# question about monitors



## Lifer374 (Dec 5, 2003)

looking at buying a baby savannah.
is this a good monitor for beginners?
is there another species that is more suitable for me to start out with?


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## Polypterus (May 4, 2003)

That depends alot on your prior experiance with other reptiles,
No Monitor is truly a begginers lizard,

but with a good amount of experiance in other reptiles, 
then yes a savannah is a good beginner monitor species
to work with.


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## CrocKeeper (Dec 26, 2003)

> That depends alot on your prior experiance with other reptiles,
> No Monitor is truly a begginers lizard,
> 
> but with a good amount of experiance in other reptiles,
> ...


The varanids definately offer some of the most fascinating captives, but as well stated above not great beginners lizards. I will go one farther and say that many species should not be kept unless the keeper has extensive experience first.

V. exanthematicus is a decent species as it is a fairly mellow lizard, but it does grow to considerable size, and it is capable of delivering one hell of a bite. Also as 90% of the savannas offered are wild collected animals, I suggest that if you are looking to keep monitors, Look for captively produced animals such as V. timorensis.


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## BoomerSub (Jun 23, 2003)

I am hesitant to recommend a species as I have little experience with varanids. However, I will suggest that you stay away from _V. niloticus_, the Nile monitor (large, ill-tempered), _V. salvator_, the Asian water monitor (too large), and _V.salvadorii_, the crocodile monitor (large, ill-tempered, delicate). All of the tree monitors tend to be quite delicate as well.

-PK


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## Polypterus (May 4, 2003)

CrocKeeper said:


> > That depends alot on your prior experiance with other reptiles,
> > No Monitor is truly a begginers lizard,
> >
> > but with a good amount of experiance in other reptiles,
> ...


Thats kind of what I said Croc, on experience level,

But you do bring up a point I did not, that being the need to
seek captive bred animals, Defininty a captive bred V. timorensis
would be much better than a wild V. exanthematicus any day,

These animals are often cost prohibitive unfortunatly to the average
individual, which naturally brings cheap imports into favor..

I see this partially a fault of those who breed these animals and
massivly overinflate the value of the animal for personal wealth
Rather than for any conservation effort.

Being in the reptile Breeding Biz on a different level I see it well
how prolific many of the "Rare" lizards really are, Surplus is a
constant problem.

Prices on some of these animals are un-nessesearlly High and beyond
the reach of the average person,

This makes wild caught half dead junk attractive,

This is a cultural change that really needs to take place in the Herp Hobby,
Captive bred should be cheaper, Wild caught should be more expensive.


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## CrocKeeper (Dec 26, 2003)

> This is a cultural change that really needs to take place in the Herp Hobby,
> Captive bred should be cheaper, Wild caught should be more expensive.


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## sweet lu (Oct 3, 2003)

CrocKeeper said:


> > This is a cultural change that really needs to take place in the Herp Hobby,
> > Captive bred should be cheaper, Wild caught should be more expensive.


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## rbp75 (May 2, 2004)

I would say the best beginner monitor would be the ackie


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## Puddjuice (Mar 11, 2004)

Ok, not to put any one down here or offend them. How do we all learn about animals, we look at articals, information, care sheets. But they don't always help you. For instence, I bought my hedgehog with a little background info. I knew about them and how to house them. But when I get him he was mean as hell. The book I had/had no treatmeants for this. He was a picky eater, the stuff they said in the book didn't work. The only way you are going to ever really learn is by owning the animal. Some may disagree but it is somewhat true. But always know what you are getting into.


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## CrocKeeper (Dec 26, 2003)

> Ok, not to put any one down here or offend them. How do we all learn about animals, we look at articals, information, care sheets. But they don't always help you. For instence, I bought my hedgehog with a little background info. I knew about them and how to house them. But when I get him he was mean as hell. The book I had/had no treatmeants for this. He was a picky eater, the stuff they said in the book didn't work. The only way you are going to ever really learn is by owning the animal. Some may disagree but it is somewhat true. But always know what you are getting into.


This same logic translates that you should not tell someone who is bolemic it is bad for them unless you give bolemea a go, or suicide maybe, or drug use....

By your logic then, it would be best for someone who wished to keep big cats to just go out and buy one, learn on the fly...or bears, or venomous snakes....if you want a bunch of dead keepers, yep that would be one way to go about it.

We learn through articles, yes, caresheets, not so often, information yes, books, yes, formal education and volumes of personal communication. Does that mean everything in print is correct, hell no. That is why you do serious homework and read VOLUMES of information, research VOLUMES of articles, and not just common periodicals, but peer reviewed journals, etc... One must seriously undertake a commitment to sifting through all the crap many times. It is very important to realize also that there may be more than one way to successfully house and maintain a species. 
Keeping is to some degree a process of trial and error for many keepers, as they lose animals and learn why they did, and hopefully learn from such mistakes. But should an animal pay for its life through such a misinformed approach to captive husbandry? I strongly disagree.

Mnay times it is very possible to find excellent information for the keeping and propagation of exotic species by looking out side our own country for information, as we have been keeping and breeding many taxa far less time than other countries....


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## Puddjuice (Mar 11, 2004)

Ok I am not one to argue and I don't want to but I have only lost a Fire Belly Newt and a Red Belly Piranha. They newt was because he wasn't eating and the piranha was from another piranha. So I have never let a animal die of lack of food, light, temperature or resourses. I feel I maintain my reps well. I will admit that when I bought my Emerald Swift I had very little knoledge on them.


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## CrocKeeper (Dec 26, 2003)

Pudd, 
I believe you do take good care of your animals as best as you realize how to. I also think it is marvelous you have a growing desire to keep them. It is imperative however that one really takes time to absorb knowledge from all types of places, as well as learn from watching your captives. The handling is common to new keepers, heck that is why you got a ball python I am sure aside from the price range, it is a docile handleable species, unfortunately as I have said in several threads and as Poly has stated in a thread, this species in particular does POORLY if overhandled, unfortunately the pet stores often times neglect to mention that.
I am also glad to see that you have a low mortality rate, that will change if you keep animals for any length of time, as the sad truth of the matter is many animals die, ESPECIALLY improperly acclimated wild caught species commonly available through the pet stores. 
Make sure you offer your emerald swift plenty of good quality UV lighting.
Conyinue doing the excellent job you are doing, and asking excellent questions, and always remember to enjoy your captives!!!!


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