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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

i was just wondering, because once in a while ill put live feed in my tank just for my friends to see.mybe 3 times a month is that cool too do,i plan to slow down gradualy,and then do it around 10 times a year.and also i grab top $$$ fish not the ones that are 20-50cents the ones that are around 5$ because those ones dont have that many in one tank.


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## zippa (Apr 29, 2005)

Short answer Don't Do It.....If you must then be sure to quarantine them for 2 or 3 weeks first.You risk all sorts of parasites or disease and it isn't worth it.

Get a 20 gallon tank and breed your own if you want the best method.


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

zippa said:


> Short answer Don't Do It.....If you must then be sure to quarantine them for 2 or 3 weeks first.You risk all sorts of parasites or disease and it isn't worth it.
> 
> Get a 20 gallon tank and breed your own if you want the best method.


the way you say it,... its a 10 out of 10 on risk lets say i quarantine them what would you give it out of a 10 on risk????????


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## btweather (Mar 12, 2007)

bud......weiser said:


> i was just wondering, because once in a while ill put live feed in my tank just for my friends to see.mybe 3 times a month is that cool too do,i plan to slow down gradualy,and then do it around 10 times a year.and also i grab top $$$ fish not the ones that are 20-50cents the ones that are around 5$ because those ones dont have that many in one tank.


i think your pretty safe by getting other fish than the cheap goldfish. i read somewhere here that cichlids, mollies, and swordtails make a safer and healthier feeder than the golds. i plan on feeding mine live once or twice a month just because thats what they were made to do. i feel like i already took away their freedom, i would really feel bad taking away their chance to hunt and kill. but their your fish do as you wish. peace


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## zippa (Apr 29, 2005)

The risk of feeding fish straight out of the fish store tanks may not be 10 out of 10 but it is a big risk.If you properly quarantine them the risk greatly decreases...Like I said if you want to be sure the feeders are clean go buy some guppies or convicts and breed your own feeders.It is not that difficult to breed feeders.The way I see it why would you risk tons of money worth of piranhas just to feed $5 worth of feeders? Not a risk I am into taking.



btweather said:


> i think your pretty safe by getting other fish than the cheap goldfish. i read somewhere here that cichlids, mollies, and swordtails make a safer and healthier feeder than the golds. i plan on feeding mine live once or twice a month just because thats what they were made to do. i feel like i already took away their freedom, i would really feel bad taking away their chance to hunt and kill. but their your fish do as you wish. peace


 Ignorance is bliss...Parasites and disease do not discriminate..Those more expensive fish may indeed be heartier but you still run a big risk if you do not quarantine them first.


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

zippa said:


> i was just wondering, because once in a while ill put live feed in my tank just for my friends to see.mybe 3 times a month is that cool too do,i plan to slow down gradualy,and then do it around 10 times a year.and also i grab top $$$ fish not the ones that are 20-50cents the ones that are around 5$ because those ones dont have that many in one tank.


i think your pretty safe by getting other fish than the cheap goldfish. i read somewhere here that cichlids, mollies, and swordtails make a safer and healthier feeder than the golds. i plan on feeding mine live once or twice a month just because thats what they were made to do. i feel like i already took away their freedom, i would really feel bad taking away their chance to hunt and kill. but their your fish do as you wish. peace
[/quote]
nicely put


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## zippa (Apr 29, 2005)

Yeah a 20 would work fine for breeding.Depending on what you want for feeders I would go with guppies to get the hang of it...Set that 20 up with a heater and filter....Add some cover for the babies such as java moss or I think they make some kind of breeding net for guppy babies to hide in....Add a dozen or two guppies and within a few weeks you will be in buisiness.Guppies reproduce very quickly and have tons for fry.In addition you may want to treat the initial bunch when you get them for everything..Use something like prazipro for worms pimafix,salt,etc..keep em well fed and let em go.


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## PaNo617 (Jan 31, 2005)

bud......weiser said:


> Short answer Don't Do It.....If you must then be sure to quarantine them for 2 or 3 weeks first.You risk all sorts of parasites or disease and it isn't worth it.
> 
> Get a 20 gallon tank and breed your own if you want the best method.


the way you say it,... its a 10 out of 10 on risk lets say i quarantine them what would you give it out of a 10 on risk????????
[/quote]

You just never know what parasites these fish are carrying from your LFS. They have tons of fish going in and out so chances are pretty good that if you feed live you're going to introduce something into your tank. I talked to one of the guys that worked at a LFS and he was telling me that their tanks are constantly infested with all kinds of disease's, you name it, they have it! Ick, Finrot, popeye, flukes are a few he pointed out to me. it doesn't matter if you buy expensive fish too feed, that doesn't mean they're disease free. If you have to feed live breed your own.


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

zippa said:


> Yeah a 20 would work fine for breeding.Depending on what you want for feeders I would go with guppies to get the hang of it...Set that 20 up with a heater and filter....Add some cover for the babies such as java moss or I think they make some kind of breeding net for guppy babies to hide in....Add a dozen or two guppies and within a few weeks you will be in buisiness.Guppies reproduce very quickly and have tons for fry.In addition you may want to treat the initial bunch when you get them for everything..Use something like prazipro for worms pimafix,salt,etc..keep em well fed and let em go.


ok i have a next heater and a filter ill try it out....ill probably get so atached to the guppies i wont want to feed them to my piranhas lol


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## Moondemon (Dec 9, 2006)

I breed convicts. VERY EASY and they go at it a lot !!!








They are in a 20 gallon and doing just fine !


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## btweather (Mar 12, 2007)

zippa said:


> The risk of feeding fish straight out of the fish store tanks may not be 10 out of 10 but it is a big risk.If you properly quarantine them the risk greatly decreases...Like I said if you want to be sure the feeders are clean go buy some guppies or convicts and breed your own feeders.


what would the setup on the breeder tank for convict cichlids be? how to tell sex?


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

Moondemon said:


> The risk of feeding fish straight out of the fish store tanks may not be 10 out of 10 but it is a big risk.If you properly quarantine them the risk greatly decreases...Like I said if you want to be sure the feeders are clean go buy some guppies or convicts and breed your own feeders.


what would the setup on the breeder tank for convict cichlids be? how to tell sex?
[/quote]
ya i also want to know that to????


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## Moondemon (Dec 9, 2006)

bud......weiser said:


> The risk of feeding fish straight out of the fish store tanks may not be 10 out of 10 but it is a big risk.If you properly quarantine them the risk greatly decreases...Like I said if you want to be sure the feeders are clean go buy some guppies or convicts and breed your own feeders.


what would the setup on the breeder tank for convict cichlids be? how to tell sex?
[/quote]
ya i also want to know that to????
[/quote]

Well, males are bigger and darker. Females have some orange color on their belly... In breeding mode, females get very colorful. My convicts just laid eggs tonight... Here's a picture of my 20 gallon setup:









You can see the female garding the eggs..:


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

Moondemon said:


> The risk of feeding fish straight out of the fish store tanks may not be 10 out of 10 but it is a big risk.If you properly quarantine them the risk greatly decreases...Like I said if you want to be sure the feeders are clean go buy some guppies or convicts and breed your own feeders.


what would the setup on the breeder tank for convict cichlids be? how to tell sex?
[/quote]
ya i also want to know that to????
[/quote]

Well, males are bigger and darker. Females have some orange color on their belly... In breeding mode, females get very colorful. My convicts just laid eggs tonight... Here's a picture of my 20 gallon setup:

View attachment 140837


You can see the female garding the eggs..:

View attachment 140838

[/quote]
nice....poor guys ...never had a chance at feedom


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## Moondemon (Dec 9, 2006)

Well, it pretty much comes down to the food chain....


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

Moondemon said:


> Well, it pretty much comes down to the food chain....


ya it does...just a little sad on there part but like you say ,its the food chain...and death isnt even that bad,i mean how much can you cry after your dead...in a way we are playn a role of a god


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## Moondemon (Dec 9, 2006)

bud......weiser said:


> Well, it pretty much comes down to the food chain....


ya it does...just a little sad on there part but like you say ,its the food chain...and death isnt even that bad,i mean how much can you cry after your dead...in a way we are playn a role of a god
[/quote]

hmm.. Have you been reading Socrate or Platon lately ???


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## taylorhedrich (Mar 2, 2005)

_*Topic Moved to Feeding and Nutrition Forum*_


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## bootdink (Jan 17, 2007)

Moondemon said:


> The risk of feeding fish straight out of the fish store tanks may not be 10 out of 10 but it is a big risk.If you properly quarantine them the risk greatly decreases...Like I said if you want to be sure the feeders are clean go buy some guppies or convicts and breed your own feeders.


what would the setup on the breeder tank for convict cichlids be? how to tell sex?
[/quote]
ya i also want to know that to????
[/quote]

Well, males are bigger and darker. Females have some orange color on their belly... In breeding mode, females get very colorful. My convicts just laid eggs tonight... Here's a picture of my 20 gallon setup:

View attachment 140837


You can see the female garding the eggs..:

View attachment 140838

[/quote]

as stated above i would go with convicts...i breed my own and they are very hardy and VERY easy to breed...once they start they dont stop...ive had mine for about 4 weeks and they're already starting on their 3 batch of fry! mine are also in a 20 gallon and their doing fine! just make sure u dont put anything else in with them cuz its torture for the other fish!these convicts are highly aggressive when breeding so be ware!!


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

Moondemon said:


> Well, it pretty much comes down to the food chain....


ya it does...just a little sad on there part but like you say ,its the food chain...and death isnt even that bad,i mean how much can you cry after your dead...in a way we are playn a role of a god
[/quote]

hmm.. Have you been reading Socrate or Platon lately ???








[/quote]
no lol...but i did have a lot to drink yesterday


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## Narile (Mar 22, 2007)

Moondemon said:


> The risk of feeding fish straight out of the fish store tanks may not be 10 out of 10 but it is a big risk.If you properly quarantine them the risk greatly decreases...Like I said if you want to be sure the feeders are clean go buy some guppies or convicts and breed your own feeders.


what would the setup on the breeder tank for convict cichlids be? how to tell sex?
[/quote]
ya i also want to know that to????
[/quote]

Well, males are bigger and darker. Females have some orange color on their belly... In breeding mode, females get very colorful. My convicts just laid eggs tonight... Here's a picture of my 20 gallon setup:

View attachment 140837


You can see the female garding the eggs..:

View attachment 140838

[/quote]

Thanks Moon, I've been looking into this. Your setup really helped. It looks like they don't need much but clean water, gravel and a ceramic bowl. Have you or anyone had success with the same setup in a 10 gallon tank?


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

where can i learn about diseases that come with feeders.anybody know a good site where i can read a artical about that.


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

Moondemon said:


> The risk of feeding fish straight out of the fish store tanks may not be 10 out of 10 but it is a big risk.If you properly quarantine them the risk greatly decreases...Like I said if you want to be sure the feeders are clean go buy some guppies or convicts and breed your own feeders.


what would the setup on the breeder tank for convict cichlids be? how to tell sex?
[/quote]
ya i also want to know that to????
[/quote]

Well, males are bigger and darker. Females have some orange color on their belly... In breeding mode, females get very colorful. My convicts just laid eggs tonight... Here's a picture of my 20 gallon setup:

View attachment 140837


You can see the female garding the eggs..:

View attachment 140838

[/quote]
well my 20 gallon isnt cycled can i trow them in there and let them go trew it because i want to cycle my tank with fish,and will that damage there health.(convicts)and i only have a stantard 20 gallon filter will that be enough???


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## zippa (Apr 29, 2005)

When you do a water change on your main tank use that water for your 20 gallon...Remove some of the media out of your existing filter and put it in the new filter.This will help you have your 20 gal cycled much sooner.As for a 20 gal filter not sure what you mean by a standard 20 filter.All you really need is a small H.O.B. type filter..Do regular water changes and you should be good.If you want info on potential diseases feeders can carry just do a search on this site.Honestly if there is a disease or parasite out there a feeder can possible have it.Pet shops push so many fish through their stores without cleaning tanks before throwing the next batch in that fish of any sort could have been in the tan prior to whatever you buy...One never knows what has been held in a pet shops tanks or what parasites or diseases they had.


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

zippa said:


> When you do a water change on your main tank use that water for your 20 gallon...Remove some of the media out of your existing filter and put it in the new filter.This will help you have your 20 gal cycled much sooner.As for a 20 gal filter not sure what you mean by a standard 20 filter.All you really need is a small H.O.B. type filter..Do regular water changes and you should be good.If you want info on potential diseases feeders can carry just do a search on this site.Honestly if there is a disease or parasite out there a feeder can possible have it.Pet shops push so many fish through their stores without cleaning tanks before throwing the next batch in that fish of any sort could have been in the tan prior to whatever you buy...One never knows what has been held in a pet shops tanks or what parasites or diseases they had.


ooh okay thanks....what i meant by the"standard 20 gallon filter"is that its the filter that came with the 20 gallon kit so its a 20g filter(wisper 20)


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## Moondemon (Dec 9, 2006)

Convicts don't need heavy filtration to be ok. Your ''20 gallon'' filter should be ok

Check this link out.... It should help you if you plan on getting convicts: CONVICTS


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## CorGravey (Feb 13, 2007)

Also depwnds on the store. One of my lfs will sell you a fish with the final stages of ick if ud buy it. I dont go to that one. My lfs quarintines sick fish with a unhappy face on the tank so we know not to buy them. This is not foolproof but it helps. Also i pick out every single fish i buy, make em scoop they active colorful ones and ur less like to get parasites. Never evr feed fish just bought always quarintine. And keep lots of Meds on hand, hopefully you never have to use them.


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## ICEE (Feb 3, 2007)

10/10 risk for 10 for 1.00 ones


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## Moondemon (Dec 9, 2006)

coutl said:


> 10/10 risk *for 10 for 1.00 ones*


hmm.. what ??


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## Narile (Mar 22, 2007)

Moondemon said:


> 10/10 risk *for 10 for 1.00 ones*


hmm.. what ??








[/quote]

On a scale of 1-10, 10 being the highest risk... he gives it a 10 for the risk of feeding feeders to Ps (10 feeders for a dollar)


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## Moondemon (Dec 9, 2006)

Narile said:


> 10/10 risk *for 10 for 1.00 ones*


hmm.. what ??








[/quote]

On a scale of 1-10, 10 being the highest risk... he gives it a 10 for the risk of feeding feeders to Ps (10 feeders for a dollar)
[/quote]

Thank you !
It makes more sence now !


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

im start the breeding this friday so when i start it ill try to get a camara and ill show how its done,i just want to learn more so i know fully what im doing and itl also be good because people will see how easy it is when you know what your doing.and it might incuarage people to breed there own and not buy them from the store.


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## Moondemon (Dec 9, 2006)

I found many web pages about breeding convicts after a search on google.... might help out !


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## flashover00 (Oct 19, 2006)

I recieved a ton of convicts from a p-fury member a while back. Tossed 5 or 6 in to my pygo tank and NOTHING HAPPENED. The convicts actually were aggressive to my p's and they lived together for like 6 months with only one convict fatality. LOL

Be forewarned, once they start breeding they keep going at it like crazy and you will have a crap load of them. I finally got rid of all of mine maybe a month or two ago...gave them to a different member who fed them to his rhom.


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

CorGrav420 said:


> Also depwnds on the store. One of my lfs will sell you a fish with the final stages of ick if ud buy it. I dont go to that one. My lfs quarintines sick fish with a unhappy face on the tank so we know not to buy them. This is not foolproof but it helps. Also i pick out every single fish i buy, make em scoop they active colorful ones and ur less like to get parasites. Never evr feed fish just bought always quarintine. And keep lots of Meds on hand, hopefully you never have to use them.


i aways grab the one that are the fewest in the tank and the most colorful i know i shouldnt get them from the store but at least i watch out i think everybody is guilty of feeding there first piranhas feeders.


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

flashover00 says that piranhas might not eat convicts how about everybody else,what kind of piranhas do you have mybe its just that the pygos that dont like convicts....... is there any other fish thats good how about live silverside??


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

how long dose it take for the parasites to take efect on my piranhas or any other disease??what are the signs that the piranhas get from eating feeders(disease and parasites)


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## flashover00 (Oct 19, 2006)

bud......weiser said:


> flashover00 says that piranhas might not eat convicts how about everybody else,what kind of piranhas do you have mybe its just that the pygos that dont like convicts....... is there any other fish thats good how about live silverside??


My pygos didnt eat them.....my sanchezi on the other hand tormented the hell outta them and fin nipped them to death...eventually eat the whole thing.

Depends on the P man


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## bud......weiser (Feb 12, 2007)

flashover00 said:


> flashover00 says that piranhas might not eat convicts how about everybody else,what kind of piranhas do you have mybe its just that the pygos that dont like convicts....... is there any other fish thats good how about live silverside??


My pygos didnt eat them.....my sanchezi on the other hand tormented the hell outta them and fin nipped them to death...eventually eat the whole thing.

Depends on the P man
[/quote]
do you think i should just buy one convict from the store and see what happens,because i dont want to breed these guy if they dont take interest right.


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## Moondemon (Dec 9, 2006)

My pygos and my sanchezi eat the convicts.... never had a problem feeding that to them.


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