# How long without a water change?



## robert69 (Jul 16, 2005)

I was visiting with a friend today. He has a 125 gallon tank with 5 Reds in it. He has had the Reds for a couple of years now. His water is crystal clear using 2 Emperor filters. I was jealous of his water clarity and asked him what his secret was i.e. how often does he do water changes, gravel vacs, etc. He said he NEVER does water changes or vacuums the gravel, etc.

I said "that's impossible!" He said "nope". All he does is add water every 3 weeks when he notices the water level getting low. I looked inside his filters and the media was damn near jet black. He said he also doesn't replace the media or rinse it out occasionally. Knowing this guy, as lazy as he is, I believe him. He barely cleans his house, let alone his tank.

My question is, how can the tank be that crystal clear with no maintenance??? He feeds his P's all the normal stuff - Smelt, shrimp, squid, etc. on a daily basis. I'd be curious to hear from the rest of the members on the following:

1)What is the longest time you have waited between water changes?
2)What is the absolute longest time you can wait to change your water?

I have always stuck to doing it at least 2 times per week with a gravel vac.

thanks


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## MiGsTeR (Jan 19, 2008)

Even tho his tank might look "clear" it doesn't necessary mean that its "Healhty"


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## AKSkirmish (Jun 24, 2005)

Ask him how he would like to taste his urine and feces all the time-

Waterchanges are a must for good health-No way around it......If one doesn't-their water params will be off and will lead to long term issues..

With that said-
I have never had a one problem with any of my piranha tanks being cloudy----

You guys are not doing something right or are just lazy......I have had everything from over stocked tanks to uderstocked tanks....No lights to lights on 24-7....I have never found any of this to be a factor with my piranha's water.....

Never had an algea issue in any of my tanks either.....


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## philbert (Mar 8, 2007)

i agree i never have cloudy water or alge or anything really for that matter. i change water twice a week and vac at least once.


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## cobrafox46 (Jun 2, 2008)

Back in the day when I was young I never did water changes and never lost my RB. I had him for like 2 years then gave him away! I always do changes and vacs at least once a week on my tanks with one fish and 2-3 times on my tanks with more than 1 fish! My nitrates never exceed 10ppm on my single fish tanks and never over 20ppm on my tanks with several fish.


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## lo4life (Aug 12, 2008)

I'm pretty lazy but geeze I do 2 vacs a week on my tank and I have one fish in it. AKSkirmish is right thats just wrong for those fish. I wouldnt like to be stuck in a box and never have my crap cleaned out....... Thats just wrong. People like that shouldnt be allowed to have fish. Dont know what else to say...........


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## NegativeSpin (Aug 1, 2007)

He's bullshitting.


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## notaverage (Sep 10, 2005)

WHen I started I knew nothing!
I never changed my water just added as well.
I had a 10 gallon tank with about 7 tri colored sharks!
They died and I didnt know why...I was a kid though under 14

I had 3 P's in a 20 and never changed teh water but twice in 2 years b/c of moving.
I had NO CLUE what I was doing and fed them golds and beef heart only!
I gave all 3 to 3 different people and they lived for about 5 years.

I feel horrible to this day!


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## GeorgeH (Sep 2, 2008)

Just curious are the frequent water changes necessary for all fish or just P's ? The local fish stores always says do a 50% change once a month.


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## Tensa (Jul 28, 2008)

GeorgeH said:


> Just curious are the frequent water changes necessary for all fish or just P's ? The local fish stores always says do a 50% change once a month.


Changing your water is good for all fish not just P's but fish such as P's and oscars for example produce more waste so the water needs to be changed more often to dilute the nitrates that buildup in the water. smaller fish produce less waste thus fewer nitrates over a equal period of time.


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## lo4life (Aug 12, 2008)

It really just depends on how many fish you have in your tank. I only have one in my tank I prolly dont have to do 2 gravel vacs a week but I do. He is a VERY messy eater thats the only reason I do 2 vacs a week and not just water changes. Plus it gets rid of the growth inhibiting hormones that P's produce by doing water changes.


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## Dr. Giggles (Oct 18, 2003)

NegativeSpin said:


> He's bullshitting.


Agreed. His pH will crash.


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## brianhellno (Jun 16, 2008)

A long time ago my aunt owned a fifty five gallon tank and all she used to do was add water when it got to low. From what I can remember it was an average stocked tank with mostly tetras plecos and lots of live plants. She owned it for maybe 5 or 6 years and I don't ever remember her doing a water change once. In fact when I went to get into the fish hobby and learned about water changes I was kind of surprised because I never heard of doing it before. Her fish looked healthy the entire time she owned the tank and not one ever died. I don't remember the filtration she used but man I bet that sucked for those fish.


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## Piranha Guru (Nov 24, 2005)

brianhellno said:


> A long time ago my aunt owned a fifty five gallon tank and all she used to do was add water when it got to low. From what I can remember it was an average stocked tank with mostly tetras plecos and lots of live plants. She owned it for maybe 5 or 6 years and I don't ever remember her doing a water change once. In fact when I went to get into the fish hobby and learned about water changes I was kind of surprised because I never heard of doing it before. Her fish looked healthy the entire time she owned the tank and not one ever died. I don't remember the filtration she used but man I bet that sucked for those fish.


The lots of live plants probably had a lot to do with that...


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## CLUSTER ONE (Aug 2, 2006)

It is possible if he has plenty of biological filtration and or plants. Pretty much anythign to remove toxins that would be removed by a water change.


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## Dr. Giggles (Oct 18, 2003)

sean-820 said:


> It is possible if he has plenty of biological filtration and or plants. Pretty much anythign to remove toxins that would be removed by a water change.


No way with 5 reds in a 125.







Biological filtration has nothing to do with it. The acidity produced on a daily basis will turn the tank into an environment where even plants couldnt live in it eventually.


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

GeorgeH said:


> Just curious are the frequent water changes necessary for all fish or just P's ? The local fish stores always says do a 50% change once a month.


I'd recommend more frequent changes, and to a slightly lesser degree percentage wise.
Of course it depends on the stability and amount of your 'seasoned' filter media, but it seems to me in my experience that 50% is kinda the "breaking point" where either the tank can handle that much of a water change or not.
I think 40% is safer, and if done more frequently than monthly, would be optimum.

As for this dude's tank having never had the water changed, I believe that he can have clear water, but his nitrate level is going to be absolutely through the roof. There isn't a test kit out there with readings nearly close enough to read what his level must be.
He needs to be educated on proper tank maintenance. It's just wrong to keep fish in that environment.


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## CLUSTER ONE (Aug 2, 2006)

Why would someone lie about doing water changes? I dont care if peopel know how much work i put into tanks. Also look at "el natural" tanks. They have very minimal filtration (if any) and they rely on bacteria and plants to keep the water clean, not filters. I agree that 5 reds is a large bioload, however with a heavily planted tank with a gravel or soil bed it could be possible. Im not saying hes not bsing, however there are more ways to remove toxins then water changes. Who knows he could have a nitrate sponge in his filter or something.


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## Dr. Giggles (Oct 18, 2003)

I've also seen setups without filters. Only salt water setups with a powerhead used directed at the gravel bed. Without oxygen a filterless tank will not work. Water changes are not required to remove toxins. Nitrifying bacteria takes care of that. Water changes are primarily to replenish nutrients lost when water becomes more acidic.


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## CLUSTER ONE (Aug 2, 2006)

what abotu crushed coral. I know i am being abit extreame and i dont even know if the guy in question is even telling the truth but like many users here, crushed coral could help a tank so it doesnt turn into acid.


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## NegativeSpin (Aug 1, 2007)

He must not be too lazy to be cleaning all of the algae that is forming on the sides of the tank from the 2800+ PPM of nitrates he'd have after two years unless he has deeeep gravel and an undergravel filtration system or lots of plants.


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## Sanjo Eel (Aug 21, 2008)

My first thought was that the tank had achieved homeostasis j/k lol.... Seriously, the first fish I ever owned were piranha, and being a novice at the time, probably only changed the water once a month. The fact is, piranha are just tough little bastards that can withstand terrible water conditions for a long time, and then after it improves they say f**k it and lay some eggs. But NEVER changing the water? Maybe the fish have just adjusted to their environment as if it were a mudpuddle in the Amazon.......


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## Nick G (Jul 15, 2007)

i gave 3 reds to my girls brother, he had them in a 55. He was into it at first, but he was so lazy he would never change water, except when i threatened him to take them back (which was an empty threat, because i was preparing to move and didnt have room for them, or else i would have just taken them back and not even said a damn thing). they lasted from beginning of december until maybe may, he had changed 25% water three times.

One day in the beginning of june, they all died the same night, out of nowhere. He calls me and he was like 'dude they all died... they all looked fine, were eating well, temperature was fine, everything was cool" I was like "u never changed the water, whens the last time you did?, and he said the day before, which i knew was BS because his mom told me every time he did, thats how i knew when he didnt. 
so i went there and tested ammonia and it was more than could even be read on my test kit. 
and i told him "the fish died because you were too lazy to change the water"

the longest i ever went was 2 or 3 weeks (it was a long story, one long story per post is the limit haha). but normally its 30-40% every 4 days or so. gravel vac every other time.


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## Grosse Gurke (Jan 3, 2003)

I know of a few people that dont do water changes....other then maybe once a year....and they swear by the health of their fish. Not sure I would recommend it....but this isnt that unusual.


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## Piranha Dan (Nov 11, 2007)

Crystal clear water is not a sign of good water quality. I had a PH crash one time that killed off my bio-filter (forgot to do a water change). I had no clue there was anything wrong till I noticed my Reds acting lethargic and tested the water--4.0ppm ammonia.


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## robert69 (Jul 16, 2005)

When I was much, much, much younger I used to have an aquarium that I never changed the water in. I was 13-14yrs old and didn't know anything about aquarium health and maintenance. I had several oscars and pacus. They lived for years without water changes. All I did was add water when it started to dip below the top 2-3 inches of the tank. I never changed the filter media or used water conditioner. As I got older and learned the proper way to maintain a tank, I perform at least 2 water changes per week. But, for whatever reason, those fish lived a LONG time......

When I was much, much, much younger I used to have an aquarium that I never changed the water in. I was 13-14yrs old and didn't know anything about aquarium health and maintenance. I had several oscars and pacus. They lived for years without water changes. All I did was add water when it started to dip below the top 2-3 inches of the tank. I never changed the filter media or used water conditioner. As I got older and learned the proper way to maintain a tank, I perform at least 2 water changes per week. But, for whatever reason, those fish lived a LONG time......


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

robert69 said:


> When I was much, much, much younger I used to have an aquarium that I never changed the water in. I was 13-14yrs old and didn't know anything about aquarium health and maintenance. I had several oscars and pacus. They lived for years without water changes. All I did was add water when it started to dip below the top 2-3 inches of the tank. I never changed the filter media or used water conditioner. As I got older and learned the proper way to maintain a tank, I perform at least 2 water changes per week. But, for whatever reason, those fish lived a LONG time......
> 
> When I was much, much, much younger I used to have an aquarium that I never changed the water in. I was 13-14yrs old and didn't know anything about aquarium health and maintenance. I had several oscars and pacus. They lived for years without water changes. All I did was add water when it started to dip below the top 2-3 inches of the tank. I never changed the filter media or used water conditioner. As I got older and learned the proper way to maintain a tank, I perform at least 2 water changes per week. But, for whatever reason, those fish lived a LONG time......


Yeah, that's really common.
Most aquarium owners know virtually nothing about proper maintenance.

Yeah, that's really common.
Most aquarium owners know virtually nothing about proper maintenance.


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