# what do you think of bush



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

haha, i just wanted to see what everyone thinks about him, i have never liked him, and then when he took it a step further by going to iraq, saying"uuh, i think, i think that there is some bombs in iraq" and now in the past 6 months, the news and everyone has proved him wrong, i just sit back and laugh at him.


----------



## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

WMD is all I ever hear about this war. What about the good things that came out of it?! We got rid of one of the worst dictators ever. We stop thousands upon thousands of lives from being killed from his rein. Women and children can now walk the streets freely. And for the first time ever they have a constitution in that country. I dont know, but I think we did a pretty damn good job in the time that its taken us.

But thats just my opinion.


----------



## cooldudectd (Mar 4, 2004)

I agree. Bush has balls. He's doing something that everyone else was afraid to.

Not every war is a bad war. Go Bush!


----------



## ChosenOne22 (Nov 23, 2003)

it was all about the WMD..but the day they invaded Iraq, the cause of the war suddenly changed into freeing the Iraqi people. bullshit


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

saddam isnt near the worst dictator, have you heard of hitler, stalin, musolini. and yeah, he got saddam. women can roam the streets now, but now the streets are full of suicide bombers, and bush needs to pull our troops out of iraq now, cause all they are doing is sitting around waiting to get shot or bombed at.


----------



## InIndiana (Nov 6, 2003)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> Women and children can now walk the streets freely.


 Can they? Terrorist networks run rampant now. The fear level in Baghdad is high if not higher then during Saddam's reign. Shiites, kurds, sunnis are waging militant wars and killing innocent civilians. They aren't walking fearlessly, they are walking cowardly.


----------



## Guest (Mar 18, 2004)

I like G.W. Bush, but I sure wish we didn't have troops holed up in Iraq.

These are soliders trained to fight, not to stand and drive around a foreign country waiting to stumble upon an ambush or a set-charge.

Thank God my cousin made it out of Iraq unharmed. He's a solider in the Army and he was stationed at Bahgdad Airport for the longest time. He's now in Germany.

I guess only time will tell whether conquering Saddam Husein was really worth the lives and money it costs.


----------



## TonyTurbo29 (Aug 11, 2003)

If you want to see where Saddams weapons of mass distruction are, please click my link below and look in the upper and middle left of the map. It's the place labled SYRIA.

http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/cia03/iraq_sm03.gif

It's just like the common drug dealer. Would they not start flushing their dope down the toliet when they see the S.W.A.T van pulling in the drive way????


----------



## MR.FREEZ (Jan 26, 2004)

bush is allright in my book i like a pres than can get things done


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

yeah, now that saddam is gone, another will just come to power. do you really think that the iraque citizens want a leader chosen by the us. no they dont.


----------



## InIndiana (Nov 6, 2003)

Ummmmm..They are holding an election.. They are choosing their own leader..


----------



## Denver (Mar 18, 2004)

I have never really liked Bush. I do however admire his resolve towards going after terrorists, and I feel overall he has done a good job of being president considering the circumstances. Unfortunately I don't think that resolve alone will solve the terrorism issue. I would never vote for him. Also, I don't agree with invading Iraq under the pretenses that he/our government used before the war...pre-emptively. If we had not invaded Iraq Bush would have my full support...even though I don't personally like him. I'm sure he will get re-elected, I just hope he can somehow salvage some of our relationships with our allies, post Iraq occupation.


----------



## Puma (Jan 27, 2004)

the argument "saddam is a horrible dictator, blah blah..." doesnt hold much water with me, since saddam does not have a monopoly over winning the "worst dictator of the century award"

the difference is that iraq has a significant social/economic interest to our country.


----------



## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

Puma said:


> the argument "saddam is a horrible dictator, blah blah..." doesnt hold much water with me, since saddam does not have a monopoly over winning the "worst dictator of the century award"
> 
> the difference is that iraq has a significant social/economic interest to our country.


 I said ONE of the worst, not THE worst.


----------



## Denver (Mar 18, 2004)

Puma said:


> the difference is that iraq has a significant social/economic interest to our country.


 It's funny that so many people choose to ignore that factor of this war. Well I guess it's not really funny.


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

yeah, and most of the time you hear things iraques say, they just dont like us, so there was no reason for us to help them.


----------



## Poseidon X (Jan 31, 2003)

I dont aggree with everything bush has done, but for the most part... he has done what is right for this country. He premotes capitalism. I think its very easy to fall into the democratic tricks. John Kerry is not another bill clinton.. this guy could be the worse thing to EVER happen to this country. He is a pure socialist! The united states of america should never be about socialism.. people work hard here and they derserve to be rewarded for that, while kerry would rather pay for the health care for the guy who gets drunk everyday and goes fishing instead of finding a job.

Lets go over one immediate changes that will be made the minute kerry gets in to office... the new reduction of the taxation of dividends will disapear. Now if you try to invest in prefered stock, not only will the coporation be taxed on these dividends, but you will be taxed on them also. This does not promote investment. He will also alter the new reduction of estate taxes which are on a slowly declining schedule over the next 10 years. Whats this mean? Lets say your parents built there house with their own hands.. there worked their whole lives hoping to build this beutiful home to leave you.. and have only a small amount of money when the die. Well you will look forward to getting this house right? wrong.. kerry would like to see estate taxes near 50%~ ! so you better be willing to come up with half the money of the fair market value of the house or its going bye bye.

Meanwhile this money is going to support a whole lot of drug users and other dregs of society.

Did you all not seen what has happened in spain? More terrorist attacks by the animals that john kerry wants to leave alone. These attacks will come back here.. they will and in much stronger design then of september 11th. What was spains response? bring in the socialist party! That is the way europe does things ( with the exception of our british freinds)







.. they run away from conflict with their tail between their legs.

I strongly think if you vote for kerry you are a coward with no backbone who does not understand the sacrafices that must be made for freedom and the freedom of others.


----------



## Denver (Mar 18, 2004)

"Lets go over one immediate changes that will be made the minute kerry gets in to office"

Do you actually think that will happen?


----------



## Puma (Jan 27, 2004)

poseidon, i dont even know where to start with that......lol.









the idea that "we were in danger" is completely debatable, and IMO we were not....i dont feel any safer now than i did before bush took office that is for damn sure.

coupled with the fact that he is a supposed "conservative".... but has spent more than any president in history and is the most fiscally irresponsible president i think we have ever had, not to mention the least intelligent.

the problem is that i dont much care for kerry either.....


----------



## Poseidon X (Jan 31, 2003)

preciscely.. im not debating that bush is the best president... but for gods sake.. ! he is certaintly better and we are better voting for him then putting kerry in office. I completely agree that i would have handled different stages of the war differently, and i go to a millitary academy who is almost completely pro war pro bush about everything. There is a big difference between some of the "new demorcrats" and kerry.. i just hope that the people that decide to vote for him, understand what they are voting for.

My philosphy on it? Vote for bush and ride out the next 4 years...even if we dont all like everything he has done, there are alot of little things that he has done that stabalized the economy ( although he has spent way to much in the war, no argument there)


----------



## MoeMZA (Feb 19, 2004)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> WMD is all I ever hear about this war. What about the good things that came out of it?! We got rid of one of the worst dictators ever. We stop thousands upon thousands of lives from being killed from his rein. Women and children can now walk the streets freely. And for the first time ever they have a constitution in that country. I dont know, but I think we did a pretty damn good job in the time that its taken us.
> 
> But thats just my opinion.


 U.S. wars in AFGHAN and IRAQ have caused close to 20,000 civilians deaths. That's 9/11 times 7!

And for all claiming Sadam was/is EVIL, don't forget who created the guy and don't forget who made OSAMA. I WONDER/AFRAID what "VILLIAN" is being created NOW in some other region.

Also, Bush misled (I say LIED to) the entire world, and now the WORLD sees him as an EVIL DICTATOR/INVADER. No president in American history has ever PRE-EMPTIVELY went to war. And there has never been a time where U.S. was hated this much. This is unheard of.

Iraq has nothing to do with the "war on terror." Bush and the rest of his cronies admited (afterward of course) that Sadam had no link to terrorism. And no the WMDs (nukes, technically, are the only weapons considered a WMD) are not in SYRIA. If he had them, he could've used them. His days were numbered, he knew it, best chance to use'm. Besides, this administration showed "proof" of the WMDs, but couldn't TRACK THEM? Please.

Finally, please understand that the END DOESN'T JUSTIFY THE MEANS!


----------



## Poseidon X (Jan 31, 2003)

lets forget it was clinton that let osama bin laden get away the first time..

The ware also freed hundreds of thousands who had been living under a brutal dicator that killed and murdered innocent civilians every day.


----------



## InIndiana (Nov 6, 2003)

It doesnt matter that Clinton let him go. He wouldn't of mattered if we didn't give him money to fight the soviets


----------



## MoeMZA (Feb 19, 2004)

Clinton is just as bad as BUSH. But don't forget that REAGAN and H.W. BUSH gave OSAMA the billions to fight the RUSSIANS during the 80s.


----------



## MoeMZA (Feb 19, 2004)

Poseidon X said:


> lets forget it was clinton that let osama bin laden get away the first time..
> 
> The ware also freed hundreds of thousands who had been living under a brutal dicator that killed and murdered innocent civilians every day.


Clinton is just as bad as BUSH. But don't forget that REAGAN and H.W. BUSH gave OSAMA the billions to fight the RUSSIANS during the 80s.

And yes, it was REAGAN and H.W. BUSH that gave SADAM the gas to kill those civilians.


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

wow this was a topic that needed to get started. yeah as he said above, 20,000 needless civilian deaths and still counting from bush trying to make things better but didnt realize the obvious thing. iraques dont like americans!


----------



## garybusey (Mar 19, 2003)

Bush is Awesome , I'd write more but I am Lazy. But I had to put in my 2 cents. As a Candian I am very Pro-Bush.... It more ways than one.......


----------



## Denver (Mar 18, 2004)

Obviously the U.S. had other interests in mind when invading Iraq, besides WMD, Freeing the Iraqi people, or ousting Saddam. It will definitely be interesting to see how the Iraqi mess pans out in the long run. It seems to me we are going to be occupying that country for a lot longer than is being discussed in the media right now.
I definitely agree that it is best to keep Bush in office right now despite the problems in Iraq. He is taking care of business with Al Qaeda, although the Gitmo prisoner thing bothers me. I don't necessarily feel safer, but I don't think Kerry could be better and he might be a whole lot worse.


----------



## InIndiana (Nov 6, 2003)

illnino said:


> wow this was a topic that needed to get started. yeah as he said above, 20,000 needless civilian deaths and still counting from bush trying to make things better but didnt realize the obvious thing. iraques dont like americans!


 Ok 1 : It is not spelled iraques. 2. That is a generalized comment about iraqi people not liking Americans. Some of us think of us as liberators, others as perpetrators.


----------



## Denver (Mar 18, 2004)

Poseidon X said:


> The ware also freed hundreds of thousands who had been living under a brutal dicator that killed and murdered innocent civilians every day.


 And now they are living under a brutal occupation where innocent civilians are being killed every day. Not only by coalition soldiers, but by terrorists trying to undermine U.S. plans.


----------



## MoeMZA (Feb 19, 2004)

Denver said:


> I definitely agree that it is best to keep Bush in office right now despite the problems in Iraq. He is taking care of business with Al Qaeda, although the Gitmo prisoner thing bothers me. I don't necessarily feel safer, but I don't think Kerry could be better and he might be a whole lot worse.


 Exactly.

'AL-QAEDA' had nothing to do with IRAQ. Matter of fact, Osama and Sadam hated each other. Even BUSH and his friends admitted SADAM had no link to AL-QAEDA, but the confession came after the war, of course.

So how is BUSH "taking care of business" with Al-QAEDA?


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

yes some iraquees like us, but the majority probabally wouldnt care for the us to be ruling their country(as in we overseeing everything they do and have military there)


----------



## Poseidon X (Jan 31, 2003)

It is idioitc to vote for a president on the basis of his war doctrine... which is exactly what kerry's campaign is about, meanwhile he discusses his socialist plan under a veil... the war will be over soon, and there is no going back on that only foreward

It has to do about fundamentals more then anything... the fundamentals that we have financial freedom now. What it all comes down to is our quality of living.. which is simply better under a republican system. Kerry's tax policy will undoubtly promote stagnation and laziness. I cant respect anyone who supports socialism.. to me that instantly says, your a lazy ass, you want other people to provide for you.. your going no where in life and you know it etc etc.


----------



## InIndiana (Nov 6, 2003)

illnino said:


> yes some iraquees like us, but the majority probabally wouldnt care for the us to be ruling their country(as in we overseeing everything they do and have military there)


 Ok. We have till June 30th or sometime during the summer ( sorry I do not know the exact date) to set up a stable election. No one is ruling that country right now. Look at the chaos that is reigning over the whole country right now. You must understand a lot of the fighting is between Shiites and Kurds and Sunnis. We ousted their dictator and are trying to set up a stable government. Many have realized that. Others have taken arms over the collateral damage that we have taken in iraq.


----------



## Denver (Mar 18, 2004)

MoeMZA said:


> Denver said:
> 
> 
> > I definitely agree that it is best to keep Bush in office right now despite the problems in Iraq. He is taking care of business with Al Qaeda, although the Gitmo prisoner thing bothers me. I don't necessarily feel safer, but I don't think Kerry could be better and he might be a whole lot worse.
> ...


 Al Qaeda had nothing to do with Iraq. That is pretty much a known fact. What I meant by taking care of business with them is simply that they are on the run ie. Bin Laden and number 2 and many others apparently, and they have not attacked the US since 09/11. But like I said, something bothers me very much concerning the patriot act, and holding people without counsel undefinitely, regardless of their status. Simply put, that goes against what this country is founded upon.


----------



## Denver (Mar 18, 2004)

Poseidon X said:


> It has to do about fundamentals more then anything... the fundamentals that we have financial freedom now. What it all comes down to is our quality of living.. which is simply better under a republican system. Kerry's tax policy will undoubtly promote stagnation and laziness. I cant respect anyone who supports socialism.. to me that instantly says, your a lazy ass, you want other people to provide for you.. your going no where in life and you know it etc etc.


 These are some pretty broad strokes you are throwin out here. 
-Who has financial freedom? What about the unemployment rates???
-Quality of life is better under republicans??? That's a fact? Quality of life for who?
Because it isn't for everyone.
-I don't support socialism, and I'm definitely not a lazy ass, but your last statment is pretty ridiculous here, it's a fact that some people in life need social programs, help with school, help with medical problems and many other things, that doesn't mean they are all leeches.


----------



## Poseidon X (Jan 31, 2003)

We are more likely to experience a sifinicant change in unemployment rates after the presidential election... if bush is elected rather then not. The problem is the US dollar is being pumped up by foreign markets that are holding our securities.. and in the case of china, which has a fixed currency established for the time being. They are easily able to provide a low cost labor market for export goods. The minimum wage needs to be decreased.. this was give room for more verticle movement in the job force during career progression and lower the fixed cost of products. We might regain some of our industry in this sense, but for the most part.. those parts of our economy are leaving and favoring a highly educated work force. The democratic party is also against NAFTA. The final phases are not in place yet, but as it stands the gatewat to mexico will be open for united states produce exports.. while we have conceeded some of our manufacturing to our southern partner, the united states produc market is vastly superior and has much lower operating expenditures.. While the mexican produce is sub par to say the least.. this will represent a massive new export market in the near future.. especially if the plan continues with the trade aggreemnt of the americas

we have charities specific to helping people with real special needs... lots of people are willing to dump their money off for a tax deduction.. on the otherhand the goverment rarely helps these people.. they are more intrested in giving this money away to those poor unfortunates who spend their life in lazy land.


----------



## Denver (Mar 18, 2004)

You didn't answer my questions though.
-Who has financial freedom? Right now? We can speculate forever on what employment rates might do if so and so gets elected, but we have just witnessed some of the lowest rates in history. Under Bush.

-Quality of life is better under republicans??? That's a fact? Quality of life for who?

Charities are great, I'll agree, there are many rich people and companies out there willing to donate $$$. I think we all know that charities are not going to solve the problems we have with government spending, medicare, and social programs that we obviously have in the U.S.

Trickle down economics is just like communism, it sounds great on paper, but it never works in practice. (Unless your goal is the rich getting richer)


----------



## Scooby (Dec 25, 2003)

Bush is a puppet, you think he's actually intelligent enough to come up with these ideas and plans etc...


----------



## Peacock (Feb 23, 2004)

*all of the things he has done are good*

bombing Iraq = smart move.


----------



## dracofish (Jul 13, 2003)

I'm not one for following politics, but I'm rather sick of a few things:

1) Seeing people work their asses off (my b/f and I included) to barely get by while the hoodrat down the street doesn't have a job yet drives a brand new car, wears designer clothes, and spends $50 a week on her nails. Who bought all that stuff? We did...

2) Seeing people work hard at their "real" day jobs and have to keep a second job pushing carriages or flipping burgers just to make ends meet because companies aren't paying them enough and there's jack sh*t they can do about it because there's 100 other people in line behind them that would take their job for less...

3) Sensorship...what the FCC is doing is wrong, and Bush and the Church are with it. I've heard rumors that the Motion Picture Association is next in line to get sensored. What the hell? What happened to freedom of speech? Nobody is making anyone listen to Stern or watch an R-rated movie. I can see this eventually starting to infringe on freedom of religion too, because I've heard stories of schools banning the wearing of pentagrams and whatnot.

4) Bush is spending money in all the wrong places. I recently heard that he pushed a boatload of money into a committee to research why the divorce rate is going up. Why not spend it on cancer research, fixing the greenhouse effect, or welfare reform? Those are more important things to look at. I also heard that he is all about going into Alaska and drilling for oil on protected land...the man doesn't give a rat's ass about our environment or trying to preserve it for the next generation.


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

well so far, the poll is 11/19 dont like him, hmm wonder who isnt going to win the election this november...


----------



## Denver (Mar 18, 2004)

dracofish said:


> I'm not one for following politics, but I'm rather sick of a few things:
> 
> 1) Seeing people work their asses off (my b/f and I included) to barely get by while the hoodrat down the street doesn't have a job yet drives a brand new car, wears designer clothes, and spends $50 a week on her nails. Who bought all that stuff? We did...
> 
> ...











Unfortunately, besides Bush we have pretty much no options.


----------



## imachode (Jun 3, 2003)

First, qualifications. I've spent the last three years studying political science at UCLA, with a concentration in international relations, so this topic is kind of up my alley.

I think caution is the watchword here. The world is definitely not black and white; with something as complicated as Iraq, there are definitely many gray areas with which to contend.

There are many ways to both denounce or justify the conflict in Iraq, and there is no doubt that there are many good reasons on both sides of the issue. We simply cannot believe that our entire political institution in the US just makes silly decisions either way, so declaring that "IT WAS RIGHT!" or "IT WAS WRONG!" merely reflects ignorance. Neither should you so easily use what you heard on the news or what someone else told you as being pertinent evidence for the issue. It was a tough decision to make. It's not like Bush said, "Oh, I know what's right, but I'll do this instead." Neither is it true that he said, "Oh, this is absolutely right! I'm going to do this for America!" Likely he was stuck between a rock and a hard place, and he chose one, and the Iraqi situation is the result.

The real choice to make here is a philosophical one: do you attack someone that you THINK will attack you if you don't, OR, do you ONLY attack someone, IF they attack you first?

War is an enduring feature of the history of mankind. It has been around since the book of Genesis; the earliest annals of written literature contain evidence of war. In the 20th century alone, we've had two world wars, one war in Korea, one war in Vietnam, countless minor wars Central and South America, two wars in the Gulf, one war on drugs, and now a war on terrorism.

With this historical fact, a reasonable, logical person can only believe that in war, the true enemy is war itself. What good are all our achievements if we cannot eventually produce peace? The truth is, as history continues, we will eventually all either kill each other off, or produce a peace. If the human species is to reach new heights and go beyond the limitations of a state of war, we need to produce a peace.

This cannot happen by waging war on others. We can't FORCE a peace, because then we'll be forcing people to adopt our beliefs, adopt our ideas on truth, justice, and liberty, and in the end, this foisting of our belief set will only end up being tyranny. For a people to understand, they'll need to learn it, by themselves, in their own time.

So, personally, I'm against war in general. The only justifiable war is a DIRECT defensive war. That means someone is actively attacking you, and when they stop, you stop. I know that seems ludicrous in the face of reality, but it needs to happen in your head first, before it can have a chance at making a difference.

War only breeds war. It's an endless cycle that can only be stopped by those who bring a paradigm shift, much like Gandhi and MLK Jr. God bless the souls of brave men like these, whose actions require much more courage that it takes to pull a trigger.

J. Choi (imachode's cousin)


----------



## Innes (Jan 13, 2003)

he is a twit


----------



## scarfish (Apr 5, 2003)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> WMD is all I ever hear about this war. What about the good things that came out of it?! We got rid of one of the worst dictators ever. We stop thousands upon thousands of lives from being killed from his rein. Women and children can now walk the streets freely. And for the first time ever they have a constitution in that country. I dont know, but I think we did a pretty damn good job in the time that its taken us.
> 
> But thats just my opinion.


 Are you kidding? Iraq is more dangerous now than it ever was.


----------



## kopid_03 (Mar 3, 2004)

would you have rather discovered a weapon of mass destruction when it was dropped onto our country or that we go there and make sure there aren't any?


----------



## scarfish (Apr 5, 2003)

kopid_03 said:


> would you have rather discovered a weapon of mass destruction when it was dropped onto our country or that we go there and make sure there aren't any?


Hey you're right. I also heard that Kenya has an unlimited supply of mutant- lions that have been instilled with a deep hatred of American capitalism. We should lay the place to waste, because those mutant-lions showing up on our doorstep is too close to a remote possibility.


----------



## kopid_03 (Mar 3, 2004)

hey thanks for the smartass comeback man


----------



## scarfish (Apr 5, 2003)

kopid_03 said:


> hey thanks for the smartass comeback man


 As long as I have the proper fuel, I'll do my best.


----------



## Peacock (Feb 23, 2004)

Draco- Life is tough.. if you dont like the USA then leave.. go to canada..

I think now that we took sadam out, the USA should step in and take over iraq...


----------



## Kory (Jun 5, 2003)

Peacock said:


> Draco- Life is tough.. if you dont like the USA then leave.. go to canada..
> 
> I think now that we took sadam out, the USA should step in and take over iraq...


 Isn't that essentially what there doing?


----------



## dracofish (Jul 13, 2003)

Peacock said:


> Draco- Life is tough.. if you dont like the USA then leave.. go to canada..


 Neil, someday you will learn that mommy can't buy everything for you...

Life IS tough, but there's absolutely no need for some people to work their asses off while others get a free ride. I find it rather ridiculous that someone that has never had to work for anything in life can call another out for wanting to see justice in the welfare department. How is it not my right to want a governmental policy change?

Get a job, see someone take part of your money and then use it to sit on their ass while you work for a living and then get back to me on how you feel about it.


----------



## MR.FREEZ (Jan 26, 2004)

Peacock said:


> Draco- Life is tough.. if you dont like the USA then leave.. go to canada..
> 
> I think now that we took sadam out, the USA should step in and take over iraq...


 we went there to help them become a soverin nation and become there own

country the days of invade and conqquer are over


----------



## nitrofish (Jan 14, 2003)

illnino said:


> haha, i just wanted to see what everyone thinks about him, i have never liked him, and then when he took it a step further by going to iraq, saying"uuh, i think, i think that there is some bombs in iraq" and now in the past 6 months, the news and everyone has proved him wrong, i just sit back and laugh at him.


 not another lets bash bush thread, wtf.

first off everyone complaind when 9-11 went down and said why didn't you do anything to prevent this. then bush does something for the protection of americans and people complain about that wtf.

it wasn't our job to play easter egg hunt for weapons either, it was iraqs job to prove they had none, they failed to do so.


----------



## Peacock (Feb 23, 2004)

dracofish said:


> Peacock said:
> 
> 
> > Draco- Life is tough.. if you dont like the USA then leave.. go to canada..
> ...


 If you dont like how your tax dollars are spent.. then MOVE..

its just like living in your parrents house.. If you dont like their rules.. then LEAVE.

im happy with my country. sure there are some fucked up things.. but i would rather live here then iraq or some 3rd world country.. if you dont like the USA, then move to africa.. Maybe there you will realize just how well you have it...


----------



## Peacock (Feb 23, 2004)

mr.freez said:


> the days of invade and conqquer are over


 Unfortunatly.


----------



## Guest (Mar 19, 2004)

Poseidon X said:


> Did you all not seen what has happened in spain? More terrorist attacks by the animals that john kerry wants to leave alone. These attacks will come back here.. they will and in much stronger design then of september 11th. What was spains response? bring in the socialist party! That is the way europe does things ( with the exception of our british freinds)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yup :nod: 
With the exception of Great Britian, Europe is handling Al Queda terrorism using the same tactics they handled Hitler with: capitulation and denial. The just hope if they placate the terrorists, they will pass them by and concentrate on killing Americans.

America and Britian are alone in this fight.


----------



## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

Poseidon X said:


> Did you all not seen what has happened in spain? More terrorist attacks by the animals that john kerry wants to leave alone. These attacks will come back here.. they will and in much stronger design then of september 11th. What was spains response? bring in the socialist party! That is the way europe does things ( with the exception of our british freinds)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If the socialists were in charge, "Madrid" wouldn't have happened in the first place: in case you haven't noticed, Al Qaeda terror is only aimed at the US and its immedeate allies. Before 9/11, each and every Al Qaeda attack was on US targets [USS Cole, US embassies in eastern Africa, WTC, etc.]) It was after the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq started that non-US targets were affected...

The European countries aren't direct targets, until they fully support the US and its war against terror, as happened with Spain and Turkey (Istanbul bombings), and will happen in other Euroean countries.
Only example is France, which has to deal with the islamic violence due to its Algerian legacy (GIA/FIS).


----------



## dracofish (Jul 13, 2003)

Peacock said:


> If you dont like how your tax dollars are spent.. then MOVE..
> 
> its just like living in your parrents house.. If you dont like their rules.. then LEAVE.
> 
> im happy with my country. sure there are some fucked up things.. but i would rather live here then iraq or some 3rd world country.. if you dont like the USA, then move to africa.. Maybe there you will realize just how well you have it...


You see, that's why this is a democracy...we have the right to change, or at least want to change, our government. Telling someone to get out because they don't like it is completely stupid. Last time I checked, this is a "free country" where the people are supposed to have ideas and speak them. This isn't a monarchy or even a dictatorship country where people should have to flee their country. Comparing our country to your parent's household just goes to show how much of a clue you don't have about how our government works. Your parent's household can be likened to a dictatorship. What they say goes...that's it. No if's, and's, or but's. That is certainly not the way a democratic government works or should be portrayed.

You have absolutely no idea where I'm coming from because you don't miss your money at all. Like I said, try living off yourself, get a job, have someone take part of your check away so they can sit on their ass, and then get back to me on how great our welfare system is.


----------



## nismo driver (Jan 27, 2004)

At first I felt that I could contribute my opinion to this topic but after attempting to read this I have decided to make several neutral points.

now that sadam is gone there are serious problems controlling the people of that country maybe those people are f-ing nuts and need to be controlled by fear or they act out of control as we have seen. Im not saying allot of what sadam has done is acceptable, but the people are insane over there...

Bush has deceived people about his intentions on many levels, he plays on people fears using the threat that if we do not strike against terror we will be targeted again... we will be targeted again whether we strike out against terror or not they hate us and every thing we stand for and belive in, and there are already hundreds if not thousands of terrorists in the country already, they dont decide im going to america to blow something up and jump on a plane the next day they plan and plot for years...

Bush mixes religion and politics too much he allows his strong beliefs to become US policy...

if 9/11 had not happened I honestly think he would not be a popular president because he has done very little to help the American people, he exports jobs, takes away our rights and is basically an idiot with no respect for foreign policy to promote a positive relation ship with other nations...

he uses his war on terror to distract people from realizing he is driving us into the hugest national debt we have ever had, the job market is horrendous and his plans for job growth have failed, and now as he continues to claim he is spreading democracy and freeing all these people he is taking away our rights and limiting our freedoms because people cant accept responsibility for there actions or pay attention to there children, so they blame media, the internet, and anything else they can when something stupid happens..

im sure if the people of Iraq have any clue of how retarded this country is and the BS politics that get worse every day they would not want this BS.. and do you actually think they will be able to have a election with out riots or assassinations.. most of the countries in south america or Africa that have democratic elections also have riots an militant parties take over and they have constant turmoil.. to think that our system of government is the best and will work for everyone is the arrogance that has brought us to the situation we are in now where half the world would love to see our country crumble...

every election it comes down to who do you hate less because of all the expense and bs that goes with the politics of running for presidency, no truly intelligent person would want to subject them selves to that crap so we always have to choose from the most power hungry manipulative dirt bags that put on a nice smile and tell you what they thin you want to hear while there pockets get stuff by special interest groups...

Our government is messed up, our choices suck, and things will probably continue to get worse...


----------



## Xenon (Nov 15, 2002)

Hmmm, we finally have a president that has the balls to do something about the Middle Eastern problem. Like it or not, even without WMD, an American and Wester prescence in that region PROTECTS OUR SECURITY and will aid in the prevention of terrorists attacking our country again. Bush has integrity, and is looking out for the best interests of the American people. Bush dealt with 9/11 in a way no other president would have balls to. He confronted the enemies on their home ground and won. We couldve just waited for another 3000 AMERICAN people to die.....


----------



## Xenon (Nov 15, 2002)

Keep in mind people. The people who dont learn the lessons of history are condemned to repeat it! Appeasment has no place when dealing with madmen. How different would the world be if England and Europe had not decided to appease Hitler in the 1930's?

Bush in '04


----------



## dracofish (Jul 13, 2003)

I agree with his position in the Middle East, but I do agree with one thing that Nismo Driver said:



> Bush mixes religion and politics too much he allows his strong beliefs to become US policy...


I think Bush has to realize that not everyone has the same religious or moral beliefs. If I want to listen to Howard Stern or watch a dirty movie, I damn well have the right to do so! If my kids want to wear pentagrams to school (If I had kids...scary thought...lol), they damn well have the right to do so! The day I get told at work to take off my pentagram because it "offends people" is the day I lose any and all faith in this country, and unfortunately, I see that day nearing. This country was founded on that most important thing...freedom of religion, even though it was kinda hypocrital for the Pilgrims to cry that they were religiously persecuted yet did the same exact thing to the natives. Then again, we're all hypocrites in some way or another...


----------



## Poseidon X (Jan 31, 2003)

Judazzz said:


> Poseidon X said:
> 
> 
> > Did you all not seen what has happened in spain? More terrorist attacks by the animals that john kerry wants to leave alone. These attacks will come back here.. they will and in much stronger design then of september 11th. What was spains response? bring in the socialist party! That is the way europe does things ( with the exception of our british freinds)
> ...


 again.. perfect example of european attitude... you would think after world war II when we had to bail out every country in europe from impending doom they would learn something. The weak are always the first to get eaten...

Socialism is a crock.. and its why european nations will never be as productive as capitalist systems.


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

well the poll results are 19/32 so i think that most of you are with me. i thought this would be a good topic that would bring up a lot of good points. and you that write a lot defending or offending our president, lots of good points there. 
bush


----------



## Poseidon X (Jan 31, 2003)

the nation is not however.. statistics are strongly in favor of bush.


----------



## mr_meanor (Nov 5, 2003)

I like Bush so


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

i dont so


----------



## mr_meanor (Nov 5, 2003)

illnino said:


> i dont so


----------



## kopid_03 (Mar 3, 2004)

i'm just glad we have a president who doesn't let people walk all over us, i don't really give a sh*t if we take over every other country


----------



## nitrofish (Jan 14, 2003)

dracofish said:


> I agree with his position in the Middle East, but I do agree with one thing that Nismo Driver said:
> 
> 
> 
> > Bush mixes religion and politics too much he allows his strong beliefs to become US policy...


 yes, im a christian but morality and law are not the same. I agree with you on that. but hey, no ones perfect


----------



## Peacock (Feb 23, 2004)

dracofish said:


> Peacock said:
> 
> 
> > If you dont like how your tax dollars are spent.. then MOVE..
> ...


 I have a job.. but i dont sit there an whine because i have to pay my dues...

yes its a free country.. but not realy.. its still OWNED by a group of people who give orders.....

you just complain because your "HARD-EARNED" money is going down the drain, or so you say. grow up.. taxes are a part of life.


----------



## dracofish (Jul 13, 2003)

Peacock said:


> I have a job.. but i dont sit there an whine because i have to pay my dues...
> 
> yes its a free country.. but not realy.. its still OWNED by a group of people who give orders.....
> 
> you just complain because your "HARD-EARNED" money is going down the drain, or so you say. grow up.. taxes are a part of life.


Yes, taxes are a part of life. I have no problems "paying my dues" to to people that actually deserve it. Welfare is a good thing, when it's not abused. There are people out there that lose their jobs and do need it for a short period of time and I have absolutely no problem helping them out, but I draw the line when people stay on welfare for years at a time or even longer because they would rather have money handed to them. Rich once worked with a woman that had lived with a very well off man for years and even had kids with them. They lived in a nice house in a rich town. She claimed that she didn't want to marry him because she would then lose her welfare benefits. Neil, you're actually telling me that you think this woman deserves it so I shouldn't complain about "paying my dues" to people like that? Get a f*cking clue man.

Another frequently abused "helping hand" is unemployment. That also comes out of our taxes. I don't know how it is in the rest of the country, but in Connecticut, those on unemployment have to "prove" to the state they are looking for a job. They do this by getting signatures from various employers stating that they put an application in...and therefore are looking for a job. Well, I can't count how many times an ass like that has come up to me and asked me to sign one of those things while saying flat out that they aren't really looking for a job. I not only told them to buzz off, but I gave them a good lecture too. Once again, I have no problem "paying my dues" to people that really need it. If a guy loses his job and is genuinely trying to find a new one, then by all means, he deserves my help. Things like welfare and unemployment aren't meant to be lifetime things. I think they should have a time limit as to how long you are allowed to be on it. If you can't find a job in six months or so, then you aren't looking.

BTW, not all of our income tax goes to welfare. I was only "complaining" about that. Some goes to social security, some goes to the state, etc.

Also, this country is not "owned" by anyone except the people that live in it. You still seem have trouble grasping the fact that this is a democracy:

democracy

\De*moc"ra*cy\, n.; pl. Democracies. [F. d['e]mocratie, fr. Gr. dhmokrati`a; dh^mos the people + kratei^n to be strong, to rule, kra`tos strength.] 1. Government by the people; a form of government in which the supreme power is retained and directly exercised by the people.

2. Government by popular representation; a form of government in which the supreme power is retained by the people, but is indirectly exercised through a system of representation and delegated authority periodically renewed; a constitutional representative government; a republic.

3. Collectively, the people, regarded as the source of government. --Milton.

4. The principles and policy of the Democratic party, so called. [U.S.]


----------



## 14_blast (Oct 6, 2003)

I love bush...hey wait, isn't this the Sir Nathan XXI poll?


----------



## Peacock (Feb 23, 2004)

dracofish said:


> Peacock said:
> 
> 
> > I have a job.. but i dont sit there an whine because i have to pay my dues...
> ...


 huh?

sorry i didnt read it.. you type to much.


----------



## kopid_03 (Mar 3, 2004)

whats the point of posting a quote that you didn't read


----------



## Hypergenix (Dec 17, 2003)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> Women and children can now walk the streets freely.


 not for our soldiers w/o getting shot


----------



## fiaman101 (Feb 22, 2004)

Bush did what every liberalwas scared to do. Andyes i do feel safer with him in office


----------



## hakeemtito (Oct 3, 2003)

decent cabinet, horrible PR.


----------



## dracofish (Jul 13, 2003)

Peacock said:


> huh?
> 
> sorry i didnt read it.. you type to much.


 Yeah, thought so...LOL


----------



## SERRAPYGO (Feb 4, 2003)

Just skimming over all this, I noticed the Bush bashing is in full swing. But, where are all the Kerry supporters? hmm..


----------



## kopid_03 (Mar 3, 2004)

kerry is a giant long faced liberal bitch


----------



## SERRAPYGO (Feb 4, 2003)

kopid_03 said:


> kerry is a giant long faced liberal bitch












I loved the up roars from the liberals when Bush used 9/11 events in his ad. But, when Kerry used vietnam footage... that was ok.









Where are the Kerry supporters?


----------



## kopid_03 (Mar 3, 2004)

there are no real kerry supporters, there are just anti-bush people who would pretend to like anyone that opposed bush


----------



## nitrofish (Jan 14, 2003)

kopid_03 said:


> there are no real kerry supporters, there are just anti-bush people who would pretend to like anyone that opposed bush


 so true :laugh:


----------



## kopid_03 (Mar 3, 2004)

has anyone ever listened to michael savage on the radio? or he actually had a tv show for a while but then it got canceled.............but he was very anti-liberal and my dad got me to listening to him and i read his book, really interesting


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

nismo driver said:


> At first I felt that I could contribute my opinion to this topic but after attempting to read this I have decided to make several neutral points.
> 
> now that sadam is gone there are serious problems controlling the people of that country maybe those people are f-ing nuts and need to be controlled by fear or they act out of control as we have seen. Im not saying allot of what sadam has done is acceptable, but the people are insane over there...
> 
> ...


 im with you on that all the way, i think the same way you do about bush and iraq. nice long article


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

yup, i dont like bush, but i dont like kerry either. but if i had to make the choice, i would pick kerry cause it seems like he wouldnt be screwing things up so much like bush did in iraq. so i am not a kerry supportor or a bush supportor, just 
anit-bush


----------



## kopid_03 (Mar 3, 2004)

so go with ralph nader or whoever else will be running, lol


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

i wouldnt mind ralph nader, he seems like he wont go out and do something outrageous and make an asshole of himself like bush did in iraq.


----------



## SERRAPYGO (Feb 4, 2003)

illnino said:


> so i am not a kerry supportor or a bush supportor, just
> anit-bush


 So, where is that going to get you? Are you going into the voting booth with that frame of mind? Scary! And what scares me is, so many people are going into those boothes with your frame of mind. Try thinking outside the box.


----------



## kopid_03 (Mar 3, 2004)

yeah you should really support someone for what they do, not just support them because you hate their opponent


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

im 14 so i cant vote, and if there were no presidents i wanted i wouldnt go to vote


----------



## Raptor (Jan 3, 2003)

I'm voting for kerry just to null a bush vote.







Kidding me bush good


----------



## MR.FREEZ (Jan 26, 2004)

voteing the other wasy just cause you dont like the other guy just isnt right

atleast find an issue one of them has that you like and vote for him


----------



## kopid_03 (Mar 3, 2004)

i'm 16 and i can't vote either, but i like bush for what he has done so far, except for when he said that illegal immigrants could stay, that i don't want


----------



## imachode (Jun 3, 2003)

ok, first of all i think it's great that people are getting involvedin politics and realizing that voting is an incredible part of our society that truely can and will affect or lives.

with that said, how many of you are old enough to vote? or maybe more importantly, how many of you actually WILL vote?


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

kopiod 03, you light small rodents on fire...........


----------



## kopid_03 (Mar 3, 2004)

illnino, what does that matter, you will probably end up dropping one in your tank and see it get its guts pulled out by your p's


----------



## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

I think Bush is doing a fine job. At first, when he took the oath into office, I thought he was a complete idiot without a clue on running an entire nation. Since 9/11, he's done much and I respect him for what he's done. Probably half of the country agrees with me that he's trying his best to right everything, i mean, look at what he's trying to do. He's doing his best to un-f*ck what the Clinton Administration left him with, he's trying to create jobs, lower taxes, increase US interests and influence throughout the world, intensify and strengthen US forces AND he's trying to relate to the people. For god-sakes, leave the man to do his job! All I hear is constant bickering of how Bush is a screw-up, Bush is an idiot, Bush doesnt know what he's doing.....well, if all that is true, then we might as well think of ourselves as a bunch of screw ups, a bunch of idiots and a bunch of fucks who dont know what we're doing, after all, its the people that lead the president, not the other way around.


----------



## nismo driver (Jan 27, 2004)

kopid_03 said:


> so go with ralph nader or whoever else will be running, lol


 the biggest problem with this approach is that it will not achive anything productive, if you oppose bush or kerry but dont like either voting for nader will help who ever it is you really dont want to see in office..

unfortunately it has gotten to the point where our options suck, i hate bush but im not really a big kerry supporter, i will most like vote for kerry since its not a vote for bush.. by voting for nader i would be taking a vote from kerry which would potentially help bush.. and nader will not win anyway so its would throw away a vote from the top runners...


----------



## nismo driver (Jan 27, 2004)

kopid_03 said:


> yeah you should really support someone for what they do, not just support them because you hate their opponent


 our choices suck if you hate both candidates and dont realyl support what either of them are representing then why not vote for the lesser of the two evils, its better than not voting at all..


----------



## nismo driver (Jan 27, 2004)

USMC*sPiKeY* said:


> I think Bush is doing a fine job. At first, when he took the oath into office, I thought he was a complete idiot without a clue on running an entire nation. Since 9/11, he's done much and I respect him for what he's done. Probably half of the country agrees with me that he's trying his best to right everything, i mean, look at what he's trying to do. He's doing his best to un-f*ck what the Clinton Administration left him with, he's trying to create jobs, lower taxes, increase US interests and influence throughout the world, intensify and strengthen US forces AND he's trying to relate to the people. For god-sakes, leave the man to do his job! All I hear is constant bickering of how Bush is a screw-up, Bush is an idiot, Bush doesnt know what he's doing.....well, if all that is true, then we might as well think of ourselves as a bunch of screw ups, a bunch of idiots and a bunch of fucks who dont know what we're doing, after all, its the people that lead the president, not the other way around.


 wow your avitar suits you well..


----------



## kopid_03 (Mar 3, 2004)

i don't really like it when the candidates have ads on tv bashing each other, that just seems wrong, even when the person i like does it


----------



## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

nismo driver said:


> USMC*sPiKeY* said:
> 
> 
> > I think Bush is doing a fine job. At first, when he took the oath into office, I thought he was a complete idiot without a clue on running an entire nation. Since 9/11, he's done much and I respect him for what he's done. Probably half of the country agrees with me that he's trying his best to right everything, i mean, look at what he's trying to do. He's doing his best to un-f*ck what the Clinton Administration left him with, he's trying to create jobs, lower taxes, increase US interests and influence throughout the world, intensify and strengthen US forces AND he's trying to relate to the people. For god-sakes, leave the man to do his job! All I hear is constant bickering of how Bush is a screw-up, Bush is an idiot, Bush doesnt know what he's doing.....well, if all that is true, then we might as well think of ourselves as a bunch of screw ups, a bunch of idiots and a bunch of fucks who dont know what we're doing, after all, its the people that lead the president, not the other way around.
> ...


 good one


----------



## Scooby (Dec 25, 2003)

> The ware also freed hundreds of thousands who had been living under a brutal dicator that killed and murdered innocent civilians every day.


Haha you said "Dicator"

Huh how exactly can he be all of the above??? JAckass, Evil, should never been elected and at the same time be great president?


----------



## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

nismo driver said:


> USMC*sPiKeY* said:
> 
> 
> > I think Bush is doing a fine job. At first, when he took the oath into office, I thought he was a complete idiot without a clue on running an entire nation. Since 9/11, he's done much and I respect him for what he's done. Probably half of the country agrees with me that he's trying his best to right everything, i mean, look at what he's trying to do. He's doing his best to un-f*ck what the Clinton Administration left him with, he's trying to create jobs, lower taxes, increase US interests and influence throughout the world, intensify and strengthen US forces AND he's trying to relate to the people. For god-sakes, leave the man to do his job! All I hear is constant bickering of how Bush is a screw-up, Bush is an idiot, Bush doesnt know what he's doing.....well, if all that is true, then we might as well think of ourselves as a bunch of screw ups, a bunch of idiots and a bunch of fucks who dont know what we're doing, after all, its the people that lead the president, not the other way around.
> ...


 my avatar suits me well, huh?

Well since my avatar depicits a down-syndromed retard of a child, that must make me a retard of a man. I guess that means I made a "retarded" choice to volunteer for the Marine Corps to defend your sorry ass and defend my country. I guess I must be viewed as a "dumbass" for backing up what I think are valid points as to why I think the Bush Administration is trying to do its job. So I guess I'll be the idiot who's going to cast my overseas ballot to re-elect "an idiot"


----------



## Chimaira (Jan 13, 2004)

Americans: Please don't forget that you are an American. You can vote for who ever the hell you want, be it Bush Or Kerry, and not let knobs like Spikey sway your beliefs.

Americans and Non-Americans: I posted this in a different Forum, and I believe it was worded perfectly, because I wrote it. 

*You know, its funny that all of you foreigners think that getting Bush out of Office is a good thing. It's funny how every country has to worry about the United States, but nobody here gives two rabbit shits about your country really. I in fact support President Bush.

Answering the Question: How can anyone Re-Elect President Bush?

Its simple, I agree with his views, and there is nothing anyone can do to change it, Call me what you want, I live in a free country, I am able to Vote, therefore it is my Choice.

And second of all, It isn't all President Bush. Here in America We have the Balance of Power. It's not all the Presidents Decision people, So if you people want to keep singling out one person, go ahead, but you are In fact the one that is close minded, and ignorant.

I'll end with saying, I'm not going to write a book, just got what I wanted to say out of this, and my whole saying here is 99% true, because I'm sure there are people that care about other Countries, but the majority don't.

Bush / Cheney in '04*


----------



## dracofish (Jul 13, 2003)

Chimaira said:


> And second of all, It isn't all President Bush. Here in America We have the Balance of Power. It's not all the Presidents Decision people, So if you people want to keep singling out one person, go ahead, but you are In fact the one that is close minded, and ignorant.


 What balance of power? Last time I checked we have a republican Congress too...


----------



## nismo driver (Jan 27, 2004)

USMC*sPiKeY* said:


> nismo driver said:
> 
> 
> > USMC*sPiKeY* said:
> ...


 i respect that you have choosen to fight "bush's war" because this is not the a war for the american people.. i have friends in the marines and they are doing what they signed up to do serve our country and doing a damn good job.. however to say that bush is doing an excelent job as president because of "his" war on terror (and any one else he doesnt like) does not make a strong point for what he has done as president.. His primary task should be to improve and maintain our economic situation and safety within the borders of our nation, going after al-Quida in afganastan is justifable, going after iraq was not..

i appreciate you servering the country but do not agree with the commander in chiefs use of your service.. To say that he is doing a good job because of how he has responded to 9/11 lacks in depth analasys of what he actually has done to our freedoms and the economic situation at home.. his job is not to oust goverments that he doesnt like, america is not the world bully that should go around crushing everyone we dont agree with, if they have something of interest to us like oil. I dont see bush sending troops to nigeria and other african nations with horrible dictatorships that do not take care of there people or promote freedom...

he goes after his own agenda and special interest, putting his spin on it to make it seem like hes doing so much for americans but he sends jobs overseas, takes away our rights with his religous right agenda, and does very little to help the economy, most if not all of his economic plans have failed... with out his war on terror AKA terrorizing the rest of the world he would have nothing to show for his presidency...

im not saying that you are a retard just that i feel your point of veiw is retarded and lacks depth...


----------



## Noble (Nov 9, 2003)

THere are two problems in politics today.

1.	The Democratic party is no longer the democratic party of Thomas Jefferson or even JFK. John F Kennedy, if you do your research, is pretty much the same as George W. Bush today. The current Democratic Part is now a socialist/ communist-lite party. They say they are diversive progressive thinkers but do not tolerate any different thought&#8230;they only say you are a diverse progressive thinker if you think EXACTLY like them. Lets look at JFK for a minute.

He was for Tax cuts. He passed a tax cut that was, at the time, 2% of the gross national income, and George W Bush's tax cut, which was was chopped in half mind you, but before it was chopped in half was 1.2% of the gross national income. So in essence, George W. Bush's tax cut was smaller then Kennedy's. Kennedy was a REAL democrat&#8230;he was not a liberal by todays standards. Heck today his policies would be looked at and Judged as a neo-conservative. He hated communism and fought to stop Russia from using Cuba as a missle base so they could black mail us with military threats in the future&#8230;.remember the "Cuban missle Crisis. Thanks to Kennedy we didn't have to face that and thanks to Reagan there is no longer a cold war. JFK, was for tax cuts, a strong military, and did not like socialism or communism.

The Liberal wing of the Democratic party of today practically embraces socialism in its entirety and I have even seen communist like approaches to many of their policies. I even see pro-Castro stuff at protests right next to JFK stuff. These guys

Kennedy would NOT like what he sees in the democrats of today. You guys ever heard of Zell Miller? He is another REAL democrat. He sees John Kerry for what he is&#8230; a panderer. Not saying Bush hasn't pandered mind you. I am a conservative Republican and I have a few beefs with Bush. But overall he is a ton better than anything I've seen from the left in 30 years. The mainstream Democrats don't realize there is a HUGE opportunity to save their party from the wacko's of their fringe groups that keep the party divided.

2.	The Republicans have NOT reduced the size of govt.
Bush and CO. are doing a good Job fighting Terrorism and the war in Iraq is a good thing&#8230;.don't worry, the story isn't finished. WMD's have shown up in every country bordering Iraq, they will trace it. Terrorists DID train in Iraq, Terrorists ARE attacking in Iraq but are slowly being weeded out.

Bush has saved the economy with his tax cut but has also spent more then any president in history. So you can't say his tax cut didn't work but you could say that his spending negated it. BUT&#8230;having said that I would like to have seen another president try to deal with a post 9/11 world without a tax cut&#8230;.what a nightmare it would have been for the middle calss. Sure the left would have said they have a better "balanced budget" but all that means your govt. has more of YOUR money. When I see a deficit I think&#8230;.The govt is being financed as well as it is spending, which mean more people have a % of money then the Govt. does.

All this said, the Republicans can fix their budget problems since they have majority in the senate, unlike the era of Reagan in which Reagan handed the democrats a balanced budget EVERY year but the house voted to undermine his budgets so that they could claim he did a bad job so they could help themselves into power.

Bush is easily the best choice since Reagan, and I haven't seen a REAL democrat since John F Kennedy. If Zell Miller ran I would have no problem with who won the elections because Zell is a democrat in the tradition founding fathers like Jefferson and in more recent times like JFKennedy.

Problem with the Republicans is that they had a clean record for 3 years and now they are trying their hand at medicare and immigration (usually a democrat agenda) and they are doing socialist-lite stuff to medicare and immigration. This immigration policy undermines his own words in National security.

So I am still happy with Bush, but&#8230;Spending, immigration and Medicare policies have created a weak spot&#8230;A tiny spot but one that the democrats can credibly critcize.

Kerry on the other hand is so full of holes I have no problem trying to point out his problems. I wish the left had better candidates. Lieberman was probably the best guy for the left wing party or maybe even Edwards (gah, I usually hate in-experience but in comparison to Dean and Kerry I'll make an exception) but Kerry and Dean just reinforced my prejudices against the left of being too far left to even be asked to have a position of power in the most powerful country in the world.

Kerry flip flops on almost everything he has said.

"I actually did vote for the $87 billion before I voted against it," - Mar. 16, 2004

He actually voted against final - That is an absolute fact. He is lying.

"I voted against that $87 billion in Washington yesterday,"

12 Who Voted Against It:
Boxer (D-CA) Byrd (D-WV) Edwards (D-NC) Graham (D-FL) Harkin (D-IA) Hollings (D-SC) Jeffords (I-VT) Kennedy (D-MA) Kerry (D-MA) Lautenberg (D-NJ) Leahy (D-VT) Sarbanes (D-MD)

"I was very disappointed, in fact I am angry to this day, about the way in which this President turned his back on the legitimate efforts of the U.N....and did not in fact in my judgment, keep his word to the United States Congress and to the American people that he would work through that system in order to try to make war truly a last resort...."

This is a departure from previous statements by Kerry during the Clinton era on UN approval of foreign policy. In a press conference in 1998, Kerry made the case that the United States should have the authority to go it alone when necessary in the best interests of our country. "We have made it exceedingly clear -- and I think Congress will support the president in this -- that the national interests of the United States of America are at stake here, as well as other countries', but that we reserve the right to make judgments about that for ourselves. If there is not unfettered, unrestricted, unlimited access per the U.N. resolution for inspections, and UNSCOM cannot in our judgment appropriately perform its functions, then we obviously reserve the rights to press that case internationally and to do what we need to do as a nation in order to be able to enforce those rights. I agree with that. I think that's the appropriate position."

I could go on all day long. I wish you democrats had a better candidate.

Why?

I actually want Kerry to NOT have had an affair.

Why, as a conservative Republican you ask?

Well, let me give you an example of why I use Noble as my moniker.

I would prefer it that the two political parties in the U.S. retain thier greatest qualities.

I Did Not want Bush to win because Kerry had a scandal.

Thats like winning a race in a formula one when your opponent has a pinto.

I want the Democrats to come out with thier best and thier most honorable politician (haven't seen him yet but I do remember JFK, M.Monroe scandals aside) and I want the highest potential to put our Politician to the test.

This way we can see the best qualities of both parties working to gain the will of the people. This brings out the best in our country.

I do not want to win a vote because we pointed out the democrats weaknesses acting as if we are afraid of letting the people know thier strengths for fear the people may vote for them.....

NO.

I want the people to see the Democrats greatest strengths and qualites and then, ONLY THEN, to be pit against the character and unwavering spirit and unbreakable resolve and morlity and belief in the individuals spirit that the Republican/Conservative stand behind.

Then standing confident with all the best of both sides seen without slant or pander that it be seen and be known that it is still the conservative/republicans that are the better choice for the will of the people and the well being of our great country.

If we lose when all of that is seen then I believe we should lose.

Great thing is that I believe when all of the myths and party spins are gone (I hope to see that some day) I believe the people would choose the republicans in the end by a long shot.

I want Kerry to have a just as good racecar that Bush has. SO people can see Bush is still better on all fronts regardless.

That is my wish for U.S. Politics.


----------



## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

nismo driver said:


> i respect that you have choosen to fight "bush's war" because this is not the a war for the american people.. i have friends in the marines and they are doing what they signed up to do serve our country and doing a damn good job.. however to say that bush is doing an excelent job as president because of "his" war on terror (and any one else he doesnt like) does not make a strong point for what he has done as president.. His primary task should be to improve and maintain our economic situation and safety within the borders of our nation, going after al-Quida in afganastan is justifable, going after iraq was not..
> 
> i appreciate you servering the country but do not agree with the commander in chiefs use of your service.. To say that he is doing a good job because of how he has responded to 9/11 lacks in depth analasys of what he actually has done to our freedoms and the economic situation at home.. his job is not to oust goverments that he doesnt like, america is not the world bully that should go around crushing everyone we dont agree with, if they have something of interest to us like oil. I dont see bush sending troops to nigeria and other african nations with horrible dictatorships that do not take care of there people or promote freedom...
> 
> ...


 point well taken, and you're right, i do seem to lack better reasoning on why i think Bush is doing a fine job. I'll have to come back at you later with my "better reasoning."

one last thing, based on this quote:


> His primary task should be to improve and maintain our economic situation and safety within the borders of our nation, going after al-Quida in afganastan is justifable, going after iraq was not..


....you sound like a democrat. So are you in favor of the republican side or democratic side?


----------



## SERRAPYGO (Feb 4, 2003)

illnino said:


> im 14 so i cant vote, and if there were no presidents i wanted i wouldnt go to vote


 This was all started by a 14yr old?


----------



## kopid_03 (Mar 3, 2004)

a 14 year old is capable of asking a question


----------



## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

kopid_03 said:


> a 14 year old is capable of asking a question


 Theres proof of it too....Look at Sweet Lu!


----------

