# My RBP Piranha are SOOOOO sick



## Stunnax0ne (Apr 3, 2007)

My RBP's have lost SOOO much color, they're now like yellowish white. It seems like their mouths have become swollen, and one is actually on the floor breathing hard and BARELY moving.... I've been feeding them raw shrimp, and they just laid eggs. The water is definatly not safe because when I look at the top of the water, it is like grey and it looks like theres chemicals in it. I'm syphoning out the water right now, and I'm so worried for their safety that I actually syphoned the eggs down the drain







since I heard they release insane ammounts of ammonia. Right now, I'm refilling the tank up after like a 3/4 drain. I'm seriously worried for them, I need some help ASAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks in advance, and I've had the fish for a month and a half.


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## itstheiceman (Oct 5, 2006)

Stunnax0ne said:


> My RBP's have lost SOOO much color, they're now like yellowish white. It seems like their mouths have become swollen, and one is actually on the floor breathing hard and BARELY moving.... I've been feeding them raw shrimp, and they just laid eggs. The water is definatly not safe because when I look at the top of the water, it is like grey and it looks like theres chemicals in it. I'm syphoning out the water right now, and I'm so worried for their safety that I actually syphoned the eggs down the drain
> 
> 
> 
> ...


how big of a tank, has it been cycled yet? how many fish, how big are they, can you post your water parameters? those are some key answers we need


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## platinum1683 (Nov 17, 2006)

yes that and you should get a fry/hospital tank up and running for situations like these too, but if you post what ice told you to we might be able to figure out your problem.


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## Stunnax0ne (Apr 3, 2007)

It's a 33 gallon tank, here are some pictures:




























Within the past week I have drained and refilled the tank maybe like every other day for the same reason. It seems like something is polluting the tank. I try to move the gravel around as much as possible when I am syphoning out the water. Just now when I moved it around a lot, I noticed a sort of black dust being pulled out. I don't know how beleivable this sounds, but by just reffilling the tank the piranha seem to have regained some of the green color they used to have, but I'm hoping this clean water lasts longer then before.


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## SERRAPYGO (Feb 4, 2003)

> Within the past week I have drained and refilled the tank maybe like every other day


Something is definitely going on here, but this part concerns me. Have you been draining and refilling all the water in the tank? If so, why?

Just looking at the pictures, your fish appear to be healthy, by appearance alone, I don't see anything wrong, but the labored breathing indicates something bad is going on. You definitely need to get some water chemistry readings here. In the meantime, before you get those readings...increase the aeration as much as possible and DO NOT add any salt or medications until you know what's going on, as they can make things worse. Ease up on the water changes for now, they aren't going to help any further at this point, and keep the lights low to reduce any unneeded stress...it looks like they have enough already. This may be a parasite problem, what have you been feeding them?

MOVED to disease, parasite and injury.


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## Stunnax0ne (Apr 3, 2007)

I had a feeling there was a board better suited for this topic, but I guess I just saw PD had the most people so I made it there. I've been changing the water because it seems to get foggy and grey after a while, it never used to do that before. I've been feeding them raw shrimp as I was advised to, because I heard feeding them goldfish exclusively could be bad for them. I've turned off the light, and I'm hoping it will somehow help. I'm craving a good sleep, since its 4.18, but I really would rather stay up and save the ill piranha. The other two are just sitting around the bottom of the tank, but they're still floating and not touching the ground so I guess they're better off. I'm going to bed soon but I'm dreading waking up to find a dead piranha


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## SERRAPYGO (Feb 4, 2003)

> [I had a feeling there was a board better suited for this topic, but I guess I just saw PD had the most people so I made it there./quote]
> No worries...that's understandable.
> 
> "Foggy and grey", usually indicates high ammonia levels, wich is extremely deadly. STOP all feeding immediately, and keep it stopped until your water parimeters are back in check and your fish are breathing normal. Good luck!


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## jjdsplace (Mar 18, 2007)

i have been told the problem i had was poisoning via air spray and air freshner.

i sugest that you get a carbon filter going if you allready have one put fresh carbon in it as this will help clear the water of any chemicals once changed do it again in 48 hours this may sound pointless but i have been though it and come out of the other side.

http://www.piranha-fury.com/pfury/index.php?showtopic=149558 see pics here as i had them all upsidedawon and breathing rapidly i now have 2 happy reds again i did lose 3 but almost lost all. ( they r seperated at the moment due to them not eating for almost a month and one attacted the other but they seem to be fine now)

stopping feeding is also good but keep an eye on the for attacking each other. also keep up the part changes and make sure you decoronate the water before you put it in the tank.


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## cfb (Mar 14, 2007)

When you wake up, if you don't have one already, you need to buy a freshwater test kit. If you can not afford the whole kit, you can buy the tests seperate. The 3 you need are ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates. You can pick up pH and water hardness tests later.

Test the water, and post the values of these 3 tests. We need this info to help determine the problem.

Second, how often are you changing the water and what percentage of the total tank water are you changing? If you are changing the water more than a couple times per week, you should not be vaccuuming black stuff out of your gravel. If you are, you are not cleaning your gravel good enough or there is some external contamination going on.

Next, how often do you feed them? If there is any uneaten food, do you remove it? If so, how long does it stay in there before you remove it?

You say that the top of the water has the look of chemicals in it... are you spraying aerosol products around the tank? Like jjdsplace mentioned before me, hairspray and airfresheners in the tank = dead piranhas.

I hope all three made it through the night and as soon as you get these questions answered, we can start pointing you in the right direction.

Randy
CFB


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## Stunnax0ne (Apr 3, 2007)

Creatures From Below said:


> When you wake up, if you don't have one already, you need to buy a freshwater test kit. If you can not afford the whole kit, you can buy the tests seperate. The 3 you need are ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates. You can pick up pH and water hardness tests later.
> 
> Test the water, and post the values of these 3 tests. We need this info to help determine the problem.
> 
> ...


I don't spray any type of aerosol in my room, I guess the foggyness is from ammonia. I woke up today to find the piranha that was having trouble dead







The other two are actually swimming around now, there doesn't seem to be as much foggyness in the water anymore. I'm guessing I'll do one last water change since there was a dead fish in the tank for the 4 or 5 hours of sleep I got. I'll do my best to buy that water testing kit, does anyone have a ballpark price? Usually I just take a bottled water sample to my closest pet shop, last time I went the guy said ammonia levels were DANGEROUSLY high, which I guess explains why I've been changing the water a lot. I actually do have a Magnum carbon-rock filter, I'll try changing the rocks today. The piranha look very healthy right now, but they still seem to swim to the top of the water and sort of just stare upwards. After about a minute of that they swim off. Thanks for all of the help guys, and btw I usually keep hiding spots with a big bell in the tank so don't think they I'm a bad owner or anything, I just wanted a clear tank when I saw they were getting sick.


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## spinalremains (Nov 10, 2006)

That sucks. Are you just running undergravel filters? You should invest in a good canister filter and plan on upgrading to a larger tank in the near future. Good luck with the two!


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## Stunnax0ne (Apr 3, 2007)

spinalremains said:


> That sucks. Are you just running undergravel filters? You should invest in a good canister filter and plan on upgrading to a larger tank in the near future. Good luck with the two!


Yup I'm running an undergravel filter with this filter also:


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## bootdink (Jan 17, 2007)

the undergravel filter might be your problem..with p's they are very messy fish and the undergravel filter will do you more harm then good, which could explain the high levels of ammonia...id throw out that under gravel filter and pick up a HOB filter like an ac70 or 110


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## Stunnax0ne (Apr 3, 2007)

bootdink said:


> the undergravel filter might be your problem..with p's they are very messy fish and the undergravel filter will do you more harm then good, which could explain the high levels of ammonia...id throw out that under gravel filter and pick up a HOB filter like an ac70 or 110


Whoops, sorry. IDK what I was thinking, sorry I'm pretty new to this. It's not an underground filter, it's just the base for the tubes you see in the back of the aquarium. Theres two tubes and at the base of each tube air is blown out to create bubbles, I guess circulating the water. The filtration I have is that filter I showed with a powerhead near the top.


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## the REASON (Jun 18, 2006)

i might have missed this, but are you using dechlorinator when you add water to your tank?


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## mylesc99 (Sep 5, 2005)

Is that the Magnum 350?


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## Stunnax0ne (Apr 3, 2007)

NJKILLSYOU said:


> i might have missed this, but are you using dechlorinator when you add water to your tank?


Yup thats the 350, and no I don't add any dechlorinator. I guess I should be doing that....


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## jjdsplace (Mar 18, 2007)

Stunnax0ne said:


> i might have missed this, but are you using dechlorinator when you add water to your tank?


Yup thats the 350, and no I don't add any dechlorinator. I guess I should be doing that....
[/quote]

you do need to use dechlorinator as clorine is very harmful to the bacterior which is why your amonia is probably so high


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## cfb (Mar 14, 2007)

Sorry about the loss of your one P. Hopefully we can save the other two. You definately want to start using a water dechlorinator like mentioned above. They are very cheap and necessary if chlorine (used in town water supplies to kill bacteria and make the water safer to drink) could be in your water.

Also, when you upgrade to a bigger tank, a HOB filter is a good idea. If you have a petsmart close to you, you can print out the internet ad for the filter and they will give it to you for the internet price (usually 25-40% cheaper). I prefer the penguin biowheels (the 350 will cost you about $27 with the petsmart ad) but AquaClear filters are good too.

And lastly, owning a freshwater test kit is a must. You can not always trust the competence level of LFS employees so testing your own water should be a part of regular tank maintenance.

Continue doing small water changes daily (10-20%) to help dilute the ammonia and nitrites.

Here is a link to a test kit. Select "freshwater master kit" in the drop down menu and print the ad out. It will cost you $20.69.
http://www.petsmart.com/global/product_det...est+kit&N=2

Here is a link to HOB filters:
penguin biowheels 350B - http://www.petsmart.com/global/product_det...966860&Ne=2

AC110 - http://www.petsmart.com/global/product_det...966852&Ne=2

Good luck with the other 2 Ps.

Randy
CFB


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## Stunnax0ne (Apr 3, 2007)

Thanks for all the help guys, so should I continue feeding them shrimp? I just did like a massive clean, cleaning out the filter and adding new carbon rocks, and I don't remember the last time I've seen them breathing so softly. They're usually breathing VERY hard. So I guess that was a good thing, but like I asked before what should I feed them? For some reason I don't like feeding them shrimp....


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## cfb (Mar 14, 2007)

You should feed them a mixed diet consisting mainly of white fish fillets such as talapia, coley, pollack, torsk (also known as cusk), pouting, cod, etc..., shrimp (shell on), muscles, and clams, earthworms, silversides, etc.

For a treat and to help vary the diet, the occasional beefheart and quarantined feeder is ok. Just do not feed this to your Ps more than once a week.

Mine also eat flake food and shrimp pellets.

Randy
CFB


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## Stunnax0ne (Apr 3, 2007)

THanks a lot guys, I'm making a run to my LFS soon so what I have on my list so far is dechloronator and a HOB filter. Should I be looking for anything else? BTW can someone explain to me what HOB stands for or whats the difference between this filter? Thanks.


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## cfb (Mar 14, 2007)

Stunnax0ne said:


> THanks a lot guys, I'm making a run to my LFS soon so what I have on my list so far is dechloronator and a HOB filter. Should I be looking for anything else? BTW can someone explain to me what HOB stands for or whats the difference between this filter? Thanks.


HOB=Hang On Back... just a quick way of saying a filter that hangs on the back of your tank. HOB filters provide mechanical and extra biological filtration.

Randy
CFB


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## mylesc99 (Sep 5, 2005)

I was wondering what that meant too.


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## Stunnax0ne (Apr 3, 2007)

I've put the new HOB filter together and also added dechloronizer drops, I'm seeing my piranha are on the move a lot more now. Thanks for all the help guys, I just wish I would have though of asking for help before the 3rd muskateer had to die







I also wanted to know that is it normal for the fish to breathe a little harder after they have eaten? I've always noticed this. Thanks again everyone.


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## SERRAPYGO (Feb 4, 2003)

Stunnax0ne said:


> I've put the new HOB filter together and also added dechloronizer drops, I'm seeing my piranha are on the move a lot more now. Thanks for all the help guys, I just wish I would have though of asking for help before the 3rd muskateer had to die
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Personally, I don't think dechlorinating drops had much to do with this particular situation...but whatever...it sounds like everything is on the upswing. It's possible they will breathe a little harder if they over stuff themselves, but becareful, there's no need to overfeed them...it kind of sounds like over feeding got you into this situation in the first place. Too much food and emphasis is placed on feeding adults and sub-adults, IMO. They just don't need it...and it often leads to more harm than good. Glad all is well!


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