# WW2



## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

I belive the the best thing that could have happend
It helped the USA IE, building tanks and air plans for the UK, untill we enterd the war, German's wow, great people they built the frist jet engine way before we did, and the V rockets.
I belive MANY great things came out of the war, and a big push into computers and cars, and air plans.
I blive if it was not for Wolrd war two, we would not be going from LA to LV for $19.00 round trip, and have many aeropsace things and even our space shuttle,

I am not saying we would not have these things, or ever get them, but i belive he pushed for great things, to bad he started a war :sad:

I am also nto saying the things he did, are good. Just saying the big push in Tech. is one of the many things i wish people would be able to see happend, please dont get mad at me just trying to make a point.

Bobme

PS i know its a touchy subject. 
And also remeber, more non-jews where killed then jews. But its still sad he killed people becuase what what they belived in


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

With any war there is usually the pros and cons that come from it. As for Hitler he didnt just kill them for what they believed in...he wanted to create a pure race... the whole blonde hair blue eyed...etc..etc. Funny he didnt even meet his standards...


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> With any war there is usually the pros and cons that come from it. As for Hitler he didnt just kill them for what they believed in...he wanted to create a pure race... the whole blonde hair blue eyed...etc..etc. Funny he didnt even meet his standards...


 True, but im just trying to say, dont just bash him for killing, he invocted a lot of good things. But i belive massive death is







but some of the things he did







but i hope we never have other leader like him again ..
Well, i cant even say that. i love to see what other "big" war would come out of, maybe livabl space stations? maybe life on mars? i dont know, cant even dream maybe what we could do with 100 billion into R&D.


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

...thanks to WW2, we're now a super power and we pretty much rule the world


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

USMC*sPiKeY* said:


> ...thanks to WW2, we're now a super power and we pretty much rule the world


 i dont think that is true. Many people i belive have more power then us, sad and true, i think a war with North Keora would be very long bloody and they might very well win beucase of how hard it is for us to get people over there. a war with China would suck and they would win, #1 rule for winning a war is who can control the skys, China has around 7 fighter jets for one of ours, so .. they will own their skys, and in the end, i belive win a war, even so, look at all those people







they out number us so much! so, please dont go poking your stick at things becuase you think we are the best, we are not, we just have freedom, and freedom will prevail.


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

...well the roman empire eventually collasped...im just saying as of right now, we rule everything...but in the end will fall like rome


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Yes we will, every one fails at some point or other.


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## SnowCichlid. (Jan 10, 2003)

I am asuming everyone here in this thread is a member of the USA. 
... us canadians are pretty much linked somehow to all the events that you guys take place in


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

SnowCichlid said:


> I am asuming everyone here in this thread is a member of the USA.
> ... us canadians are pretty much linked somehow to all the events that you guys take place in


 ...you're our friendly neighbor to the north...howdy


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## Ms_Nattereri (Jan 11, 2003)

For now Snow your right, just wait til Judazz comes along...then youll find yourself a non-american!!


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## KumbiaQueens (Feb 5, 2003)

true, but for the current standings, its all north-americans posting on here...
WW2 was the aide for the US in which put us in our current place. if it wasn't for that, we wouldn't have our current power


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

KumbiaQueens said:


> true, but for the current standings, its all north-americans posting on here...


 ...wait till innes and juda come along, then it'll be a ride


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## Xenon (Nov 15, 2002)

Hmmmm, I would rather still live in the caves and skin goats for my clothes than see the torture, death, and pain of over 6 million people. True WWII did spurn a lot of innovation:

To name a few,
1. The jet airplane
2. The atom bomb
3. The ballistic missile

Yet why should I praise a war that brought about the innovation of tons of weapons that will eventually cause the death and torture of millions more? It was a necessary fight for us yet I dont feel praising Germany or America for their "innovation" is right.

Oh yeah, I forgot SPAM and OJ. Thats a great invention of WWII.


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

Xenon said:


> Oh yeah, I forgot SPAM and OJ. Thats a great invention of WWII.


 ...i dont see how spam is a great innovation...the thing tastes nasty...hm..i wonder if we can use SPAM as a chem or a bio weapon


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

Ms_Nattereri said:


> For now Snow your right, just wait til Judazz comes along...then youll find yourself a non-american!!


 Howdy y'all, just poppin' by...









WWII may have brought a lot of inventions, in particular in the military, but they would have been developed anyways: the war only quickened the process. I mean, all those fancy present-day war toys (like smart bombs, stealth weapons etc.) are all developed and produced in peace time (or because of the arms race during the cold war [so out of fear]). WWII didn't bring many new things that were beneficial to the John Doe's in the street...
Besides that: WWII was the beginning, or the cause of the Cold War (and that can hardly be classified as good either







).

All I have to add to this: 'Europe über Alles'


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

Judazzz said:


> Besides that: WWII was the beginning, or the cause of the Cold War (and that can hardly be classified as good either
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 ...the cold war was a war game....makes me want to play a game like that...who wants to challenge me at a game or RISK?


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

USMC*sPiKeY* said:


> who wants to challenge me at a game or RISK?


 If you can find an on-line version of risk, I'll play you......


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

Judazzz said:


> USMC*sPiKeY* said:
> 
> 
> > who wants to challenge me at a game or RISK?
> ...


 ...alright, its ON!!!!! so what happens if i find a virtual thumb wrestling thing online?


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

I'll digitally thumb wrestle you, lol


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Judazzz said:


> Ms_Nattereri said:
> 
> 
> > For now Snow your right, just wait til Judazz comes along...then youll find yourself a non-american!!
> ...


 im not saying they would not have come, did you read what i said at all?
all i am saying is, he pushed up the time table, many years.


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

Right, but was that a good thing??? Has the world become a better place with nukes, super-efficient jet fighters (I know civil aviation has thrived due to jet engines, but that's not what I'm talking about...) and self-proppelling missiles?


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Judazzz said:


> Right, but was that a good thing??? Has the world become a better place with nukes, super-efficient jet fighters (I know civil aviation has thrived due to jet engines, but that's not what I'm talking about...) and self-proppelling missiles?


 i do see your point, however remeber ensitn worked for hitler before he saw he was a mad man, so if we didnt make them, the world would be going







to a nut job.


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

bobme said:


> i do see your point, however remeber ensitn worked for hitler before he saw he was a mad man, so if we didnt make them, the world would be going
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 ...hehe TOO LATE!!!!! i think the world is in the hands of nut jobs! ie....bush, blair, hussien, bin laden, juda as a mod


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Hmmm, maybe but you did make a mistake, Bush and blair, are not in control of any one, its called "Freedom" hussien and bin laden







all the time. its call no-freedom.


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

USMC*sPiKeY* said:


> ...hehe TOO LATE!!!!! i think the world is in the hands of nut jobs! ie....bush, blair, hussien, bin laden, juda as a mod


 Don't tempt me to abuse my newly gained powers, boy


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

bobme said:


> Hmmm, maybe but you did make a mistake, Bush and blair, are not in control of any one, its called "Freedom" hussien and bin laden
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 ...i didn't say they were in control of anyone... i said they all were nutjobs







...as for bush and blair not controlling anyone...you got that right, they can't even gain control of the damn UN to gain support for a just war


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

> bush, blair, hussien, bin laden, juda as a mod


And by the way: I dont like to be compared with Bush: I find that offensive.......


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

your worng again, geez.
If you read into this, the UN support is not about yes or no, its about money.
You see, All the people voting NO " France, Germay, China, Russia" Iraq all owns BILLIONS to these people, Russia and france more then any one, all iraw plans, scuds and guns and tanks, came from russia, worth like 25 billion. China sold Iraq the ground-to-air missiles and the software to run them, France sold them anti-aircraft missles and new computers and radar, and in return Iraq sells them millions of gals. of Oil, and germany sold Iraq ... sh*t i can spell it, Garascops? for the milles, like 2 billion dollar tab, and some other stuff.
its all about money, money, money, every one who didnt sell him any thing, is voting yes, people who sold him stuff, want their money, and vote no.


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

bobme said:


> your worng again, geez.
> If you read into this, the UN support is not about yes or no, its about money.
> You see, All the people voting NO " France, Germay, China, Russia" Iraq all owns BILLIONS to these people, Russia and france more then any one, all iraw plans, scuds and guns and tanks, came from russia, worth like 25 billion. China sold Iraq the ground-to-air missiles and the software to run them, France sold them anti-aircraft missles and new computers and radar, and in return Iraq sells them millions of gals. of Oil, and germany sold Iraq ... sh*t i can spell it, Garascops? for the milles, like 2 billion dollar tab, and some other stuff.
> its all about money, money, money, every one who didnt sell him any thing, is voting yes, people who sold him stuff, want their money, and vote no.


 well if you had read the post/poll that i HAD created about this topic back in february, you would've noticed that i said "france, germany, russia are iraq's oil bitches"....i have followed this throughly enough!!! i know the UN isn't gonna do jack $#!t to take out saddam! i know the french won't turn their backs on iraq, because they are iraq's bitch! when iraq tells france to bend over, the french do nothing but bend over....like they did in ww1 and 2







....this is why i oppose the point of having the UN...they haven't done jack $#!t for the world, so what's the point of having the UN...the US has played a bigger role than the UN has ever had....so don't tell me i don't know what im talking about!


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

yea, France needs Iraq's oil, but the other people dont, they just buy some, but most of their oil% comes from other places.


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

bobme said:


> yea, France needs Iraq's oil, but the other people dont, they just buy some, but most of their oil% comes from other places.


 ...as do the us...the US has oil interests in alaska, venezula and i think the gulf of mexico...that's why i keep saying the US is going to war because of saddam, not because of his oil fields....although it is a possible interest to the US, its not too big of a deal!....yet people still think the US is going over to iraq because of oil...what a load of crock!


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Yes, the USA dose not buy any oil from Iraq, and if we do, we return the oil in food, not money.
and they say we are going to war over Oil because Bushes plan is to sell oil like mad, to pay to rebuild Iraq, and we im sure we will end up buying a lot of it to lower our gas prices.


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

bobme said:


> You see, All the people voting NO " France, Germay, China, Russia" Iraq all owns BILLIONS to these people, Russia and france more then any one, all iraw plans, scuds and guns and tanks, came from russia, worth like 25 billion. China sold Iraq the ground-to-air missiles and the software to run them, France sold them anti-aircraft missles and new computers and radar, and in return Iraq sells them millions of gals. of Oil, and germany sold Iraq ... sh*t i can spell it, Garascops? for the milles, like 2 billion dollar tab, and some other stuff.
> its all about money, money, money, every one who didnt sell him any thing, is voting yes, people who sold him stuff, want their money, and vote no.


 Don't act like the US is Mother Theresa in this scenario...








I'll tell you something: in the early '80's, a certain guy called Donald Rumsfeld travelled to Bagdad to sell bacteria cultures to the Iraqi's. Nowadays, this gentleman suffers from a severe case of "lost memory syndrome", but the US is responsible for the the Iraqi bioweapons programme, since they supplied the necessary components which Iraq could never had manifactured itself...

You might say this is all a lie, and not true, but unfortunately, it is. The other countries are definitely guilty as charged, but before you start pointing your fingers and accusing other countries of what they've done wrong, take a look at what your own government has done in the past...


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Judazzz said:


> bobme said:
> 
> 
> > You see, All the people voting NO " France, Germay, China, Russia" Iraq all owns BILLIONS to these people, Russia and france more then any one, all iraw plans, scuds and guns and tanks, came from russia, worth like 25 billion. China sold Iraq the ground-to-air missiles and the software to run them, France sold them anti-aircraft missles and new computers and radar, and in return Iraq sells them millions of gals. of Oil, and germany sold Iraq ... sh*t i can spell it, Garascops? for the milles, like 2 billion dollar tab, and some other stuff.
> ...


 Yes i know, its called betrail, please dont tell only hlaf the story sir, we even gave bil ladin millions and trained him and armed him. Now look, two huge towers in New York, are gone. Our fault? no, he is a back staber.


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

USMC*sPiKeY* said:


> bobme said:
> 
> 
> > yea, France needs Iraq's oil, but the other people dont, they just buy some, but most of their oil% comes from other places.
> ...


*10%* of all the oil the US uses, comes from Iraq (UN sanctions have been loosened in mid-90's: Iraq is allowed to sell a certain amount of oil, and gets food and medicines and so on in reverse).

Remove that quantity of oil, and 10% of the US economy would stop functioning all together....


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

bobme said:


> Yes i know, its called betrail, please dont tell only hlaf the story sir, we even gave bil ladin millions and trained him and armed him. Now look, two huge towers in New York, are gone. Our fault? no, he is a back staber.


 That's a bit over simplistic, don't you think...?
The US government stabbed the Iraqi opposition in the back likewise, because they failed to support their uprising against Saddam after the 1st Gulf War, even though they promised to do so....

So you don't tell half a story either.


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Judazzz said:


> USMC*sPiKeY* said:
> 
> 
> > bobme said:
> ...


 maybe for a few months, but we would pass a new bill to pump more of our own oil. you know we would. We lost all of our oil from Ven. and still we are Ok, becuase we turned up our home land production, i hope the strike i over, or maybe it is, i tryed to find out, couldnt find to much info on it, however either way, if it is over, we didnt get oil from the for two months.


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Judazzz said:


> bobme said:
> 
> 
> > Yes i know, its called betrail, please dont tell only hlaf the story sir, we even gave bil ladin millions and trained him and armed him. Now look, two huge towers in New York, are gone. Our fault? no, he is a back staber.
> ...


 yes, we used the Kurrds, and now we ask them for help again?







i hope to god they say no.


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

Every Western nation has a strategic oil reserve for 9 months, so you could last a lot longer without Iraqi or Venezuelan oil.

But still, the US started extracting oil in Iraq as soon as the enbargo was loosened, so don't say you don't have intersets over there (just like some European countries have).


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

and our millitray reserve, but i hope we dont tap that.
Anyway, im just saying, we are not fighting to gain control for his oil, we are just inforceing old Un laws that no one else wants to do because they all want there money out of him, and we dont.


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

bobme said:


> Judazzz said:
> 
> 
> > bobme said:
> ...


 I wouldn't take pride out of that if my government did the same...
All I'm trying to say is that every conflict has two sides, and many Americans tend to overlook the other side completely: wheter it's shady/objective or not is not important, that you only look at your own version of the story, and claim that that *is* the only truth is...


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

i wasnt, we screwed many people over, and killed many people, rember the highway of death? :sad:


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

Oil interests are just one of the motives for the US to wage war on Iraq, just like removing Saddam, or destroying his weapons of mass destruction, or perhaps even enlarging US influence in the area are...
And so do European countries have their motives to say no to a war.

Too bad all that seems to matter is self-interest, for all parties involved, American and European, instead of trying to improve things in Iraq.......


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

bobme said:


> i wasnt, we screwed many people over, and killed many people, rember the highway of death? :sad:


 Yup, that was pretty nasty........
Things like that are a part of war, and every country has its own black pages in military history, but that doesn't make it any less nasty :sad: Must admit it was dealt with pretty efficient, though....


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Maybe we should go back to the old roman war fare, no war at all. Camp, camp around the country and not let any thing in our out. 
but that would hurt people we dont want to hurt. however then it would be a war crime on saddam if he didnt let them out. so either way .. we lose. I just dont like being the big bully in the world, when we dont need to be.


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

Being the world's most powerful nation is no position to envy, that's for sure...

Btw: bobme, isn't this thread called WW2?


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Judazzz said:


> Being the world's most powerful nation is no position to envy, that's for sure...
> 
> Btw: bobme, isn't this thread called WW2?


 Yea i know, we got off topic with nut jobs and oil


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

Well, it least it's a decent discussion without flaming or obscenities flying around!
And it's still about war, so technically, we did not derail this thread, but we broadened it's horizon


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Yea we didnt talk about nipples rings and penis pumps.


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)




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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)




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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

:laugh:















I wonder what it will do to my laundry, lol!

btw: red skullz for me too, yay!










edit: oh no, I got crowns (how queer........), and just three of 'em


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Yup no red skulls for you!


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

bobme said:


> Yes i know, its called betrail, please dont tell only hlaf the story sir, we even gave bil ladin millions and trained him and armed him. Now look, two huge towers in New York, are gone. Our fault? no, he is a back staber.


 ....i don't think we gave bin ladin millions and trained his operatives...he did that with his own funding....but we did fund the afghan government, jihad (i think)....so in actuality, it IS our fault....bin ladin was no back stabber or traitor, he wanted to be martyr and a symbol

....i go away for an entire day, and i miss out on a debate


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

Judazzz said:


> That's a bit over simplistic, don't you think...?
> The US government stabbed the Iraqi opposition in the back likewise, because they failed to support their uprising against Saddam after the 1st Gulf War, even though they promised to do so....


 ...you can thank bush sr. for that one...im still puzzled as to why the US left unfinished business...











> Maybe we should go back to the old roman war fare, no war at all. Camp, camp around the country and not let any thing in our out.


...that would hurt america's military might....the US isn't a force that likes to sit still and camp...we like to bomb the $#!t out of things







...personally, prefer the old methods...quick rush on two fronts, flank the opposition and attack


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

why bomb them to the stone age? they live their now.


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

bobme said:


> why bomb them to the stone age? they live their now.


 ....i thought you were up for bombing them?


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

I am. and yes, we trained bin ladin


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

bobme said:


> I am. and yes, we trained bin ladin


 WE DID NOT TRAIN BIN LADIN...we partially aided the jihad, BUT WE DID NOT TRAIN BIN LADIN!


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

Are you sure there were no American advisors (as they use to call military personel) helping out the Afghan mujahedeen (or however you spell it...) during the Afghani-Russian war, either in Afghanistan or in the surrounding countries???
I don't know the answer to this, but it wouldn't surprise me....


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

Judazzz said:


> Are you sure there were no American advisors (as they use to call military personel) helping out the Afghan mujahedeen (or however you spell it...) during the Afghani-Russian war, either in Afghanistan or in the surrounding countries???
> I don't know the answer to this, but it wouldn't surprise me....


 we aided the afghans during the afghan-russian war















....but we didn't train al-queada, just the ji-had


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

USMC*sPiKeY* said:


> ....but we didn't train al-queada, just the ji-had


Well, in a way the US did laid the military foundation of Al Qaeda: without their military, logistic and communicational (is this a word? But you get the picture...) support, organizing a truely global terrorist network would have been a lot tougher, if not near impossible.

But this is all looking back, and it's easy to criticise a person's aor a nation's actions in the past with present-day knowledge. I only hope the US have learned something from it (but taht doesn't seem to be the case).


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

no it dosnt seem like we did. Im sad to say, we are repeating our bad footsteps all over again.


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

bobme said:


> no it dosnt seem like we did. Im sad to say, we are repeating our bad footsteps all over again.


 i thought you were an american?....where's your sense of pride?....if you think everything we do is bad, then leave


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

USMC*sPiKeY* said:


> bobme said:
> 
> 
> > no it dosnt seem like we did. Im sad to say, we are repeating our bad footsteps all over again.
> ...


 Looking at your own government/nation in a critical way does not say you don't have pride for your nation.
People who swallow anyting, and just blindly obey orders and believe everything they are told, are a real danger to any country. Every country needs its critical citizens for checks and balances.... It's called commitment.


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

USMC*sPiKeY* said:


> bobme said:
> 
> 
> > no it dosnt seem like we did. Im sad to say, we are repeating our bad footsteps all over again.
> ...


 damn bitch slow down!
i love america, and some day, i hope to be able to run for some type of office. However, the system is failed, and needs to be over hulled, a lot of things are worng in it. However the core is good. just the shell of our goverment needs cleaning.


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

bobme said:


> damn bitch slow down!
> i love america, and some day, i hope to be able to run for some type of office. However, the system is failed, and needs to be over hulled, a lot of things are worng in it. However the core is good. just the shell of our goverment needs cleaning.


 ...so when you run for some type of office, you're saying you wouldn't be corrupted over time by your surroundings? i find that a load of BS!...and don't call me a bitch!


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## Xenon (Nov 15, 2002)

bobme said:


> USMC*sPiKeY* said:
> 
> 
> > bobme said:
> ...


 He will be the first gay president


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

Im not gay, im big boned!


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## ProdigalMarine (Jan 31, 2003)

bobme said:


> Im not gay, im big boned!


 ....so you're a jolly man?


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## bobme (Feb 17, 2003)

USMC*sPiKeY* said:


> bobme said:
> 
> 
> > Im not gay, im big boned!
> ...


 i am happy all the time.


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

bobme said:


> im big boned!


I guess you have one happy boyfriend then, mmm


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