes the tank dirty....it gets cloudy....and then i have to monitor them eat, which i don't always have time to do...especially with my moody ass serras...

Where can I find that list of fish with inhibitors?


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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

also serras only eat other fish in the wild....



77gp454 said:


> I heard Danios are a safer feeder and would assume anything is better than those 10 cent shty gold fish. Hopefully someone else has more input on this.


yeah crosshair tell you that? i like the danios myself


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## ChilDawg (Apr 30, 2006)

Danios are "safer", but they are cyprinids, so they are likely to be chock-full of thiaminase...


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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

ChilDawg said:


> Danios are "safer", but they are cyprinids, so they are likely to be chock-full of thiaminase...


is that really bad?

i mix up the feeders with diifferent amazonian life


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## taylorhedrich (Mar 2, 2005)

mR. Blueberry said:


> Danios are "safer", but they are cyprinids, so they are likely to be chock-full of thiaminase...


is that really bad?

i mix up the feeders with diifferent amazonian life
[/quote]
No, it's not terrible as long as you don't feed it as a staple in their diet (which we already know that you don't).


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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

"staple" meaning....


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## CorGravey (Feb 13, 2007)

I think it means main or something. Staple diet=Main source/type of food


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## taylorhedrich (Mar 2, 2005)

CorGrav420 said:


> I think it means main or something. Staple diet=Main source/type of food


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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

i'm confused... i do only feed the serra live fish (pet fish)


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## taylorhedrich (Mar 2, 2005)

mR. Blueberry said:


> i'm confused... i do only feed the serra live fish (pet fish)


Why? I thought you would know better than that...take a look in this forum and you will find much better alternatives to live food that will be a lot better for your Serra.

Also, ChilDawg was talking about danios being members of the 'cyprinid' family. This means they have thiaminase that can potentially stunt the growth of your piranhas if it's fed as a staple in their diet. It is not a staple in the diet of your fish, because you feed other things as well; in this case the tetras and other tropical fish (which are not members of the cyprinid family like danios).

Hope that cleared it up.
~Taylor~


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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

taylorhedrich said:


> i'm confused... i do only feed the serra live fish (pet fish)


Why? I thought you would know better than that...take a look in this forum and you will find much better alternatives to live food that will be a lot better for your Serra.

Also, ChilDawg was talking about danios being members of the 'cyprinid' family. This means they have thiaminase that can potentially stunt the growth of your piranhas if it's fed as a staple in their diet. It is not a staple in the diet of your fish, because you feed other things as well; in this case the tetras and other tropical fish (which are not members of the cyprinid family like danios).

Hope that cleared it up.
~Taylor~
[/quote]

I know, I occasionally drop in somestuff and they never take it because I lowered my temp to 73 so as to lower appitite, they go 2 weeks sometimes without eating, and the only way to prevent fin nips and keep them happy are with live fish


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## 77gp454 (Feb 18, 2007)

mR. Blueberry said:


> I heard Danios are a safer feeder and would assume anything is better than those 10 cent shty gold fish. Hopefully someone else has more input on this.


yeah crosshair tell you that? i like the danios myself
[/quote]
Not sure where I heard that, just made a mental note of it after reading. I do think I have heard that more than a couple times since I joined, the only decent feeder that stuck in my head. I have heard several times that the cheap goldfish suck. When I fed my Ps live, 9 out of 10 times they waited till I was M.I.A before they ate them. At least now, with dead food they will usually tear it up right in front of me.


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## PaNo617 (Jan 31, 2005)

mR. Blueberry said:


> i'm confused... i do only feed the serra live fish (pet fish)


Why? I thought you would know better than that...take a look in this forum and you will find much better alternatives to live food that will be a lot better for your Serra.

Also, ChilDawg was talking about danios being members of the 'cyprinid' family. This means they have thiaminase that can potentially stunt the growth of your piranhas if it's fed as a staple in their diet. It is not a staple in the diet of your fish, because you feed other things as well; in this case the tetras and other tropical fish (which are not members of the cyprinid family like danios).

Hope that cleared it up.
~Taylor~
[/quote]

I know, I occasionally drop in somestuff and they never take it because I lowered my temp to 73 so as to lower appitite, they go 2 weeks sometimes without eating, and the only way to prevent fin nips and keep them happy are with live fish
[/quote]

You should raise your temp to 76°, I woudn't go any lower then that...Feeding feeders is always risky man, unless you go through the hassle of having to quarantine them. You're better off feeding frozen, much easier IMO. My LFS tanks are infested with all kinds of diseases...They have fish going in and out so often that even when they treat their tanks with meds, a couple weeks later they get more fish in and more then likely there's going to be some sick fish. I wouldn't want risk it, personally.


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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

PaNo617 said:


> i'm confused... i do only feed the serra live fish (pet fish)


Why? I thought you would know better than that...take a look in this forum and you will find much better alternatives to live food that will be a lot better for your Serra.

Also, ChilDawg was talking about danios being members of the 'cyprinid' family. This means they have thiaminase that can potentially stunt the growth of your piranhas if it's fed as a staple in their diet. It is not a staple in the diet of your fish, because you feed other things as well; in this case the tetras and other tropical fish (which are not members of the cyprinid family like danios).

Hope that cleared it up.
~Taylor~
[/quote]

I know, I occasionally drop in somestuff and they never take it because I lowered my temp to 73 so as to lower appitite, they go 2 weeks sometimes without eating, and the only way to prevent fin nips and keep them happy are with live fish
[/quote]

You should raise your temp to 76°, I woudn't go any lower then that...Feeding feeders is always risky man, unless you go through the hassle of having to quarantine them. You're better off feeding frozen, much easier IMO. My LFS tanks are infested with all kinds of diseases...They have fish going in and out so often that even when they treat their tanks with meds, a couple weeks later they get more fish in and more then likely there's going to be some sick fish. I wouldn't want risk it, personally.
[/quote]

good advice..thank you

how long of a quarintine is necessary? i already dose them with salt and mela fix when they go into the tank


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## Cal68 (Mar 23, 2007)

^ a week imho. hell...just freeze the mofoz.


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## VJventrella (Feb 16, 2007)

I have a 7inch elong in a 55g and i cant get him to eat anything thats not moving. If i through a piece of fillet in he will bite it then leave it...what can i do to get him to start eating other things but live food. If not how would i quarantine feaders so they are healthy to feed. Could i put them isolated in a seperate tank with salt in the water for like 2 weeks?


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## pirahnabreeder01 (Oct 4, 2004)

i tie it to a peice ogf fishing string and jingle it up and down in the water they will tear it up


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## Trigga (Jul 1, 2006)

Well i dunno if this has been said but YES you can have clean feeders...i do it all the time...have a small tank running around 10 gallons and put the feeders in there with no meds, just a filter and an airpump if you have a whole bunch of them. Then the really sick ones end to die off and those are the ones you wouldnt want to feed your ps anyway. THen just regular salt treatments and a quality flake for about 2 weeks and they will be much more active, much more alert and better looking. You can dose with prazi if you want but its not really necassary cuz you are feeding them nice and dosing with salt. its expensive to start up but once everything gets running its quite easy.


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## CorGravey (Feb 13, 2007)

Trigga said:


> Well i dunno if this has been said but YES you can have clean feeders...i do it all the time...have a small tank running around 10 gallons and put the feeders in there with no meds, just a filter and an airpump if you have a whole bunch of them. Then the really sick ones end to die off and those are the ones you wouldnt want to feed your ps anyway. THen just regular salt treatments and a quality flake for about 2 weeks and they will be much more active, much more alert and better looking. You can dose with prazi if you want but its not really necassary cuz you are feeding them nice and dosing with salt. its expensive to start up but once everything gets running its quite easy.


x2


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## joefish219 (Feb 8, 2005)

77gp454 said:


> I heard Danios are a safer feeder and would assume anything is better than those 10 cent shty gold fish. Hopefully someone else has more input on this.


i love getting the zebra danios becasue they are usually good quality and also fast as sh*t so i watch fish darting through the tank


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## ChilDawg (Apr 30, 2006)

They're great exercise and all, but they do have thiaminase issues. If you feel that you need to do feeders as a staple, I would stay away from danios.

On a side issue, it's a-c-q-u-i-r-e-d.


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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

Trigga said:


> Well i dunno if this has been said but YES you can have clean feeders...i do it all the time...have a small tank running around 10 gallons and put the feeders in there with no meds, just a filter and an airpump if you have a whole bunch of them. Then the really sick ones end to die off and those are the ones you wouldnt want to feed your ps anyway. THen just regular salt treatments and a quality flake for about 2 weeks and they will be much more active, much more alert and better looking. You can dose with prazi if you want but its not really necassary cuz you are feeding them nice and dosing with salt. its expensive to start up but once everything gets running its quite easy.


good advice! thanks


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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

Is there a list of feeders that are healthier?


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## cfb (Mar 14, 2007)

Found this on another site...

If you do want to use live feeder fish, then the first thing to do is find a way to avoid introducing parasites. Probably the best approach is to use livebearers that you can breed yourself, such as mollies and guppies. While some people have also used cichlid fry as feeders, the spiny fins on these fish are problematic for many predators not especially adapted to deal with them. Livebearers, by contrast, are small and soft, and won't choke your prize predator.

Goldfish and rosy red minnows can be easy to breed, but they suffer from being high in the chemical thiaminase. They must not be used as the staple diet, because over time they will prevent the predatory fish from having enough vitamin B1, which will cause serious health problems. The muscles, bones, and nerves appear to be most seriously affected.

Using cheap fish from your local pet shop is a poor alternative; by any objective standard the risks are high. Quarantining and treating feeder fish with anti-parasite and anti-bacteria drugs may be an option, but if you aren't prepared to do this, you would be wise to pass over this source of feeder fish.

The other key advantage of raising your own feeder fish is that you can "gut load" them. Predatory animals, even strict carnivores like cats, depend upon the gut contents (usually plant matter) of the prey animals they eat to obtain certain nutrients lacking in meat. This is why cats eat the guts and liver of mice and birds they catch, yet ignore the bits that seem nicer to us, like the wing muscles. Likewise, predatory fish will benefit from being fed feeder fish that have themselves been fed properly. Make sure that the feeder fish have been fed vitamin-ennriched food before they are offered to the predatory fish. Vegetarian and algae-based foods are generally considered the most useful. The feeder fish should be "fattened up" for anything up to a month before being used.

Randy
CFB


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## FohDatAss (Oct 7, 2003)

thanks guys for all the help


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