# is it possible to breed piraya's



## shoe997bed263 (Oct 15, 2004)

anyone ever herd of breeding piraya's is it possible has anyone ever tried


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## shoe997bed263 (Oct 15, 2004)

i know that it must be possible to breed them or we would not have any but i mean in a home aq


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## NavinWithPs (Apr 3, 2003)

im pretty sure that it is "possible." definately not for the average hobbyist.

... and pirayas are imported.


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## CraigStables (Oct 5, 2003)

it has never been done before in the homoe aquarium (unless someone wants to correct me on that...frank?)

It would probably take a fairly large aquarium though as Piraya are meant to get very aggressive when spawning, and recall a couple of members having females killed and found eggs inside them when they cut them open!


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## Judazzz (Jan 13, 2003)

shoe997bed263 said:


> i know that it must be possible to breed them or we would not have any but i mean in a home aq


 All piraya available are wild-caught...

A few people have witnessed what they'd explain as pre-breeding behaviour, but so far all experiments and attempts that I know of had to be aborted prematurely, due to extreme agression and the fear of loosing fish.
I bet it's possible, but I guess it requires atank of a size well beyond the reach of the average hobbyist.


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## KrazyCrusader (Oct 26, 2004)

Judazzz said:


> All piraya available are wild-caught...
> 
> A few people have witnessed what they'd explain as pre-breeding behaviour, but so far all experiments and attempts that I know of had to be aborted prematurely, due to extreme agression and the fear of loosing fish.
> I bet it's possible, but I guess it requires atank of a size well beyond the reach of the average hobbyist.
> [snapback]771615[/snapback]​


I do believe that SC is currently experimenting with Breeding Piraya in a 100 Gallon tank. I'll try and find out from him but it's not something that can be easily duplicated. I know he said there was some aggression.


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## HOLLYWOOD (Feb 6, 2003)

I attempted breeding piraya a year ago read through the following thread *Piraya Breeding Project*.

Cliffs:

1. Bought the pair from Knifeman 10 and 10 1/2".
2. Housed them in a 90 gal tank 18" wide.
3. They twirled in circles (aggressive behaviour) both sustaining battle wounds.
4. Added a third piraya but same aggressive result.
5. Ended breeding project for fear that aggressive behaviour would be fatal.

Further undocumented findings:

1. Lost the largest piraya through cannibalism and found egg clusters throughout the tank with some still lodged in its midsection. 
2. Lost second knifeman piraya through cannibalism.
3. As a result I concluded that although piraya fall under the same pygocentrus species, I do not recommend shoaling with other pygo species. Theres probably a reason why Piraya is the only pygocentrus species found in the Rio Sao Francisco river ( correct me if im wrong).
4. Preffered breeding pair would have to be larger than 11" and housed in a tank with a larger than 3' width , half with plants and driftwood other half bare.


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## hastatus (Jan 16, 2003)

Hollywood is correct on all counts. A 100 gallon is not suitable and unrealistic for a large species as P. piraya. But to each their own.

No public records exist of breeding P. piraya. However, there is a fish farm and 1 research facility that has bred them using native water and sexual maturity, respectively. No different from what you would find here in the States in DNR facilities that breed salmon or trout. It remains unknown to me if the fish farm is producing small piraya for the market, but it would not surprize me if they are.

When you try to breed a large species (as piraya is) use a large tank not a small mind.


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## KrazyCrusader (Oct 26, 2004)

Edited by Hastatus:

Lets keep references to other members from other boards who have been banned off P-FURY whether their accomplishments are real or imagined.


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## KrazyCrusader (Oct 26, 2004)

Sorry Frank. I didn't realize


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## KrazyCrusader (Oct 26, 2004)

Some things that might make this project a success if someone tried it.

Controlling the water conditions and simulating a wet/dry season.

Housing the Piraya in a large tank "300 Gallon"

Getting 6+ Piraya at a young age and growing them out together. It would increase the chances of a pair being found.

I think that this is a species that will probably be bred in the not so distant future and there are plenty of talented individuals on P-Fury that will undoubtably have success with it.


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## KrazyCrusader (Oct 26, 2004)

KrazyCrusader said:


> Some things that might make this project a success if someone tried it.
> 
> Controlling the water conditions and simulating a wet/dry season.
> 
> ...


Hollywood have you given any thought to trying again to breed the Piraya?


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## hastatus (Jan 16, 2003)

> Controlling the water conditions and simulating a wet/dry season.


This is not a silver bullet because it is not always the key to successful breeding of any species, though it does "in theory" help.

300 g's is to small of an aquario and Hollywood and I have discussed this in person and in his home. Just because you know how to drive a car doesn't mean you know the mechanics behind what makes an engine run. So it is with breeding any species of fish. Some are predisposed to breed prolifically. S. maculatus and P. nattereri come to mind in that regard. S. rhombeus a riverine fish is also prolific because of the amount of water it is found in. Though you the home aquarist will be hard pressed to have the space needed to have them spawn like that.

Pygocentrus piraya is a large species and you can have 100's of them but there is no guarantee they will pair off and if they do, there is no guarantee they will breed. Tis' a fool who thinks they have all the answers or can talk the fish to do it just for them.









I hope Hollywood does try again and uses what he has learned from past successes with P. nattereri. They are the same genus, just need a slight variation of requirements. There is nothing scientific about it, just luck and perseverence.


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## MR HARLEY (Aug 12, 2003)

KrazyCrusader said:


> Some things that might make this project a success if someone tried it.
> 
> Controlling the water conditions and simulating a wet/dry season.
> 
> ...


I wonder where that was copy and pasted from ..........










> Tis' a fool who thinks they have all the answers or can talk the fish to do it just for them.


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## KrazyCrusader (Oct 26, 2004)

MR HARLEY said:


> I wonder where that was copy and pasted from ..........:laugh:


Copy and pasted from??








Just because I have an interest in the breeding of Piranha's and offered one suggestion?

I spent days reading through and taking notes from over 16 Pages of PIranha Fury breeding threads and learning from the people who had practical knowlege and actual experience compare their results to Piranha Experts.
I spent time reading information posted from Frank on his website listing factual information about the fish.

Reading countless articles about breeding various species of fresh water fish and what tricks have increased the chances of a successfull spawn.

Look I haven't bred any fish myself yet. It will be a long time before I have the oppurtunity to take on this task myself. I simply don't have the space to buy huge tanks and stock them with Hundreds of dollars worth of fish that could all end up killing each other over night and leave me with nothing.

There is no need to take shots at me. I never claimed to be on the Piranha-Fury's Breeding Team. They were just suggestions. If the only reason you posted was just to be a jerk then just shut up. If it was meant to be a joke and I should be laughing then I guess it's hard to convey your sense of humor into a text form of communication, but I guess you can ignore me telling you to shut up.


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## MR HARLEY (Aug 12, 2003)

It was a Joke KC, are you still takeing your medication ? (see that was another joke)
Oh yeah those threads you read , I have seen them too


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## KrazyCrusader (Oct 26, 2004)

MR HARLEY said:


> It was a Joke KC, are you still takeing your medication ? (see that was another joke)
> Oh yeah those threads you read , I have seen them too
> 
> 
> ...


You've been around here along time! I assumed you would have.










I'm going to try and create a thread for an update on all the current breeding projects people are working on.


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## hastatus (Jan 16, 2003)

Be nice folks. Only I'm entitled to "see through things here".


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## 33truballa33 (Oct 18, 2004)

...........nevermind.... didnt mean to make the cook upset


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## hastatus (Jan 16, 2003)

> 33truballa33 Posted Today, 09:40 AM
> very good info has been put out in this thread but i dont see how one can fault a person from trying to do something that has never been done. and because it hasnt been done i dont really see how one can put labels on what conditions n criteria must be met.* i kno who u are talking about* when u said "Tis' a fool who thinks they have all the answers or can talk the fish to do it just for them." by no means does the person i _ASSUME you're tlaking about claim to have all the answers. what he does is a lot of research and tries to duplicate what he finds in captivity. yes i kno people don't agree with what he has done in the past and some of his methods or what not but people have to realize that if things arent tried they will never be accomplished. ahha its a real easy thing to comprehend but seems like people forget this. humans have been able to become the dominant species on earth by adapting and ultimately learning from their mistakes and learning from failures. that is the premis that his projects are based on. to further inhance the hobby and knowledge of breeding. if one is faulted or heavily critized for trying to do that i have nothing to say. yes tehre is a lot that i was not on the board to experience that you guys may have during the past, but people make mistakes and have disagreements. its not that hard to forgive and move on.. seriously if some people on here worked together so much could be accomplished its almost sad to see such division amongst such knowledgable and passionate hobbyist. and thas my .02 cents
> _


_

My remarks were NOT aimed at anyone specific but general terms to anyone that thinks just because you find a ton of environmental data doesn't mean you have the answers to what makes a species breed. It is more complex than that.

However, since you chose to perhaps make a connection I will say this. Hollywood and many other people in this forum and outside of PFURY have been breeding piranas for quite a few years. The person you have been "hinting at" has been in the hobby for less than 3 years and his knowledge base is what is found on the internet and scientific documents that he has little skill to decipher. Reminds me of a used car saleman.









Lastly, his opinions are limited to a species that breeds at/near the same level of experience as P. nattereri. While this is a good thing as it gives out more data on what conditions this person used for his success, that by itself is no great accomplishment other than in your own mind. Breeding Serrasalmus species such as the one used by this individual is rather well reported over the last 20 or so years and documented by public aquarios as well as by semi-professional breeders who have taken the time to explore breeding this particular species. They are not in great demand as a whole species. Rather P. nattereri is, since that is the most common species and "cheaper" overall to buy and manage in groups. In conclusion, if you are unhappy that notoriety is not being given to this great accomplishment (again this is solely what is in your own mind) perhaps you should stick to the breeding forum that best suits you.

This forum is less ego-based than sharing methods that work. So my suggestion to you again is, if you don't like the cook, find another kitchen.







_


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## MR HARLEY (Aug 12, 2003)

Great Move 33balla...


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## hastatus (Jan 16, 2003)

Gotta watch these Martha Stewart-types.


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## Winkyee (Feb 17, 2003)

hastatus said:


> In conclusion, if you are unhappy that notoriety is not being given to this great accomplishment (again this is solely what is in your own mind) perhaps you should stick to the breeding forum that best suits you.
> 
> This forum is less ego-based than sharing methods that work. So my suggestion to you again is, *if you don't like the cook, find another kitchen*.
> 
> ...


You knocked that up a notch









View attachment 40825


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## MR HARLEY (Aug 12, 2003)

winkyee said:


> You knocked that up a notch
> 
> 
> 
> ...










.............Spicey!!!!!!!!!1


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## mantis (May 16, 2003)




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## KrazyCrusader (Oct 26, 2004)

mantis said:


> [snapback]797772[/snapback]​


About your Sig Mantis..

"I don't believe in voodoo" "But I believe in this" ->Loki

-Dogma


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