# Complete US Ban on Piranha's



## greenmonkey51 (Aug 16, 2004)

Better check this bill out. It has the potential to shut down ownership of any Piranhas period. Current fish would be grandfathered in, but after that kiss them goodbye.

http://www.defenders.org/resources/publica...vention_act.pdf


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## Dawgz (Aug 18, 2005)

f*ck that...


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## blackandgold4ever05 (Jun 5, 2008)

I hate this country anymore. I will end up leaving eventually for Canada or Europe. Why don't they sign a "bill" about investigating the terrible crimes committed by George Bush. (search youtube.com for "Loose Change"), You will see what I mean.

USA is already hated by the rest of the world and now they are gonna force all their own people to do the same.


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## greenmonkey51 (Aug 16, 2004)

blackandgold4ever05 said:


> I hate this country anymore. I will end up leaving eventually for Canada or Europe. Why don't they sign a "bill" about investigating the terrible crimes committed by George Bush. (search youtube.com for "Loose Change"), You will see what I mean.
> 
> USA is already hated by the rest of the world and now they are gonna force all their own people to do the same.


Do you seriously know anything about the the bill process. I suggest you watch some schoolhouse rock. Also using youtube for a source is not a real good idea. Keep the unrelated politics crap out of this thread.


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## routman21 (Jun 23, 2007)

blackandgold4ever05 said:


> I hate this country anymore. I will end up leaving eventually for Canada or Europe. Why don't they sign a "bill" about investigating the terrible crimes committed by George Bush. (search youtube.com for "Loose Change"), You will see what I mean.
> 
> USA is already hated by the rest of the world and now they are gonna force all their own people to do the same.


USA > YOU


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## Trigga (Jul 1, 2006)

i dont think piranha would get banned since they aren't fish that can survive any type of weather condition, but maybe the stereotype of piranha's may caused them to be banned anyway. I could care less im in canada so


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## Coldfire (Aug 20, 2003)

greenmonkey51 said:


> Do you seriously know anything about the the bill process. I suggest you watch some schoolhouse rock. Also using youtube for a source is not a real good idea. Keep the unrelated politics crap out of this thread.












You pulled out "schoolhouse rock"


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## Plum (May 4, 2006)

blackandgold4ever05 said:


> I hate this country anymore. I will end up leaving eventually for Canada or Europe. Why don't they sign a "bill" about investigating the terrible crimes committed by George Bush. (search youtube.com for "Loose Change"), You will see what I mean.
> 
> USA is already hated by the rest of the world and now they are gonna force all their own people to do the same.


Don't come to Canada.

Income tax is higher. Sales Tax is 13% in Ontario. Our cost of goods is higher than yours (Example - many fish products are on average 33% less in the USA i have found, in my experience). Our Economy is dwarfed by the USA's - thus you most likely won't find a job that pays as well up here in comparison. Also - it's cold.

All of these items impact your fish hobby - meaning dollars to invest into your piranha hobby. Be ar responsible Pfurian and stay in the USA - you and your pets will thank me.


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## Piranha Tank (Mar 22, 2006)

can anyone explain what was the message from greenmonkey51 i cannot open the file what was the actual message on complete ban of piranhas in us. thanks
shabbir


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## CLUSTER ONE (Aug 2, 2006)

Piranha Tank said:


> can anyone explain what was the message from greenmonkey51 i cannot open the file what was the actual message on complete ban of piranhas in us. thanks
> shabbir


"to prevent introduction and establishment of non native wildlife species that negitivly impacts the economy,m enviroment, or human or animals species health and for other pourposes"
Its not focussed on piranhas, but all non native wildlife.


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## Ibanez247 (Nov 9, 2006)

Large mouth bass were brought to the us fro mgermany way back 1920's or somethn just for the sport. Tell me that had no impact on natural wildlfe here. Jsut like anything else the us will; make it "illegal" but it wont matter. IF theres a way to get them they'll still be available. I can understand in certain climates but I live in VT no way a P is going to live in 60 degree water. Ok i jsut read that and hehe fro mwhat I gather ANY species not native will be banned. So say good by to pretty much any tropical fish. Cichilds arent native, well prety much anythign out of the amazon which is pretty much every tropical fish in my LFS. So why is it illegal to keep large mouth bass and other fish that are native? Just another chain on the link to pull tighter and control your life a litle more yaaaaay. Dont worry guys in another 40-50 years we'll be living in a one government world anyway so it doesnt matter where you live.


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## rhomkeeper (Mar 31, 2008)

they us government has tried this in the past and failed, the result would be the same this time around too, so not much need to worry, besides the way our government works it will take years to even get around to voting on it


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## greenmonkey51 (Aug 16, 2004)

sean-820 said:


> can anyone explain what was the message from greenmonkey51 i cannot open the file what was the actual message on complete ban of piranhas in us. thanks
> shabbir


"to prevent introduction and establishment of non native wildlife species that negitivly impacts the economy,m enviroment, or human or animals species health and for other pourposes"
Its not focussed on piranhas, but all non native wildlife.
[/quote]

Piranha are non native. They're also invasive. It doesn't matter if they can't live in the northern climates. Read the bill carefully and you'll see it says if the species can survive anywhere in the US then it will be banned. This bill will ban all importing, selling, buying, and breeding of piranhas. I suggest you guys take this seriously. Also largemouth bass are native to the eastern part of the US. They just have been stocked everywhere else.


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## redbellyman21 (Jun 27, 2004)

so what step is it in? like I have a black rhom already, but what about all the fish that r inventoried in lfs, are they allowed to be sold? or will they be terminated.. this will be the day that I will want to move the f out!


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## lo4life (Aug 12, 2008)

Ibanez247 does have a good point.. What about all the other types of tropical fish??


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## cueball (May 24, 2005)

wow this is going ot a happening topic i see,,,
COME TO CANADA COME ONE COME ALL BRING YOUR FISH TOO.... the only place in the world a piranha would last about 2 hours out doors lol let me guess some rich kid got bite by his pet so his rich daddy wants to put a ban on them


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## Nick G (Jul 15, 2007)

wonder what Frank thinks about this.

im not a lawyer and reading that pretty much put me to sleep... anyone have any law experience that can offer any real insight into the possibility of this actually happening?

moving to canada just isnt going to happen. no offense to canada, just not my style.


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## cueball (May 24, 2005)

o an i well be checking out "Loose Change" on you tube i hate bush with a passion , and anyone that don't think hes done north America harm you have a major screw louse he set north america back a half of a generation in only 8 years,,



Nick G said:


> moving to canada just isnt going to happen. no offense to canada, just not my style.










out of strictly comedy" why isn't canada not your style" we got the finest beer in the world{well nova scotia does anyways} ,, housing is cheeper in the eastern side of canada. sea food is like candy,over here and bin laden dont give a sh*t about canada{ its 80+ safer here} plus the girls are slutyer here lol whats there not to like

OUT OF COMEDY,,,,,,, there finer points to canada as well


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## Nick G (Jul 15, 2007)

cueball said:


> moving to canada just isnt going to happen. no offense to canada, just not my style.










out of strictly comedy" why isn't canada not your style" we got the finest beer in the world{well nova scotia does anyways} ,, housing is cheeper in the eastern side of canada. sea food is like candy,over here and bin laden dont give a sh*t about canada{ its 80+ safer here} plus the girls are slutyer here lol whats there not to like

OUT OF COMEDY,,,,,,, there finer points to canada as well
[/quote]
its not new jersey. my family doesnt live there.
anyway, back to the real topic here. sorry to derail.


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## blackandgold4ever05 (Jun 5, 2008)

cueball said:


> moving to canada just isnt going to happen. no offense to canada, just not my style.










out of strictly comedy" why isn't canada not your style" we got the finest beer in the world{well nova scotia does anyways} ,, housing is cheeper in the eastern side of canada. sea food is like candy,over here and bin laden dont give a sh*t about canada{ its 80+ safer here} plus the girls are slutyer here lol whats there not to like

OUT OF COMEDY,,,,,,, there finer points to canada as well
[/quote]








Dont forget about the decriminalization of marijuana and possibilities of medical marijuana. Here I come Canada!!! Not yet, but maybe in the future. I HATE THE USA!


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## Trigga (Jul 1, 2006)

yeah the laws on the green are the best in the world outside of amsterdam..this would really be a blow for the market though since alot of piranha keepers are in the united states. so maybe looking on the bright side this would be good for the wild piranha populous?

Still gonna suck though.

for you guys


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## Piranha Dan (Nov 11, 2007)

Is this for real, or is somebody making sh*t up to cause a rukus? I only ask because this sounds exactly like laws that are already on the books. Be pretty reduntant to pass something into law that's already law.


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## sadboy (Jan 6, 2005)

all I know that it takes quite a few steps to pass a bill.


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## cueball (May 24, 2005)

they way i see it" the second pitt bulls was ban on ont. canada there population bloomed" what ya gonna do then theres to many... NOTHING
iam sure there not going to beat down evey ones door looking for piranha tanks


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## Trigga (Jul 1, 2006)

cueball said:


> they way i see it" the second pitt bulls was ban on ont. canada there population bloomed" what ya gonna do then theres to many... NOTHING
> iam sure there not going to beat down evey ones door looking for piranha tanks


yeah but no one will be able to sell them anywhere so it will be very hard to get your hands on em


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## lo4life (Aug 12, 2008)

It will be just like anything else that gets banned there's always a way to get what you want.


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## Nick G (Jul 15, 2007)

blackandgold4ever05 said:


> Dont forget about the decriminalization of marijuana and possibilities of medical marijuana. Here I come Canada!!! Not yet, but maybe in the future. I HATE THE USA!


you wont be missed. 
so does anyone have anything to say about the possibilities of this actually happening?


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## cueball (May 24, 2005)

home grown red belly& carbies well rule.. maybe the rhoms well sky rocket if price HOPE NOT


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## greenmonkey51 (Aug 16, 2004)

lo4life said:


> It will be just like anything else that gets banned there's always a way to get what you want.


If no piranhas are being imported, and most of the large fish farms that breed them stop, you can't get them. This isn't like weed or other things that are easy to hide. All imports are checked by USFW. They may not know much, but they know what piranhas are.


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## lo4life (Aug 12, 2008)

Just like cueball said home grown reds and carbie.. I'm not going to really worry about it until it happens. Got to many other things to worry about


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## greenmonkey51 (Aug 16, 2004)

Will be illegal and banned. Where are you going to sell them. Fish stores wouldn't take them and USFW is watching this site and many others.


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## lo4life (Aug 12, 2008)

I'm sure they watch all the weed websites to. Y dont they do anything about them. Hell they have magazines on growing the stuff so basically they have the addresses of the people who get the magazine..


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## greenmonkey51 (Aug 16, 2004)

The DEA doesn't care about the little potsmokers. They only care about the big dealers and growers. I suggest you check out Rodger's Aquatics on what happens when you mess with the USFW.


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## lo4life (Aug 12, 2008)

Like I said before its not going to matter till it does happen. Whenever that will be.


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## cueball (May 24, 2005)

"black market fish trade" price might tripple but the fish well still be here


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## lo4life (Aug 12, 2008)

cueball said:


> "black market fish trade" price might tripple but the fish well still be here


Agree with you on this one.


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## blackandgold4ever05 (Jun 5, 2008)

Nick G said:


> Dont forget about the decriminalization of marijuana and possibilities of medical marijuana. Here I come Canada!!! Not yet, but maybe in the future. I HATE THE USA!


you wont be missed. 
so does anyone have anything to say about the possibilities of this actually happening?
[/quote]

Do you know me?


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## kmart189 (May 24, 2007)

watch the movie zeitgeist its a lot better than loose change.


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## robert69 (Jul 16, 2005)

I hope this bill goes down in defeat. I know it will more than likely take forever to get voted on and/or passed. A few questions for all of you:

1)What would happen to this site? Would P-Fury continue to operate knowing we can no longer sell/buy fish?

2)IF P's become illegal in ALL states, would this site be able to continue offering Piranha keeping advice, tips and discussions out in the open?

3)What will members of P-Fury living in currently legal states do if this bill passes and they no longer can buy/sell P's?

I have lived in both legal/illegal states, so I know what it is like to NOT be able to buy/sell P's on this site. It is not a good feeling to be "banned" out of fear of Fish and Game busting this site for the actions of a few individuals. I sympathize with all of you that are currently living in illegal states, I know how difficult it is to want to pursue this hobby responsibly only to be told you cannot. If this bill passes, all of us responsible P keepers will be truly devastated.

This might not be the politically correct thing to do(or say), but we need to go underground so that ALL of us can continue to care for our fish and enjoy this hobby responsibly. I know I am opening myself up for some serious verbal abuse by other members, but I once lived in an illegal state, so I am very understanding of our brothers/sisters who cannot legally own P's. It sucks for them and as a Piranha keeping family, we should ALL stick together.

Lastly, does anyone have advice on how to fight against this bill?

thanks


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## Trigga (Jul 1, 2006)

greenmonkey51 said:


> The DEA doesn't care about the little potsmokers. They only care about the big dealers and growers. I suggest you check out Rodger's Aquatics on what happens when you mess with the USFW.


they wont be able to stop people with reds and caribe right now from buying ginormous tanks and breeding them and selling them under the radar...snakeheads are illegal in ontario but people still got em and they aint going to jail either. And aren't asian arrows illegal in the states? Im pretty sure people still have those too.


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## assclown (Dec 12, 2005)

sean-820 said:


> can anyone explain what was the message from greenmonkey51 i cannot open the file what was the actual message on complete ban of piranhas in us. thanks
> shabbir


"to prevent introduction and establishment of non native wildlife species that negitivly impacts the economy,m enviroment, or human or animals species health and for other pourposes"
Its not focussed on piranhas, but all non native wildlife.
[/quote]
agreed i didnt see "piranhas" in the whole bill


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## Nick G (Jul 15, 2007)

blackandgold4ever05 said:


> can anyone explain what was the message from greenmonkey51 i cannot open the file what was the actual message on complete ban of piranhas in us. thanks
> shabbir


"to prevent introduction and establishment of non native wildlife species that negitivly impacts the economy,m enviroment, or human or animals species health and for other pourposes"
Its not focussed on piranhas, but all non native wildlife.
[/quote]
agreed i didnt see "piranhas" in the whole bill
[/quote]
"non native" would mean piranha though, i believe.


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## Dawgz (Aug 18, 2005)

Im not giving up my Caribe...

Ya'll better get off my porch (grabs 12 gauge)...lol


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## greenmonkey51 (Aug 16, 2004)

Trigga said:


> The DEA doesn't care about the little potsmokers. They only care about the big dealers and growers. I suggest you check out Rodger's Aquatics on what happens when you mess with the USFW.


they wont be able to stop people with reds and caribe right now from buying ginormous tanks and breeding them and selling them under the radar...snakeheads are illegal in ontario but people still got em and they aint going to jail either. And aren't asian arrows illegal in the states? Im pretty sure people still have those too.
[/quote]

How are you going to sell them under the radar. You can't advertise them. Piranha keepers aren't as well organized as other hobbies. Most peoples contacts are going to be through this and similar sites. If the bill passes and Piranhas are put on the list, this site is almost defunct. The breeding forum would be gone as well as the classifieds. The mods aren't going to allow any illegal behavior, because it presents too great of a danger to the site owner.


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## Dawgz (Aug 18, 2005)

greenmonkey51 said:


> The DEA doesn't care about the little potsmokers. They only care about the big dealers and growers. I suggest you check out Rodger's Aquatics on what happens when you mess with the USFW.


they wont be able to stop people with reds and caribe right now from buying ginormous tanks and breeding them and selling them under the radar...snakeheads are illegal in ontario but people still got em and they aint going to jail either. And aren't asian arrows illegal in the states? Im pretty sure people still have those too.
[/quote]

How are you going to sell them under the radar. You can't advertise them. Piranha keepers aren't as well organized as other hobbies. Most peoples contacts are going to be through this and similar sites. If the bill passes and Piranhas are put on the list, this site is almost defunct. The breeding forum would be gone as well as the classifieds. The mods aren't going to allow any illegal behavior, because it presents too great of a danger to the site owner.
[/quote]

LOL then someone should make another site and make it invite only registration....get all the OG's up in there...


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## cueball (May 24, 2005)

Dawgz said:


> Im not giving up my Caribe...
> 
> Ya'll better get off my porch (grabs 12 gauge)...lol


hillbilly style.. i likes


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## robert69 (Jul 16, 2005)

I agree with Dawgz 100%! Why not create a website with us veteran members by registration only??? In this day and age of super technology, isn't there a way to create a site that cannot be traced back to one person? Would Fish and Game really spend millions to track down the owner of a website that allows free open exchange forums similiar to Craigslist?. I will be the first to admit that I don't know shi* about web technology. But I do have friends that download music on websites that cannot trace their IP address, etc. Last I checked, this is the Land of Freedom. If someone wanted to set up a Craigslist type fish forum, it could be done. Let's protect our hobby at ALL costs!


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## greenmonkey51 (Aug 16, 2004)

It won't take millions to find the owner of a site. The feds are more tech savy than people give them credit for. Don't think for a minute that anything you do on the net can't be tracked. Why not drop the childish attitude and act like adults. Write your senators and representatives. Tell your friends to do the same. How do you think reptile owners have got many bills defeated. They don't sit around on forums whining. Start raising some hell with your politicians.


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## siph (Jun 13, 2008)

robert69 said:


> I agree with Dawgz 100%! Why not create a website with us veteran members by registration only??? In this day and age of super technology, isn't there a way to create a site that cannot be traced back to one person? Would Fish and Game really spend millions to track down the owner of a website that allows free open exchange forums similiar to Craigslist?. I will be the first to admit that I don't know shi* about web technology. But I do have friends that download music on websites that cannot trace their IP address, etc. Last I checked, this is the Land of Freedom. If someone wanted to set up a Craigslist type fish forum, it could be done. Let's protect our hobby at ALL costs!


Thats just what they think. Hiding behind a proxy won't prevent your IP address from being traced. There are certain measures one can do to hide your credentials, but that does not mean you can't get found. I agree with greenmonkey, get in contact with your politicians if this issue really concerns you.


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## robert69 (Jul 16, 2005)

I am not being childish. I am very passionate about fish keeping as well as protecting our freedom to responsibly partake in this hobby. I have the right to open up discussion about this bill since it will affect all of us on this site. Everyone on here has the right to express themselves, whether you think it's "childish" or not. I am expressing myself in hopes of stimulating conversation around this topic. Also, in my first post on this subject, I asked what we can do to fight this bill. I'm not on here just to piss and moan about the subject. So, please keep your rude comments to yourself.


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## Trigga (Jul 1, 2006)

greenmonkey51 said:


> The DEA doesn't care about the little potsmokers. They only care about the big dealers and growers. I suggest you check out Rodger's Aquatics on what happens when you mess with the USFW.


they wont be able to stop people with reds and caribe right now from buying ginormous tanks and breeding them and selling them under the radar...snakeheads are illegal in ontario but people still got em and they aint going to jail either. And aren't asian arrows illegal in the states? Im pretty sure people still have those too.
[/quote]

How are you going to sell them under the radar. You can't advertise them. Piranha keepers aren't as well organized as other hobbies. Most peoples contacts are going to be through this and similar sites. If the bill passes and Piranhas are put on the list, this site is almost defunct. The breeding forum would be gone as well as the classifieds. The mods aren't going to allow any illegal behavior, because it presents too great of a danger to the site owner.
[/quote]
why wouldn't you be able to sell them under the radar? its called word of mouth, maybe your not as organized as other hobbists but please dont degrade other piranha keepers by saying that. Why would the forum be gone? Theres so many other members from all over the world where piranha are 100% legal nationwide.

im in canada where this sh*t would never effect us because most non native fish would just die off in our winters so i could care less it would be a shame for something like this to happen though


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## robert69 (Jul 16, 2005)

Trigga - Do they sell P's in pet stores in Canada? I've been to Canada a couple of times but have never seen any P's in the stores.


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## Trigga (Jul 1, 2006)

they sell reds almost everywhere, stuff like rhoms and elongs are a once in a while thing unless you go to aquarium only stores like Big Al's where people trade them in and they have shipments of them often.


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## robert69 (Jul 16, 2005)

Cool, thanks for the reply.


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## Dawgz (Aug 18, 2005)

Childish? a 12 gauge isnt childish


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## NakedSavage (Apr 9, 2008)

Dawgz said:


> Childish? a 12 gauge isnt childish


HAHAHA


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## br75b (Jul 9, 2008)

Many of you may have heard this already. I seen a news special about snakeheads and how they are destroying river ways and such in and around Maryland I believe. As hard as the local wildlife agencies have tried to contain them, they have had little impact. They also believe that a "super" snakehead has evloved out of this. I'm not sure "super" is the correct word but it was something along those lines (stupid anyway). It is actually just a regular but larger than average snakehead. They have also confirmed that they are breeding and migrating in the waters. The wildlife head showed tanks of baby fish he collected for study. It was kind of funny because they did this undercover investigation on the black market imports of the fish for dinning purposes. I guess it is a common dish for other culturals. They think aside from "bad pet owners" letting them go that the markets play a part in it.

Either way you look at it, this is a horrible attempt to try to control the states and stamp out the exact reason this country exsist. Freedom for all anyone?

I'm sure everyone has a story of so-in-so catching a P in local water. But tell me of one instance that P got out and started breeding having a significant impact on wildlife, or "people" as the bill states. HAHA

If this is to pass they have to do a lot research to pinpoint species that would actually have impact as the snakehead has. But aside from that, what's next? No koi or goldfish, in turn killing a huge trade market and many peoples hobbies.

It goes to show that they are willing to waste money on rather small matters, while looking past hundreds of others because some lobbiest puts some money in the big mans pockets. Sorry I could go on forever. I hate the way the govt runs this country. The fact that W. got in, not once, but twice says a lot. He is going down in history as the absolute worst pres ever.


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## Brian5150 (Oct 17, 2006)

I can't imagine this bill passing. I'm sure there are many bills like this that don't pass we just havent taken the time to look at evey bill that is presented.

The reason people want this ban is because of the assholes involved in the hobby of fishkeeping that dump fish that are too big or unwanted anymore into local ponds,rivers or lakes.
If anyone here has done this before or knows a friend that has dumped a non native fish give yourself or that friend a punch in the head . Your the reason idiots come up with sh*t like this.

Would'nt this pretty much ruin the whole aqaurium trade? Fresh and saltwater ? Theres millions of dollars in the trade of aquarium keeping this will not pass.


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## notaverage (Sep 10, 2005)

redbellyman21 said:


> so what step is it in? like I have a black rhom already, but what about all the fish that r inventoried in lfs, are they allowed to be sold? or will they be terminated.. this will be the day that I will want to move the f out!


Why move out....just get a breeding pair and dont tell anyone what you have.


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## Ibanez247 (Nov 9, 2006)

greenmonkey51 said:


> can anyone explain what was the message from greenmonkey51 i cannot open the file what was the actual message on complete ban of piranhas in us. thanks
> shabbir


"to prevent introduction and establishment of non native wildlife species that negitivly impacts the economy,m enviroment, or human or animals species health and for other pourposes"
Its not focussed on piranhas, but all non native wildlife.
[/quote]

Piranha are non native. They're also invasive. It doesn't matter if they can't live in the northern climates. Read the bill carefully and you'll see it says if the species can survive anywhere in the US then it will be banned. This bill will ban all importing, selling, buying, and breeding of piranhas. I suggest you guys take this seriously. Also largemouth bass are native to the eastern part of the US. They just have been stocked everywhere else.
[/quote]

Large mouth bass were imported from Germany and thats a fact. Unless the history channel is putting out false info. But thats beisde the fact. I know some of you guys are involved with some other illegal substances and its widelly available heh. You think a bill is going to keep people from owning what they want ya right. People are still keeping snakeheads and they are illegal along with a very large list of other wildlife. If theres a want for something theres a way to do it. MAy not be "legal" with the law but hell theres a lot of laws out there and people still break them. But ya as far as them being imported and stuff it will be much, much harder to get a piranha if this were to pass but not impossible. Does this involve marine fish too? Sorry I cant stnad reading goverment BS. They repeat themselves about 20 times just to get the point across. Really, government people are pretty frikn stupid. Its sad idiots run the world while the geniusus sit at home and follow the idiots. Like stated before it will be a long time before something like this were to pass. IF not something is seriously wrong cause I can think of a lot more important things we need to take care of besides frikn fish.


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## robert69 (Jul 16, 2005)

Valid points by all! There are bigger fish to fry out there(no pun intended) - poverty, economics, war, etc.


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## greenmonkey51 (Aug 16, 2004)

Ibanez247 said:


> can anyone explain what was the message from greenmonkey51 i cannot open the file what was the actual message on complete ban of piranhas in us. thanks
> shabbir


"to prevent introduction and establishment of non native wildlife species that negitivly impacts the economy,m enviroment, or human or animals species health and for other pourposes"
Its not focussed on piranhas, but all non native wildlife.
[/quote]

Piranha are non native. They're also invasive. It doesn't matter if they can't live in the northern climates. Read the bill carefully and you'll see it says if the species can survive anywhere in the US then it will be banned. This bill will ban all importing, selling, buying, and breeding of piranhas. I suggest you guys take this seriously. Also largemouth bass are native to the eastern part of the US. They just have been stocked everywhere else.
[/quote]

Large mouth bass were imported from Germany and thats a fact. Unless the history channel is putting out false info. But thats beisde the fact. I know some of you guys are involved with some other illegal substances and its widelly available heh. You think a bill is going to keep people from owning what they want ya right. People are still keeping snakeheads and they are illegal along with a very large list of other wildlife. If theres a want for something theres a way to do it. MAy not be "legal" with the law but hell theres a lot of laws out there and people still break them. But ya as far as them being imported and stuff it will be much, much harder to get a piranha if this were to pass but not impossible. Does this involve marine fish too? Sorry I cant stnad reading goverment BS. They repeat themselves about 20 times just to get the point across. Really, government people are pretty frikn stupid. Its sad idiots run the world while the geniusus sit at home and follow the idiots. Like stated before it will be a long time before something like this were to pass. IF not something is seriously wrong cause I can think of a lot more important things we need to take care of besides frikn fish.
[/quote]

"Largemouth bass were originally distributed throughout most of what is now the United States east of the Rockies, including many rivers and lakes in Texas, with limited populations in southeastern Canada and northeastern Mexico. Because of its importance as a game fish, the species has been introduced into many other areas worldwide, including nearly all of Mexico and south into Central and South America."

Thats straight from the Texas parks and wildlife website. I'm sure I can find more if needed.


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## SBDTHRU (Jul 27, 2007)

Psh screw this. Spend your time and money on getting rid of the problems we already have. Just gonna be more laws that nobody has the time to enforce. Worry about the failing economy not the slight chance that piranha's could make there way into the pond across the street and cause terror for a couple hours before they die.


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## greenmonkey51 (Aug 16, 2004)

Did anyone actually read who the bill sponsors are. Two or three are from Florida. There are major problems in Florida with nonnatives. This bill is only in the natural resources committee. Meaning that this is committee was formed to look at issues like this. Every bill that goes through the process has to go through committee's that are formed for that specif subject. So they're not wasting time. The economy is something larger than what can just be fixed in one congressional session.


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## ryneb99 (Aug 1, 2008)

Well I certainly hope this doesn't pass as I won't have money to set up a tank for some P's until this coming summer, but TBH after actually reading through it doesn't really sound that bad.

In section 4, the approved species list section, it says that the Secretary can include on the list of approved species any species that are not harmful to the economy, environment, or human/native species health according to the best scientific or commercial data available. The Secretary can also include on the approved list any species that may be harmful but are already so widespread that future import prohibitions or restrictions would have no practical use.

It also says that any species on the banned list can have a proposal submitted to show that they are not harmful to the US and should be removed from the banned list. If that proposal were to be rejected then a rebuttal could be submitted for a final verdict.

So while I may not be that well versed in government speak, it sounds like there are plenty of loopholes contained within this bill.

As a HUGE newbie to P's I'm not quite sure how many places within the US breed piranhas, but if there are a decent amount of fish farms for piranhas then those species bred within the US probably wouldn't be affected. Those that are primarily imported however could potentially become banned if this were to pass and they were deemed harmful to the US.


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## Wide_Eyed_Wanderer (Aug 22, 2006)

I just skimmed through this thread so the bill is basically banning any non-native speices? If so this bill will never ever get passed. Even if if does i wont give 2 shits because I live in canadia.


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## ashkahn (Nov 12, 2007)

Man, this sucks. I live in Canada but if this bill does get passed, 90% of the members on this site will quit, because they don't have access to fish.

And whose to say this bill won't be adapted to Canada?

the Secretary can include on the list of approved species any species that are not harmful to the economy, environment, or human/native species health according to the best scientific or commercial data available. The Secretary can also include on the approved list any species that *may be harmful but are already so widespread that future import prohibitions or restrictions would have no practical use*.

I think piranhas would be considered "widespread".

On the other hand, any tropical fish that is imported for fish keeping is pretty much widespread.


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## Trigga (Jul 1, 2006)

who says? it would be easy to get stuff into canada, and there are companys such as below water in montreal that stock the rare piranha's often.


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## KrBjostad (Jun 21, 2008)

Plum said:


> I hate this country anymore. I will end up leaving eventually for Canada or Europe. Why don't they sign a "bill" about investigating the terrible crimes committed by George Bush. (search youtube.com for "Loose Change"), You will see what I mean.
> 
> USA is already hated by the rest of the world and now they are gonna force all their own people to do the same.


Don't come to Canada.

Income tax is higher. Sales Tax is 13% in Ontario. Our cost of goods is higher than yours (Example - many fish products are on average 33% less in the USA i have found, in my experience). Our Economy is dwarfed by the USA's - thus you most likely won't find a job that pays as well up here in comparison. Also - it's cold.

All of these items impact your fish hobby - meaning dollars to invest into your piranha hobby. Be ar responsible Pfurian and stay in the USA - you and your pets will thank me.

[/quote]

actually lower cost of living=lower wages but the ratio between wages and cost are closer in canada so you would likely have less left over

back on topic: That would be incredulously asanine but I wouldn't put it past the good ol' US.


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

I really doubt there will be a nationwide ban on piranhas.
There's been too much effort to keep them legal.
(Frank (Hastatus), Jeff (Grosse Gurke) and Arnold (Hollywood) as 3 prime examples... hats off to you guys...)

I think we're pretty solid at this point in our legality.


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## PELIGROSO PYGO (Aug 27, 2008)

Man i feel really bad for you guys below in the states.. this ban is terrible but i don't think it would ever have been brought up if soo many ppl didn't abuse their their pets or dump them somewhere.. but then again the ppl over there are always getting screwed over by the freggin government.. Canada has its benefits but like you heard its F#**in cold! and our dollar is low so yea.. but our gurls are slutty lol and ontario in paticular has all the flavors of women on this green earth.. so come on down! oh yea FUKC BUSH!!


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## primetime3wise (Sep 28, 2003)

wow, the # of predatory fish this bill COULD include would be enormous. i guess we could all switch to community fish...guppies, mollies, playties....yea!


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