# Color Enhancing Experiment



## Piranha_man

There's been a couple of interesting threads lately regarding color enhancing foods... what brings out reds, oranges and yellows.
I've gotta thank the members in the previous threads (like BRUNER) who did a lot of the legwork on getting information by which I'm basing my experiment.

As per aforementioned information, carotenoids promote reds and oranges, lycopene promotes reds, and spirulina promotes yellows.

So... I went down to the health food store and bought supplements of each.

The carotenoids came in a softgel which I was able to poke a hole in the capsules and squirt out the thick, dark orange goo.
The lycopene also came in a softgel, the stuff was a thick red goo.
The spirulina is in powder form.

I mixed 3 softgels from each, and about a half teaspoon of the powder with a little water and am soaking some tilapia in it.
Gonna let it soak overnight and feed tomorrow.
I'll try this for awhile and post the results.



















Sorry for the shitty pics, my camera is a cheapie and I'm no photographer.


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## Piranha_man

p.s. If this shows results, I can see making some homemade pellets outta this stuff.


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## JoeDizzleMPLS

That looks delicious P-Man...


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## jp80911

should throw that on the grill


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## Smoke

That's great! Keep us posted please... who are the lucky candidates of this gourmet feast BTW?


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## Piranha_man

My pygos (cariba and reds) and my spilo.


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## Smoke

Nice, I've been trying a few experiments of my own lately


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## Piranha_man

Yeah? 
Whatcha got goin'?


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## Smoke

Nothin like you, that's the real deal. But I started trying out some paprika. Last night I took some smelt and rubbed it in paprika... it wasn't well received, but I think my Manny and my Eigen ate it... I also started trying out Salmon. I've read that salmon is high in carotene and other good proteins. We will see...


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## BRUNER247

I didn't do anything that any of you couldn't have done. A simple google search. What enhances yellow coloration in fish, what enhances coloration in fish, ect. GL P-man. Hope it works. Be sure to get a before, couple during, & a after shot like month or so after ya start. Try to take pics in same light, or same time of day.


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## Piranha_man

^^ Will do man... gonna go throw some of the "activated" tilapia in right now.

Heck, these gelcaps are the same size and color of Hikari pellets... maybe I could sneak a few in during a pellet feeding?
That would be insane... one piranha getting a full 25,000 IU of carotenoid in one bite!


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## jp80911

be careful, you may turn the entire fish orange or red or yellow. and somehow their poop might be rainbow color, lol


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## r1dermon

hey something you might find interesting that i found on another site...



> What exactly is astaxanthin and why does it make salmon red?
> Astaxanthin is the red pigment that gives salmon, shrimp and flamingos their pink-red colour. Chemically it is similar to ß-carotene (in carrots) and vitamin A. It is part of the group of carotenoids . The chemical structure of astaxanthin is shown below:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Astaxanthin is made by several kinds of algae and plankton. These are eaten by many aquatic species including crustaceans , amongst which are shrimps, which store the pigment in their shell, resulting in their pink-red exterior. Crustaceans in turn are eaten by fish (salmon, trout) or birds (flamingo, red ibis). These also store the pigment in their skin and fatty tissue. This is the reason why salmon and other animals are red. Astaxanthin does not undergo bleaching, thus these animals retain their pink coloration.
> 
> The function of astaxanthin in connection with aquatic animals is not entirely clear. However, it is a potent antioxidant, comparable to vitamin E. It may also offer protection against UV light.
> 
> Only algae can produce astaxanthin; higher animals cannot alter the chemical structure. This has important consequences for aquaculture (fish farming).
> 
> Salmon farming exists in several forms. Salmon can be grown in the sea, where their diet is partly natural, but they also get additional food. Another way to culture salmon is in tanks on land. In this case they do not eat a natural diet, but get fish feed. However, without shrimp or another source of astaxanthin, salmon will remain white. The consumer does not want this, which means astaxanthin will have to be added to the fish feed
> 
> Astaxanthin is chemically made from carotene. This is the most common source of astaxanthin in fish feed. Other possibilities are: adding shrimp waste or adding a powder made from astaxanthin-producing yeasts. However, the last two methods are considerably more expensive, which is why the chemically made astaxanthin is mainly used.
> 
> It is chemically different (mirror image of the natural astaxanthin) but for salmon or men it makes no difference.
> 
> Principles of Colour Enhancing Koi Foods
> "Here are some key words to look for when considering dietary supplements that will enhance red pigmentation in your koi - carotenoids, canthaxanthin, astaxanthin, spirulina, Musca Domestica and Krill.
> 
> Carotenoids are a family of over 600 natural lipid-soluble pigments that are produced within microalgae, phytoplankton, and higher plants. They also produce compounds such as essential fatty acids, steroids, sterols, vitamins A, D, E, and K. Within the various classes of natural pigments, the carotenoids are the most widespread and structurally diverse pigmenting agents. They are responsible, in combination with proteins, for many of the brilliant yellow to red colors in plants and the wide range of blue, green, purple, brown and reddish colors of fish and crustaceans.
> 
> Carotenoids are absorbed in animal diets - sometimes transformed into other carotenoids, and incorporated into various tissues. As we all know, flamingo's are pink or should be pink - this is due to ingesting algae containing high levels of beta-carotene and then converting this yellow carotenoid into canthaxanthin and astaxanthin before depositing it into the feathers and tissues as red plumage. Some fish species such as koi and various crustaceans have the enzymatic mechanisms to convert carotenoids into other forms as well, such as astaxanthin - some fish/animals don't. Astaxanthin is the optimal carotenoid for the proper pigmentation of the red/pink colors is aquaria. Crustaceans and other aquatic animals are unable to produce astaxanthin de novo (naturally), only plants and protists (bacteria, algae, fungi) are capable of synthesizing carotenoids. Therefore astaxanthin must be available in either their native habitat or manufactured diet to meet nutritional requirements. In the natural aquatic environment, astaxanthin is biosynthesized in the food chain within microalgae or phytoplankton at the primary production level. The microalgae are consumed by zooplankton, insects or crustaceans which accumulate astaxanthin, and in turn are ingested by fish which then accrue astaxanthin.
> 
> Fish in the wild will obtain natural red, orange and yellow color pigments, via carotenoids, through natural food sources such as shrimps, snails, daphnia and blood worms. Pond's lack these natural food sources so the fish require a supplement to their diets. Unfortunately natural color enhancers are an expensive addition to a diet, so many fish foods do not contain them or they are provided in such small quantities they are not effective.


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## Smoke

jp80911 said:


> be careful, you may turn the entire fish orange or red or yellow. and somehow their poop might be rainbow color, lol


They will fart rainbows lol


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## Piranha_man

r1der... another great find on the topic.








I especially like the part about how it turns salmon red.

Looks like we may be on the right track with the carotenoids and spirulina (the spirulina is via blue-green algae).
I threw the lycopene in there for the hell of it... it may or may not have any effect.

Another thing I'm gonna try is when feeding my guys pellets, toss in a carotenoid gelcap and see if they mistakenly eat it in their frenzy for the pellets, as they're basically the same size and color as the pellets...


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## r1dermon

do you have a meat grinder? if so it might be possible to throw a bunch of shrimp, salmon, and other nutritious foods into a mixer and grind it all together, then lay it flat and put it in a 130 degree oven and dry it out good...you might need some sort of binder like xanthan gum, but i'd imagine you could customize an astaxanthan rich pellet which is nutritious, as well as caratenoid heavy for color...just thinking outloud.


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## 0S1R1S

I'm looking forward to seeing the results. If they turn out to be positive with no negative impact on the fish, I may have to get some baby reds to color up nice and good.

Oh yeah, and that picture of the dosed fillet looks like you just ripped out someone's lungs or liver. This is now how I picture P-man..


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## Piranha_man

0S1R1S said:


> I'm looking forward to seeing the results. If they turn out to be positive with no negative impact on the fish, I may have to get some baby reds to color up nice and good.
> 
> Oh yeah, and that picture of the dosed fillet looks like you just ripped out someone's lungs or liver. This is now how I picture P-man..


That _IS_ a picture of me, and I _DID_ rip out _Gandhi's_ liver... which I'm trying to pass off as "carotenoid infused tilapia."


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## Piranha_man

I just did a pellet feeding and tossed in a few carotenoid gelcaps with the pellets and the fish gobbled 'em up.

25,000 IU of beta carotine per gelcap.


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## e46markus

Probably be a while before we can see any results...it'd be interesting to see if it works


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## balluupnetme

Does anyone know what promotes green/blue/purple ?


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## Redruckus

i know if you grind up raw shrimp/lobster/crab shells with some kind of meat it realy enhances red colouring in fish that or gut loading worms with spirulina and carrots


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## Piranha_man

No change in the fish yet, but their poops are the color of a roadside warning cone.


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## BRUNER247

balluupnetme said:


> Does anyone know what promotes green/blue/purple ?


Phycocyanin promotes blue/green.
If nothing else at least you can spot their crap from 5' away P-man. Lol


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## Piranha_man

Phycocyanin for blue/green

Carotenoids for red/orange

Spirulina for yellow

Would be cool if one could compound these extracts into a pellet.
Of course the fish would require other foods as well, but these pellets could be added to their diet in order to enhance coloration.


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## Redruckus

> No change in the fish yet, but their poops are the color of a roadside warning cone.


pfffttt bahahahaha........that is all

on a side note if the poo is that colour they are probably not absorbing the enhancer


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## r1dermon

pman, you might want to try making "fish cakes" with those ingredients, and actually baking them...see what happens. i read a recent study that suggested that carotene is more easily absorbed when it has been briefly cooked.


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## Piranha_man

Really?
That's wild... kinda like THC, eh?









And here this morning I mixed up some fresh "Color Enhancing Marinade" (hereby to be referred to as "CEM") with 8 carotenoid and 4 lycopene gelcaps... I mixed it with cold water, thinking that the heat from warm/hot water might have adverse effects.

Gonna soak some more tilapia today.


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## BRUNER247

Spirulina is for blue & green also I believe. It mainly said blue & green & it added that it was fed to chckens for bright yellow skin & yokes. So should work with both blue & yellow. I'm sure it'll take More than a couple feedings before a difference is noted. I'd think after a week or two a difference should be seen.

sh*t this is only the 3rd or 4th day at most. CEM. Lol. Go P-man go!


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## Ægir

Lots of reef aquarium owners make an "all in one" food to make feeding easier.

Get as much variety in food as you can (Shrimp, salmon, talpia, squid, scallops, etc) and food process it with some hikari pellets, the stuff you are using, maybe some garlic, and anything else you can think of... even vegetables!

Using a piece of eggcrate on a cookie sheet, spread the paste over, put in the freezer... And now you have tons of frozen cubes that you can just drop in. Easier than fillets to deal with, and less waste prob.


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## Piranha_man

Ægir said:


> Spirulina is for blue & green also I believe. It mainly said blue & green & it added that it was fed to chckens for bright yellow skin & yokes. So should work with both blue & yellow. I'm sure it'll take More than a couple feedings before a difference is noted. I'd think after a week or two a difference should be seen.
> 
> sh*t this is only the 3rd or 4th day at most. CEM. Lol. Go P-man go!


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## Ægir

Depending on what you use in the food you shouldnt need gelatin... it just made things more of a mess. If your blend is runny, and has lots of wet ingredients then you might have to. With fish fillets and meats you should be fine.

Yes, I blended EVERYTHING, and would lightly rinse the cubes under hot water (maybe 10 seconds?) before feeding. You might have better luck with a chunkier mixture depending on how big the fish are.


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## balluupnetme

Ægir said:


> Depending on what you use in the food you shouldnt need gelatin... it just made things more of a mess. If your blend is runny, and has lots of wet ingredients then you might have to. With fish fillets and meats you should be fine.
> 
> Yes, I blended EVERYTHING, and would lightly rinse the cubes under hot water (maybe 10 seconds?) before feeding. You might have better luck with a chunkier mixture depending on how big the fish are.


Do you have any pics of your fish ? did this mix help with the coloration of your fish ? I'm gonna make a mix also


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## Smoke

balluupnetme said:


> Depending on what you use in the food you shouldnt need gelatin... it just made things more of a mess. If your blend is runny, and has lots of wet ingredients then you might have to. With fish fillets and meats you should be fine.
> 
> Yes, I blended EVERYTHING, and would lightly rinse the cubes under hot water (maybe 10 seconds?) before feeding. You might have better luck with a chunkier mixture depending on how big the fish are.


Do you have any pics of your fish ? did this mix help with the coloration of your fish ? I'm gonna make a mix also









[/quote]

You gonna bring out colors in your Rhom? Blue I presume?


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## Ægir

balluupnetme said:


> Do you have any pics of your fish ? did this mix help with the coloration of your fish ? I'm gonna make a mix also


I use it mostly for saltwater and reef aquariums... Typically one food doesnt cover everything (different fish, corals, etc) so a mixture saves time and makes feeding easier. It sucks having to feed 10 different things on a schedule

The hard part is keeping the pieces big enough, and not having them turn to "dust" when they hit the water...yet still having a uniform mixture. some people use clear gelatin, but I found that to be the hardest part of the food making. Either it stays slimy or gets as hard as a rubber ball.

If you use google, im sure people have a recipe and instructions that are more detailed and refined.

next people will be feeding their Ps creatine, and protein weight gainer shakes


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## BRUNER247

Weight gainer. Lmmfao! Man checkout my beefed cake rhom, he's on the juice but he's tryn to kick his habit. P-man are you taking your rrs to the gym with ya? Lol


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## Redruckus

thats too funny ......now that you mention it my natts can all dorsal fin press there own body wieght, thinkin about giving them bullshark growth hormone just to see what happens


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## pirana666

Hello,my reds are 5 years old and i got 3 caribe 4 years old... i feed them tilapia,shrimps,

but i see the colors faiding away,NOW:i heard about hikari gold should bring the collors back....

does anybody now about experiments with that food...?

Hikari Gold Ingredients
White Fish Meal, Wheat Flour, Wheat Germ Meal, Brewers Dried Yeast, Soybean Meal, Shrimp Meal, Dehydrated Alfalfa Meal, Carotene, Thiamine Mononitrate, Riboflavin, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Vitamin A Supplement, L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Biotin, Calcium Pantothenate, Choline Chloride, D-activated Animal Sterol, Folic Acid, Menadione Zinc Oxide, Manganous Oxide, Salt, Ferrous Chloride, Copper Sulfate, Cobalt Sulfate, Aluminum Sulfate, Magnesium Sulfate.


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## Piranha_man

So for the last couple of days I've been feeding my pygos cubes of tilapia with carotenoid gelcaps stuck in them...
They've gotten wise to this and now pick the tilapia off and leave the gelcaps.


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## 0S1R1S

P-man, how is this experiment going? I want to see your radiant glowing fish all hopped up on these gelcaps.


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## Guest

0S1R1S said:


> P-man, how is this experiment going? I want to see your radiant glowing fish all hopped up on these gelcaps.


x2

Have you seen any change in colouration? I'm thinking of trying this myself but I already soak the food in vits n minerals, don't know how beneficial doing this as well would be.


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## Piranha_man

I did it for a few weeks.
I think there was a teeny enhancement of coloration... but not enough to warrant continuation of the process.

I'm back to feeding them a diet consisting of 95% Hikari Pellets with the occasional tilapia, shrimp & steak.


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## Mr. Hannibal

Thanks for sharing!


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## Sylar_92

Below I have two comparison pics of two reds, One which I raised from the size of a nickle and fed only Hikari sinking carnivore pellets as well as carrots and the other pic is a red BigAls raised from the same size mostly fed rosy reds and fish flakes. As you can see the red I raised is more colourful and bulky, while the red BigAls raised has little red colouring on its stomach. something to point out, the red BigAls raised is from the same batch I bought my red from. Originally I thought the other red was a wild caught because the way it looked but I confirmed with the second fishroom manager that it was from the same batch of babies that I bought mine from.








my red at 2.5"








BigAls red which I bought at 2.5"


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## 0S1R1S

Good comparison Sylar. Top fish definitely looks healthier by color/bulk means.


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