# Just When I Think I Got It Down...



## MFNRyan (Mar 27, 2011)

So most of you know I have been battling with my 55g since I first started it. Right now for the last 3 weeks, the ammonia has been at 2.0-4.0 hard to tell the color difference. Test it with a master test kit. Test my tap water with the kit no ammonia in the tap water. Took my tap water in one pill bottle, my tank water in another to LFS. Asked them to test. Tap water 0, Tank the same as mine. Have done weekly 25% chances, switched to every other day 10% changes, Did a 50% change Saturday, ammonia dropped to 1.0 but was right back up on sunday. Pulled everything out of the tank stirred my gravel up completely to get all the waste out. Sucked up as much as I could, then vac on the gravel. Did 75% water change. Ammonia temp drop, right back up again. Checked my filter (cascade 1500) Changed the floss, only running biop cubes by fluval and the bottom bio pad. Cleaned the bio pad in tank water I put in a bucket. Today I put Hagen Cycle nutrafin in the tank to boost the BB for my bio cubes. This problem seemed to have started when I swithced the cubes in the filter and removed the charcoal, ammonia chips and whatever the blue, green chips do. So now here I am again completely lost on why the F my tank won't act right. I checked for left over food under the rocks an in the gravel everything. One thing I did find in my research is the pH from my tap is about 7.3.. the pH in the tank is about 6.1. Am I ruining the BB because the pH in my tank is so much lower? How can I keep that up? That's problem 1.

2. I have 6 tanks. a 55g with my Gibbus (ammonia) A 36g that has ran for going on 5 years great shape currently has Manny, A 100g I bought from a piranha owner, kept a rhom in it (nitrates) A 125g pygo shoal great shape, 40 breeder bought brand new tigar barbs for BB build been running about 3 months (Nitrates) 20 long has cichlids great shape, 30 breeder has now a gold spilo, been running for 5 months (nitrates)

Today I had a guy call an ask me if I could take his gold piranha for free, his fish bit it's tail off and bully it he wanted someone to take care of it. I said sure. Put it in my 30 breeder because it was well established, used it for my tank to keep live feeder convicts in an was empty since Sunday. Put the fish in everything was fine. Come back notice cloudy eye. Checked water right away. Ammonia 0 (double checked this then a 3 time.. 0 every time) Nitrites .25/.5 and Nitrates 2/4 hard to tell colors diff. Did a 25% water change, Nitrites back in check, Nitrates no change. Added some salt for his eye and some nutrafin cycle to the tank to help the filter along. Filter has all bio cubes with one thing of floss.

My 100g I have been trying to get ready for my Manny for over a month now. Had ammonia spike, then went throught he entire mini cycyle. had the same tiger barbs in it that are now helping my 40 breeder. let the tank run after it leveled out and slowly just my NItrates have climbed in it. did 25% water change, nothing, did a 50% 2 days later cleaned all the rocks in the bottom added waste away to remove any build up and added salt plus extra water treatment. Nothing, also cleaned the ac 110 sponges since I use them for only mechanical in both my 125g an my 100g. There was a lot of gunk in it, then pulled the bio wheel and rinsed it in the tank water it was very dirty. Let the tank run a few days. I have 250g worth of filtration on the tank and around 500gpm of turnover rate. Nitrates still the same place. Notice Notrite building also. Did water change today on all my tanks with high nitrate and my 55g with high ammonia. Added Nutrafin cycle to them all, do not understand why I am having such a hard time with water params on some and not on all the tanks. What am I doing wrong. After my 55g experiance I wait to make sure a cycle is done before I add fish. The 100g I got filters from two other tank set ups that were already running. I did remove the charcoal and ammonia chips that were in them, added bio cubes. None of my tanks have charcoal or any of that in them, just mechanical filter media which I clean about 1 a month and bio media, I'm guessing my bio cubes have not gained enough BB or I don't have enough cubes. Either way I have no idea whats going on an this new fish has cloudy eye with no ammonia in the tank? Sorry this is so long and so much to reply to but I'm having a hard time here. I already plan on downsizing. I wish I could get rid of all my empty tanks now an maybe some fish. Never had these problems before an have kept fish since I was 12?? Some help would be awsome. I get PM messages on my phone thorough out the day an can responsed pretty quickly if not busy.

Thanks guys


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

If I'm reading this correctly, the tank in the first part has an ammonia problem that won't go away and the tank in the second part is showing nitrates that you can't get to disappear completely.

For the first tank, I'd say that you are messing with it way too much -- you need to let the bacteria colonize on your bio media and every time you mess with the filter, gravel, big water changes, etc. you are just slowing things down and/or starting things over. Make sure you have enough bio filtration and leave things alone -- only perform small volume water changes when necessary, no more stirring up the gravel and sending waste/ammonia up into the water column, go easy on the feedings, and make sure you don't have anything rotting in the tank.

As for the second tank, nitrates are a good sign as long as you aren't showing ammonia or nitrites and you keep the levels in check. Nitrates are the end product of the nitrogen cycle - Ammonia -> Nitrite -> Nitrate. Having nitrates means that your cycle is working and that the bacteria is taking care of the more harmful ammonia and nitrite. Try to keep nitrates below 20 ppm, but anything up to 40 ppm isn't anything to worry about.

Cloudy eye is usually just a symptom of poor water quality or eye irritation that could have easily been caused during the process of transferring the fish from the other guy's tank to yours. Clean water should make it go away on its own, but keep an eye on it to make sure it doesn't get worse of start to fill with fluid.


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## MFNRyan (Mar 27, 2011)

Thanks Joe, Your correct the ammonia tank I took everything out to make sure there was nothing still sitting in the tank causing the ammonia. Feedings are few an far between since it's a serra tank. Today I got more bio media because I only have one tray in my canister filter with bio media an two with floss. So i'll add that to it an do a slight water change. 5 gal bucket. I also got some prime today cause I hear so many people using it and stress zyme to help calm the fish. I also hear stress zyme helps your bio filter. Should I maybe add some to the canister filter itself?

On the two tanks with Nitrate problems there are no ammonia or nitrite showing. I know you never get all the nitrates down but it stay a darker shade of red all the time even after doing water changes an large water changes. That is what bothers me. I don't know if i should add some of the prime or stress zyme to these tanks or not. I hear adding these chemicals may be a temp fix but it will only come back. So i'm unsure.

The cloudy eye looks slightly better today but not much. Hasn't got any worse and I did a dose of salt last night. I was wanting to get a 10" Rhom, but I'm going to put this on hold until I get rid of the smaller fish and can get all my tanks in check an staying that way. I don't want to put a fish like that through any BS

Thanks for the help man


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

RedBelly11 said:


> Thanks Joe, Your correct the ammonia tank I took everything out to make sure there was nothing still sitting in the tank causing the ammonia. Feedings are few an far between since it's a serra tank. Today I got more bio media because I only have one tray in my canister filter with bio media an two with floss. So i'll add that to it an do a slight water change. 5 gal bucket. I also got some prime today cause I hear so many people using it and stress zyme to help calm the fish. I also hear stress zyme helps your bio filter. Should I maybe add some to the canister filter itself?
> 
> On the two tanks with Nitrate problems there are no ammonia or nitrite showing. I know you never get all the nitrates down but it stay a darker shade of red all the time even after doing water changes an large water changes. That is what bothers me. I don't know if i should add some of the prime or stress zyme to these tanks or not. I hear adding these chemicals may be a temp fix but it will only come back. So i'm unsure.
> 
> ...


Prime is a good dechlorinator and can even neutralize ammonia, just don't go overboard with it because you do need some ammonia for the bacteria to colonize. Stress Zyme isn't exactly a miracle product or anything, I definitely wouldn't add any of that or Prime directly to the canister.

You never said exactly how high your nitrate readings are, where are they at? It's usually not a good idea to add chemicals to try to fix your problems -- chemicals for the most part only cover up the symptoms and don't take care of the actual problem.


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## MFNRyan (Mar 27, 2011)

Yeah that's what I hear about chemicals. I can't tell what shade the nitrates are. I will take a picture real fast for ya an you can check it out


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## MFNRyan (Mar 27, 2011)

Here it is man. Usually it's a very faint orange. I can't tell if this is red or what. But seeing how I drained down 8" out of my tank yesterday and filled with new added nutrafin bio boost an all that good stuff I don't think it should be high at all? Checked the water I am putting in and it reads 0 on everything. Water is also soft an 7.6 pH. In most all my tanks pH is very low though, with no plants or drift wood in any of them. The only one it's high in is my 36g an it has cichlid stone for a substrait which raises pH


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

Really tough to say for sure from that pic, but maybe 20-40ppm?? If you do a 50% water change on a tank with 40ppm nitrates, it should have 20ppm immediately after filling it back up with water -- that's assuming your tap water has no nitrates.


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## MFNRyan (Mar 27, 2011)

Yeah, tap water has no nitrates or nothing. When I had the problems with my 55g I took water to the fish store an had them test it for me. They got the same results I got from my kit. That's why I don't understand why it doesn't go down when doing a water change. I'm going to give it a few days not mess with it or anything and see what happens. I dropped a nylon bag full of bio cubes in the ac110 filter so hopefully in a few weeks it will have even more bio filtration. It's hard for me to tell in person lol I can't tell the difference in it. Looks darker then 20 but not as dark as 40 to me. The longer I look at it the more I try to tell myself its higher or lower an my eyes start playing tricks on me


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## MFNRyan (Mar 27, 2011)

Yeah, tap water has no nitrates or nothing. When I had the problems with my 55g I took water to the fish store an had them test it for me. They got the same results I got from my kit. That's why I don't understand why it doesn't go down when doing a water change. I'm going to give it a few days not mess with it or anything and see what happens. I dropped a nylon bag full of bio cubes in the ac110 filter so hopefully in a few weeks it will have even more bio filtration. It's hard for me to tell in person lol I can't tell the difference in it. Looks darker then 20 but not as dark as 40 to me. The longer I look at it the more I try to tell myself its higher or lower an my eyes start playing tricks on me


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