# which koralia to use?



## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

Right now I have koralia 4 for my 180g (6x2x2) and thinking about upgrade it for a higher flow rate model.
Would koralia 8 (3250gph) be too much for my tank size? if so, which model should I upgrade to?
it's a mix pygo tank with 6 caribes 4" or so and one piraya 5" or so, maybe will add few more wild reds or ternetzi if available.


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## philbert (Mar 8, 2007)

I dont really like korila very much they do provide a wider band of water flow, but i have not seen any of my Ps play in the current like they do for an AC power head. honestly for a 180 i would get an AC110 or maybe 2 AC70s.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

philbert said:


> I dont really like korila very much they do provide a wider band of water flow, but i have not seen any of my Ps play in the current like they do for an AC power head. honestly for a 180 i would get an AC110 or maybe 2 AC70s.


I have one AC70 in that tank in addition of the koralia 4, not powerful enough IMO. Also have AC110, it's very powerful but I don't like how it produce a jet of current, almost blow away all my plants when I used in my square tank. it also uses more electricity (60W if remember correctly)


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## nataz (Mar 31, 2006)

I would go with a few more 4's, maybe two more. One on each end and one in the middle. I think they work pretty good. I didn't put the piece on the front of it thought. I have one on each end and my FX'5 return blowing into the back of one.
Or, go big and get a http://ecotechmarine.com/ -- (vortex) bad as* power head. Cost a bit, but it moves water like no other. In my 220 without any rocks it would make cyclones on the other side of the tank. You can find them used on saltwater sites also.






sorry couldn't post the utube video

But to each there own. Good Luck.


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## assclown (Dec 12, 2005)

a catalina 1800 or 2200 would work out fine and cheap too, like 70 bucks


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

thanks for the input, I'll look into those.

so what's the idea current I should have for that tank? that's what I'm trying to find out.
koralia 8 is 3250gph and I can get that for $99, not too bad. but I'm not sure if that will be too much current for pygos in 180g


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)

I think instead of having one Koralia 8 with a ungodly amount of flow why not do like 2 K6's or something.


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## skylute3 (Nov 30, 2007)

I enjoy my maxi jets...cobrafox put me on those.
I have my 180 6'2'2, and I'm gunna run, 2 maxi jet 1200
With eco mode 2100 gph. That'll be 4200, and u can get the
Swivel kind (which I like better) on ebay for 80 for the 2. Good deal imo.
Good luck...btw, don't like koralias...had the 4, wasn't impressed


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)

i forgot about the eco mod for the maxi jets, Ive got some reef buddies than run those on a wave maker and love em. Anyways the Swivel kind he is talking about are really bulky and big just fyi


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

so 3000+ gph won't be too much for the tank?


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)

let me know how it goes b/c i need one for my new rhom he swims in the return current alot but it's way underpowered.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

I have koralia 4 in my 180g square tank for my 12" black diamond, it seems enjoying it. 
what power head are you using in your tank now? how's the rhom doing? start to see the blue hue yet?


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)

The water is discolored now from medication, I dosed his tank to help his fins heal a little better and just in case he had anything from being wild caught, It does appear to be coming in a little more around his gills and i finally got him to eat after 8 days, I had to add two 10 dollar koi's b/c they didnt have any goldfish.


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## Ægir (Jan 21, 2006)

If you want to save money, you can buy Maxijet 1200s and the sure flow mod kit Clicky with the magnet mount... suction cups arent reliable

Otherwise get one of the Koralia magnums... But for the money i would rather have 3 of the MJ mods


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## cobrafox46 (Jun 2, 2008)

3 Maxis would be nasty........I would go with them for the price. I have had mine going for over a year now with no problems!


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## Plum (May 4, 2006)

jp80911 said:


> thanks for the input, I'll look into those.
> 
> so what's the idea current I should have for that tank? that's what I'm trying to find out.
> koralia 8 is 3250gph and I can get that for $99, not too bad. but I'm not sure if that will be too much current for pygos in 180g


Great idea. Also, where might you be getting these for $99 - I will buy a few.


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## cobrafox46 (Jun 2, 2008)

Plum said:


> thanks for the input, I'll look into those.
> 
> so what's the idea current I should have for that tank? that's what I'm trying to find out.
> koralia 8 is 3250gph and I can get that for $99, not too bad. but I'm not sure if that will be too much current for pygos in 180g


Great idea. Also, where might you be getting these for $99 - I will buy a few.
[/quote]

That is what I was thinking...I thought they were around $250. Do you have one Plum? Do they flow really well?


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

petsolutions.com


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## cobrafox46 (Jun 2, 2008)

Damn they came down in price....WOW! I may have to try one.


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## Plum (May 4, 2006)

Thank you for the link - MUCH appreciated.

I have two, and I love them. at $99..... I love them even more.

I think people drastically underestimate the current needs of these fish.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

um, so i should get two koralia 8 then, one for each tank...


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## Plum (May 4, 2006)

If you go this way provide shaded area so that they may rest.

IE: place powerhead at one end of the tank, then place driftwood at the other end providing them areas to rest and stay out of the current.

Just bought two more Koralia 8's!!!


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

me too, just bough two








I'll see how they react to the new current flow and re arrange the tank accordingly. thanks for the advice.


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)

Hey Jack either pm me or call me, either way let me know if its to much/not enough current im next to buy ! thanks


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

Yea sure Scott. I should receive mine on Monday and will let you know if my fish are loving it or they all got blow away.


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## Plum (May 4, 2006)

Don't worry.... they won't blow away.


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)

Lol yeah Aquarium is going to look like a Jacuzzi


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## the_w8 (Jul 28, 2003)

I have my K4 in my 125 for my big rhom and it seems to be doing jus fine. It's impeller kinda rattles at times and can be annoying, but he seems to like it.


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

Plum said:


> Thank you for the link - MUCH appreciated.
> 
> I have two, and I love them. at $99..... I love them even more.
> 
> *I think people drastically underestimate the current needs of these fish.*


Would you like to fill me in on that one?? Why do you think your Ps need a powerhead??? I feel completely opposite and feel like its very overrated for our tanks.


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)

Seedless im not saying your wrong by any means just friendly disscussion, But id like you to elaborate on your opinion plz !

Though many of the areas where piranha's come from arent fast flowing, Piranha's still swim around alot exspecially pygo's. In the home aquaria space is limited so i feel its my responsibility to give them a powerhead.


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

Ba20 said:


> Seedless im not saying your wrong by any means just friendly disscussion, But id like you to elaborate on your opinion plz !
> 
> Though many of the areas where piranha's come from arent fast flowing, Piranha's still swim around alot exspecially pygo's. In the home aquaria space is limited so i feel its my responsibility to give them a powerhead.


I dont have time to respond as Im getting ready for a wedding right now. I would love to comment on this Monday.


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)

> Im getting ready for a wedding right now


Dont do it, your life will go down the











> to comment on this Monday


Ill be patiently awaiting your response


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## Plum (May 4, 2006)

SeedlessOne said:


> Thank you for the link - MUCH appreciated.
> 
> I have two, and I love them. at $99..... I love them even more.
> 
> *I think people drastically underestimate the current needs of these fish.*


Would you like to fill me in on that one?? Why do you think your Ps need a powerhead??? I feel completely opposite and feel like its very overrated for our tanks.
[/quote]

It is why you see many fish lose their colors (IMO) and why you see many overweight fish in the hobby (factual). One main reason for the overweight is that persons feed their fish much to often and don't provide it with near the amount of energy expulsion that it is accustomed to in the wild.

Sure - you don't need a powerhead to keep a "happy" fish. You do need to have a good amount of flow to keep a nice colored, well fit piranha.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

I didn't know that has something to do with coloration of fish....guess learn something new everyday.


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## Plum (May 4, 2006)

jp80911 said:


> I didn't know that has something to do with coloration of fish....guess learn something new everyday.


Purely speculation on my part, but I think a very logical guess. If you import a 12" piraya from the wild, and compare it to the ones that people raise - for the most part... HUGE difference. The imported fish is much more slender, and the colors vivid.

Look at a tank raised fish.... it's fat (storing most of it in what I would call its forehead) and the color is gone ( Think the vivid humeral spot on a caribe).

If you look at my video, you can see one Caribe that is fat and ugly - though big. I bought him tank raised and paid $40 for him (about 10")... no wonder - he is ugly as sh*t. Grew up in a 75 gallon.. over fed and no powerhead. Look at my video, you can literally pick him out.

The rest are large and have kept their colors similar to wild specimens (IMO). 2 reasons are no "power feeding" and lots of current.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

I do agree with the body shape part, which most of the tank raised piranhas are over fed and didn't have much "exercise".
I do hope that will indeed help with the color cuz I want my caribes to keep their humeral spots








can't wait to get mine on Monday.


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## Ægir (Jan 21, 2006)

My opinion on powerheads is: Most people are running HOB filters or canister filters for their tanks... Not sumps and wet/drys with higher GPH turnover rates in flow... and in the wild that's just not the same, so some additional movement helps to replicate but isnt necessary if you cant afford it, or dont like it (personal preference)

You cant really get a for sure "gallon per hour" rate for a river that is up to 120 miles wide at its widest point (and slowest theoretically)... replicating that in a 12" 18" or 24" deep aquarium that is 4' 6' or 8' in length would still need more flow than typical filtration to be a replication of a natural environment.



> It is estimated that the Amazon discharges between 34 million and 121 million liters (9 million and 32 million gallons) of water per second


Thats between 540 million and 7 billion 260 million GPH flow, if that thats at the widest point (the mouth of the river as per the quote above), approx 120 miles wide (633,600 FT)... thats 5,113.64 gallons per 6' wide area.... or 1,704.54 gallons per 2' and thats at the lowest.... at the higher end of the estimation thats 72,282.1968 gallons per 6' wide, and 24,094.0656 per 2' wide area...

SO if you are providing between 1704 GPH and 24,095 GPH Linear flow (end of thank to end of tank) IN a 24" deep tank (front to back) then you are in the right ballpark...

Thats after a bottle of vodka, and using quick google statistics so... i am sure there's an expert that can tell you more precise flow rates, and widths of the river... and even more precise about where different species prefer to dwell, or spend most of their time.

You also have to keep in mind that the river doesnt flow at a constant rate, for part of the year it almost stops during the dry season, and then picks up during the wet season. I dont know of many people replicating that either, so some without powerheads could claim they are replicating dry season, and some with massive flow the opposite.


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

Ill be back to edit this post tonight. Skunk pretty much hit the major points. I also want to get into this "color reducing" stuff. B.c that is just rubbish.


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## cobrafox46 (Jun 2, 2008)

Skunkbudfour20 said:


> My opinion on powerheads is: Most people are running HOB filters or canister filters for their tanks... Not sumps and wet/drys with higher GPH turnover rates in flow... and in the wild that's just not the same, so some additional movement helps to replicate but isnt necessary if you cant afford it, or dont like it (personal preference)
> 
> You cant really get a for sure "gallon per hour" rate for a river that is up to 120 miles wide at its widest point (and slowest theoretically)... replicating that in a 12" 18" or 24" deep aquarium that is 4' 6' or 8' in length would still need more flow than typical filtration to be a replication of a natural environment.
> 
> ...


Nice


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## Plum (May 4, 2006)

Rubbish - strong word.

Go test it for yourself... A healthy fish is obviously going to exhibit more natural characteristic. Body shape is one, color is another.

I don't bother with the "dry season" as I place shaded areas in the tank in thsat they can rest in (obviously always having them in current is not a good idea either (not natural).



SeedlessOne said:


> Ill be back to edit this post tonight. Skunk pretty much hit the major points. I also want to get into this "color reducing" stuff. B.c that is just rubbish.


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## Ægir (Jan 21, 2006)

cobrafox46 said:


> Nice


Thanks man, i read that today after sobering up and was fairly impressed myself


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)

Skunk here is my thought on your write up, Though your calculations are prolly close on flow at the mouth of the amazon river, None of our piranha's are caught there, You talk to George or Pedro, And none of there collectors fish at the mouth of the amazon NONE, Here is a picture that pedro posted awhile back during a collection trip










If your calculations where to be put into affect there you would need a bass boat, Most of the fish that are caught are not in fast or even moderate flowing waters, The reason i think current is needed in the home aquaria is due to the fact that our fish swim alot more in the wild than they do in the aquarium.

On the coloration topic I think it has everything to do with the food being consumed ! My cousin just recently did a science project with hamsters on this.


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## Ægir (Jan 21, 2006)

Ba20 said:


> Skunk here is my thought on your write up, Though your calculations are prolly close on flow at the mouth of the amazon river, None of our piranha's are caught there, You talk to George or Pedro, And none of there collectors fish at the mouth of the amazon NONE, Here is a picture that pedro posted awhile back during a collection trip
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I am aware no piranhas are caught at the mouth of the river... I just wanted to use the widest point of the river because in theory it would be slower flowing, than if you had the same flow through a more narrow (and obviously deeper channel). And to get the numbers i came up with i needed a width, and GPH (or second) flow. The only information i could find containing those 2 numbers just happened to be the mouth of the river... so i thought i would work it out just to find a ball-park number

If you can find me numbers that have a gallon per second estimate, and the width of a tributary, then i could be more accurate.

And as for your food thing, i think that plays a large part of it... but if you fed your Ps rich food such as salmon, and had them in nearly stagnant water... they would be nothing but FAT. There has to be a balance of good diet, exercise, and ideally the closer you can replicate their natural environment, the happier and less skittish they will be

This is actually making me want to build a badass tank, with a controllable pump on a closed loop.... Constantly ramping (over 6 months or a year full cycle) from 1500gph to 20,000 gph flow in a linear motion from one end of the tank to the other, and then back down.... if i can find a 2' or 3' deep tank, that is 8 or 10' long for a good price it would be a DIY project i am willing to tackle when i have some more spare funds. And if i am going to take the time to control a pump like that, i would prob add rain, cloud and lightning simulation as well... a good solid storm once a month would be cool to watch









Another thing that just struck me, even if a 40' wide, 10' deep river is moving a mile per day (extremely slow)... that is still a gallon per hour rate that none of us can fathom


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)

> There has to be a balance of good diet, exercise, and ideally the closer you can replicate their natural environment, the happier and less skittish they will be


Couldnt agree more


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

First and foremost.... Plum I hope you didn't take my last post offensively. It was not what I meant. I should of followed my statement with IMO. And your tank is freaking beautiful.

Most of my points have already been discussed in the thread. I just don't feel like a powerhead really does much in our aquariums with properly taken care of Ps. Yea I do agree that overweight fish could benefit from the extra exercise. But at the same time I also think majority of P owners feed their fish *way* to much. And as far as color goes I can only say one thing..... diet diet diet. Properly feed Ps have the color everyone wants......Ive tired so many tank/food combos. This one works for me......


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

the color on that caribe is awesome, what are in its diet?


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

Hikari Bio Gold 95%. Shrimp, tilapia, and krill every now and then. Feed once about every 8-14 days.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

I've never tried pellet, maybe should give that a try.
once every 8-14 days? damn, that's long time between feedings. how big is it? any chance of more pictures? or videos?


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

No I don't have any more pics on this computer sorry. If you would like I can snap a few tomorrow some time. Our fish once a decent size can easily go a month+ without food. Like I said most people IMO overfeed their Ps.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

if you do not mind, more pics please









I plan to reduce feeding time once mine get bigger, they are only 4" now, so I feed twice a day (morning and night). just don't want them get hungry and turn on to each other. lost one already to piraya cuz it didn't get to eat anything for almost 2 days (caribes finished them all)


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)

link to pellits plz is it the cichlid ones ?


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## SeedlessOne (Nov 21, 2006)

Click


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

got my koralia 8's today, damn those things are HUGE. lol

it's been in the tank for about an hour now, so far they seem to enjoy the extra current. (not all my plants tho, especially the tall ones, lol)


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## Ba20 (Jan 29, 2003)




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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

ask and you shall receive.
full tank shot with koralia 8 and 4 on each side.








now, I cut the them off from the above picture and put them side by side, the red outline just to make it easier for you to see the size difference.


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## Plum (May 4, 2006)

Thank you for the compliment regarding the tanks and the same must be said in regards to the color of that cariba..... It is only my personal experience of course also. Diet is the main factor, and I agree with your feeding regimen - mine is about every 7 to 14 days - pellet trained also.



SeedlessOne said:


> First and foremost.... Plum I hope you didn't take my last post offensively. It was not what I meant. I should of followed my statement with IMO. And your tank is freaking beautiful. Most of my points have already been discussed in the thread. I just don't feel like a powerhead really does much in our aquariums with properly taken care of Ps. Yea I do agree that overweight fish could benefit from the extra exercise. But at the same time I also think majority of P owners feed their fish *way* to much. And as far as color goes I can only say one thing..... diet diet diet. Properly feed Ps have the color everyone wants......Ive tired so many tank/food combos. This one works for me......


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