# i feel sick, still in shock



## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

i still cannot believed this happened, and i might be done with the hobby. i just acquired a 7"-8" h. aimara through a vendor at another site, MFK. well, i was a little worried about him jumping, and i only had a small area of about 2"x4" open on the tank from my AC70 hob. i had weights and everything on the lids, but he still managed to find his way out. i should have been MUCH more concerned, as i now see. i asked someone about all this and they said not too worry...not blaming them, it's my own fault for not being prepared enough...they were just stating their experience with the fish. i was going to lower the water to about 2/3 of full, but decided not to, it was easily the worst decision in my fish keeping experience.

so, i came down to my basement, where the aimara was, and immediately panicked as he was not in the tank. after a few moments i located him about 3-4 feet from the tank. i immediately thought he was dead, already for sure, but i tossed him back in, anyway. this was around 10:30 EST. to my surprise, although upside down, he started breathing, his gills were going really fast, and i thought he might just make it. i had little idea of how long he had been outside the tank, could have been 15 minutes or a few hours. well, the breathing continued for about 1 1/2 to two hours, very rapid, and i still had hope. however, after that, it slowed considerably for another 30-45 minutes, then just eventually stopped.

i wrapped him up and tossed him in the snow outside, not sure why, but really doesn't matter. anyone who knows about these fish, knows how rare it is in the hobby.

i'm not so sure i will recover from this one, i still feel shocked it happen after 2 days!!! i feel sick, and don't know if i will go forth from the hobby at this point. and great i have to be up for work early. i just had to vent and write something before i head off to bed. not sure if this makes sense but i'm so shocked still i can't accept this even happened.














awesome fish. he was pretty chill for the short time i had him, would just lay hidden in some pvc. that and a crapload of $$$ down the toilet for the one fish i wanted more than any piranha.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

sorry for your lost man, I had a jardini once and it jumped out of the opening for HOB. that's one of the reason why I don't use any HOB now. 
hope you'll come out of it.


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## CichlidAddict (Jul 1, 2005)

Ouch, it would be tough to lose a holy grail fish like an aimara. Sorry to hear it man.


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## TheCableGuy (Feb 22, 2005)

Sorry for your loss.








I've lost an oscar like that before.


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## bigshawn (Dec 29, 2005)

Damn Prime, I know how excited you were to get this fish man I feel for you, I know you took a big hit here but we or should I say I need guys like you in this hobby keep you head up man this will pass..........


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## Tdot_Jack (Nov 16, 2009)

Whats done is done and can't be undone, there are many speed bumps in life. Twas a rare fish, but that doesn't mean it can't be replaced. Look forward to another one sometime in the not so distant future. Also start saving lol, I know of one person who has it, and he paid some 3,000$ for it.


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## Us And Them (Dec 4, 2008)

Hey Prim3 ,

Im terribly sorry for Your loss , But I dont understand . Hoplias Aimara are a Type of Lung Breathing Fish . they have a primitivel LUNG
for that very reason.....

Prim3 , I wish I could have talked to you the instant this happened , Old Fisherman Tricks and a Powerhead Could have probably Saved its life.... I dont understand how it died , they should be able to Withstand Being out of water for atleast 2 days.

Once again , Im terribly sorry and sad for you , AS i KNOW HOW EXPENSIVE and Rare , Aimaras' Really Are ..

Take care.
But IMO what probably killed him was the Sudden Shock of the Water , You should have put It in a bucket and began the acclimation Process.


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## glockner99 (Nov 2, 2005)

I'm sorry for your loss.....
Your story reminded me of the morning I went downstairs to find my Red Tail Gold Asian Arowana dried on the floor...
I also thought I was done with the hobby...but one of the LFS owners I spoke to gave me some advice to keep it in perspective....
He told me that the hobbyists like us who keep Rare and expensive species have to expect death or loss...and before we purchase our $$$ fish...we should make the decision that we are willing to take a loss sooner or much later because in the end we are dealing with animals(fish) that live in an environment in home aquaria that so much can happen so quick. I agreed with him...It still doesn't change the fact that it sucks....Best wishes!


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

Jon87 said:


> Hey Prim3 ,
> 
> Im terribly sorry for Your loss , But I dont understand . Hoplias Aimara are a Type of Lung Breathing Fish . they have a primitivel LUNG
> for that very reason.....
> ...


thanks for the well wishes, guys. still somewhat in shock and how bad this is hasn't hit home fully yet. i will probably keep going forward, i was just so dismayed late last night. like i said this was the one species i really wanted. who knows maybe some other day down the road.

i thought so too, as far as them living out of water for an extended period of time...your right it probably was shock. when i first tossed him back in, he was lying upside down, but still breathing heavily. it continued for 2 hours, then slowed down considerably for like 1/2 hour+, till the point it just stopped. i thought he might be alright because of this, he even moved his body slightly, in the beginning. however, by the time the breathing was slow, he was very limp and stiff.

out of curiousity, what could i have done? toss 'em in a bucket and add a little water at a time? or what? what about a powerhead? damn i wish i had at least posted while it was happening, here. i added some stress coat, but even wish i had had some aquarium salt at the time.


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

My condolences man...


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## Us And Them (Dec 4, 2008)

primetime3wise said:


> Hey Prim3 ,
> 
> Im terribly sorry for Your loss , But I dont understand . Hoplias Aimara are a Type of Lung Breathing Fish . they have a primitivel LUNG
> for that very reason.....
> ...


thanks for the well wishes, guys. still somewhat in shock and how bad this is hasn't hit home fully yet. i will probably keep going forward, i was just so dismayed late last night. like i said this was the one species i really wanted. who knows maybe some other day down the road.

i thought so too, as far as them living out of water for an extended period of time...your right it probably was shock. when i first tossed him back in, he was lying upside down, but still breathing heavily. it continued for 2 hours, then slowed down considerably for like 1/2 hour+, till the point it just stopped. i thought he might be alright because of this, he even moved his body slightly, in the beginning. however, by the time the breathing was slow, he was very limp and stiff.

out of curiousity, what could i have done? toss 'em in a bucket and add a little water at a time? or what? what about a powerhead? damn i wish i had at least posted while it was happening, here. i added some stress coat, but even wish i had had some aquarium salt at the time.
[/quote]

Yeah When they are out of water , Remember they aren't USING their Gills , Which is why it would have appeared Quite Lifeless.
Yeah Definetly Would have Just Dripped him Man , Very Slow , Consistent Drip , Now the Powerhead Method Is Something i actually Picked up from RNR , which ended up saving my Little Mac. Coudos to RnR.

You Pick up your Fish and Place Him in Front of yourPower head , Its Like CPR for Fish , You Hold it in front of the Powerhead , Until
You see his breathing return to 1 Breathe EVERY 2 Seconds.

Now , For the Drip I would have kept him in Very Shallow Water , Just enough to Wet Its Fins and Begin the Drip. Drips Can be created with Gravel Vacs with that Little Clamp attachment that it comes with.

Once again terribly sorry Prim3.

But I would have Sat him in Very Shallow Water , Enough to Keep its Fins wet , and Began the Drip from Than,


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

^now i feel even a little more sick for not asking for help when it was happening, and knowing i could have possibly saved it by doing those things.

thanks, at the very least it's something to know about in the future.

after the first bit after i tossed him in, i really thought he was gonna make it as his gills were going strong and rapid. then, like i said they really slowed down to the point they just stopped.


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## Pit_man (Sep 13, 2008)

sry for ur loss prime


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

thx. this just really hits home hard. this is not a species of fish you can just go to your LFS for, as most of you know.


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## Us And Them (Dec 4, 2008)

primetime3wise said:


> ^now i feel even a little more sick for not asking for help when it was happening, and knowing i could have possibly saved it by doing those things.
> 
> thanks, at the very least it's something to know about in the future.
> 
> after the first bit after i tossed him in, i really thought he was gonna make it as his gills were going strong and rapid. then, like i said they really slowed down to the point they just stopped.


Look at like this.. IMAGINE , Someone is strangling You (Fish Jumps out of tank)... and You can Barely Breathe , just enough to keep your body functions going(Primitve Lung).
Then all of a Sudden , That person Lets Go (Back into Tank ) and someone BlastsYou to Africa (The Difference in temp inside and outside the tank ) in a matter of seconds and Shoots Your Lungs Full Of oxygen to MAX CAPACITY After You damn well Just near Died in the Cold North American Climate ,You were just being was being Strangled in.

LOL , it makes sense . in a strange retarded analogy Kind of way


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

primetime3wise said:


> i thought so too, as far as them living out of water for an extended period of time...your right it probably was shock. when i first tossed him back in, he was lying upside down, but still breathing heavily. it continued for 2 hours, then slowed down considerably for like 1/2 hour+, till the point it just stopped. i thought he might be alright because of this, he even moved his body slightly, in the beginning. however, by the time the breathing was slow, he was very limp and stiff.
> 
> out of curiousity, what could i have done? toss 'em in a bucket and add a little water at a time? or what? what about a powerhead? damn i wish i had at least posted while it was happening, here. i added some stress coat, but even wish i had had some aquarium salt at the time.


how high from the ground is your tank? if the fall is pretty high then it might have hurt the fish somewhat, IMO
not sure about the bucket trick but probably not too important I think, the shock from going back to the tank shouldn't be what kills it. imagine if the fish is out of water for a period of time in the wild to move from one water body into an other, once it gets there it'll just go right into the water which will be similar what you have done. unless it can find a bucket and some air tube to start a drip on its own...which I highly doubt about that..

as for the power head you can point the outlet towards to head of the fish to help move water into and out of the gill which will help it breath, or at least place an air stone under its head to provide more oxygen exchange.
I once bought a tilapia from fish market and only found out they didn't kill it (which normally they would kill it and gut it, etc) so I put it in a cooler filled with tap water and put an air stone under it, 30 minutes later it was all up and swimming around. that was after it being in a plastic bag for probably a good 2 hrs or so, I was surprised myself...anyway, the point is if "first aid" was done properly than just throw it back in the tank and hope for the best, you could've saved its life.

anyway, what's done is done, just learn from this incident so you know what you can try next time should similar event happens, of course, we all hope it won't happen again but a little info won't hurt anyone.
next time just make sure you seal up every damn opening on the tank and don't use HOB filters with fish that are known to jump out. nothing wrong with HOB but it just requires too big of an opening. unless you can find a way of sealing the opening (like using egg crates) I would recommend get rid of them. just my 2 cents


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## Us And Them (Dec 4, 2008)

jp80911 said:


> i thought so too, as far as them living out of water for an extended period of time...your right it probably was shock. when i first tossed him back in, he was lying upside down, but still breathing heavily. it continued for 2 hours, then slowed down considerably for like 1/2 hour+, till the point it just stopped. i thought he might be alright because of this, he even moved his body slightly, in the beginning. however, by the time the breathing was slow, he was very limp and stiff.
> 
> out of curiousity, what could i have done? toss 'em in a bucket and add a little water at a time? or what? what about a powerhead? damn i wish i had at least posted while it was happening, here. i added some stress coat, but even wish i had had some aquarium salt at the time.


how high from the ground is your tank? if the fall is pretty high then it might have hurt the fish somewhat, IMO
not sure about the bucket trick but probably not too important I think, the shock from going back to the tank shouldn't be what kills it. imagine if the fish is out of water for a period of time in the wild to move from one water body into an other, once it gets there it'll just go right into the water which will be similar what you have done. unless it can find a bucket and some air tube to start a drip on its own...which I highly doubt about that..

as for the power head you can point the outlet towards to head of the fish to help move water into and out of the gill which will help it breath, or at least place an air stone under its head to provide more oxygen exchange.
I once bought a tilapia from fish market and only found out they didn't kill it (which normally they would kill it and gut it, etc) so I put it in a cooler filled with tap water and put an air stone under it, 30 minutes later it was all up and swimming around. that was after it being in a plastic bag for probably a good 2 hrs or so, I was surprised myself...anyway, the point is if "first aid" was done properly than just throw it back in the tank and hope for the best, you could've saved its life.

anyway, what's done is done, just learn from this incident so you know what you can try next time should similar event happens, of course, we all hope it won't happen again but a little info won't hurt anyone.
next time just make sure you seal up every damn opening on the tank and don't use HOB filters with fish that are known to jump out. nothing wrong with HOB but it just requires too big of an opening. unless you can find a way of sealing the opening (like using egg crates) I would recommend get rid of them. just my 2 cents
[/quote]

The fall is another Option , that could have injured Your fish. But the Bucket method And Drip is absolutely Necessary ESPECIALLY since
the Fish is going From no Water to Completely Submerged in water.. DP I couldnt see the fish Just Jumping in the water , that wouldnt make any sense because Fish need time to Adjust to the levels of the water. unless it was a completely balanced Ecosystem.

With NON Lung Breathing Fish You have No option , But if your fish Jumps out , The Fact that it has no Oxygen will kill it , or the shock of throwing it back in the tank after and extended period of time Would kill it.
JP , an Airstone isnt what is giving Your Fish the oxygen , The exchange of Gasses from the Surface agitation it receives from the Airstone , is what does.

Drip Method was very important , IMO.

Cheers/

You could have 1000 Airstones , but if You dont have room for Gas exchange or your lid is too tight , expect mortality within 24 hours.


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

^from the top of the 75g i would say almost 5 feet from the ground, plus however high he jumped out.

yes, this hobby can drive you crazy from time to time, but sh*t happens i guess...i know most of you know this... since this is a piranha website. i would bet that almost all of us have at least lost a rb or other pygo before, and i have seen 12" piraya, or similar, go down, on this site over the years.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

Jon87 said:


> You could have 1000 Airstones , but if You dont have room for Gas exchange or your lid is too tight , expect mortality within 24 hours.


unless your tank is completely air tight and completely water tight (at the top) and filled to the max other wise there will always be gas exchange going on, especially if you have air stone. it pumps air from the out side into the tank. even all the gas doesn't completely dissolve into the water and most of them will be released into air once the bubble breaks at the surface it is still providing fresh air into the tank which will eventually gets into the water via surface agitation.


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## Us And Them (Dec 4, 2008)

I see what You mean , I always wondered why airstones were in the Hydrosponge Filters , thats makes sense.
And about the depth , lol my mistake I meant Levels as In pH etc. not level as in water level.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

Jon87 said:


> I see what You mean , I always wondered why airstones were in the Hydrosponge Filters , thats makes sense.
> And about the depth , lol my mistake I meant Levels as In pH etc. not level as in water level.


ok i see what you mean, but i seriously don't think that will be too critical as compare to go from fish in a bag from vendor into fish tank. in the shipping case, fish is in a small amount of water, and bio waste produced will probably lower the pH to a certain level so there's a bigger difference between water in the bag and water in the tank. however, some people have just put fish directly into tank water without drip and never had an issue. i've never ordered on online so no idea what would/could happen if drip is not used.
the fish out of water and exposed in air, the pH of the air is well...no idea but if there is such reading I'd say probably 7??? and the pH in the tank water is usually around that, so the damage can't be too great that's why I compare with as a fish travel from one water body on to dry land, "walk" over a distance then enter an other water body. I wouldn't think they do that often during wet season but probably more often during dry season. the pH and water parameter between two water bodies could be quite different.. for example, one is drying up with tons of dead fish in it and one is much deeper and still have a good amount of water.

they are very hardy fish so I don't think that little will effect much.

I think the most important thing is to help increase the water flow through the gill so the fish can breath better and regain strength, either via power head or air stone, or even just simple holding the fish and move it back and forth over a period of time should help a bit.


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## Us And Them (Dec 4, 2008)

If you dont drip Your fish according to Sponsors Directions and it dies , Your Fish warranty will be void.
I wish we had more Wolf Experts Here !! Ive owned Red Wolf , But Never Aimara.

Theres a difference between a Fish in the Bag and a fish out of Water .

Bagged Fish shows some Trace level of pH , Out of Water Fish no pH.

So imagine this If the pet store has a Low pH and Your tank Has a High pH , theres is a chance of mortality if not dripped properly.
Now , Imagine , Your Fish is out of water and A bit dazed and Confused , then BAM , you throw him in a tank with a pH of 7.5.

Your telling me not to expect mortality ? lol


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

Jon87 said:


> If you dont drip Your fish according to Sponsors Directions , Your Fish warranty will be void.
> I wish we had more Wolf Experts Here !! Ive owned Red Wolf , But Never Aimara.


good point, that's why I said it's more critical to drip when you receive fish from an online vendor









I've only have hoplias malabaricus and hoplias micropleis, but I figure they are similar??? the lucky part was that I never had them jumped out on me...even when I had HOB I used egg crate to cover up the opening on the lid and put something heaving on it.


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## FEEFA (Nov 19, 2007)

Sorry for your loss but dont let it discourage you from the hobby. sh*t happens and we just have to deal with it. I recently lost a rtg arow aswell and the worst part is I dont even know exactly what the cause was.


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## Us And Them (Dec 4, 2008)

JP You had a MicroPelis ???? thats awesome . great Wolfs IMO.

Im trying to get a JB group Order Bring myself in a Malibaricus ... If only Snakeheads were Legal in Ontario ... Sigh..
Once again Prim3 , dont let it discourage you man. I would Get another Aimara , if the price is right.


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

Jon87 said:


> JP You had a MicroPelis ???? thats awesome . great Wolfs IMO.
> 
> Im trying to get a JB group Order Bring myself in a Malibaricus ... If only Snakeheads were Legal in Ontario ... Sigh..
> Once again Prim3 , dont let it discourage you man. I would Get another Aimara , if the price is right.


yeah, there is really no other fish i want more than an aimara, and even with the loss, spending a bunch of money is worth it in the long run if it is a fish that lives for many many years...just probably not now, that was a hard hit on my wallet and a tough way to learn a lesson.

thanks for the encouraging words guys, it means a lot.


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## Us And Them (Dec 4, 2008)

Yah , I can barely scrape enough by with what Ive Got , so im always trying innovative new ways to create alternatives to expensive items
Like a PowerHead , With Some Pvc and 1 Pvc Elbow Joint Easily Can modify Your Return Nozzle to act as a Very Strong Powerhead.

Take A look around , and see what else people have to offer , If Im not Mistaken arent Snakeheads legal where Your from?


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## Armand_caribe (Sep 9, 2009)

Gutted for your loss dude,







however, is it so serious to make you quit the hobby?, I mean all of us in some point of our life being a fish keeper have experienced losses.

Chin up dude, you can always get another one in the future and you'll be more experienced.

Cheers.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

snakeheads are illegal over the entire US so that's out of questions.

H. microlepis is no comparison to H. aimara, if I can ever free up my square tank I'd love to own one...but then I need an other 180g for my 12" diamond. can't see that happening anytime soon in this crappy economy, my wife would kill me before I buy the tank


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## Ja'eh (Jan 8, 2007)

It certainly sucks to lose a fish like that, sorry for your loss.


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

Armand_caribe said:


> Gutted for your loss dude,
> 
> 
> 
> ...


i'll be fine, was more of a kneejerk reaction last night, i'm not going anywehere. you have to realize that fish was a whole lot of chedder $$$.


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

i hear you guys about the economy, in general. i have a nice job in I.T., but, i am pretty pesimistic about the long term prospects of the us economy. makes me wary to buy any more fish at this point.

i really also think our classifieds have taken a hit since the recession started. fish that would have been snagged up real quickly now sit there months and months. it could also be the general activity of the site, as we don't get as many members in anymore, compared to who leaves. but still, point is, i hear you guys about being wary of spening a bunch of money on fish.


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## Ja'eh (Jan 8, 2007)

primetime3wise said:


> Gutted for your loss dude,
> 
> 
> 
> ...


i'll be fine, was more of a kneejerk reaction last night, i'm not going anywehere. you have to realize that fish was a whole lot of chedder $$$.
[/quote]

Just out of curiousity how much was he/she worth?


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## Us And Them (Dec 4, 2008)

I dont want to get anything that expensive just because of that possibility. Most I would Pay for a Fish would be $500 and only because
The Bigger and Older they get it seems the greater the chance that they may die.


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

Ja said:


> Gutted for your loss dude,
> 
> 
> 
> ...


i'll be fine, was more of a kneejerk reaction last night, i'm not going anywehere. you have to realize that fish was a whole lot of chedder $$$.
[/quote]

Just out of curiousity how much was he/she worth?








[/quote]

ugh. it's horrid. $850 + $125 for shipping from california...for an 7"-8" one. that's just about as small as i have seen them available...which is why i jumped on it. they seem to have become more available in recent times, so maybe the price will go down in the future, but, yeah...ouch.


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## Ja'eh (Jan 8, 2007)

Wow that hurts me just reading that.


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## Winkyee (Feb 17, 2003)

Very sad man, Very Sad..


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

yeah, pretty sickening, i don't think many here realize how rare this species is. until SA/george and a few others started importing them recently, i think there were only a small handful in north america.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

yea, i've never seem them on sale anywhere until recently but they are usually big as compare to 7-8" don't think I can spend that much on a fish..


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

jp80911 said:


> yea, i've never seem them on sale anywhere until recently but they are usually big as compare to 7-8" don't think I can spend that much on a fish..


not so sure i will be able to anymore







too much can go wrong with fish, even seemingly healthy ones. i've seen so many nice piranha deaths on this site, over the years, for sometimes no apparent reason.


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## Ja'eh (Jan 8, 2007)

Yeah that's what scares me off of getting a manuelli again.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

primetime3wise said:


> yea, i've never seem them on sale anywhere until recently but they are usually big as compare to 7-8" don't think I can spend that much on a fish..


not so sure i will be able to anymore :laugh: too much can go wrong with fish, even seemingly healthy ones. i've seen so many nice piranha deaths on this site, over the years, for sometimes no apparent reason.
[/quote]

I know people spends thousands of dollars on some nice asian aros then ended up with a dried up one on the floor. we all know it sux but it's part of the hobby I guess, just gotta take it like a man, learn from the mistake and march on.


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## CLUSTER ONE (Aug 2, 2006)

Sorry to hear it died. Just live and learn i guess. 1000$ loss too, on top of how much you wanted that fish. Gl on whatever you decide to do in this hobby.


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## Armand_caribe (Sep 9, 2009)

primetime3wise said:


> Gutted for your loss dude,
> 
> 
> 
> ...


i'll be fine, was more of a kneejerk reaction last night, i'm not going anywehere. you have to realize that fish was a whole lot of chedder $$$.
[/quote]

Just out of curiousity how much was he/she worth?








[/quote]

ugh. it's horrid. *$850 + $125 *for shipping from california...for an 7"-8" one. that's just about as small as i have seen them available...which is why i jumped on it. they seem to have become more available in recent times, so maybe the price will go down in the future, but, yeah...ouch.
[/quote]








that was a big ammount for a fish tho, I understand your feeling, but at least you spent that money trying to get a nice fish and then he suffered an unexpected accident.

If its money what we are talking about, some months ago I was victim of a fraud and some MoFkrs were able to steal from me $2300.00 bucks they cheated on me as if I were a 12 year old boy, I still remember it and I don't believe I was so dumb to fail with his story but anyway sometimes inteligent(I believe I'm one of them tho :laugh: ) people do stupid things you're not the only one dude...

Cheers.


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## JoeDizzleMPLS (Nov 5, 2007)

sorry to hear it man, i really hope you are able to sit back and think about all the great things you've gotten from this hobby over the years and realize that the good far outweighs the bad... i feel like this every time i lose a nice fish and i know it must be harder for you since this was your dream fish. keep your head up man, the hobby needs good guys like you.


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

thanks guys. yea i just wanted a large, not too skittish predator, and couldn't really think of a better species...maybe some time down the road.


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

primetime3wise said:


> thanks guys. yea i just wanted a large, not too skittish predator, and couldn't really think of a better species...maybe some time down the road.


what about oscar? :tongue:


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

jp80911 said:


> thanks guys. yea i just wanted a large, not too skittish predator, and couldn't really think of a better species...maybe some time down the road.


what about oscar? :tongue:
[/quote]

that's starting to look closer to my fish budget now


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## jp80911 (Apr 3, 2008)

primetime3wise said:


> thanks guys. yea i just wanted a large, not too skittish predator, and couldn't really think of a better species...maybe some time down the road.


what about oscar? :tongue:
[/quote]

that's starting to look closer to my fish budget now :rasp:
[/quote]

poor men thinks alike


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## His Majesty (Apr 5, 2005)

real sory to hear what happened. its a real shitt sitution. hope you dont quit the hobby because of this setback.


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## Us And Them (Dec 4, 2008)

More Pygos!


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

i'm good. would have been nice to have another monster, but like i said maybe down the road. nothing like monster fish, i still am amazed by my 14" rhom just looking at him, his size impresses me.


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