# Poll on the debate last night.



## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Who do you think came accross better, not who are you voting for.


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## Jewelz (Feb 24, 2004)

Kerry


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

I think Kerry too... but the debate really didnt allow for both sides to express total opinions...

it seemed that Bush was frustrated because of having to force the debater to give him time to respond... or even a chance to respond at all to kerry's accusations...

I dont think it was well setup this time


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

I had class during the debate, so I missed it


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

I didnt like bush going "Ugh, Uh, Um, or ...."


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

hes not a good speaker... every Bush supporter would have told you that...


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## User (May 31, 2004)

No doubt, Kerry did.


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## CraigStables (Oct 5, 2003)

I stayed upto watch it (3am over here in the UK), god knows why but I did!

And as a total neutral I think Bush came accross better. OK, he isnt as good as Kerry at making his point, he stops and seems to blank out every so often. But what he does say normally makes sense and answers the question. Where as Kerry seemed to dodge the harder questions, and just lay more accusations on Bush!


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## Jewelz (Feb 24, 2004)

CraigStables said:


> I stayed upto watch it (3am over here in the UK), god knows why but I did!
> 
> And as a total neutral I think Bush came accross better. OK, he isnt as good as Kerry at making his point, he stops and seems to blank out every so often. But what he does say normally makes sense and answers the question. Where as Kerry seemed to dodge the harder questions, and just lay more accusations on Bush!


 substance vs. style

but in these debates, style counts as much as anything


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## CraigStables (Oct 5, 2003)

Jewelz said:


> but in these debates, style counts as much as anything


 depends who it is watching, although I do agree with you!

To some people it would seem that Bush was struggling to answer questions, etc. And Kerry was calm and composed, but if you listened to what was said Kerry just seemed to say what he thought would be popular, and contrdicted himself a number of times!


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

CraigStables said:


> Jewelz said:
> 
> 
> > but in these debates, style counts as much as anything
> ...


 did he really?

like when? can you provide an example?


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## User (May 31, 2004)

It was Bush's body language, he was clearly upset with some of Kerrys comments. On the other hand, Kerry smilied everytime Bush said something bad about him.

But still winning the debate does very little, you must win the election.


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## Winkyee (Feb 17, 2003)

Kerry just told the truth .









Bush... He couldn't keep his lies straight.

"There's an old saying in Tennessee - I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee - that says, fool me once, shame on - shame on you. Fool me - you can't get fooled again." -George W. Bush, Nashville, Tenn., Sept. 17, 2002


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## Phtstrat (Sep 15, 2004)

I'm Republican, but do not believe in Bush. He is a horrible speaker, constantly an "um, ugh, hmm"'er. In addition, his eyes are constantly blinking, which makes it uncomfortable to listen to him.


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

Phtstrat said:


> I'm Republican, but do not believe in Bush. He is a horrible speaker, constantly an "um, ugh, hmm"'er. In addition, his eyes are constantly blinking, which makes it uncomfortable to listen to him.


 Im Republican also... but gonna vote dem this time...


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

You guys are liberals at heart, admit it


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## TommyBlaze (Jan 16, 2004)

All kerry can do is bash bush. He has no substance no character, kerry is a fair weather fan. Ask your self this before the election will you vote for the same person a terrorist would vote for? DONT VOTE FOR KERRY BECAUSE YOU DONT LIKE BUSH!!!!!!!! If you are going to vote for Kerry regardless give yourself a reason to. Do you really think Kerry will be good for this country?


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## seharebo (Jul 19, 2004)

I am a Republican as well and Bush leaves me no alternative than to vote for Kerry. Besides, Kerry is a very conservative Democrat.


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## TommyBlaze (Jan 16, 2004)

That is the worst reasoning for kerry to be president!!!!!







Terrorist will be licking there chops if kerry becomes president, go ahead and vote for the same person a terrorist would.


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## seharebo (Jul 19, 2004)

TommyBlaze said:


> That is the worst reasoning for kerry to be president!!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Not the worst considering I believe that Kerry is the stronger of the two and will fix or world reputation and the mess we are in with Iraq. Not to mention, awknowledging the issues with N.Korea. The worst reason to vote for Bush is just because you are a Republican.

Don't worry:


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## aaron07_20 (Apr 23, 2004)

My whole family are republicans, they all voted for Bush for his 1st term..but after the war in iraq everyone is voting for kerry..he obviously can handle it better...


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

aaron07_20 said:


> My whole family are republicans, they all voted for Bush for his 1st term..but after the war in iraq everyone is voting for kerry..he obviously can handle it better...


What a joke!


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## TommyBlaze (Jan 16, 2004)

Fix our world reputation? Again showing kerry is about being liked and not about what is right. Iam not republican, democrat, or liberal. Kerry just doesnt have the guts or conviction to stand up for what is right. Oh and did anybody else notice in the debate that kerry said he would disarm our nuclear bombs?...................If thats not enough not to vote for kerry I dont know what is then


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## seharebo (Jul 19, 2004)

That's not being a waffler Ms Natt....it is having the intellect to realize that when something isn't work it needs to change. If voting Republican is going to work for one this election, because of the candidate, than so be it. Stupidity is voting for someone just because they are either a Democrat or a Republican. Just because you affiliate yourself with one party's core values does not mean that you are forced to vote for that person soley based on the fact that the represent the Republican Party. That is idiocy.


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

seharebo said:


> That's not being a waffler Ms Natt....it is having the intellect to realize that when something isn't work it needs to change. If voting Republican is going to work for one this election, because of the candidate, than so be it. Stupidity is voting for someone just because they are either a Democrat or a Republican. Just because you affiliate yourself with one party's core values does not mean that you are forced to vote for that person soley based on the fact that the represent the Republican Party. That is idiocy.


 that is 100% accurate!

I voted for dubya the first time around because i am a republican... but now... i see my mistake... and while im still a repub... i will vote dem.


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## Jewelz (Feb 24, 2004)

seharebo said:


> That's not being a waffler Ms Natt....it is having the intellect to realize that when something isn't work it needs to change. If voting Republican is going to work for one this election, because of the candidate, than so be it. Stupidity is voting for someone just because they are either a Democrat or a Republican. Just because you affiliate yourself with one party's core values does not mean that you are forced to vote for that person soley based on the fact that the represent the Republican Party. That is idiocy.


 I don't disagree, I've voted for Clinton AND Gore - this will be the first time I am voting Republican


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## LEON (Dec 5, 2003)

WOW. Someone said Kerry is a conservative Dem. This could not be further from the truth!!!!

He is one of the most liberal Dems in Wahington.

Last night he was making empty promises on fixing all the worlds problems without any detailed plan to do so other then saying I'll do it better.

His statement about getting troops out in 6 months is both ingenuine and irresponsible. How could you make such a blanket statement like that. He says that he would only do that if everything went according to his plan "DUH", it was a foolish empty promise. Typical of his trying to appeal to both pro-war and anti-war, but a statement that can't be supported by reality.

His attacks on home land defense were also hollow promises (borders, cargo containers, police and fire). The situation is much more complex then he makes it out to be such as the economic considerations. He is the ultimate critic who points out were the great man stumbles, but he can't come up with a detailed plan to explain how he is going to come through on all his promises.


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

seharebo said:


> Stupidity is voting for someone just because they are either a Democrat or a Republican.


 I agree with that statement.

I meant waffles with this definition:


UrbanDictionary.com said:


> 1. waffles
> 
> a bastardization of roofles, which is a bastardization of rofl, which means rolling on floor laughing


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

style-kerry

reality-bush

winner-bush

almost everything kerry spoke of was contradicting himself of his own views.

Not more than 30 days ago he said the first thing he is going to do if he wins is pull all of the troops out of iraq. now he wants to stay there. Whats he going to do 30 days from now??? There was so many other things that were either total B/S or a flip-flop of what he was saying he wanted to do in the past. Ive said it to many people before, Bush is not the man that we need him to be but he is by far the best from who we have to choose from. Kerry is just plain dangerous.


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

LEON said:


> WOW. Someone said Kerry is a conservative Dem. This could not be further from the truth!!!!
> 
> He is one of the most liberal Dems in Wahington.
> 
> ...


 well also, you can expect any of the candidates to have fully answered any question with the given time limits...

All they can do is promise... bush did not get into any detail either... no time...


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## seharebo (Jul 19, 2004)

LEON said:


> WOW. Someone said Kerry is a conservative Dem. This could not be further from the truth!!!!
> 
> He is one of the most liberal Dems in Wahington.
> 
> ...


 I don't get how this makes him a liberal dem?


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

"A Bush proposal to weaken clean-air rules would put three times more mercury into our air and water than existing rules would allow. One in six women has enough mercury in her system to risk her kid having brain damage, mental retardation, blindness, seizures, and speech impediments."

I dont know but it seems to me that every chance Bush gets he tries to help out his oil family business and doesnt care about the enviroment at all.


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

that is another reason i say Kerry 04


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

Another b/s statment was that kerry said that it was wrong to send troops into iraq without proper weapons and body armor (not sure if that is exactly how he worded it) but how can he say this if he voted against funding to give the troops better weapons and body armor?


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

dood... its hard to fix another man's mistake of starting a war...


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

: Claimed "I've Had One Position, One Consistent Position, That Saddam Hussein Was A Threat." (Sen. John Kerry, First Presidential Debate, Miami, FL, 9/30/04)

ü Kerry Said, "We Now Know That Iraq Had No Weapons Of Mass Destruction, And Posed No Imminent Threat To Our Security." (Sen. John Kerry, Remarks At New York University, New York, NY, 9/20/04)

Claimed "My Position Has Been Consistent: Saddam Hussein Is A Threat. He Needed To Be Disarmed." (Sen. John Kerry, First Presidential Debate, Miami, FL, 9/30/04)

ü "Saying There Are Weapons Of Mass Destruction In Iraq Doesn't Make It So." (Sen. John Kerry, Remarks To Democrat National Convention, Boston, MA, 7/29/04)

ü "I Have Always Said We May Yet Even Find Weapons Of Mass Destruction." (Fox News' "Fox News Sunday," 12/14/03)


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

all that says is... Saddam is a threat... and we need proof of the weapons to enter iraq...


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

How about Bush-Lying, Denying, Censoring, etc....

"If global warming makes you nervous, well, ignore it. That's exactly what Bush's EPA did when it sliced a whole chapter on climate change from its 2002 annual report on pollution.

There was plenty of practice for denial and deletion, the most notorious case being just after the attack on the World Trade Center. The EPA found levels of asbestos and other pollution thousands of times above normal around the disaster site. But the White House ordered the agency to announce that it was safe."


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

> dood... its hard to fix another man's mistake of starting a war...


I dont believe the war is a mistake, I do believe it alot harder than what it was expected to be. It would be alot easier if it wern't for libs crying over every single mistake or casuality of war that happens, what we need to do is step up the aggression and say to hell with giving a dam if we blow up a church or worring about how we treat prisoners of war. This would also save american lives. If there is one thing I dont agree with bush its how big of a sissy he is being about not totally destroying these towns that are filled with the enemy. We have the capability to do it, I only hope if he is re-elected he does this.


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

> If global warming makes you nervous, well, ignore it. That's exactly what Bush's EPA did when it sliced a whole chapter on climate change from its 2002 annual report on pollution.


Global warming is utter nonsence. This planet went through global warming and ice ages and every other natural desaster many times long before humans were on this planet, and it will happen again regardless of what we do.


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

what if there are innocent children there? you would just kill them too?

Im glad you arent in command... sh*t... why dont we just nuke them... right???


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## Jewelz (Feb 24, 2004)

I think in the next debate, Kerry should be allowed at least twice as much time to answer questions - you know, so he can speak for all of his numerous positions/viewpoints on each issue


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

rbp75 said:


> > dood... its hard to fix another man's mistake of starting a war...
> 
> 
> I dont believe the war is a mistake, I do believe it alot harder than what it was expected to be. It would be alot easier if it wern't for libs crying over every single mistake or casuality of war that happens, what we need to do is step up the aggression and say to hell with giving a dam if we blow up a church or worring about how we treat prisoners of war. This would also save american lives. If there is one thing I dont agree with bush its how big of a sissy he is being about not totally destroying these towns that are filled with the enemy. We have the capability to do it, I only hope if he is re-elected he does this.


 Wow you are a REAL American arn't YA! YEE HAW lets just bomb all those people who cares about them damned innocent women and KIDS--HAW??







Oh and you want to save American lives? Maybe if we never got into the useless war which still doesn't have a point. Sadamn was contained in his little area for damn 10 years and we go and stir up sh*t. Treating POWs good huh? SO you don't care about how they are treated, what about how American POWs are treated, ohhhh sorry didn't mean to bring up the double standard. I believe all this war has done is invite religious groups and terrorist groups to take over the country.


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

> Wow you are a REAL American arn't YA! YEE HAW lets just bomb all those people who cares about them damned innocent women and KIDS--HAW?? Oh and you want to save American lives? Maybe if we never got into the useless war which still doesn't have a point. Sadamn was contained in his little area for damn 10 years and we go and stir up sh*t. Treating POWs good huh? SO you don't care about how they are treated, what about how American POWs are treated, ohhhh sorry didn't mean to bring up the double standard. I believe all this war has done is invite religious groups and terrorist groups to take over the country.


Im glad you see it my way!!

It worked for ww II


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## Atlanta Braves Baby! (Mar 12, 2003)

Kerry owned Bush in thar debate as I firgured he would.


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

Sorry I left out a REAL flip flop from Bush.

"Nobody much likes sewage, except maybe sewer rats or those albino mutant lizards they say inhabit the pipes. So why did Bush, on his inauguration day, rescind a rule to cut down on sewage dumping? And then he goes from belly flop to flip-flop. First, Bush whacked a new regulation to reduce the arsenic in drinking water. A few months later--after a public outcry--he agreed to cut arsenic down to the same limits they have in Old Europe."

I guess Bush might be a bit of a flopper?


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

rbp75 said:


> > Wow you are a REAL American arn't YA! YEE HAW lets just bomb all those people who cares about them damned innocent women and KIDS--HAW?? Oh and you want to save American lives? Maybe if we never got into the useless war which still doesn't have a point. Sadamn was contained in his little area for damn 10 years and we go and stir up sh*t. Treating POWs good huh? SO you don't care about how they are treated, what about how American POWs are treated, ohhhh sorry didn't mean to bring up the double standard. I believe all this war has done is invite religious groups and terrorist groups to take over the country.
> 
> 
> Im glad you see it my way!!
> ...


 it didnt work... it was a mistake...


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

> what if there are innocent children there? you would just kill them too?
> 
> Im glad you arent in command... sh*t... why dont we just nuke them... right???


I dont believe in killing inocent people men,women,children. But after what happened today apparently the terrorist dont care about who they kill. watch the news.


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

> QUOTE (rbp75 @ Oct 1 2004, 02:34 PM)
> QUOTE
> Wow you are a REAL American arn't YA! YEE HAW lets just bomb all those people who cares about them damned innocent women and KIDS--HAW?? Oh and you want to save American lives? Maybe if we never got into the useless war which still doesn't have a point. Sadamn was contained in his little area for damn 10 years and we go and stir up sh*t. Treating POWs good huh? SO you don't care about how they are treated, what about how American POWs are treated, ohhhh sorry didn't mean to bring up the double standard. I believe all this war has done is invite religious groups and terrorist groups to take over the country.
> 
> ...


It ended the war. It worked.


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

it was not the right way to do things... only an ignorant person would say it was the right thing to do!


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

rbp75 said:


> > what if there are innocent children there? you would just kill them too?
> >
> > Im glad you arent in command... sh*t... why dont we just nuke them... right???
> 
> ...


 So should the United States armed forces and the Commander In Chief act like Terrorists?


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

> it was not the right way to do things... only an ignorant person would say it was the right thing to do!


ok your right it was not the right thing to do but it was effective.

Im not saying nuke everything, there are other powerfull weapons we have that we can use. And im not saying bomb innocent people.when we started the war with alqueda in afgan when the terrerist were hiding behind innocent people like cowards just like the terrorist are doing in iraq we dropped fliers saying this town will be bombed, you have this many days to evacuate, and then they flattened it.
Much more effective than sending troops into their terratory where terrorists can shoot and bomb anybody they want without careing who they kill.


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

> So should the United States armed forces and the Commander In Chief act like Terrorists


No but as I said there are more effective ways than sending troops into harms way.


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

rbp75 said:


> > So should the United States armed forces and the Commander In Chief act like Terrorists
> 
> 
> No but as I said there are more effective ways than sending troops into harms way.


 Sending Troops in harms way is the Bush way


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

> QUOTE
> So should the United States armed forces and the Commander In Chief act like Terrorists
> 
> No but as I said there are more effective ways than sending troops into harms way.
> ...


Well its either the bush way, the way I said it should be or the kerry way, ask the terrorists if they would be so kind to stop bombing our buildings.


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## MistaFishPimp05 (Jul 28, 2004)

I am definately in Bush's corner but he did not do well at al last night....he barely answered the questions asked "first I'll answer this question.." was not uncommon to here from him. He also stuttered, stammered and made stupid faces throughout the debate. Kerry was very cool, calm and collected throughout the debate but i still would not want him as a President


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

Alquida (spelling?) was responsible for our buildings, not Iraq, Bush has said this many times.


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

Filo said:


> Alquida (spelling?) was responsible for our buildings, not Iraq, Bush has said this many times.


 yeah... WTF are we doing in Iraq???!?!?!?


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

> yeah... WTF are we doing in Iraq???!?!?!?


Alqada is mostly non-existant, with the exception of OBL we have or killed most of the top alquada assholes. Iraq is the was the next in line and will not be the last.
George bush said in the beginning this is a war with terrorist, there were terrorist 
and terrorist supporters in Iraq, thats what we are doing in Iraq. And I hope you dont expect that they will be the last.


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## aaron07_20 (Apr 23, 2004)

I love how kerry said that by going after Iraq after 9/11 is like going after mexico after the attack on pearl harbor...it is sooo tru....Bush just can't admit that he screwed up..


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

he didnt screw up... it was planned that way he can help his buddies in the oil industry...

Hence... only oil refineries were protected...


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

> love how kerry said that by going after Iraq after 9/11 is like going after mexico after the attack on pearl harbor...it is sooo tru....Bush just can't admit that he screwed up.


well unless my history is bad I dont remember hearing that mexico ever harbored or supported any japanese during pearl harbor. so no thats not true.


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## Rigor_mortiZ_Rhom (Dec 21, 2003)

wait a minute.. how do you know....??? maybe mexico has Nuclear bombs... we should go and blow them up... lol


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

> wait a minute.. how do you know....??? maybe mexico has Nuclear bombs... we should go and blow them up... lol


whirllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll,,,, KABOOM!!!! Anyone want want some authentic mexican chili.


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## Liquid (Aug 24, 2004)

TommyBlaze said:


> All kerry can do is bash bush. He has no substance no character, kerry is a fair weather fan. Ask your self this before the election will you vote for the same person a terrorist would vote for? DONT VOTE FOR KERRY BECAUSE YOU DONT LIKE BUSH!!!!!!!! If you are going to vote for Kerry regardless give yourself a reason to. Do you really think Kerry will be good for this country?


 and bush didn't bash kerry before the debate








i like that..kerry waited till the debate to bash him to his face so he couldn't hide behind the people in charge of his campaign, and all good ol bush could do is repeat his campaign slogans and ssstuhtuhtuh i say ssstuhtuh i say ssssssstudder like a jack ass


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## ChErRiEliPz510 (Nov 17, 2003)

Bush: " uh...uh.... terriost...blah blah blah...uh...uh


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## Jewelz (Feb 24, 2004)

if y'all are so opposed to war in Iraq, you must really hate Kerry. Kerry was for the war and Kerry suggested that we go disarm Saddam waaaay before Bush was president.. on more than one ocassion


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

Hey Filo, join the Green Party already


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

Jewelz said:


> if y'all are so opposed to war in Iraq, you must really hate Kerry. Kerry was for the war and Kerry suggested that we go disarm Saddam waaaay before Bush was president.. on more than one ocassion


 Ohhh but dont forget its okay to change your mind as many times as you want as long as its what the people want :laugh:


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## MR.FREEZ (Jan 26, 2004)




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## Jewelz (Feb 24, 2004)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> Jewelz said:
> 
> 
> > if y'all are so opposed to war in Iraq, you must really hate Kerry. Kerry was for the war and Kerry suggested that we go disarm Saddam waaaay before Bush was president.. on more than one ocassion
> ...


Kerry ? change his mind ? no freakin way.. seems like such a decisive man with strong leadership abilities to me :laugh:


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## Liquid (Aug 24, 2004)

Jewelz said:


> if y'all are so opposed to war in Iraq, you must really hate Kerry. Kerry was for the war and Kerry suggested that we go disarm Saddam waaaay before Bush was president.. on more than one ocassion


 kerry also said what anyone with a brain cell left would agree on that yes, we have to finish what we started and we can count on him, who on the record has never been recorded mia dureing a crisis or chokeing when the pressure is on, to finish this war in iraq in a civilized fashion, while at the same time instead of leaveing the true threat of north korea up to china to fix the problem he will personally enter bilateral negotiations with n.korea to dim the hostile flame that they and everyone else outside of tony blair has for us which is a step in the right direction, kerry can be counted on and bush cannot and he showed that last night when he was confronted with the issues at hand


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

> kerry also said what anyone with a brain cell left would agree on that yes, we have to finish what we started and we can count on him


Wait two weeks he'll change his mind/


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## illnino (Mar 6, 2004)

bush didnt have his sh*t togeather, he had to scramble and think of answers fast, and when some question was asked conserning global something, kerry answered it, and then bush had no clue what the question was, and when bush said he wanted to get rid of all nuclear weapons, but us still has a lot....

bush really didnt have his sh*t togeather for that when he shouldhave cause that is basically what decides the undecided voters.


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## Liquid (Aug 24, 2004)

when bush was asked about n.koreas nuclear weapons, his responce was...we're gonna stay out of that and let china deal with it...what the hell is that...we declare war on iraq because we were suspicious that they had wmd's, but we ignore n.korea who is known for its wmds, and we're not talking mustard gas here...you can't see the contradiction?? I know some of you are hard up for bush, but please, for one second try and look at this with out being a republican or a democrate and then make an unbiased decision. not for the democrates or the republicans but for the future and how dangerous it will be if we continue to isolate ourselves. if we are not going physically remove and shutdown n.korea or irans nuclear facilities, the worst thing we could do, is ignore them and turn our back, our countries representatives have to personally negotiate with them so at least we can get on the same page, but to ignore them?? call them names like evil then turn our back and leave it up to anouther country who can barley take care of themselves to put the pressure on them?? i can't believe people support this, its like the friggin twilight zone.


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> Hey Filo, join the Green Party already


 I guess you like paying for this

"Polluter Pays? Not Anymore.

"You make a mess, you clean it up." That's what the Superfund law intended when President Carter signed it in 1980 to clean up the nation's worst toxic messes. But the current Bush administration has broken with more than two decades of policy and rejected the principle of "polluter pays." In 1995, taxpayers paid 18 percent of the cost of cleaning up abandoned toxic waste sites. In 2004, taxpayers will foot the entire bill.3 Under the Bush administration, Superfund site cleanups have fallen to fewer than 50 sites a year compared with more than 80 sites per year during the 1990s.4 One in four Americans lives within a short bicycle ride of a Superfund site.5 "

Its nice to see people dont care where their $ goes. But I do


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## diddye (Feb 22, 2004)

this is a global war on terrrorism...we send troops all over the world, not just iraq to fight terrorism. Ya, there are no terrorists in iraq...just iran, jordan, saudi arabia, kuwait, palestine, egypt....everywhere but iraq. Kerry talks big....saying iran and n.korea are threats. How many here who support kerry will support him if he goes to war w/ either of them? Aaron? Rigor? Filo? Seharebo? Thought so.


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

Unlike Bush, Kerry is big on hoping to work with the UN. I doubt without hardcore evidence of a huge threat, the UN would approve. I also doubt Kerry would start an unprovoked war.


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## Liquid (Aug 24, 2004)

rbp75 said:


> > yeah... WTF are we doing in Iraq???!?!?!?
> 
> 
> Alqada is mostly non-existant, with the exception of OBL we have or killed most of the top alquada assholes. Iraq is the was the next in line and will not be the last.
> ...


name 1 terrorist they caught in iraq before the war, name one thing iraq did on record that supported terrorist, please post facts.....:sarcastic: besides that time at band camp when we funded/supported saddam to drop mustard gas on iranians and his own people.
p.s non existent eh???


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

Filo said:


> I also doubt Kerry would start an unprovoked war.


 Your right! Hed declare it about 10 different times...each time taking it back!


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

Liquid said:


> rbp75 said:
> 
> 
> > > yeah... WTF are we doing in Iraq???!?!?!?
> ...


 Are you saying the war in Iraq wasnt needed?


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## Winkyee (Feb 17, 2003)

So to this point 12 said Bush did better.
What debate were you watching ??


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## Liquid (Aug 24, 2004)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> Liquid said:
> 
> 
> > rbp75 said:
> ...


indeed, ive already stated on anouther post that i disagreed with both kerry and bush on iraq and the war in iraq was uncalled for, its ust too bad we found that out after we already invaded, not one terrorist that have commited maor terrorist attacks have been from iraq, i know of none that declare iraq as thier home, after we invaded we caught not one terrorist liveing in iraq untill after they moved there after we invaded to recruit iraqis based on thier new found hatred for the u.s. we did the real terrorist a favor and opened the door to iraq for them. now they have a reason to recruit iraqis.....uhhhh because we kill thousands of thier women and children a day.


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## Liquid (Aug 24, 2004)

winkyee said:


> So to this point 12 said Bush did better.
> What debate were you watching ??


 the one on fox


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## diddye (Feb 22, 2004)

i think kerry was a better speaker and was better imagewise...but george's message was more clear. Kerry was even criticized last night for his additional flip flops. i bet nobody here can state kerrys position on iraq....anybody? Whats his view of iraq??? BTW liquid, one ex. of of saddam was when he paid families of suicide palestiaian bombers....and i beleive an embassy bombing. Forget which one.


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## Liquid (Aug 24, 2004)

diddye said:


> i think kerry was a better speaker and was better imagewise...but george's message was more clear. Kerry was even criticized last night for his additional flip flops. i bet nobody here can state kerrys position on iraq....anybody? Whats his view of iraq??? BTW liquid, one ex. of of saddam was when he paid families of suicide palestiaian bombers....and i beleive an embassy bombing. Forget which one.


 pleas epost links if you have the time.


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

Liquid said:


> Ms_Nattereri said:
> 
> 
> > Liquid said:
> ...


 Saddam didnt live in Iraq before the war







Bush said we went to war because of Saddam and his WMD, do you doubt he had any?!

Because I have several quotes from several different people on both parties [Democrat and Republican] who will say that he had WMD. Mind you chemical weapons is also consider a WMD, in which case, did he not use them against the Kurds?!









Just because we didnt find them, doesnt mean he didnt have them! Everyone from President Clinton to different National Security Advisors to even *KERRY* said he had WMD and that we need to disarm him.


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## Liquid (Aug 24, 2004)

Liquid said:


> diddye said:
> 
> 
> > i think kerry was a better speaker and was better imagewise...but george's message was more clear. Kerry was even criticized last night for his additional flip flops. i bet nobody here can state kerrys position on iraq....anybody? Whats his view of iraq??? BTW liquid, one ex. of of saddam was when he paid families of suicide palestiaian bombers....and i beleive an embassy bombing. Forget which one.
> ...


 to fight a smarter war, to mend some of our international ties so we can get the support we need from alot more countries, isolate the al queda/taliban threat other then allow them al queda to turn this into a religous war, which btw we encouraged by declareing war on a country that had absolutly nothing to do, with al queda/taliban or 911.


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## Heartless-Dealer (Aug 3, 2003)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> Liquid said:
> 
> 
> > Ms_Nattereri said:
> ...


 LOL ARE U SERIOUS

did u just say use them against the kurds?

lol that was years ago

what does that have to do with now

and I'm sorry but has it not crossed your mind that we not only invaded his country and conquered his regime, but we also ousted him as a dictator and put him in jail

do u not think he knew this would happen?

why no chemical weapons or weapons of mass destruction used on our troops?

where did all these massive labs that are needed to make such weapons dissapear too..

i mean the labs that would have to be in effect in order to make these types of weapons arent easily concealed like a bottle opener..

they are buildings and buildings..

ignorance is sad


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## User (May 31, 2004)

Liquid said:


> Liquid said:
> 
> 
> > diddye said:
> ...


 http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1022083/posts


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

Heartless-Dealer said:


> ignorance is sad


Yeah and you show a lot of it









Go on and vote Kerry Heartless! Too bad you dont know much about his views









_"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime . He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real ..."_
Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan.23.2003


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## Liquid (Aug 24, 2004)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> Liquid said:
> 
> 
> > Ms_Nattereri said:
> ...


we've been in that country for how long?? we found saddam in a hole in the mdlle of no where but we can't find nuclear facilities??, the most i think they found was something that looked like a meth lab out in a trailer park in idaho, oh and some left over mustard gas that we supplyed them to use on iran..he destroyed most of his own scud missles before we invaded by orders of the un


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

Anyways it seems that even Bush's daddy was a better pres than him in summary. Bush Sr. said in his memoir that he did not want to send troops to Iraq because there would be no way to end it. As in it would be another Vietnam, it doesnt end. Bush Sr. also at least SOMEWHAT cared for the enviroment (yeah that thing we live in, and if you ruin it, its gone) yeah that thing.

"Every administration since Teddy Roosevelt's has left office with more lands protected than when it entered, except the current Bush administration, which has weakened protections on an incredible 234 million acres of our public land, an area equivalent to the states of Oklahoma and Texas. The administration weakened the Clinton administration's Roadless Area Conservation Rule, which protected almost 60 million acres of national forests, by exempting the Tongass and Chugach national forests in Alaska and giving governors a loophole to exempt national forests in their state."


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## Liquid (Aug 24, 2004)

Liquid said:


> Liquid said:
> 
> 
> > diddye said:
> ...


 bump


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

> name 1 terrorist they caught in iraq before the war, name one thing iraq did on record that supported terrorist, please post facts.....:sarcastic: besides that time at band camp when we funded/supported saddam to drop mustard gas on iranians and his own people.
> p.s non existent eh???


I heard on the radio just yesterday a sound clip of ABC news before bush and before 9-11 that there was evidence that osma bin ladin having connections with sadam asking for him for amnisty (i think that was the word used) for himself and other alquada members in which sadam accepted, but you wont here them play that now because like every other mainstream media they wouldnt want to make bush look right. Theres one thing.


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

Any other sources of good credibility to that statement rpb?? I'm interested in that very much because I was under the impression Sadamn HATED Osama for being so religious. Sadamn believed HE was the highest and there is no God. But I dont recall the U.S. finding any Alquida in Iraq.


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## Liquid (Aug 24, 2004)

rbp75 said:


> > name 1 terrorist they caught in iraq before the war, name one thing iraq did on record that supported terrorist, please post facts.....:sarcastic: besides that time at band camp when we funded/supported saddam to drop mustard gas on iranians and his own people.
> > p.s non existent eh???
> 
> 
> I heard on the radio just yesterday a sound clip of ABC news before bush and before 9-11 that there was evidence that osma bin ladin having connections with sadam asking for him for amnisty (i think that was the word used) for himself and other alquada members in which sadam accepted, but you wont here them play that now because like every other mainstream media they wouldnt want to make bush look right. Theres one thing.


 if i dont see it from a credible source, i do not believe it, hear say is the worst kind of news ever..btw heres a quote off of the home page from that link user posted

"Free Republic stands firmly on the side of right, i.e., the conservative side"

need i say more?, this is total b.s. , don't you think if this was true, bush would be campaigning this everyday on national tv on one of his "i approve of this message".
I'm a cnn fanatic, i watch it more then my wife watchs friends, i also watch bbc and i've yet to see,read anything on this......post a credible source...please


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## Liquid (Aug 24, 2004)

ill give bush one and one thing only and thats to let the ban on assault weapons expire, the only thing out of his term that pleased me


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

Liquid said:


> rbp75 said:
> 
> 
> > > name 1 terrorist they caught in iraq before the war, name one thing iraq did on record that supported terrorist, please post facts.....:sarcastic: besides that time at band camp when we funded/supported saddam to drop mustard gas on iranians and his own people.
> ...


 Credible sources?! Do such exists? All of media is biased, either way you look at it. Thats the problem with people nowadays. They take the media for granted. As if what they is how it is. Entirely not true.


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

Well I would rather depend on a source such as the San Jose Mercury rather than the tabloids or radio shows. At least then you know its a little more filtered for accuracy.


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

http://archives.warroom.com/archives.php



> if i dont see it from a credible source, i do not believe it, hear say is the worst kind of news ever


Theres a link to the radio program that played the sound clip from ABC news in 1999 linking Al qadia to sadam. When you get to the page click on wednesday sep 29th link and the sound clip will come up at 1 hour and 9 min into the show.
Hopefully you have a comp that can load it fast enough to not have to wait that long. There is your proof. unless ABC news is not a credible source of information.

check edit for corection on date sep 29 wednesday


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

Filo said:


> Well I would rather depend on a source such as the San Jose Mercury rather than the tabloids or radio shows. At least then you know its a little more filtered for accuracy.


 San Jose Mercury?!?









Your kidding me right?! Please say you are







Thats the most liberal based paper I know







I just gave an example how they slanted an article on the front page this last week to make Bush look bad when in fact hes not even connected with what they said. And look at how many times they misreport things. They always have a section in the inside of the front page where they state theyve misprinted something.

The best you can do if you want the news is to read several different sources and make the conclusion yourself as to what to believe. You have to take all sources with a grain of salt and not as fact. A lot of articles are going to be slanted and biased towards one way.


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

"Q. What happened to all the older archives?
A. All older warroom archives originally aired prior to January 5th, 2004 are the legal property of the station Quinn and Rose used to be broadcast on, and can no longer be offered for download in order to keep the lawyers happy."

Anyways, I believe that was said. The issue ir more of a grey area, some have said they are linked then some say they arn't. I don't believe we have any POW-Al qaeda from Iraq. They are linked off and on its a mushy topic.


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

point being there is evidence to a link which for anybody who listens to what was said on ABC. and dont forget this was said before there was any political bias that would have had influence on what was said. And that is more than enough to justify war with Iraq. As I said Bush said this is a war with terrorist and those who support them. Fits the criteria


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## SERRAPYGO (Feb 4, 2003)

The best thing Bush did (wich I've seen nobody mention or notice) was in his closing and final statement where he siad "The military will continue to be voluntary". That was smart. Kerry had no opprotunity to respond to that and that issue preys upon the minds of parent voters worried about their prime aged sons or daughters getting drafted. 
True, neither candidate supports a draft at this point but, it's the democratic party that has put the proposal on the table, not the republicans. Personally, I don't know the ins and outs of it but, it's what I've heard from reliable sources.
I agree Kerry was more poised and ready for this debate than Bush. Kerry was confident in his statements. But, I could'nt help think Kerry was spouting off verbatim from cue cards while Bush seemed to speak from the heart with more conviction.


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> Filo said:
> 
> 
> > Well I would rather depend on a source such as the San Jose Mercury rather than the tabloids or radio shows. At least then you know its a little more filtered for accuracy.
> ...


 Heh sorry, havn't found any copies of Republican Times around San Jose yet...hopefully I will soon so that I can educate myself on the great things President Bush has done. Like when he uses the Patriot Act against our citizens, then has them locked up without a lawyer or phone calls.







It's a sad and scary place for Islamic/middle-eastern people to live right now. I guess the guys locked up in Guantanamo Bay will just rot away in their cells eventually...HELP IS ON THE WAY!


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

Serrapygo said:


> The best thing Bush did (wich I've seen nobody mention or notice) was in his closing and final statement where he siad "The military will continue to be voluntary". That was smart. Kerry had no opprotunity to respond to that and that issue preys upon the minds of parent voters worried about their prime aged sons or daughters getting drafted.
> True, neither candidate supports a draft at this point but, it's the democratic party that has put the proposal on the table, not the republicans. Personally, I don't know the ins and outs of it but, it's what I've heard from reliable sources.
> I agree Kerry was more poised and ready for this debate than Bush. Kerry was confident in his statements. But, I could'nt help think Kerry was spouting off verbatim from cue cards while Bush seemed to speak from the heart with more conviction.


 HR 163 and SB 89 are the two bills written by *DEMOCRATS* to start a draft.

There is a third bill HR 487 which WANTS to ELIMINATE the selective services, and guess who its written by? *A REPUBLICAN*

If you want to know more on the bills type in their number at this site: http://thomas.loc.gov


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

Filo said:


> Ms_Nattereri said:
> 
> 
> > Filo said:
> ...


 The Patriot Act? Your bringing that up?! Has YOUR life changed from it?! Have you not been able to lead a normal life since its been in place?!









You swear like Bush goes around and goes up to every middle-eastern and says "Jail them!" and leaves them to rot away. Come on man, think with some sense. It was put into place because of the terrorist that are harboring within our country.

Id rather _lose_ part of my freedoms if it keeps me safe. Considering these freedoms Ive _lost_ have had no effect on me in my life.


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

Oh yeah, and I forgot to mention, kids under the age of 16 are being held at Guantanmo for an "undetermined" amount of time. Bush thinks the Geneva Convention does not apply to him. HELP IS ON THE WAY!


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## User (May 31, 2004)




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## delta (Jul 23, 2004)

Filo said:


> Oh yeah, and I forgot to mention, kids under the age of 16 are being held at Guantanmo for an "undetermined" amount of time. Bush thinks the Geneva Convention does not apply to him. HELP IS ON THE WAY!


 they didnt follow geneva why should we but those poor 16 yr olds woulda blown you and me up if given the chance they have kids a lot younger than 16 trained to kill us

id like to know how many kerry's supporters have family that was in nam as kerry considers them all war criminals


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## Fido (May 21, 2003)

I have family from Nam. But as many people I don't agree with everything Kerry says or has done. I really don't think any of us would like it if the tables were turned and they hit us up with little sketchy proof and locked us in Cuba. If every other country has to follow the Geneva Convention, why dont we?


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## Heartless-Dealer (Aug 3, 2003)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> Filo said:
> 
> 
> > Ms_Nattereri said:
> ...


 oh please karen, 
with every statement you make, you cause urself to look dumber and dumber...

do u even know what the patriot act constitutes?


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## Heartless-Dealer (Aug 3, 2003)

also i find it funny that karen calls the media biased, while every argument she has ever put forward is media-based...

all she ever talks about is how bush is agaisnt terrorism and this and that

do u ever wonder why we are even in iraq...

its so stupid

iraq was the least terroristic state in the middle east

take it from someone who has been there..

anyone with a radical religous statement was killed my frined..

saddam saw it as a threat...

he did not want his power to be underminded by some radical fundamentalists who had control over the people..

we are going after the people who atatcked us 9/11..correct?

where does iraq come into the picture? LOL

if u knew an ounce about the middle east u would know that states such as iran, syria, and afghnaistan pose so much more of a threat that it is not even comparable..

god people who make decisions on no facts make me sick!


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

Both of them couldn't debate worth a crap yesturday! They kept reiterating the same crap over and over again. None of them brought up any good points other than the ones we've already heard. However, i still like bush, why?

He supports me and my military members
He put funds into military budgeting
He gives me a decent "VERY WELL-EARNED" payraise
He is very consistant on topics and sticks to what he believes


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

ProdigalMarine said:


> Both of them couldn't debate worth a crap yesturday! They kept reiterating the same crap over and over again. None of them brought up any good points other than the ones we've already heard. However, i still like bush, why?
> 
> He supports me and my military members
> He put funds into military budgeting
> ...


 Yay! Go air force! down jar heads :rasp:


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## Jewelz (Feb 24, 2004)

Heartless-Dealer said:


> also i find it funny that karen calls the media biased, while every argument she has ever put forward is media-based...
> 
> all she ever talks about is how bush is agaisnt terrorism and this and that
> 
> ...


 It's not like good ole John Kerry ever suggested we go invade Iraq or voted for it, right ?

oh wait .. he did.. more than once !!


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

One more month...and these stupid threads will be over.


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## delta (Jul 23, 2004)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> One more month...and these stupid threads will be over.


 no joke


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