# I Operated On My Piranha



## Armand_caribe (Sep 9, 2009)

Hi.

So very unfortunately I do not have photos in this thread which would have been great but due to the urgency I couldn't get anyone to support me taking the picts as I operated on the P'.

Taking pictures while operating on the piranha would have been difficult to me because my concern for the integrity of the fish led me to perform the procedure in the fastest possible way.

(Sedating procedure based on Pat's thread).

Description step by step:

1 .- I got some oil of clove in the drugstore and bought a some potable pure cane alcohol (after the surery you can alway drink it too... ).

2.-I mixed 1 ml of clove oil with 10 ml of alcohol (the ratio is 10-1).

3.-I got a 20 liter bucket filled with a little over half (11 liters) with the same water of the aquarium where the piranha was.

4.-I got piranha with a net and put it in the bucket, then poured 3 ml of clove oil previously mixed with the alcohol in the 11 liters of water (the ratio is 1 ml per gallon of water). After 5 min piranha was as dead which scared me a little because it is the first time I do this and although I have good info sources about the procedure i worried a little.

5.-In a separate tray I put enough water (from the same bucket with anesthetic) to have the piranha lying on one side in a mean that his mouth and nose kept under water while the afected side surfaced.

6.-I proceeded to cut at the top of the swelling with a very sharp knife but the skin of the piranha is very hard, -scales you know - it took a bit of work because his body is also very slippery. At last I did a cut and immediately it let came out a slimy, light brown purulent substance of a nauseous smell.

7.-I kept squeezing the swelling as if it where an acne pimple, the pus kept coming out through the cut. I had to get rid of the water in the tray as it got too cloudy and then refill it with a some more water from the bucket with the anesthetic (it is important to keep using the water with anesthetic for if you don't if the patient may wake up during surgery). I kept looking for a possible parasite but found nothing but a strong subcutaneous infection that had already disbanded part of the piranha meat under the skin (precisely where the swelling is).

8.-I kept looking and no parasite, I make a cut across but none of the suspected parasite, which I was looking for around 20 minutes with the wound of the piranha very open but nothing. (I'm sure if there was a parasite I would have found it I checked the affected area pretty well).

9.-Then with a solution of methylene blue and salt I thoroughly cleaned the wound using some cotton soaked in the solution.

10.-Once clean I got rid of the water in the tray (which I previously changed three times during surgery for our patient was always in fresh water all the time (only with anesthetic on it) and put the piranha in his nursing tank holding him with my hand so his face was in front of the powerhead's flow (be careful not tu use a very strong flow of water) so, somehow cool water circulates through his respiratory system. Piranha reacted in a matter 30 seconds and began to swim as drunk by the tank. I covered up the tank with a pice of garment so no light enter the tank by the next 24 hours.

11.-I medicate the tank with salt and methylene blue. His current temperature is 25 º C but would raise about 30º C to help his healing faster.

Conclusions:

a) Anesthesia is very effective and safe, but we should not overdo it at the rates described above.

My conclusión and diagnosis-I m not a vet-, it appeared that the piranha is affected by a strong source of bacterial infection completely unknown to me because prior to its appearance I couldn¡t see that the piranha had been beaten or scratched in the area described before the infection. I wish someone could deepen further about the possible origin of this infection.

I hope what I did -drain the pus, clean the wound and leave it uncovered to enhance the effect of methylene blue and the salt on- Is enough to heal the piranha. I might use some other medication, what do you suggest?.

Piranha's wound is large however, due to its location does not put in danger his life, needless to say that I've seen piranhas injured 3 or 4 times worse and pull though.

I wait for your comments and any advice to help my P' to recover guys.


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## CLUSTER ONE (Aug 2, 2006)

Do you have before and after pics. I have no idea what kind of wound/parisite your talking about. Anesthesia is scary stuff for your first time. Not long ago when i first used i thought i killed my fish.

Scissors id think would be easier then a knife. I would of used those pointed tipped sharp nail scissors sd they are easier to control then a knife.


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## Armand_caribe (Sep 9, 2009)

You're right about the scissors, as a matter of fact I used some scissors to make the cut bigger.

Picts aren available for now however I would try to post some after and before picts soon .

Cheers.


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

Incredible thread!

Hats off to you for taking the initiative and being bold enough to do what you did.
Please keep us posted on the updates of his recovery.


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## RedneckR0nin (Nov 5, 2008)

Dr Armand to the rescue. Cool thread man and interesting read all around. Keep us posted on any updates in the condition.


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## Armand_caribe (Sep 9, 2009)

Thanks for replies guys.

However I'm afraid the surgery wasn't enough to heal the P', he died today morning.

I guess the disease was too advanced since previous being operated on, the P had been about 4 days without eating anything wich was really a bad sign considering this fish was a real pig to eat...

Some 2 months ago the P got a big lump in his left back side just behid his head, the lump begun to grow and within one week it was the size ao a lemon. It bursted as if it were acne and I thought it was it, I just medicated with some salt, but soon after he got a swelling gillplate and his eye was about to explode like a balloon.

It was when I decided to treat him with tetracicline thinking it was a big inner infection. It was easy for me to medicate him becase as this P eat everything I droped in the tank, I only hid this small pieces of tetracicline tablets on pieces of fish meat so he could swallow.

He seemed to improve however after 2 weeks of treatment the lump came back and then the P started to behave more letargic.

It was when desperated, I decided to operated on and during the surgery I found that his meat was melted just below the affected zone and a lightbrown fluid of a very nasty smell escaped though the cut.

I think it was cancer.


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## CLUSTER ONE (Aug 2, 2006)

Did you say the lump was the size of a lemon? Cancer is possible, but i dobut it would be the casue if there was puss in the lump


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## PiranhaMike661 (Jul 9, 2010)

WOW!! That's freakin crazy. I just couldn't picture having to operate of any of my fish. I wouldn't even know where to begin. My hat is off to you pal. That's terrible news that you lost the fish, but his death was not in vain. I'm sure that you can say that you are more confident in your ability to operate on your fish (if required). I know I could'nt do it. Anyhow, sorry about your loss and good luck in the future.


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## FEEFA (Nov 19, 2007)

Sorry for your loss armand but you did all that you could for it


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## RedneckR0nin (Nov 5, 2008)

That's shitty brother but least you tried to do something for him.


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## memento (Jun 3, 2009)

Agreed to the above








Like I said before, you're one of the few who actually went all the way in a try to save their fish. Be proud on that mate


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## Armand_caribe (Sep 9, 2009)

Thanks for reples guys I really appreciate your words.

Lossing this P's was tough, he was a beautiful specimen, I was able to measure him and he was from nose to tail a bit bigger that 9", he was always very active and had a great apetite, eating everything I tossed into the tank.

RIP,









He's the one in my avatar.


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## Armand_caribe (Sep 9, 2009)

CLUSTER ONE said:


> Did you say the lump was the size of a lemon? Cancer is possible, but i dobut it would be the casue if there was puss in the lump


Yeah the lump was full of it, I guess that light brown stinky flid was puss. It was as if he were roting in life.

I could perform a sort of authopsy just to foud out the damaged tissue reached just behind his skull. I didn't went further on the authopsy because the smell was nasty so I just quit, anyway the P' was dead. By the way I didn't find any parasite althoughI didnt complete the authopsy work.


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## Piranha_man (Jan 29, 2005)

That's insane man... the size of a lemon!









Like already said... you went beyond the norm for your fish...
Sorry about your loss.


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## Armand_caribe (Sep 9, 2009)

Thanks pal.


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## platinum1683 (Nov 17, 2006)

Thats crazy man. Sorry to hear about your loss. I recently had to pull my RTC out of his tank and pull out some shrimp from his throat with some tweezers. RTCs will never stop eating, they truly are gluttons.


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## BRUNER247 (Jun 2, 2010)

Sounds like a abcess. Suks he didn't make it at least you tryd to help him! That suks he didn't pull through.


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## BRUNER247 (Jun 2, 2010)

Armand_caribe said:


> Hi.
> 
> So very unfortunately I do not have photos in this thread which would have been great but due to the urgency I couldn't get anyone to support me taking the picts as I operated on the P'.
> 
> ...


I don't know what awards you have but if it were up to me with what you've done I'd make you instant OG n information award both. Only hardcore are gonna do surgery on a fish you keep n cut em up after they died. Hats off to you man.


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## memento (Jun 3, 2009)

BRUNER247 said:


> I don't know what awards you have but if it were up to me with what you've done I'd make you instant OG n information award both. Only hardcore are gonna do surgery on a fish you keep n cut em up after they died. Hats off to you man.


So a hardcore award








Why an information award, it's a procedure taken from Pat's description elsewhere on this forum


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## BRUNER247 (Jun 2, 2010)

Your right combi I've only ventured into this forum but a couple times.I read this thread one day n replied a couple days later n its even mentioned a couple times that its been done before.but there's no doubt he should be rocketed to OG status for going above n beyond what a normal keeper would do.personally it would have been lucky to get to the size of a grape before I did something.makes me wanna go perform a c-section right now.lol.


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## Da' Manster! (Sep 1, 2009)

Sorry to hear that, Armand....







.....Just noticed this thread this morning!...Kudos to you for at least making a valiant effort to save him!...







...good luck the rest of the way, my friend!...


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## Armand_caribe (Sep 9, 2009)

Thanks for comments Bruner and Da manster, really appreciate it.

As you said Bruner, that was an abacess.

Cheers.


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