# Help, Rhom's tail dissolving apart



## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

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Hey, I have had this guy for about 3 days, he came with a little bit of fin losage, that were a little frayed, now today i saw some skin peeling off, and parts of his anal fin fraying off the back of him as he moved his tail. What could this be?

I have amonia alert, and it read gray ( seachem brand) i guess thats between alert and toxic, the blue and the purple. So I did a 30% water change, not touching the gravel, and then added an aqua clear amonia remover bag into the filter, and threw in some Prime, and Stress Zyme. Hope he gets better now. Will keep you updated.

But any suggestions of what else to do?


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

sorry to hear.. looks to me like fin rot.. there are some great guys in here who can help better than I, so consider my post a *bump*

'cuz you have a great fish, and I would love to see him get healthy again..

Hope all goes well!


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## Grosse Gurke (Jan 3, 2003)

Looks like it could be caused from the ammonia. I would do daily water changes until the tank is cycled....anywhere from 10%-25%....maybe add some salt.


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

Grosse Gurke said:


> Looks like it could be caused from the ammonia. I would do daily water changes until the tank is cycled....anywhere from 10%-25%....maybe add some salt.


But if i put in that stress zyme, which contains bacteria colonies to help speed the rid of amonia... and do a daily water change, wouldnt that just keep taking the bacteria out? I did a 30% about an hour ago, and added all that zyme and Prime to help it out. I thought it would be good now and get rid of the amonia on its own.. Am I wrong?


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## Grosse Gurke (Jan 3, 2003)

I dont know anything about stress zyme, but I doubt it will seed the bacteria you need. The only product I have heard that actually works is biospira...and it is not an instant fix. Also, remove any feeders you have in the tank...if you have any...it will just add ammonia to the tank.


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

I only have about 3 feeders and they are small, I have them in cuz they are eating loose particles of food at the bottom of the tank. I added about 2 teaspoons of salt into the filter now since i did a 30% water change


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## Ex0dus (Jun 29, 2005)

ital1anstallion4 said:


> I only have about 3 feeders and they are small, I have them in cuz they are eating loose particles of food at the bottom of the tank. I added about 2 teaspoons of salt into the filter now since i did a 30% water change


The loose food in the bottom of the tank can be part of the problem man. They break down and mess with water conditions horrible. Its best to let food sit for no longer than 15-10mins. If your tank isnt cycled thats prob the problem with the rhoms tail. Fin rot can happen due to bad water conditions. What kind of filter do you have? It might be a good idea to invest in some biospira to help with your cycle. Also try some pimafix for the tail rot.


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## Winkyee (Feb 17, 2003)

ital1anstallion4 said:


> I only have about 3 feeders and they are small, I have them in cuz they are eating loose particles of food at the bottom of the tank. I added about 2 teaspoons of salt into the filter now since i did a 30% water change


Always pre-dissolve salt before adding to your tank.
Some very nice expensive fish have been lost by not doing this.


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

The filter is a Pennplax concorde 180, I have a quick-clear carbon filter cartridge, that has dacron floss, activated carbon, plastic frame, foam pad, and zeolites all in one cartridge that you slide into the filter. I also put an aqua clear amonia remover bag in the filter before the cartridge. So its right next to the intake, it says "removes and controls harmful amonia" on the box. I havent changed the carbon cartridge yet. Started the tank on about jan. 16th, and havent changed it yet due to bacteria colony loss, i was afraid of that. So its still in place, looks a little dirty.

His fin was already frayed when i got him like i said, and thats only been since this past friday, so I didnt think it could be fin rot, because all the other fish are fine. I thought amonia burn.

The salt i put in the filter before the cartridge, so it gets dissolved fast in there, and then slowly poured in the tank through the filter. I dont think that would be too concentrated to hurt the p.

The API stress Zyme, is similar to biospura i guess. Because it has the whole bacteria thing in it, it helps releive fish stress it says, and it gives them a slimy coat.


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## Ex0dus (Jun 29, 2005)

ital1anstallion4 said:


> The filter is a Pennplax concorde 180, I have a quick-clear carbon filter cartridge, that has dacron floss, activated carbon, plastic frame, foam pad, and zeolites all in one cartridge that you slide into the filter. I also put an aqua clear amonia remover bag in the filter before the cartridge. So its right next to the intake, it says "removes and controls harmful amonia" on the box. I havent changed the carbon cartridge yet. Started the tank on about jan. 16th, and havent changed it yet due to bacteria colony loss, i was afraid of that. So its still in place, looks a little dirty.
> 
> His fin was already frayed when i got him like i said, and thats only been since this past friday, so I didnt think it could be fin rot, because all the other fish are fine. I thought amonia burn.
> 
> ...


Im honestly not familiar with your filter at all. It sounds like a wisper cartridge filter. The problem with these is when you change the cartridges, you are rmeoving any bacteria that built up there. Sometime down the road, sooner than later, you might want to invest in a ac filter. The model will depend on your tank size of course. Carbon is the filter isnt necessary unless your removing medication or have it in there to fight the 'uncycled tank smell'. The zeolite as well is not worth the extra money it costs. Nothing can beat a properly cycled tank imo. His fins were prob frayed when you got him die to stress. If they are gettign worse thats a bad sign. 
API stress zyme is nothing like bio spira. BTW, what are your tank readings?


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

Ex0dus said:


> The filter is a Pennplax concorde 180, I have a quick-clear carbon filter cartridge, that has dacron floss, activated carbon, plastic frame, foam pad, and zeolites all in one cartridge that you slide into the filter. I also put an aqua clear amonia remover bag in the filter before the cartridge. So its right next to the intake, it says "removes and controls harmful amonia" on the box. I havent changed the carbon cartridge yet. Started the tank on about jan. 16th, and havent changed it yet due to bacteria colony loss, i was afraid of that. So its still in place, looks a little dirty.
> 
> His fin was already frayed when i got him like i said, and thats only been since this past friday, so I didnt think it could be fin rot, because all the other fish are fine. I thought amonia burn.
> 
> ...


Im honestly not familiar with your filter at all. It sounds like a wisper cartridge filter. The problem with these is when you change the cartridges, you are rmeoving any bacteria that built up there. Sometime down the road, sooner than later, you might want to invest in a ac filter. The model will depend on your tank size of course. Carbon is the filter isnt necessary unless your removing medication or have it in there to fight the 'uncycled tank smell'. The zeolite as well is not worth the extra money it costs. Nothing can beat a properly cycled tank imo. His fins were prob frayed when you got him die to stress. If they are gettign worse thats a bad sign. 
API stress zyme is nothing like bio spira. BTW, what are your tank readings?
[/quote]

hey thanks, I dont know the nitrite, nitrate readings. BUt PH is 6.9, temp is 82F, and the amonia was high earlier today according to that meter. Which says that means its .5ml of bad amonia. I need a good nitrite nitrate and amonia test kit. Does anyone know a good cheap one to buy? The ones I see are like $40 and test for all kinds of sh*t i dont even need. Plus they dont last long, and then u have to replace them.


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## Ex0dus (Jun 29, 2005)

ital1anstallion4 said:


> The filter is a Pennplax concorde 180, I have a quick-clear carbon filter cartridge, that has dacron floss, activated carbon, plastic frame, foam pad, and zeolites all in one cartridge that you slide into the filter. I also put an aqua clear amonia remover bag in the filter before the cartridge. So its right next to the intake, it says "removes and controls harmful amonia" on the box. I havent changed the carbon cartridge yet. Started the tank on about jan. 16th, and havent changed it yet due to bacteria colony loss, i was afraid of that. So its still in place, looks a little dirty.
> 
> His fin was already frayed when i got him like i said, and thats only been since this past friday, so I didnt think it could be fin rot, because all the other fish are fine. I thought amonia burn.
> 
> ...


Im honestly not familiar with your filter at all. It sounds like a wisper cartridge filter. The problem with these is when you change the cartridges, you are rmeoving any bacteria that built up there. Sometime down the road, sooner than later, you might want to invest in a ac filter. The model will depend on your tank size of course. Carbon is the filter isnt necessary unless your removing medication or have it in there to fight the 'uncycled tank smell'. The zeolite as well is not worth the extra money it costs. Nothing can beat a properly cycled tank imo. His fins were prob frayed when you got him die to stress. If they are gettign worse thats a bad sign. 
API stress zyme is nothing like bio spira. BTW, what are your tank readings?
[/quote]

hey thanks, I dont know the nitrite, nitrate readings. BUt PH is 6.9, temp is 82F, and the amonia was high earlier today according to that meter. Which says that means its .5ml of bad amonia. I need a good nitrite nitrate and amonia test kit. Does anyone know a good cheap one to buy? The ones I see are like $40 and test for all kinds of sh*t i dont even need. Plus they dont last long, and then u have to replace them.
[/quote]

you have a petsmart near you? print off a price online for a master test kit and bring it in for them to price match. bigals has a sale right now on one, like 12.99 its like 34$ at petsmart.


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

Yeah I have a petsmart and a petco near me. What site do I go to for the price for the test kit to print out?


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## Ex0dus (Jun 29, 2005)

www.bigalsonline.com


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

Thanks, I bet the petsmart I go to wont even have the right test kit. lol

and heres a link to my filter set-up. The cartridge system.

http://www.bigalsonline.com/catalog/catego...ategory_id=2597


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## Ex0dus (Jun 29, 2005)

http://www.bigalsonline.com/catalog/produc...id1=3233;pcid2=

^^is the test kit that petsmart should have

while your at it might wanna think about upgrading the filter to maybe a aquaclear. What size tank is it? 40-45gal?

http://www.bigalsonline.com/catalog/produc...id1=2885;pcid2=


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

I pretty much have the same filter as that aqua clear. Its a 40 gal tank, and the filter moves the water fine, its just a little old, never used though, this is first time. It works the same as any aqua clear, What I want to do is get a bag of bio media to throw in the filter as well as the fitler carbon cartridges.


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

Well the rhom looks a little better now, he still hasnt eaten anything at all. But when a fish swims in front of his mouth, he bites at it, and the fish swims away.. good sign i guess


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

alright he ate 2 feeder fish last night, there are only 2 more in the tank, and when they get near him he chases after them. Getting better, Im gonna look for that test kit today


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## sassyO (Jan 30, 2006)

I got my test kit at bigals....its called freshwater master test kit. It has everything you need 1. Nitrite test 2bottles for the Nitrate test 2 bottles for the ammonia test and a ph test as well as a high rate ph test which our guys like the higher range. This test kit is great with the instructions and also information of what to do if the parameters are not what you need. This kit cost 34.99CDA. Like the man says, there is nothing better then a good cycled tank for your fishes health and well being.
Also, give the guy some Melafix it will help the healing.
You can spend so much money on getting things you don't need or that don't help. V


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

Hey here are the tank params. 40 gal, temp. 81F, ph 7.8, amonia 4ppm, nitrite 0.25ppm, nitrate 10ppm.

I did a 30% water change yesterday. And added some stress zyme, and prime to help the amonia. Just bought a bio media package today and threw that in the filter, along with amonia remover filter insert by aquaclear. Hopefully this cleans things up. .. Any other suggestions on what to do to help the tank?


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## Grosse Gurke (Jan 3, 2003)

More water changes.


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

did another water change, and the readings are the same. .25 ppm nitrites, and 4-8 ppm amonia. rhom seems to act normal.

Now when i did the water change the amonia alert thing in the corner of the tank read no amonia, then after a few hours of cylcing it went back to toxic... so i dunno what the hell is going on ... more water changes? I dont want to stress the fish out anymore he just got here, hes starting to act like a piranha, and now im water changing his home around.

Anything else i can do? I was thinking just let it go, add some more amonia remover, and let it chill... what do you guys think?


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

alright, this morning the rhoms tail was completely dissolved to a stubble, the top and bottom part of his back tail fin are gone, i thought it was healing, i dunno what to do, he seems fine. Should i get that stuff that heals your fish? i did put salt in the water after the 30% change again last night


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## Ex0dus (Jun 29, 2005)

ital1anstallion4 said:


> alright, this morning the rhoms tail was completely dissolved to a stubble, the top and bottom part of his back tail fin are gone, i thought it was healing, i dunno what to do, he seems fine. Should i get that stuff that heals your fish? i did put salt in the water after the 30% change again last night


Things sound very very serious. Im betting its from the ammonia. How do his eyes look? ammo lock will detox the ammonia but you still need to stay on top of water changes. do several small water changes to get the toxins readings down.


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

his eyes arent cloudy at all, they are crystal clear, as well as my water, its the clearest ive ever seen it, prefect crystal, and hes swimming around checking the tank out. So he doesnt seem in distress. Im using Seachem's Prime... to detox the amonia... is this a good product or should i get that ammo lock? i will do another water change later this evening.. thanks though exodus.. your a big help


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## piranha_guy_dan (Oct 4, 2004)

i suggest using a gravel vac while you change the water. i never just change the water............ i always gravel vac while its changing the water. its doing no good leaving the sh*t and uneatten food under and in the gravel to create the amonia. you have to get rid of the source so vaccum your gravel dont just change some water


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

still getting 4.0 readings for amonia... gonna get a gravel vac, some amonia detox, and fin and tail rot medicine, then do the gravel vac, add stress, detox and the medicine, and see what that does for me...

i was told by my friend to vacum half the gravel on the bottom, like the front half, and then next week or so vacum the other half...

what do you think?


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## piranha_guy_dan (Oct 4, 2004)

do all of it at once............. just plunge it down into the gravel let it suck the sh*t til its clear water then suck another spot.......

i suggest doing it all at once..... no need for only doing bits at a time.


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

cool thanks ill give it a try soon


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

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alright I dont know if you can see this, but his anal fin is starting to heal... his tail fin deteriated a little more, but he is very active and shows signs of progressive healing on the other parts of his body... I just hope the tail fin starts to heal, its down to a little stubble for a tail... lol

hes seems very hungry, eats about 5 feeders a day. So i stopped with the feeders, and i will start shrimp in a day or two, and then gravel vac the bitch out.... lemme know what you think


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## piranha_guy_dan (Oct 4, 2004)

fin and tail rot. good thing on stopping the feeders.


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

alright, vacumed the tank with the gravel rock, added some stress zyme, prime, and melafix. to the tank and help the piranha heal. that melafix sh*t smells strong.

checked amonia its now between 2-4 ppm

ill check again tomm.


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## ital1anstallion4 (Jan 27, 2006)

alright checked again today.. Rhoms tail is healing up nicely since i added that melafix...

amonia: 2ppm
ph: 7.0
nitrites: .1ppm

ill check in about 3 more days and see what happens

Im not gonna bother checking the nitrates for about a week, because as long as I have amonia thast not a problem right?


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