# sick caribes



## badkarma2010 (Dec 24, 2007)

hello -

i am in desperate need of some advice. i have a tank full of caribes and i've noticed that one or two have a condition where it looks like their skin is peeling off and they are darker in color. it is strange because all the other ones looks fine. however, i have also lost a few of the ones that look healthy too. i have no clue what is going on. i have tried furazone, melanix, pimafix, and salt. all water parameters are fine. any suggestions would greatly appreciated.

thanks


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## Grosse Gurke (Jan 3, 2003)

The water cant be fine if they are having issues with their skin (unless it is a simple heater burn)....did you test it recently? How long has the tank been running? Have you checked the ph? Have you added anything new to the tank....any new decor? When you say a tank full....what do you mean? How many fish, what size, how large of tank and what kind of filtration? How is your tap water? How often do you do water changes and what how large do you do...and when was the last water change?


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## barbianj (Aug 3, 2003)

> The water cant be fine


X2

You need to reply with as many facts as you can along with pictures in order for anyone to giva an accurate diagnosis, especially since you have only made one post so far.

Oh, and


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## badkarma2010 (Dec 24, 2007)

badkarma2010 said:


> hello -
> 
> i am in desperate need of some advice. i have a tank full of caribes and i've noticed that one or two have a condition where it looks like their skin is peeling off and they are darker in color. it is strange because all the other ones looks fine. however, i have also lost a few of the ones that look healthy too. i have no clue what is going on. i have tried furazone, melanix, pimafix, and salt. all water parameters are fine. any suggestions would greatly appreciated.
> 
> thanks


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## Grosse Gurke (Jan 3, 2003)

^ Are you implying there is enough information in that post to diagnose your fish?

Could be for someone I guess...but not me. Until you find out what is going on....I would concentrate more on water changes then chemicals....


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## badkarma2010 (Dec 24, 2007)

thanks for the quick response. the pH is 6.5, ammonia is 0, temp 80 (the room is heated so not heater burn. i am currently running wet/dry on two separate tanks, both are 96x42x24, yes 400 gallons each. 26 in one tank and 35 in the other, so you can see that medication costs are a lot. i have had tropical fish for over 25 years so i am not a beginner to the hobby. i am not saying this to be an ass but i have seen all types of sicknesses with tropical fish and this one is not one i have ever seen before and it is resisting all the treatments so far. i've been using furazone and salt and have recently put in melanix and pimafix. nothing new has been introduced into either system and i have had these fish for over a year. i feed them frozen fish daily and i change at least 25% weekly.

i will get some pictures to you when i get home today. thanks in advance for any suggestions you might have.


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

Well, your pH is good, temp. is good, 'ammonia' is good...
With the water changes you're doing I presume your nitrates are in check...

Interesting.

The water stays a steady 80 degrees without fluctuation on it's own with no heater?
That's VERY interesting!


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## barbianj (Aug 3, 2003)

It would help to know what your nitrite and nitrate are as well. This is crucial.

If you have been keeping fish for so long and cannot diagnose it, how can we tell what the problem is without seeing your fish as you can??


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## Grosse Gurke (Jan 3, 2003)

badkarma2010 said:


> thanks for the quick response. the pH is 6.5, ammonia is 0, temp 80 (the room is heated so not heater burn. i am currently running wet/dry on two separate tanks, both are 96x42x24, yes 400 gallons each. 26 in one tank and 35 in the other, so you can see that medication costs are a lot. i have had tropical fish for over 25 years so i am not a beginner to the hobby. i am not saying this to be an ass but i have seen all types of sicknesses with tropical fish and this one is not one i have ever seen before and it is resisting all the treatments so far. i've been using furazone and salt and have recently put in melanix and pimafix. nothing new has been introduced into either system and i have had these fish for over a year. i feed them frozen fish daily and i change at least 25% weekly.
> 
> i will get some pictures to you when i get home today. thanks in advance for any suggestions you might have.


Certainly sounds like you know your stuff. If you are feeding that size bio-load daily...I would think your nitrates are pretty high. In a 180 that I only feed twice a week with 7 fish...I had to do weekly 50% changes to keep them in check....however since you have been in this hobby for a while I am sure you checked to make sure your schedule is keeping up with the bio-load. You are running one wet/dry for both systems? That would be a load to medicate...I probably would fish the two out and put them in a hospital tank until you can find what is causing the issue....no use taking the chance it could be spread.

Honestly...unless you have introduced something new to the tank that might have introduced a bacteria/fungus, or had some disruption in your cycle....I would have no idea what could cause pealing skin.


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## badkarma2010 (Dec 24, 2007)

thanks for the input. good point about the difficulty in diagnosing it without a picture. i will try and get some good ones so you can see what i'm trying to describe. in the meantime i just did another massive water change and i've added more melanix, pimafix and salt. i've also added a UV to the system. i will post any changes or progress. i love these damn caribes. wish me luck.


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

Okay.... "Good luck."


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## pirayaman (Nov 3, 2007)

could be bites from the others thats my only guess unless its too many meds in the water and they are reacting to one another


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## Dr. Giggles (Oct 18, 2003)

Just curious if you had a large fluctuation in pH recently since this is one thing I know that can cause peeling of the skin. Especially if the pH was in the mid 7's for example and dropped to 6.5 or lower.


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## badkarma2010 (Dec 24, 2007)

I did have an issue with the pH about 2 months ago but i got that under control. i separated them into 2 different tanks and added a stronger buffer in there and that helped to stabilize it. aside from that crash and spike i keep the pH at about 6.2 - 6.5.

the really strange thing is, and this is where people think i'm crazy, is that it only affects one at a time. last week i took out the one that was affected and then just yesterday i noticed it on another one. this has happened a few times now. currently i have in my system melanix, pimafix and i added a U/V. i also went back to basics and just added some quick cure and i'll try that for a few days. i tried to take some pictures but the water is really cloudy from the additives so i'll have to wait a few days for those.

one question i have is, has anyone had any issues with using pimafix, melanix and praxi-pro together?

thanks to everybody for the replies!


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## barbianj (Aug 3, 2003)

Piranhas are very hardy fish. Except for tolerance to ammonia, nitrite and nitrate. Prazi pro is for parasites. Maintaining a certain Ph is generally not necessary. UV sterilizers kill microorganisms in the water column. You are doing a bunch of things that don't make sense-treating a problem that has not been properly diagnosed. Define the problem first.


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## Dr. Giggles (Oct 18, 2003)

badkarma2010 said:


> I did have an issue with the pH about 2 months ago but i got that under control. i separated them into 2 different tanks and added a stronger buffer in there and that helped to stabilize it. aside from that crash and spike i keep the pH at about 6.2 - 6.5.
> 
> the really strange thing is, and this is where people think i'm crazy, is that it only affects one at a time. last week i took out the one that was affected and then just yesterday i noticed it on another one. this has happened a few times now. currently i have in my system melanix, pimafix and i added a U/V. i also went back to basics and just added some quick cure and i'll try that for a few days. i tried to take some pictures but the water is really cloudy from the additives so i'll have to wait a few days for those.
> 
> ...


Fortunately pimafix, melafix, and prazi are relatively harmless to your p's. What I would do is once you are done with the week long treatment I would work on 30% daily water changes for a couple days and add an antibiotic such as Maracyn 2. I have to strongly suspect your pH issue from 2 months ago, especially if your pH dipped below 5.5 because in an aquarium beneficial bacteria actually begins to die off. I suspect due to less than perfect water conditions at the time your fish's immune system must have got weekened and then got attacked by pathogens that are a normal part of the water column. Good luck.


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## badkarma2010 (Dec 24, 2007)

cool, thanks for the info. i'll give you an update in a week or two, hopefully with some good news.


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## CLUSTER ONE (Aug 2, 2006)

Piranha_man said:


> The water stays a steady 80 degrees without fluctuation on it's own with no heater?
> That's VERY interesting!


he said the room was heated
some people with lots of tanks will just heat an entire fish room as opposed to heating multiple seperate tanks
this would work well but it would make a bit of an uncomfortable working enviroment


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## scotty (Oct 3, 2007)




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## Guest (Jan 13, 2008)

Grosse Gurke said:


> thanks for the quick response. the pH is 6.5, ammonia is 0, temp 80 (the room is heated so not heater burn. i am currently running wet/dry on two separate tanks, both are 96x42x24, yes 400 gallons each. 26 in one tank and 35 in the other, so you can see that medication costs are a lot. i have had tropical fish for over 25 years so i am not a beginner to the hobby. i am not saying this to be an ass but i have seen all types of sicknesses with tropical fish and this one is not one i have ever seen before and it is resisting all the treatments so far. i've been using furazone and salt and have recently put in melanix and pimafix. nothing new has been introduced into either system and i have had these fish for over a year. i feed them frozen fish daily and i change at least 25% weekly.
> 
> i will get some pictures to you when i get home today. thanks in advance for any suggestions you might have.


Certainly sounds like you know your stuff. If you are feeding that size bio-load daily...I would think your nitrates are pretty high. In a 180 that I only feed twice a week with 7 fish...I had to do weekly 50% changes to keep them in check....however since you have been in this hobby for a while I am sure you checked to make sure your schedule is keeping up with the bio-load. You are running one wet/dry for both systems? That would be a load to medicate...I probably would fish the two out and put them in a hospital tank until you can find what is causing the issue....no use taking the chance it could be spread.

Honestly...unless you have introduced something new to the tank that might have introduced a bacteria/fungus, or had some disruption in your cycle....I would have no idea what could cause pealing skin.
[/quote]

I'm pretty new to the piranha hobby but comparing the feeding frequency of my fish to yours, I must be overfeeding. I got 8 smaller reds (4inches) in a 75 and feed them every other day. If that's too often, should I only feed them 2x a week too?


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## Grosse Gurke (Jan 3, 2003)

yangl said:


> I'm pretty new to the piranha hobby but comparing the feeding frequency of my fish to yours, I must be overfeeding. I got 8 smaller reds (4inches) in a 75 and feed them every other day. If that's too often, should I only feed them 2x a week too?


Nope...every other day is good for nattereri at that size. As they grow...you can start to SLOWLY reduce feedings...and get them on an irregular schedule.


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