# The Wasp Injector Knife



## 0S1R1S (Aug 29, 2010)

Has anyone seen these yet? Awesome concept.

This weapon injects a freezing cold ball of compressed gas, approximately the size of a basketball, at 800psi nearly instantly. The effects of this injection will drop many of the world's largest land predators. The effects of the compressed gas not only cause over-inflation during ascent when used underwater, but also freezes all tissues and organs surrounding the point of injection on land or at sea. When used underwater, the injected gas carries the predator to the surface BEFORE blood is released into the water. Thus giving the diver added protection by diverting other potential predators to the surface.
































Check out their website for more info and pricing.


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## sadboy (Jan 6, 2005)

I want one.... Were can I get it.....


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

holy sh*t!!!! that thing is badasss!!!!

ak...where you at on this!?!?? lmao!


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## ICEE (Feb 3, 2007)

What if it stabs a person


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## sadboy (Jan 6, 2005)

Instant death I assume...

Looks like the price is around $400 plus tax.


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## Bawb2u (May 27, 2004)

Didn't seem to cut that watermelon very good.


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## Wide_Eyed_Wanderer (Aug 22, 2006)

This weapon scares the f*ck out of me. Would rather get shot with a 50 cal than stabbed with this.


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## kove32 (Oct 26, 2004)

Genius!!! I wonder how many people will get killed with this thing..either way, I want one.. I don't know why I want it, but I do!


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

This is crazy, can anyone buy them if so i don't want to be the next stabbing victim, f*cking worse than getting shot like DT said


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## His Majesty (Apr 5, 2005)

thats one hell of a scary weapon. i want one


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## WhiteLineRacer (Jul 13, 2004)

horrible and should be illegal what the hell is wrong with you people, would you want a drunk chav to get hold of one of them.


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## His Majesty (Apr 5, 2005)

no but i want one to defend myself against a chav


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## WhiteLineRacer (Jul 13, 2004)

and thats whats wrong with the whole I need a gun cause he may have a gun issue







They did that with nukes too untill some people woke up.


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## His Majesty (Apr 5, 2005)

is this even legal in england?


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## Piranha Dan (Nov 11, 2007)

So the guy on the receiving end gets shanked, frozen from the inside out, then pops like a balloon......talk about adding insult to injury.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

lol no it wouldn't be legal in England, u get put on tag for having a screwdriver in your pocket without a good reason, there is no way this death weapon would be legal.

Who do these guys think they are? Diving equipment, yes because divers actively seek fights with great white sharks where they would need a death tool like this.


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## Nick G (Jul 15, 2007)

that would come in handy during all my ...err... diving trips.


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

nope...i just got off the phone with the gun rights lobbyists...they're calling it an air compressor that, like most any other tool, has the prospect of being misused inherint in it's design.


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## CLUSTER ONE (Aug 2, 2006)

I saw this on CSI, criminal minds or one of those crime shows. It was a divers friend who grabbed the knife not knowing what it was and killed somebody with it after their stomack exploded.


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## Ibanez247 (Nov 9, 2006)

Why are watermelons always used for demonstrations for weapons? Should be a pig or something.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

if everyone in the world had a gun... people would be a lot more courteous and crime would drop.

Would you cut that guy off in rush hour traffic if you knew he had a gun?

Would that same guy not let you in just to be a d!ck if he knew you had a gun?

Would you walk into a gas station rob the place and punch the clerk in the face with 4 other people in there if you knew everyone in there had a gun like you?

as far as this knife.... who cares.... if someone wants to hurt you / kill you what does it matter what they use really? gun knife poison... none sound like fun to me thats why I am a nice guy... dont want people to try and kill me.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

What if no one had guns? Sounds a lot better to me, unlikely, but a lot better.


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## His Majesty (Apr 5, 2005)

yeh but people would still have knives, base ball bats, metal pipes etc. its not the weapon that kills. its the person whos using it. you can use a gun to hunt or to murder. you can use the bat to smack a ball with or smash your friends head in. the asshole who wants to hurt you is the real problem


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

hah what if noone had guns... thats what the gov has been trying to do for YEARS and you see how that works.... the bad guys are the ones with guns.... so they automatically have an upperhand.

drugs are illegal everywhere...... yet somehow people still get them... I am pretty sure they have been outlawed for QUITE sometime.


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## JeanLucPicard (Nov 15, 2010)

c_granger21 said:


> if everyone in the world had a gun... people would be a lot more courteous and crime would drop.
> 
> Would you cut that guy off in rush hour traffic if you knew he had a gun?
> 
> ...


If everyone needed a gun to feel safe, we mine as well start living in Feudal style castles again.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

I dont think everyone needs a gun to feel safe. Never said that..... I said I think people would think twice before doing things if they knew everyone had a gun. And I know the news it rather one sided.... but if you watch it..... people are CRAZY shooting people for no reason.. robbing people raping people.... I think the numbers would drasticly drop if they had the thought in the back of their mind that wow everyone in this place im about the rob has a gun....


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

I knew something like this would start








Let's be honest about one thing, it's easier to kill someone with a gun then it would be with a bat or a knife. I personally don't like guns but I know the Americans love them and there's nothing wrong with that. I just don't want to live in a society where everyone is carrying a gun legally, might as well just wear full body armour everywhere you go if you feel your in constant danger. Who's to say crime would be reduced? Criminals would have guns and them knowing other people do won't stop them, you'll just have more bloodshed in the long run with everyone getting involved in gun fights.









ps. Don't worry, I'm not starting a campaign or joining one to get rid of guns in the US, your guns are safe


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

but... like I said in my earlier thread.... you can try and stop guns all you want... they wont stop... just like drugs.

so what is the point in outlawing them when the only ones that will have them then is the outlaws.

for the record traveller just cause it seems this is what your getting at I am not a NRA loving gun toting hillbilly nor do I even own a gun. Just saying I think ALL people having guns is a much better solution than just the criminals having them.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Sounds nice, but I can't see it working. People are going to rob or steal whether or not everyone has a gun, and adding more people into the equation will just be madness.


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## CLUSTER ONE (Aug 2, 2006)

c_granger21 said:


> if everyone in the world had a gun... people would be a lot more courteous and crime would drop.
> 
> Would you cut that guy off in rush hour traffic if you knew he had a gun?
> 
> ...


How would this work? Police have guns. Criminals have guns. Are they courteous of eachother? No they create shootouts. If everybody had guns it would then turn into who had the better gun. If somebody had a pp7 vs another with a ak47 do you think the person with the ak will respect the person with the small gun very much? You would have to regulate the guns people coule have and then you are right back to the current thought of regulating guns. Personally I like the thought of no guns alot better. Mayby you have differnt thoughts then me but i don't want a road rager or somebody with anger problems to be carrying a gun. They may shoot regardless if somebody else has a gun or not.


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## JeanLucPicard (Nov 15, 2010)

America would turn into Battle Royale.

Anyone here seen City of God? Imagine the kids who get the guns. It would be just like that, but with white people.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

cluster the person with anger problems can already have a gun...... you guys make no sense.... all I am saying is IF GUN laws pass and guns are regulated.... who are the people who are not going to have guns? the law abiding citizens.... who is STILL going to have guns? the people who are going to do bad with them. They may shoot regardless.... but they may think wow.... i might not want to shoot someone in this place because I am dead for sure after I do that.


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## Smoke (Sep 8, 2010)

Nice, ordered a few for my kids!


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

CLUSTER ONE said:


> if everyone in the world had a gun... people would be a lot more courteous and crime would drop.
> 
> Would you cut that guy off in rush hour traffic if you knew he had a gun?
> 
> ...


How would this work? Police have guns. Criminals have guns. Are they courteous of eachother? No they create shootouts. If everybody had guns it would then turn into who had the better gun. If somebody had a pp7 vs another with a ak47 do you think the person with the ak will respect the person with the small gun very much? You would have to regulate the guns people coule have and then you are right back to the current thought of regulating guns. Personally I like the thought of no guns alot better. Mayby you have differnt thoughts then me but i don't want a road rager or somebody with anger problems to be carrying a gun. They may shoot regardless if somebody else has a gun or not.
[/quote]

flawed logic...criminals commit crimes. a gun does not change that fact. i defend myself from crimes, as you probably do as well. now perhaps only a minority of criminals who commit crimes have a gun, and an even smaller fraction are willing to use that gun unprovoked...your chances are very small, of actually being involved in a life threatening situation, in which a gun would change the outcome in your favor. however, for those who dont like to play the odds, a gun is a reasonable tool to carry, "just in case". criminals will always have weapons, which they'll use to commit crimes. it's a matter of, do you want to defend yourself from ALL crimes to some capacity, or do you want to play the odds that a criminal will never present a life threatening situation to you.

i tried to write that paragraph as objectively as possible.


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## His Majesty (Apr 5, 2005)

^


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## MPG (Mar 14, 2010)

I'm expecting this weapon to show up in all the next fps video games.


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## CLUSTER ONE (Aug 2, 2006)

r1dermon said:


> How would this work? Police have guns. Criminals have guns. Are they courteous of eachother? No they create shootouts. If everybody had guns it would then turn into who had the better gun. If somebody had a pp7 vs another with a ak47 do you think the person with the ak will respect the person with the small gun very much? You would have to regulate the guns people coule have and then you are right back to the current thought of regulating guns. Personally I like the thought of no guns alot better. Mayby you have differnt thoughts then me but i don't want a road rager or somebody with anger problems to be carrying a gun. They may shoot regardless if somebody else has a gun or not.


flawed logic...criminals commit crimes. a gun does not change that fact. i defend myself from crimes, as you probably do as well. now perhaps only a minority of criminals who commit crimes have a gun, and an even smaller fraction are willing to use that gun unprovoked...your chances are very small, of actually being involved in a life threatening situation, in which a gun would change the outcome in your favor. however, for those who dont like to play the odds, a gun is a reasonable tool to carry, "just in case".For you it is nice to have as you know your intentions though I don't want millions of others armed who I don't know or trust.The topic was everybody in the nation carrying not just those who choose to. You may be responsible but I don't want some guy with anger management issues carying criminals will always have weapons, which they'll use to commit crimes.If you arm yourself they will arm themselves better. They will evolve to suit their needs. The wolrd carrying guns will just make criminals have to carry bigger guns, larger bullets, quicker fire, longer range. it's a matter of, do you want to defend yourself from ALL crimes to some capacity, or do you want to play the odds that a criminal will never present a life threatening situation to you.I think this is flawed logic. Saying arming everybody will protect the inoccent is rediculous. If everybody arms themselves with pistols then gangs will arm themselves with machine guns. Do street gangs not shoot eachother because they know the other gangs have guns too or do they find other methods such as drivebys to attack lethally while minimizing risk to themselves? Gang wars go on and both sides have guns. Just becasue they have guns doesn't stop the other side it creates drivebys, ambushs and uneven firepower attacks...

i tried to write that paragraph as objectively as possible.
[/quote]

If everybody had a gun that would simply increase the seriousness of crimes. Nobody will now rob a store with a knife. They would start robbing stores with high powered weapons, robbing in groups for increased fire power (as a casheier probably won't try and stop 5 guys with guns aimed at him), blitz attacks and probably do things like holding hostages for protection. If guns were widespread it won't magically stop crimes it will just escalate them to a more lethal level.

Imagine no weapons at all. Everybody just has two fists. Will there be no crime? No. People who want to fight will form groups for protection, bulk up for strength and if they are getting into a fight they probably don't want to get hit with the first shot. Those who are innoccent will probably be alone without being trained fighters. They have the same weapons though if somebody wants to rob you 5 vs one chances are you lose. You are better off giving them what you want, defending yourself and having police after them later. If you fight back against 5x your power chances are you will get your face kicked pretty good. Did a level playing field weapon wise stop crime? No. The criminals will work so they get the edge whether is is though gangs, training, blitz attacks, hostages, drivebys... If a criminal is serious they would probably have their gun drawn right away knowing if they don't the others will which isn't stopping anything it just means they must adapt to regain an advantage. Eventually you have millions walking around with machine guns, shotguns... for protection as you you want to do a pistol a gang will do better automatic weapons and so on.

Better being beat up with fists then outshot.


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## AKSkirmish (Jun 24, 2005)

c_granger21 said:


> I dont think everyone needs a gun to feel safe. Never said that..... I said I think people would think twice before doing things if they knew everyone had a gun. And I know the news it rather one sided.... but if you watch it..... people are CRAZY shooting people for no reason.. robbing people raping people.... I think the numbers would drasticly drop if they had the thought in the back of their mind that wow everyone in this place im about the rob has a gun....


Nope
More people in my area carry firearms....wether it be for personal protection or for hunting or just for wildlife protection.....Yet we still have some of the highest crime rates..









I know in my area it doesn't matter one bit....People just simply dont care...


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## Wide_Eyed_Wanderer (Aug 22, 2006)

If everyone had a gun







. You know that American History cartoon, with all the scared, shivering, petrified, pilgrims with their shotguns shooting at every minor thing that spooked them? Thats how it would be if everyone had a gun.


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## sadboy (Jan 6, 2005)

Look I want one to keep the Canadian's at bay..... I know their up to something


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## Piranha Dan (Nov 11, 2007)

The problem with regulation is that it doesn't solve anything and intrudes on what is, in America, a Constitutiional RIGHT, not a privelege. Criminals, by definition, do not obey the law, therefore passing laws prohibiting certain weapons does two things: Jack and sh*t.
You tell Joe Average from Suburbistan he can't own an automatic weapon, he says "OK" and doesn't own one.
You tell Bob the gang banger he can't own an automatic weapon, he smuggles in a crate of them from Mexico and carries one around anyway. The problem is not guns. It's crime. Banning one has no effect on the other.
Case in point: Chicago, until very recently, had enacted a complete ban on handguns. A few years ago it smashed the record for most handgun shootings in one weekend (50 or so if I remember).
By the way, I still think that is an AWESOME knife.


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## zippa (Apr 29, 2005)

Ibanez247 said:


> Why are watermelons always used for demonstrations for weapons? Should be a pig or something.


 These guys always test weapons on flesh. Be it whole pigs,side of beef,ribs,skull etc.

Go to 1:27 in this video.


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## JeanLucPicard (Nov 15, 2010)

The great sword (aka 2 handed sword) was a Norman weapon right? Edit:



> It was only from the 11th century that Norman swords began to develop the quillons or crossguard. During the Crusades of the 12th to 13th century, this cruciform type of arming sword remained essentially stable, with variations mainly concerning the shape of the pommel. These swords were designed as cutting weapons, although effective points were becoming common to counter improvements in armour, especially the 14th century change from chain mail to plate armour.[25]
> 
> It was during the 14th century, with the growing use of more advanced armor, that the Hand and a half sword, also known as a "bastard sword", came into being. It had an extended grip that meant it could be used with either one or two hands. Though these swords did not provide a full two-hand grip they allowed their wielders to hold a shield or parrying dagger in their off hand, or to use it as a two-handed sword for a more powerful blow.[26]


Source


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

this is like beating a dead horse.... cluster sounds like your very peaceful and possibly a bit to optimistic for me.... "get rid of all weapons" alright.... and lets have chocolate rivers and rainbows in the sky everyday. My theory is a lot more realistic.... because you will never EVER ever get ALL the guns... you may take them away from the people that follow rules but every criminal that wants a gun will have one. just like drugs, they are always going to be around.

I understand you think if EVERYONE had a gun... there would be more bloodshed... valid arguement I just disagree I believe if everyone had a gun it would deter would be criminals... and as far as big groups robbing places.... that happens now bigger higher powered guns ur just getting silly now.... it doesnt matter if I have a $100 .22.... if it is up to the criminals head and he has a fully auto .50cal he is going to have a hard time turning around. And it is kind of hard to run with a gun like that also.


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## JeanLucPicard (Nov 15, 2010)

c_granger21 said:


> this is like beating a dead horse.... cluster sounds like your very peaceful and possibly a bit to optimistic for me.... "get rid of all weapons" alright.... and lets have chocolate rivers and rainbows in the sky everyday. My theory is a lot more realistic.... because you will never EVER ever get ALL the guns... you may take them away from the people that follow rules but every criminal that wants a gun will have one. just like drugs, they are always going to be around.
> 
> I understand you think if EVERYONE had a gun... there would be more bloodshed... valid arguement I just disagree I believe if everyone had a gun it would deter would be criminals... and as far as big groups robbing places.... that happens now bigger higher powered guns ur just getting silly now.... it doesnt matter if I have a $100 .22.... if it is up to the criminals head and he has a fully auto .50cal he is going to have a hard time turning around. And it is kind of hard to run with a gun like that also.


How old are you? just curious


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

old enough to vote.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Cluster has a valid argument and it already is the case in the US, from my limited understanding about US gun laws, civilians can only legally purchase certain firearms. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Law enforcement are able to posses fire power civilians can't, and this is because small time criminals wouldn't be able to get their hands on expensive weaponry. Special law enforcement teams are out their to deal with the ones that can, swat ect. If everyone was able to have a gun, prices would be reduced making higher power weaponry easier for everyone to posses, even criminals.

You can't make sure everyone uses their gun responsibly, say a robber busts into a bank with a gun, people start shooting all over the place "protecting" themselves. What happens if a bullet goes stray and kills an innocent child, how do you proceed with the law in prosecuting the person who's stray bullet killed that child? Self defense? I know if it was my child I would want the person who saw fit to take the law into their own hands prosecuted to the fullest degree. There's a reason why the world isn't like this, not everyone is trained to the extent that they know what to do in a firefight, not every average Joe is a sharpshooter.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Sorry just feel very strongly on this subject... I don't think it is right to take guns away from the people who have them legally jump through all the hoops to have them. For whatever reason. Because no matter how many laws are made criminals will still have guns. Trust me no where did I say I wouldnt like ALL guns to be goe aswell... I just think it is a bit unrealistic is all.


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## CLUSTER ONE (Aug 2, 2006)

Sure a small gun can kill but if everybody has small guns criminals will probably get automatic weapons that can fire much faster and if they are robbing a store I'd think they would be alot more prepared for you then you are for them. They see you and know you have a gun yet you may not know their actual intention so they have the element of suprise which means the gun is probably up to your head and not vice versa.They know their intentions alot earlier then you do and therefore would be prepared for any resistance probably before you even see them. Sure if they don't see you you could stop them but if they are expecting everybody to have guns im sure they will try to counter them before they can even be used.

I did not say ban guns altogether I am just pointing out your idea of everybody carrying it rediculous at best for saying it would make a safer society. In north america it is almost impossible to ban guns unless you want to ban hunting as well. Plus places like Alaska people carry to protect themselves from wildlife.

Even AK (who is from Alaska) says most people up there carry some weapon and it has a high crime rate not low like you suggest it would be. You say the knowlege that others are also armed being a deturent obviously is flawed in this case.

Mayby it is just you being American and me Canadian that I don't understand what it is like to walk down a street where everybody caries guns. My area also does not get shotup so IMO my area is doing great even though people don't commonly carry guns. They are not banned outright but the vast majority chooses not to carry.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Ummm I would think it would be classified as unintentional manslaughter? No exactly sure what that scenario would fall under... but in no way would that person be excused. If you pull the trigger your accepting responsibility for where that bullet goes. But if it were a life or death situation.... I would like to have the gun so I had the option to pull that trigger.

"Rather be tried by 12 than carried by 6"

Well cluster... I wish I lived in a safer neighborhood.

Think of all the scenarios people could have been stopped.... If someone was armed.

Nearly all of the school shootings could have been stopped short if teachers were to be carrying guns....
Lane Bryant store where those women were lined up and executed... instead of getting on their knees someone could have done something.

Ok.. one example is not enough to completely disregard my opinion.... Because there is a town in texas that EVERYONE carries a gun. And thier crime rate dropped significantly cannot remember the name of the town of the top of my head.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

It won't bring back the child though.


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## CLUSTER ONE (Aug 2, 2006)

Last thing I will say:

Look at all the countires in the world with low crime rates and those with high crime rates. Notice that the ones with low crime rates are not the countries where half the population is armed.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Nope will not bring them back.... that is one scenario I could run a million by you.... what if the guy killed him... and later found out he was going to kill everyone in the place??? So yes one kid died.... but saved an entire room of people.


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## WhiteLineRacer (Jul 13, 2004)

Piranha Dan said:


> So the guy on the receiving end gets shanked, frozen from the inside out, then pops like a balloon......talk about adding insult to injury.


the treble whammy!!!


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Cluster.... Those statistics mean nothing though.... just because the crimes arent reported doesnt mean they dont happen. I would like to see the information that proves armed civilians are directly related to crime.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

just googled lowest murder rates... and over half of the lowest 10 countries are in africa....................

just want to say cluster dontwant any hard feelings you are knowledgable and are one of the people I look forward to answering my questions regarding piranhas ! just obviously have a different opinion here.


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

guns are here to stay...there's billions of them in the world, and they can be easily manufactured by someone with some machine shop experience. cannons, pistols, hell, even bombs can all be manufactured in a shed in the middle of nowhere montana...so the fact is, you're never going to disarm the world.

traveler, that would be a terrible situation as you describe it...i think guns in the hands of criminals can be combated with better gun laws than we have now. innocent children are killed by stray bullets all the time in this country, from some gang banger idiot shooting at some other idiot on a porch step over a bum drug deal. there are many steps that would reduce that type of crime, and i think the first one is to legalize drugs. the second is to document firearms from their origin. i know this would be a hairy subject with a lot of people, but it's better than the alternative, which can be seen in goofy regulation such as the assault weapons ban, and the brady bill...there's no doubt that there needs to be regulations on guns...but the regulations need to be more targeted, instead of just banning random features, or establishing time periods where someone can buy a gun.

at the end of the day, this is america. the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. it's in the US constitution. other countries may scoff at that, but it is what it is. it's an amendment to a piece of paper which is the framework for this country. people are just going to have to accept that.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

link?


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

http://www.mapsofworld.com/world-top-ten/countries-with-lowest-murder-rates.html

I also strongly agree with legalizing drugs... check out this TOP murder countries.... http://www.mapsofworld.com/world-top-ten/countries-with-highest-murder-rates.html


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

They appear to be countries with very very strict gun laws.


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## Da' Manster! (Sep 1, 2009)

Ibanez247 said:


> Why are watermelons always used for demonstrations for weapons? Should be a pig or something.


yeah, but where are you going to find a cop who is willing to do that?!


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Info on guns in Senegal


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

traveller................................................... now your just pulling facts out of thin air.... they appear to be.... why are they a different shape on the map.

http://www.nationsencyclopedia.com/economies/Africa/Senegal-POVERTY-AND-WEALTH.html

i think it has something more to do with NOT being able to afford guns in senegal.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

They are. Research them.
Iceland's cops don't even carry guns, lol.
I just posted the faq. for Senegal.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

theres the population of iceland.... http://www.google.com/publicdata?ds=wb-wdi&met=sp_pop_totl&idim=country:ISL&dl=en&hl=en&q=iceland+population................................


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

lol
Never mind, I'm not even going to bother anymore. Your right, those countries people are armed to the teeth.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

i wouldnt bother either... because there is 300k people in iceland... go to that same link and click US theres 300million.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

It takes population into account. Dude your right. FREE GUNS FOR EVERYONE!! LETS MAKE THE WORLD A SAFER PLACE!!!


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

no need to pout...just cause I can bring up google links just as fast as you


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Links?
Senegal Gun Law
Iceland Gun Law
Burkina Faso Gun Law
Cameroon Gun Law
Finland Gun Laws
Gambia Gun Law
Mali Gun Law
Saudi Arabia Gun Law
Mauritania Gun Law
Oman Gun Laws

Notice anything in common? Either not allowed to posses firearms or very strict regulations. And they are mostly in the lowest number of privately owned firearms (guns per 100 people) in the world.

Dude your making no sense what so ever. Research before you say something.

I'm not pouting, I'm laughing at how your trying to prove your point







You don't seem to understand what the stats mean.


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## 0S1R1S (Aug 29, 2010)

So mark everyone down for one of these for the annual pfury knife fight?


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

ok the last 3..... say nothing.also saw nothing about lowest % of gun per 100 people...


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Gun Ownership

Last three? lol Try all.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Alright...... where is columbia on the highest gun per 100 people....? it was one of the top murder capitals...? US wasnt on the top 10 murder count...........

gun ownership.... is not in direct correlation with crime / murder rates..... your links you just posted combined with the ones I posted prove that.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Stop pulling at straws here. 
Columbia really? Drug capital of the world. These stats are for REGISTERED firearms.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

OK your stats are for registered FIREARMS mine were for MURDER US was top of registered firearms... and nowhere to be found on the murder list !


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Firearm Homicide

Dude start finding the links.


> United States: % homicides with firearms = 46


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

Traveller said:


> Gun Ownership
> 
> Last three? lol Try all.


what a stupid chart...AKskirmish accounts for half this nations guns in the first place...could you imagine if libya or egypts people were armed with guns...they would've had no problem toppling their corrupt regime, and probably would've have had to live with it in the first place...look at libya, they dont stand a chance against their government until the big bad united nations comes in and starts bombing ghadafi. what country is going to come to the US citizens aid if the government ever turned on us? fact is, my gun is for my protection. i'd feel really bad if someone took my guns and the next day i was shot by a gang banger for my sweet jordans...but in this country that would happen, and then the gang banger would turn the gun in, be assured of no charges against him, and paid 300 dollars per gun turned in...but the kicker is, it'd come out of my taxes!!! BAHAHAHA.


----------



## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

That thing is sweet just not $400 sweet









I picked up a new CZ SP-01 Phantom today 18+1 9mm for $525 as a new carry for days I'm wearing loose fitting clothing otherwise I carry a HK45C...I'm pretty sure more kids are killed each year riding bikes then getting shot by law abiding citizens...Should bicycles be banned?


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Yemen is no.2 on the list, they haven't been able to overthrow their government yet after months of protest. It has more to do with foreign backing then gun possession


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

OK Traveller... except I never said US was a perfect place... never said they didnt own a lot of guns... but sitll you have yet to show me that we are the number one murder capital...... because we have the most guns....


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## JeanLucPicard (Nov 15, 2010)

Traveller is the only one here posting an actual argument rather than just posting an opinion.


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

c_granger21 said:


> OK Traveller... except I never said US was a perfect place... never said they didnt own a lot of guns... but sitll *you have yet to show me that we are the number one murder capital...... because we have the most guns....*


swish. stick a fork in this argument...


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

I never said that, you said more guns equal safer place, but the stats prove otherwise. The US is the closest to having everyone armed, yet it isn't the safest place in the world.


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

10pointers said:


> Traveller is the only one here posting an actual argument rather than just posting an opinion.


wrong...the claim is that more guns=more deaths due to guns

what specific statistic proves this? everything else is conjecture. how many guns per person...etc...most violent nations...none of that sh*t matters. the US has the most guns in the world per capita...do we have the most murders at the hands of guns per capita? no sir. in light of that, he really hasn't made an argument...or if he has, it hasn't been a good one.


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## JeanLucPicard (Nov 15, 2010)

r1dermon said:


> Traveller is the only one here posting an actual argument rather than just posting an opinion.


wrong...the claim is that more guns=more deaths due to guns

what specific statistic proves this? everything else is conjecture. how many guns per person...etc...most violent nations...none of that sh*t matters. the US has the most guns in the world per capita...do we have the most murders at the hands of guns per capita? no sir. in light of that, he really hasn't made an argument...or if he has, it hasn't been a good one.
[/quote]

Can you prove that gun ownership increases personal security? On a statistical level?


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

Stats are for registered firearms. Also don't forget poverty, poverty is a leading cause of crime.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

having the most registered firearms... and having everyone armed is not even close to the same arguement........... one person (gun collector) can register as many guns as they want......


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

Traveller said:


> I never said that, you said more guns equal safer place, but the stats prove otherwise. The US is the closest to having everyone armed, yet it isn't the safest place in the world.


so what don't visit the US if your so fearful thats your choice. Why is this even being discussed...I've had my CCW for the last 10 years and I've never even drawn my carry. So why do I carry? Because I can.

If I could buy an RPG I would just for shits and giggles, however I'm wanting to buy a suppressor just not sure how to go about it legally.


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

ZOSICK said:


> I never said that, you said more guns equal safer place, but the stats prove otherwise. The US is the closest to having everyone armed, yet it isn't the safest place in the world.


so what don't visit the US if your so fearful thats your choice. Why is this even being discussed...I've had my CCW for the last 10 years and I've never even drawn my carry. So why do I carry? Because I can.

If I could buy an RPG I would just for shits and giggles, however I'm wanting to buy a suppressor just not sure how to go about it legally.
[/quote]

I've been to the US multiple times, and believe me, I have been to worse places. I'm not saying get rid of all privately owned guns in the US, I'm just saying the argument of having everyone armed would reduce crime is not true.


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

10pointers said:


> Traveller is the only one here posting an actual argument rather than just posting an opinion.


wrong...the claim is that more guns=more deaths due to guns

what specific statistic proves this? everything else is conjecture. how many guns per person...etc...most violent nations...none of that sh*t matters. the US has the most guns in the world per capita...do we have the most murders at the hands of guns per capita? no sir. in light of that, he really hasn't made an argument...or if he has, it hasn't been a good one.
[/quote]

Can you prove that gun ownership increases personal security? On a statistical level?
[/quote]

would the cops carry them if they didn't?

since that probably wont satisfy your voracious appetite for information, i'll provide you with some studies...

http://www.rense.com...eral76/univ.htm

"guns are used three to five times more often to stop crime, than to commit it"
1. Gary Kleck, _Targeting Guns: Firearms and Their Control_, N.Y.: Aldine de Gruyter, 1997, p. 160; FBI Uniform Crime Reports, _Crime in the United States_, annual reports.

"fatal shootings of criminals occur in only a fraction of 1% of protective firearm uses nationwide"
4. Kleck, pp. 163-164.


> In his book, _More Guns, Less Crime_,1 Prof. John R. Lott, Jr. provides the most comprehensive study of firearm laws ever conducted. With an economist's eye, Lott examined a large volume of data ranging from gun ownership polls to FBI crime rate data for each of the nation's 3,045 counties over an 18-year period. He included in his analysis many variables that might explain the level of crime--factors such as income, poverty, unemployment, population density, arrest rates, conviction rates and length of prison sentences. With 54,000 observations and hundreds of variables available over the 1977 to 1994 period, Lott's research amounts to the largest data set that has ever been compiled for any study of crime, let alone for the study of gun control. And, unlike many gun control advocates who masquerade as researchers, Lott willingly made his complete data set available to any academic who requested it.
> 
> "Many factors influence crime," Lott writes, "with arrest and conviction rates being the most important. However, nondiscretionary concealed-handgun laws are also important, and they are the most cost-effective means of reducing  crime."
> 
> ...


do you have anything supporting an alternative viewpoint 10pointers?



> *the argument of having everyone armed would reduce crime is not true.*


please provide a single scientific study that has arrived at that conclusion.


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## JeanLucPicard (Nov 15, 2010)

Rense.com is your source?


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

Traveller said:


> I never said that, you said more guns equal safer place, but the stats prove otherwise. The US is the closest to having everyone armed, yet it isn't the safest place in the world.


so what don't visit the US if your so fearful thats your choice. Why is this even being discussed...I've had my CCW for the last 10 years and I've never even drawn my carry. So why do I carry? Because I can.

If I could buy an RPG I would just for shits and giggles, however I'm wanting to buy a suppressor just not sure how to go about it legally.
[/quote]

I've been to the US multiple times, and believe me, I have been to worse places. I'm not saying get rid of all privately owned guns in the US, I'm just saying the argument of* having everyone armed would reduce crime is not true.*
[/quote]

Well no sh*t sherlock...Thats why kids under the age of 21, felons and so on can't own a firearm legally ...In my state If you have a DUI you can't get your CCW for 3 or 5 years if you all ready one it's void, also I don't believe the mentally handicapped can't own a firearm legally.

R1 Lives in MA so basicly he can only play with bows, crossbows and air guns







you gotta move R1 just not to Nebraska


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

10pointers said:


> I never said that, you said more guns equal safer place, but the stats prove otherwise. The US is the closest to having everyone armed, yet it isn't the safest place in the world.


so what don't visit the US if your so fearful thats your choice. Why is this even being discussed...I've had my CCW for the last 10 years and I've never even drawn my carry. So why do I carry? Because I can.

If I could buy an RPG I would just for shits and giggles, however I'm wanting to buy a suppressor just not sure how to go about it legally.
[/quote]

I've been to the US multiple times, and believe me, I have been to worse places. I'm not saying get rid of all privately owned guns in the US, I'm just saying the argument of* having everyone armed would reduce crime is not true.*
[/quote]

Well no sh*t sherlock...Thats why kids under the age of 21, felons and so on can't own a firearm legally ...In my state If you have a DUI you can't get your CCW for 3 or 5 years if you all ready one it's void, also I don't believe the mentally handicapped can't own a firearm legally.

R1 Lives in MA so basicly he can only play with bows, crossbows and air guns







you gotta move R1 just not to Nebraska








[/quote]

crossbows? hell no man...not unless you're handicapped and hunting.

(ps i have one if you're interested...cheap)


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## Guest (May 19, 2011)

I haven't been able to find an unbiased study yet, most are US groups supporting strict regulation, others are from the NRA and similar groups supporting less regulation. Once I find an independent study, I'll post it, though I'm not going to go out of my way to find one. But the statistics do have meaning in the argument.


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

gangbangers need to start doing drive by crossbowing, I'd rather be shot by a gun than stabbed by the wasp or shot with a broadhead.


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

totally agree...

traveler, unless you do your own study based on the statistics that you yourself have compiled, the data will always be skewed one way or another...what you have to find is many studies which examine the same variables, to see if there is any bias influencing one or anothers final conclusion. i dont think you can attribute a 51% drop in crime to an increase in gun ownership in florida entirely, but there is no evidence to suggest that it tempered that statistic.


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## JeanLucPicard (Nov 15, 2010)

ZOSICK said:


> gangbangers need to start doing drive by crossbowing, I'd rather be shot by a gun than stabbed by the wasp or shot with a broadhead.


Get a little GENGHIS KHAN up in this BITCH


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

america has raped the second amendment... millitia yeah right







america a free state









Im pretty sure most 1st world countries have strict gun laws and we aren't being slaughtered in the streets by gun violence and bad guys, the world isn't the wild wild west. If someone wants to kill you and you have a gun unless your psychic and can react to the murderer before he pulls the gun to your head it might help you. Also if i was a criminal and everyone had guns i would be more tempted to shoot since i don't wanna get capped... if the citizens don't have guns all they need to do is flash it and no shoot people in fear of being shot themselves.

And c_granger how can you comare the countries you were to the states... columbia el salvador


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

10pointers said:


> gangbangers need to start doing drive by crossbowing, I'd rather be shot by a gun than stabbed by the wasp or shot with a broadhead.


Get a little GENGHIS KHAN up in this BITCH
[/quote]










It's been my experience that a boar shot with an arrow bleeds more than one shot in the same location with a bullet...

bob firearm regulations vary from state to state


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## JeanLucPicard (Nov 15, 2010)

ZOSICK said:


> gangbangers need to start doing drive by crossbowing, I'd rather be shot by a gun than stabbed by the wasp or shot with a broadhead.


Get a little GENGHIS KHAN up in this BITCH
[/quote]










It's been my experience that a boar shot with an arrow bleeds more than one shot in the same location with a bullet...

bob firearm regulations vary from state to state
[/quote]

There's no question there if you ask me - I processed over 30 bucks last fall, the ones shot with rifle were clean, the ones hit by bow were just disasters in general. This could have been because of accuracy of the shot, person shooting etc. but it stuck out in my mind.


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

skirmish, you got a line on one of these knives?


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## AKSkirmish (Jun 24, 2005)

r1dermon said:


> skirmish, you got a line on one of these knives?












Not that I would get one for just anyone


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

Are these things proven (durability), it just seems like a gimmick to sell a low quality blade at a premium price


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## AKSkirmish (Jun 24, 2005)

it is nothing I would buy for a "quality" blade







Money can be spent alot better if thats what one is looking for-
"fun" factor sells it though to those not into diving.....


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## Da' Manster! (Sep 1, 2009)




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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

AKSkirmish said:


> it is nothing I would buy for a "quality" blade
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thats my point







this isn't something I would ever carry for daily or hunting purposes. AK I haven't even had to sharpen fallkniven kronor you recommended 3+ years ago thanks man


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

yeah that kershaw blur has continually shred boxes...in-fact, i lost it during a snow storm and found it a month later in a melting snowbank covered in salt and grime...gave it a quick rinse and buffed it with the dremel and it's still in mint condition minus a few frame scratches. lol. can't recommend this knife enough.


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## Guest (May 20, 2011)

bob... read all the posts... the reaosn I compared to columbia was because columbia IS one of the top 10 as far as murders go... and they are not even on the list for one of the scountries with a lot of guns so before you







read all the posts.. in no way am I trying to say columbia is in the same boat as the US but... it was proving a point.


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

are you kidding me itsead of







now im




























obviously columbia has alot of murdered









they are in a conflict that has been ongoing since the 60's have you ever heard of the FARC the ELN better yet what about the cartels


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

it's pointless to argue that point...have you ever heard of the bloods, crips, ms13, hells angels...etc...these are the long arms of the same cartels you blame for gun crime in that country...i guess we have to discount ALL gun crime committed by gangs now? if so USA's numbers would be minescule compared to what they are now.


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

never head of these bloods or crips







its really no argument i can go get a gun in canada the only differance is i dont feel threatend enough to walk around with a gun on me, your admitting you have rampant crime in the states and you cant walk around unarmed







If you live in south central or brookly ok you might be better of with a gun i will admit that









and why would the gangs all the sudden be discounted there america citizens... most of em anyways


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

> Furthermore, in recent years, the gap in violent crime rates between the United States and Canada has narrowed due to a precipitous drop in the violent crime rate in the U.S. For example, while the aggravated assault rate declined for most of 1990s in the U.S. and was 324 per 100,000 in 2000, the aggravated assault rate in Canada remained relatively steady throughout and was 143 per 100,000 in 2000. In other areas, the U.S. had a faster decline. For instance, whereas the murder rate in Canada declined by 36% between 1991 and 2004, the U.S. murder rate declined by 44%. [sup][8][/sup] Both Saskatoon and Regina consistently have Violent Crime rates that would place them among the 10 most violent cities in the US, and often individually exceed larger US centres in terms of Total numbers for Aggravated Assaults and Robbery.[sup][_citation needed_][/sup]


dont base your arguments on opinionated conjecture...dannyboy will surely call you out for it.
[sup][/sup]


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

so canada is getting worse than the states.... we still dont feel the need to walk around with guns







It must suck living in constant fear of getting shot by someone









and since crime is going down in the states and gun laws are getting more restrictive well im not going to put it together but makes ya wonder


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

bob351 said:


> *never head of these bloods or crips *
> 
> 
> 
> ...


you don't have poor minoritys that commit crimes in canada? I call major bullshit! Canada has no gangs? see the definition of a "gang" before you reply


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

sarcasm... my point was we have gangs are you f*cking serious you thought i didnt no about bloods and crips, f*cking amazing





















we have all the crime you guys have but we dont walk around in fear of being shot


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## Guest (May 20, 2011)

I wish there was a canadian p-fury......... i dont really care enough to learn about canada but I am sure it sucks just as bad as the US... hah... im done in this thread...

bob- your rather annoying I didnt know canada was so great until i met you.... why dont you go eat some puddin.... hah i know the US isnt perfect... but I also know canada cant be either...

WE dont walk around in fear either ...... god read for a minute and quit with ur stupid smiley faces............ i dont own a gun I work in some of the worst neighborhoods around.... I am just saying there are crazy ass people out there.... and if some crazy person pulls a gun on me and my family in walmart... i want to be able to do something and not stand there like a fool.


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

whos saying canada is perfect im only saying i dont feel like i need a gun when i go to the groery store, and c_granger unfortunetly you dont learn about the rest of the world in your schools but guess what we learn about you.



c_granger21 said:


> I wish there was a canadian p-fury......... i dont really care enough to learn about canada but I am sure it sucks just as bad as the US... hah... im done in this thread...
> 
> bob- your rather annoying I didnt know canada was so great until i met you.... why dont you go eat some puddin.... hah i know the US isnt perfect... but I also know canada cant be either...
> 
> WE dont walk around in fear either ...... god read for a minute and quit with ur stupid smiley faces............ i dont own a gun I work in some of the worst neighborhoods around.... I am just saying there are crazy ass people out there.... and if some crazy person pulls a gun on me and my family in walmart... i want to be able to do something and not stand there like a fool.


what are you gunna do tough guy... whip out our toolie well guess what that gang banger would pop your sorry ass in the head before you even got the chance


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

bob351 said:


> so canada is getting worse than the states.... we still dont feel the need to walk around with guns
> 
> 
> 
> ...


r1 i wanted you to comment on this before evryone else started chiming in saying canada is not perfect when no one said it is.


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

bob351 said:


> *sarcasm...* my point was we have gangs are you f*cking serious you thought i didnt no about bloods and crips, f*cking amazing
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I just figured you where an idiot that lived a very sheltered life.

Nor do I... nether do any of my neighbors the last crime we had in my hood was a golden retriever that was stealing yard ornaments and hiding them under his deck.


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

ZOSICK said:


> *sarcasm...* my point was we have gangs are you f*cking serious you thought i didnt no about bloods and crips, f*cking amazing
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I just figured you where an idiot that lived a very sheltered life.

Nor do I nether do any of my neighbors the last crime we had in my hood was a golden retriever that was stealing yard ornaments and hiding them under his deck.

Are you sure your not an idiot Bob?
[/quote]
Who's the idiot you really thought i had no clue about bloods and crips, you also believe i think all americans walk around with guns going to the grocery store, i know sarcasm is hard over text but seriously.....


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

who said anyone is living in constant fear? isn't it sort of an anomoly? like, you live in fear, so you carry a gun, but you carry a gun, so you dont live in fear...right? depending on which way you look at it...

basically what you're willing to admit, is that canada is not perfect, and does have violent gun crime. (its an indisputable fact). now, the USA has worse gun crime statistics, however, i imagine you're also willing to admit that the gang problem in the US is a much larger one than in canada as well...

perhaps the next step is to find all crime perpetrated by, and upon gang members in the US and canada, that way we're talking non-organized criminals vs. civilian, law abiding population. that way we'll get a clearer picture of the real stats. thing is, most gang related crime occurs in the inner city. it's segregated to a particular part of an area. there's not much in the way of "comingling" when it comes to gang members thuggin around in suburban neighborhoods (where it's likely that the vast majority of gun owners live). end of the day, until there's concrete numbers on gang members killing gang members with firearms presented, the gun crime is really skewed. (by your own admission, since you yourself downplayed the gun crime in columbia due to cartels).


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

r1dermon said:


> who said anyone is living in constant fear? isn't it sort of an anomoly? like, you live in fear, so you carry a gun, but you carry a gun, so you dont live in fear...right? depending on which way you look at it...
> 
> basically what you're willing to admit, is that canada is not perfect, and does have violent gun crime. (its an indisputable fact). now, the USA has worse gun crime statistics, however, i imagine you're also willing to admit that the gang problem in the US is a much larger one than in canada as well...
> 
> perhaps the next step is to find all crime perpetrated by, and upon gang members in the US and canada, that way we're talking non-organized criminals vs. civilian, law abiding population. that way we'll get a clearer picture of the real stats. thing is, most gang related crime occurs in the inner city. it's segregated to a particular part of an area. there's not much in the way of "comingling" when it comes to gang members thuggin around in suburban neighborhoods (where it's likely that the vast majority of gun owners live). end of the day, until there's concrete numbers on gang members killing gang members with firearms presented, the gun crime is really skewed. (by your own admission, since you yourself downplayed the gun crime in columbia due to cartels).


I do agree the gang violence is way worse in the states, not really a comparison to canada's rough areas, but my point was if you don't live in fear you don't need a gun...

Obviously the crimes committed by lawful gun owners is insignificant I support lax gun restrictions in canada but im not naive to think the more guns = less crime like some in this thread, crime will occur no matter what if the population has hand guns then they will get automatics if we get automatics then they get rpgs its a never ending battle. Also if someone puts a gun to your head and says give me your money it aint the movies your not going to be able to quick spin whip out your revolver and pop him in the dome. My issue with the thread is not the guns... its the people who think more guns = less crime.


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

bob351 said:


> who said anyone is living in constant fear? isn't it sort of an anomoly? like, you live in fear, so you carry a gun, but you carry a gun, so you dont live in fear...right? depending on which way you look at it...
> 
> basically what you're willing to admit, is that canada is not perfect, and does have violent gun crime. (its an indisputable fact). now, the USA has worse gun crime statistics, however, i imagine you're also willing to admit that the gang problem in the US is a much larger one than in canada as well...
> 
> perhaps the next step is to find all crime perpetrated by, and upon gang members in the US and canada, that way we're talking non-organized criminals vs. civilian, law abiding population. that way we'll get a clearer picture of the real stats. thing is, most gang related crime occurs in the inner city. it's segregated to a particular part of an area. there's not much in the way of "comingling" when it comes to gang members thuggin around in suburban neighborhoods (where it's likely that the vast majority of gun owners live). end of the day, until there's concrete numbers on gang members killing gang members with firearms presented, the gun crime is really skewed. (by your own admission, since you yourself downplayed the gun crime in columbia due to cartels).


I do agree the gang violence is way worse in the states, not really a comparison to canada's rough areas, but my point was if you don't live in fear you don't need a gun...

Obviously the crimes committed by lawful gun owners is insignificant I support lax gun restrictions in canada but im not naive to think the more guns = less crime like some in this thread, *crime will occur no matter what* if the population has hand guns then they will get automatics if we get automatics then they get rpgs its a never ending battle. Also if someone puts a gun to your head and says give me your money it aint the movies your not going to be able to quick spin whip out your revolver and pop him in the dome. My issue with the thread is not the guns... its the people who think more guns = less crime.
[/quote]

that is correct. so then, are you not safer with a gun than without? crime will occur regardless, and a gun is an implement with which to defend ones self...


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

If i had a gun technically i would be safer but i would not trust half the people i know to have a gun let alone most of the population... I know I can shoot I hunt etc but most people would end up hitting a civilian or pulling it out in inappropriate situations i mean if your getting robbed the guy dosnt deserve to be shot dead throw him in jail and if someone pulls a gun on you well i doubt your gun on your waist will do much and if you reached for it you would probably end up getting shot since the robber would be jumpy since you have a weapon.


----------



## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

bob351 said:


> *sarcasm...* my point was we have gangs are you f*cking serious you thought i didnt no about bloods and crips, f*cking amazing
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I just figured you where an idiot that lived a very sheltered life.

Nor do I nether do any of my neighbors the last crime we had in my hood was a golden retriever that was stealing yard ornaments and hiding them under his deck.

Are you sure your not an idiot Bob?
[/quote]
Who's the idiot you really thought i had no clue about bloods and crips, you also believe *i think all americans walk around with guns going to the grocery store*, i know sarcasm is hard over text but seriously..
[/quote]

I do... it's my right why not...It was a question not a statement bob! a simple no i'm not an idiot would have been fine, no need to get all hostile about a post. Apparently hostility is not the Canadian way.


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

bob351 said:


> *If i had a gun technically i would be safer* but i would not trust half the people i know to have a gun let alone most of the population... I know I can shoot I hunt etc but most people would end up hitting a civilian or pulling it out in inappropriate situations i mean if your getting robbed the guy dosnt deserve to be shot dead throw him in jail and if someone pulls a gun on you well i doubt your gun on your waist will do much and if you reached for it you would probably end up getting shot since the robber would be jumpy since you have a weapon.


/thread


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

r1dermon said:


> *If i had a gun technically i would be safer* but i would not trust half the people i know to have a gun let alone most of the population... I know I can shoot I hunt etc but most people would end up hitting a civilian or pulling it out in inappropriate situations i mean if your getting robbed the guy dosnt deserve to be shot dead throw him in jail and if someone pulls a gun on you well i doubt your gun on your waist will do much and if you reached for it you would probably end up getting shot since the robber would be jumpy since you have a weapon.


/thread
[/quote]

ha!


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

Yes if I had a gun not if everyone had a gun....

read the rest of the post, i knew you guys would do that


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

bob351 said:


> Yes if I had a gun not if everyone had a gun....


yeah but who's going to give a 3 year old a 9mm to carry around?


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## Guest (May 20, 2011)

Scenario A:
Man walks up to you and holds you at knife point demanding your wallet, you struggle and attempt to draw your weapon already sustaining injuries, you and the assailant are now wrestling for the gun. Gun could end up in your hands or the person attacking you.
Scenario B:
Man walks up to you and holds you at knife point demanding your wallet, you are unarmed and hand over the wallet. Assailant views you as no threat and makes a get away with your wallet.

Out of those two, which one would you deem the safer option? Remember crime will happen no matter what.


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

honestly from some of the videos that come outta the states...









I can just imagine if everyone had a gun, ohh wait i dont need to it already has happened... the wild wild west and that wasn't the safest place around











Traveller said:


> Scenario A:
> Man walks up to you and holds you at knife point demanding your wallet, you struggle and attempt to draw your weapon already sustaining injuries, you and the assailant are now wrestling for the gun. Gun could end up in your hands or the person attacking you.
> Scenario B:
> Man walks up to you and holds you at knife point demanding your wallet, you are unarmed and hand over the wallet. Assailant views you as no threat and makes a get away with your wallet.
> ...


Well put thats what i was trying to say...


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

what if in scenario B he stabs you in the neck and kills you?

what if in scenario A, you draw fast enough to shoot the assailant in the head, and keep your wallet?


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

Give me a break... how many time have you been robbed r1, from my experience they are not psychopaths they are criminals there a big difference and like i said its not the movies... its real life.


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## Guest (May 20, 2011)

Could easily do so in scenario A as well.

The point is in some cases a firearm may make you safer, but also possessing a firearm can aggravate the situation, it can easily be used against you because you don't know when the crime will happen, only the one committing it does.


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

what if, in scenario C the assailant holds a gun to your head (you are unarmed), and like a ninja, you wrestle the gun out of his hands, and point it at him. keeping your wallet, detaining an assailant until the cops come, and winning a gun. (hopefully a colt, but probably a cheap ass .38spl revolver, or kel-tec)


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

What if you miss his head and smoke a little girl shopping with her family on her birthday... what if you miss and hit a woman in the stomach and kill her un born baby.


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

bob351 said:


> Give me a break... how many time have you been robbed r1, from my experience they are not psychopaths they are criminals there a big difference and like i said its not the movies... *its real life.*


that's my point...anything can happen. even criminals, who ARENT psychopaths (are you a criminal psychologist? if so, how many patients have you treated? also, where's your phd from? and do you have a book?) can unexpectedly stab an unarmed victim in the neck and kill them.


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

Traveller said:


> Scenario A:
> Man walks up to you and holds you at knife point demanding your wallet, you struggle and attempt to draw your weapon already sustaining injuries, you and the assailant are now wrestling for the gun. Gun could end up in your hands or the person attacking you.
> Scenario B:
> Man walks up to you and holds you at knife point demanding your wallet, you are unarmed and hand over the wallet. Assailant views you as no threat and makes a get away with your wallet.
> ...


B! 
It takes 5min to cancel and request new cards! BTW I still have the option to yell at him if he turns around he's dead







Nebraska has let several law abiding citizen shoot a criminal in the back with no charges


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

bob351 said:


> Scenario A:
> Man walks up to you and holds you at knife point demanding your wallet, you struggle and attempt to draw your weapon already sustaining injuries, you and the assailant are now wrestling for the gun. Gun could end up in your hands or the person attacking you.
> Scenario B:
> Man walks up to you and holds you at knife point demanding your wallet, you are unarmed and hand over the wallet. Assailant views you as no threat and makes a get away with your wallet.
> ...


B! 
It takes 5min to cancel and request new cards! BTW I still have the option to yell at him if he turns around he's dead







Nebraska has let several law abiding citizen shoot a criminal in the back with no charges








[/quote]

lol...yeah, in most states he'd be target practice while he gets his little run in. haha.


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

r1dermon said:


> Give me a break... how many time have you been robbed r1, from my experience they are not psychopaths they are criminals there a big difference and like i said its not the movies... *its real life.*


that's my point...anything can happen. even criminals, who ARENT psychopaths (are you a criminal psychologist? if so, how many patients have you treated? also, where's your phd from? and do you have a book?) can unexpectedly stab an unarmed victim in the neck and kill them.
[/quote]
Ok so in a perfect america you see every citizen strapped... sounds like afghanistan not a world leader.

You can also get run over by a car should evryone carry 50.cal snipers to shoot out people engine blocks, please don't answer that I fear i will get a yes


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

i tend to walk on sidewalks.

but that brings up another interesting point. anybody could be run over by a car that some douche is driving...so should we ban them because we dont trust others to use them properly?


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

r1dermon said:


> i tend to walk on sidewalks.
> 
> but that brings up another interesting point. anybody could be run over by a car that some douche is driving...so should we ban them because we dont trust others to use them properly?


If we had an alternative way of getting around why not.... but we dont jsut like if we needed to cary a gun it would be a different story but in london cops dont even carry guns yet some american feel the need to, i will never understand you guys were so close but so very different









Seriously america is a "world leader" with more guns than an average household in afghanistan


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

good point...not that it matters to the discussion...but good point none-the-less.


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

the point was if the cops in london dont need guns why does every citizen in the states... this argument is going nowhere its not all americans belive in having guns so im dont with this, if your whole country and most of the civilised world dosnt agree with you and you still belive its the right way well f*ck it more power to you


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## Guest (May 20, 2011)

Cops in London have guns, not all the ones on patrol, but special units. Where I use to live you'd see cops walking round with mp5's if there was a stabbing.


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

terms you will never hear a responsible gun owner... Strapped, Clip, Gat, Piece, "9" (referencing all guns) ...Oh and I have 53 fire arms in my home every thing from a 22mag pistol to clay guns that are worth more than a new jeep wrangler







BTW Browning will custom make you a safe in any configuration you want for a price.


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

well...london may want to consider arming their police...if they're not going to let their populace arm themselves.

http://www.channel4.com/news/london-gun-crime-figures-worryingly-high


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## Guest (May 20, 2011)

Certain police are armed


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

obviously they have guns but alot dont patrol with guns... i thought that would be implied, sh*t i cant cut any corners when i post i will start giving 100% details at all times


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

bob, i dont understand why there is gun crime in a country where the citizens aren't allowed to own guns, and most of the cops aren't either! im not sure i get where that crime is coming from...is it imported from america?


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

were did that come from why does everything have to revolve around america... get over yourself


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## Guest (May 20, 2011)

Depends what area your in. My ends, feds with mp5's patrolling the highstreet. Safer areas, community support walking round, but they have to radio in for back up, but they stopped using them in some places cause they'd get robbed and have their radios stolen


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

bob351 said:


> were did that come from why does everything have to revolve around america... get over yourself


oh good! so gun crime has nothing to do with america...im glad we're on the same page.


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

ok.....


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## Guest (May 20, 2011)

A lot of the guns floating around ldn are replicas which are bored out to accept live ammunition, also guns which where deactivated for collection purposes which where then reactivated. Now they've put stricter laws on them.


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

Traveller said:


> A lot of the guns floating around ldn are replicas which are bored out to accept live ammunition, also guns which where* deactivated for collection purposes* which where then reactivated. Now they've put stricter laws on them.


Thats like owning a classic car with no drive train leaving it worthless and no longer collectible.


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

ZOSICK said:


> A lot of the guns floating around ldn are replicas which are bored out to accept live ammunition, also guns which where* deactivated for collection purposes* which where then reactivated. Now they've put stricter laws on them.


Thats like owning a classic car with no drive train leaving it worthless and no longer collectible.
[/quote]
i agree i have an old flintlock pistol that i want to reactivate to defend myself with


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## Piranha Dan (Nov 11, 2007)

Wait....so cops....regular cops.....in Britian.....where's it's illegal for the citizens to own firearms.....have to carry submachine guns!?!?!?


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## WhiteLineRacer (Jul 13, 2004)

Piranha Dan said:


> Wait....so cops....regular cops.....in Britian.....where's it's illegal for the citizens to own firearms.....have to carry submachine guns!?!?!?


It's a terrorist thing mainly.

Guns used by UK Police

In the year 2007-08, there were 6,780 Authorised Firearms Officers and 21,181 police operations in which firearms were authorised throughout England and Wales

Glock 17 pistol[3][4]
Glock 26 pistol (in use with the London Metropolitan Police Service)
Sig Sauer P226 pistol[4][5]
Walther P99 pistol (in use with Nottinghamshire Constabulary)
Heckler & Koch MP5 SF A3 semi-automatic carbine[4][5]
Steyr AUG Semi-automatic carbine, used by some forces instead of the MP5 carbine[4]
Heckler & Koch G36C semi-automatic carbine[6]
SIG 556 carbine (used by Strathclyde Police).
Heckler & Koch L104A1 baton gun less lethal option, fires Plastic Attenuated Energy Projectiles [4][5]
X26 Taser[3][4], a non-lethal weapon classified as a firearm
[edit] Specialist weapons (SFO)The following have in the past been on issue to Specialist Firearms Officers.

L1A1 irritant chemical launcher, launches projectiles of irritant substances such as CS gas or PAVA[4]
Remington 870 Pump-action shotgun, mainly used for door breaching[4]
Precision (sniper) rifles:

Heckler & Koch PSG1 sniper rifle[4]
Heckler & Koch G3KA4 battle rifle, used in sniping roles[4]
Heckler & Koch MSG-90 sniper rifle[4]
Heckler & Koch 93 sniper rifle[4]
Heckler & Koch HK417, used in sniping roles
Riflecraft TMR1 sniper rifle[4]
In some circumstances, fully automatic firearms can be authorised for use[citation needed].

Heckler & Koch MP5 A3, MP5K and MP5 SD3 fully automatic sub-machine gun, a variant of the semi-automatic version listed previously


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## Guest (May 20, 2011)

bob- back a few posts..... when I said in walmart the guy pulls his gun out........ and I said I would like to be able to protect myself.... well here in the US..... we have more than 5 people in walmart... so it would be almost impossible for him to focus on EVERYONE.

And I am glad you learn about our country in your schools. Gives your country some sort of goal....
You see in the US we dont have to learn about other countries...............................................................................

perks of being perfect.








(sorry couldnt find the canadian flag must be because I am an uneducated american)


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

canada is so much better than the USA...so many more rights...no need to fear anything...it's awesome. this must be a cartoon then.


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## JeanLucPicard (Nov 15, 2010)

r1dermon said:


> canada is so much better than the USA...so many more rights...no need to fear anything...it's awesome. this must be a cartoon then.


Finally, you're coming around


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

c_granger21 said:


> bob- back a few posts..... when I said in walmart the guy pulls his gun out........ and I said I would like to be able to protect myself.... well here in the US..... we have more than 5 people in walmart... so it would be almost impossible for him to focus on EVERYONE.
> 
> And I am glad you learn about our country in your schools. Gives your country some sort of goal....
> You see in the US we dont have to learn about other countries...............................................................................
> ...


To think we only have 5 people in walmart a at a time doesn't help your case there, if ya didn't know witch you probably didn't we have an electrical grid just like you, streets, highways, cars, you name it we have it... we've come along way since our igloo days of the 80's. You don't help your case with the rest of the world hating you for being completely arrogant, i cant blame your school system i no it must be hard learning all 230 years of it sh*t if ya needed to know a few other countries your heads would probably explode.


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## r1dermon (Mar 9, 2005)

bob351 said:


> bob- back a few posts..... when I said in walmart the guy pulls his gun out........ and I said I would like to be able to protect myself.... well here in the US..... we have more than 5 people in walmart... so it would be almost impossible for him to focus on EVERYONE.
> 
> And I am glad you learn about our country in your schools. Gives your country some sort of goal....
> You see in the US we dont have to learn about other countries...............................................................................
> ...


To think we only have 5 people in walmart a at a time doesn't help your case there, if ya didn't know witch you probably didn't we have an electrical grid just like you, streets, highways, cars, you name it we have it... *we've come along way since our igloo days of the 80's*. You don't help your case with the rest of the world hating you for being completely arrogant, i cant blame your school system i no it must be hard learning all 230 years of it sh*t if ya needed to know a few other countries your heads would probably explode.
[/quote]


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## Guest (May 20, 2011)

Wait a minute, igloo days of the 80's? So your saying that guy wasn't really the prime minister that spoke about the national igloo? Damn . . . .


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

Ohh heaven no we still have the national igloo where do you think our government works... unfortunately with global warming its melting thats hwy we are going to need that dome


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

this i what my parents grew up in they never let me forget how lucky we are to have a log cabbin, the red is seal blood since we don't have paint in canada


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

Bob351 have you ever heard of a knife that when stabbed injects an 800psi blast of CO2?


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## bob351 (Oct 23, 2005)

:laugh:


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## ZOSICK (May 25, 2005)

where can I get one of these? AK...


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## Bawb2u (May 27, 2004)

ZOSICK said:


> Bob351 have you ever heard of a *knife that when stabbed injects an 800psi blast of CO2*?


Now that's just crazy talk, that is. Where did you ever hear of such a thing?


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## AKSkirmish (Jun 24, 2005)

ZOSICK said:


> Bob351 have you ever heard of a knife that when stabbed injects an 800psi blast of CO2?


Diving supply store should beable to aquire one....


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