# Another Fighting Or Sexing Question



## beastin

Just saw them bite at each other and pin one to the gravel. Then swim off with its mouth open for a moments, but then they met up and started swimming in place next to each other... hard to describe. but like flapping in sync? IT looked pretty aggressive. the biting and all. is this good or bad?? The "girl" was like fully black, and she floated on her side after one bite... i thought he killed her. wtf is goin on haha


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## CLUSTER ONE

It could be breeding. Best way to recognise it is to youtube some breeding vids and see if it is the same behaviour.

Some breeding behaviour:
-more agressive fish
-male digging nest
-fish chasing eachother
-fish swimming in circles
-Fish swim side to side over nest and vibrate (fertilize eggs)

If it was breeding behaviour you may have eggs in a few days but a description is hard to tell alone by so I suggest find a vid so you can see if it was or was not similar to a vid of a confirmed breeding.


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## BRUNER247

info removed. I'm not experienced enough to give info. Maybe after another 20+ years I'll be worthy enough to give info out.


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## beastin

they do some of the behaviors in the video. like teh side by side in sync swimming, and chasing each other around. they almost always float by each other, sometimes the female goes to a different part of the tank, angles her head upwards, and just swims there for 10-20 minutes then comes back.

I dont see any eggs tho!

i do see him sometimes pretending like hes picking up food on teh ground, but not blowing like ive seen in some videos.


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## BRUNER247

Info removed. As 20+ years isn't near enough time keeping piranha for me to have a opinion.


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## beastin

well they dont do the in sync side by side thing often. its rare that i see it.

should i not vacuum the tank? I like doing that every 5 days or so to get the extra food they didnt eat, like bloodworm remains..poop...etc.

also, should i not feed them on the side of the tank that they like to chill out at? I dont know if thats affecting the mating or not,because thats the spot i try to vacuum.


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## BRUNER247

Info removed. Hundreds of batches of babies doesn't qualify me enough to give info.


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## beastin

sorry the bloodworms are for the firemouth cichlids. and yeah the p's dont like em.


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## BRUNER247

Info removed. As I obviously don't know wtf I was sayn anyhow.


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## Piranha-Freak101

and id be carefull with those cichlids cause they have a great taste for p eggs


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## beastin

wont the p's just kill the cichlids then? I wouldnt mind if they snacked on them. I feed the cichlids good food. ha.


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## CLUSTER ONE

BRUNER247 said:


> Should make it a point to clean the nest area extra good. This way if & when they do spawn,siphoning the eggs will be mostly eggs instead of mostly crap.


 I agree clean the tank good so then after there are eggs you can leave them alone for abit. A cleaner tank with fresh water may also help get them to breed.


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## ACrowe25

Bruner I' take info from you anyday! Feel free to pm me anything about my juvie RB P's. Feeding anything!









Bruner I' take info fromC you anyday! Feel free to pm me anything about my juvie RB P's. Feeding anything!


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## beastin

update: so still no eggs. However a few days ago, i caught them swimming head to head in a circle... if that makes sense. it was like if you were looking at them and they were showing their side to you, there heads would be glued together and their tails would be furthest away from each other.

they were swimming vertically with heads down into rocks, but still no fry. whats going on


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## pygocentrus da 3rd

[quote name='beastin' timestamp='1305007119' post='2700075']
Just saw them bite at each other and pin one to the gravel. Then swim off with its mouth open for a moments, but then they met up and started swimming in place next to each other... hard to describe. but like flapping in sync? IT looked pretty aggressive. the biting and all. is this good or bad?? The "girl" was like fully black, and she floated on her side after one bite... i thought he killed her. wtf is goin on haha
[/quote they are probably courting..it can also be a territorial dispute..but usually territory disputes are just side by side wagging warning bites and some scraps or full on assult to the death ..but breeding fish can exibit some of these behaviors but in a much more ritualistic way and will stay with eachother seperate from the rest of the pack and beat the sh*t out of eachother and swim in tight circles..Im sure you knew all of this already but they are breeding im 90% on that


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## bcp0715

hey pygocentrus will they bite thru breeding? mines swim against each other but with their mouths open


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## beastin

is it okay to feed them during their breeding sesh? I thawed some raw shrimp but they've been going at it for an hour


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## beastin

still no eggs. Should i swap to smaller substrate? my rocks are kinda big


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## new era

After this many months and still no eggs? Or better yet, did they breed? How many do you have?


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## beastin

*update: the chiclids were all eaten.*

Still nothing







kinda disappointing. I know for a fact once they were both face to face in the rocks circling. I saw the female do some crazy seisure vibrate things a few times. However, nothing.

Is there something I'm not doing? I do a 25% water change weekly. I am feeding them a mixed diet of white fish, tilapia, some live feeders (they really like them), and raw shell on shrimp.

I think their diet is good. I try to vacuum all their waste out, and its usually either dark brown/blackish, or dark green waste. I have one of those sponge filters over my main filter so the fry wont be sucked up... but... i have a powerhead. could that possibly have sucked the fry up and killed them? lol

i dont know. I love these fish and would like to put the parents in a different tank, and grow a shoal of fry together.


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## new era

My best guess would be they are not breeding. If they are you will see them fanning their eggs for 2-3 days. Mine usually hatch on the second day. You should check your water parameters, feed them less or just a couple times a week. Do big water change 50% with cooler water and turn the heater up just a little bit. That should trigger the spawning. Well at least for me. Keep us updated.


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## beastin

my tank temp is usually at 82. Would turning it up be bad for them?


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## new era

82 is good. Keep it there. Do big water change. 50%


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## beastin

just did a 40-50% water change. now what? lol


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## new era

Temp. Drop and raise. Go read through my thread. It will help a lot.


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## beastin

ok i just did another 30% water change... some was already evaporated... but i did that and they seem to have liked it. is it possible that dropping the temperature from adding fresh new colder water sparksbreeding? they havent done anything but are swimming next to each other since the change, and this is rare (unless they are scared)


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## beastin

video...


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## new era

Their color look like they should be breeding soon. After temp drop, turn up the heat to 82-84 degrees and let the tank sit for 3-4 without touching or feeding them. That should help them. And Yes, cooler water help triggers their spawning that's the reason why you are supposed to do 50% WC.


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## beastin

so let me double check my plan of action with you. Do a 50% water change and dont feed them or do anything in the tank for 3-4 days?

When you say cooler water, should I add a gallon of cooler water daily? I dont have a digital thermometer or else I would lower the temp and raise it again.. i just dont want it to spike to 90 or something crazy when i turn it back up. The temp of the water did drop to 76 from 82 when I did the 50% change.

What do you think of my p's?  I think the male has the visible teeth, the female is a huuuge b*tch :] Hard to tell the length of them, but id guess 8-10"?


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## new era

Everything is correct except adding a gallon everyday. Just add cooler water when you do the 50% water change. I suggest you get a thermometer so you know the temp. By adding water everyday yoy are not letting the water sit for 3-4 days. Lol. I think your p's are big enough but I suggest you add another one ior a few if you are uncertain of their sex.


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## beastin

so do a 50% change every 3-4 days? and either ones a male and ones a female or i have gay fish, kanye.


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## new era

That's what I did! You should also check your water parameters. If it is toxic or not good then you must do water changes everyday until it drops then you let the tank sit for 3-4 without touching or feeding. What size tank do you have?


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## new era

AAgain, check my thread about my water parameters.

PH 7.0
Nitrate 40
Nitrite 0
Ammonia 0

I believe that's how your water parameter should be. Correct me if I'm wrong.


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