# 240G planted tank log



## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

Well it took me a while to get all this equipment together and functioning but the journey is still far from over. Thought I would post some pictures. It is not perfect but it is a start. I am going to need your help and knowledge in the near future to overcome some of the frustration that lies ahead.


















































































I have since cleaned the algae on the glass. It was caused by my main lights. they are off now. Trying to figure out the correct balance of CO2 and nutrients for the amount of light without lots of algae. What is the cause dark green algae on the smaller java moss. That plant is right under my moonlight, could that be the problem. I don't have the proper test kits for planted aquariums. I will get them on wednesday and will post some parameters. The light grey powder on the driftwood some plants fromt the substrate settling. it took a day to clear up.


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## spreerider (Jul 15, 2004)

you should tie the anubias onto a pice of driftwood or a rock it does better without its roots in the substrate and u should keep its rhizome above the sand.


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## EZmoney (May 13, 2004)

that is looking real nice so far!









what happened to the big rock and cave?


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

I took the rock and the cave out to put in new substrate and some how it didn't end up getting put back in. Time will tell i guess. My fish are getting bigger and more swimming space is probably better.

whats a "rhizone?" I am guessing it is the stem the leaves and roots grow off of.


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## spree_rider (Mar 20, 2004)

divine said:


> whats a "rhizone?" I am guessing it is the stem the leaves and roots grow off of.


yes it is


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

divine said:


> Well it took me a while to get all this equipment together and functioning but the journey is still far from over. Thought I would post some pictures. It is not perfect but it is a start. I am going to need your help and knowledge in the near future to overcome some of the frustration that lies ahead.
> 
> I have since cleaned the algae on the glass. It was caused by my main lights. they are off now. Trying to figure out the correct balance of CO2 and nutrients for the amount of light without lots of algae. What is the cause dark green algae on the smaller java moss. That plant is right under my moonlight, could that be the problem. I don't have the proper test kits for planted aquariums. I will get them on wednesday and will post some parameters. The light grey powder on the driftwood some plants fromt the substrate settling. it took a day to clear up.


The dark green algea might be bacteria, if it is a film. You can tell if you can wipe it away easily, and it smells. If not, yes it is an imbalance. Algea is normal for a new tank.

I would like for you to describe your tank in ful, from size of tank to what filter you are using, how much ferts, what kind, lights, everything.
We can't help without that info.

Looks good, but I, personally, would put WAY more plants in there. Especially if you have higher light and CO2. Every single time I have started a tank, it caused much grief to start a tank with less plants.
Also, there looks to be a nutrient defficiency in there, plants seem to be yellowing, and loosing vigor. Beginners should use some test kits until you know how to read the plants. You might want to get a nitrAte, phosphate, pH, and KH test kit. N and P are the most important.


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

My setup

-240 gallon with two overflows with 2" drains. Inside each overflow is a pipe with a U on top to keep the water level one inch lower than the tank level. This prevents the water from being too agitated. 
-54 gallon sump with 15 gallons of bio media and mechanical filteration. 1200 gallons per hours returned to the main tank
-400 watts of heat (26 degrees celcius)
-15 watt UV sterilizer (700 gallons per hour)
-5 lb CO2 with a reactor designed for up to 500 gallon tanks (12 hours, on the same timer as the lights)
-three 25watt 5000 K floresents (12 hours)
-three 25watt 8000 K floresents (12 hours)
-three 175 watt 6500 K MH (8 hours, not being used right now)
-15 bags of Seachem Black Onyx Sand
-One watt moonlight

-Eleven RBP who have no clue how good they have it.

I agree i need more plants. I want to have both corners planted and the space inbetween carpeted. I can't find a suitable carpet plant in calgary right now.

I have a NH4, NO2, NO3, and PH test kit. I am going to buy a KH kit to determine the CO2 ppm. I will get a Phosphate kit also well. Do i need a kit for Fe.

Is Phosphate the only thing i am going to have to dose or will i need Fe and K as well.


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

well, nice and big tank. If you get problems, there goes a weekend if you wanna really clean it out, but great tank.
Here is my .02$
You have lots of light, almost 3wpg, so ..wow, MH bulbs are very bright. You need more plants if you ask me pronto. just get any cheap plants and pack 'em in there.. plant mass is crucial.(again, if you ask me)
My friend has a 125 with a sump, and he goes through CO2 like mad. prepare to get it refilled a lot. In that tank, keep CO2 @ 30ppm. make sure the bubbles from CO2 are getting blown all over the tank with the waterflow. IF the CO2 don't get everywhere, problems are sure to follow. I personally might consider 2 diffusers, 1 on each side.
I don't think you will need a Fe test kit. I dose almost 10ml a day in my 75. You will go through MAD ferts in your tank, better get aquainted with www.gregwatson.com.
keep an eye on nitrates, keep in between 10-25 at all times! this being the case, I would get potassium nitrate, just in case. 
You will need a micro fert, like flourish comprehensive, or tropica master grow. ~240g... get CSM+B from greg. It will save u $$ bigtime, but not as good. eh, I use it.
flourish iron will be good to use.. iron chelate from greg is good, not as good of quality as flourish, but again.. with your setup.. u will save here.
mono potassium phosphate from greg is a must. keep low though, 
-without bottoming out!- .5-2ppm
potassium sulfate will be good to use too. 
Even though u will be dosing good if you get these things in your water, you will have to find a happy medium that the tank will respond well to.
this could take some time.. and work.. and patience.
the end result to me, is def. worth it.


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## spree_rider (Mar 20, 2004)

for a good carpet plant i like micro chain swords, they grow fast and easy fill in very nicely and can be quite small and carpet like if under high lighting.... withe your setup you might have trouble seeing them...


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

Sorry it has been such a long time between posts. Here is the low down. I went away for a month and my sister took care off my tank. Added a lot of amazon swords which have produced 20 new swords so far. She did well but forgot to dose ferts the last week. Away it hurt my plants a little.

water parameters are

no3 20 to 50 ppm
K is unknown as i couldn't find a test kit, but i dosed K anyways. 
FE chelated is close to zero so i added two doses of that
KH is 100 mg/l caco3 (6 degrees of hardness)
gh is 240 mg/l caco3
po4 is .25 ppm so i added the correct dose to being it is .5
ph is about 7.4

I am shooting for 25 ppm co2, 25 ppm no3, .5 ppm FE (unsure if i am after chelated or not). CO is low but i am working on it. I upped the bubble rate and fixed one of the over flows to stop it aireating the water as much. and sealed the sump. I have read a lot lately and I think i can put this off. It is just going to cost a lot in fertilizers. For now i am using seachem but once i get the hang of it i am going to gregg watson ferts.

I will try and get some pictures in the next few days.


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

Already that plants look a lot better. Had some "pearling" action last night. it was amazing to actually see oxygen being given off by the plants.


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

hows the tank doing?

if it was my tank, I would add way more plants, to balance things out.. but that is my opinion


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

Ran out of CO2 while away for a week and well the glass was a little green but not the water. thank you UV sterilizer. Getting the CO2 turned on again tomorrow. Other than that things are going well. Seem to be able to keep about 20-25 ppm of CO2. Water parameters seem to be stable. I have been keeping a journal of everything. I might start posting it. Been using seachem ferts but i realized the beginner dose will not even come close to what i need. Ordered a lot of ferts from greg watson. Plants have grown a lot and seem to be spreading. i will post som pictures hopefully tomorrow.

How do you test for potassium?


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

Should i be monitoring calcium and why?


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## BigChuckP (Feb 9, 2004)

What I would do:
1. Get an account on www.aquaticplantcentral.com, they have a fertilizing calculator that will help you understand better what you are dosing. It's called the fertilator.

2. Try the Estimative Index (EI) dosing technique, doesn't require you to test your params, practically ever. I dose every week in total 20ppm of KNO3, .2PPM of Iron (start at .1 and watch plants, I had to up it), 2PPM of phosphate, 20PPM of K, and dose micros as follows...I take a tablespoon of CSM+B and mix it in 250ml of hot water and dose 9ml 4 times per week. You should dose 4ml from that mix per 10 gallons and dose that 3 times per week (I have changed my dosing a bit from this), so dose 96ml from that mix 3 times per week and watch your plants to see how they are growing, if they look like they need more micros, up it a bit, and see what happens.

3. How do you test for potassium? Get a test kit...? I would just try the EI dosing technique which would eliminate the need to test your params unless you have a sudden algae outbreak or something.

EDIT:

4. Get more plants! Buy some Hornwort, Anarcharis, Watersprite, wisteria, Rotala indica, or hygro which are fast growing plants.

5. For a carpet get E. Tenellus, dwarf sag, or dwarf hairfgrass, E. Tenellus is a fast grower so you might want to go with that.

6. Post some more pics!


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

Thanks for the links. Things seem alright today. going to buy some more plants next time the lfs gets some. Got my order from Greg watson. seems like a good product. time will tell i guess. The site needs a better way to upload pictures.


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

wow, man.. when you get this tank settled in, and balanced right.. it will be incredible!

it is huge! Is the algea getting any better? again.. tank looks great, can't wait to see it when you are comming down home stretch!

Great post, chuck!


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## BigChuckP (Feb 9, 2004)

divine said:


> wow, man.. when you get this tank settled in, and balanced right.. it will be incredible!
> 
> it is huge! Is the algea getting any better? again.. tank looks great, can't wait to see it when you are comming down home stretch!
> 
> Great post, chuck!


Thanks!


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

Sorry, I meant to say thanks to chuck as well but i got frustrated with uploading pictures and forgot. I checked out those links today. The fertilator is a very powerful tool. I used APC to learn some names of plants. Going to go buy another 100 dollars in plant hopefully tomorrow or friday and fill in a few more areas. Algae seems to be under control. After about a week there is a litte of the glass but not thick at all, just in a few spots along the bottom. I am learing a lot. I have my sump covered and sealed up with tape. One of the biggest challenges i have faced was the CO. with the overflows and the aireation of the sump is was had to get the over 10 ppm at first but by getting the height of the u tube just right and covering the sump, and adjusting the pump and CO2 reactor i was at 25 ppm till the tank run out. Well I am probably babbling by now. I am tried and going to bed.

Thanks for everyone's help.


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

Can't wait to see this tank after a few months .. gonna be sweet


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## 33truballa33 (Oct 18, 2004)

wow that is insane... nice work man look forward to seeing pics in a few months


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

bought $100 in plants today and some algae eating shrimp (hopefully they hide in the plants from the RBP). more swords, anubias, and e.tellenus. tested and dosed ferts. I am going to bed. will post specifics on ferts tomorrow. There isn't a kit for K and i don't know if i should be watching Ca. Is that only for SW? If not. what kind of levels should i be keeping?


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## black_piranha (Jan 12, 2006)

besides the problems u had, u have a nice setup.


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## BigChuckP (Feb 9, 2004)

divine said:


> bought $100 in plants today and some algae eating shrimp (hopefully they hide in the plants from the RBP). more swords, anubias, and e.tellenus. tested and dosed ferts. I am going to bed. will post specifics on ferts tomorrow. There isn't a kit for K and i don't know if i should be watching Ca. Is that only for SW? If not. what kind of levels should i be keeping?


Personally I don't test for K, I simply dose 20ppm per week, which is said to be the highest ppm one should have, which is what the EI system recommends. I am trying to do as the "experts" do and just watch my plants and see what they tell me. When you see your leaves turn clear or yellow that is usually a sign of a lack or iron, k, or micros...sorry I can't be clearer, I'll try to find the answer, I think dippy said it in a post recently. 
I've never dosed calcium before or tested for it, it has something to do with GH, it should only be a concern if your water is extremely soft or hard...do you know?


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

Started to use the greg watson fertilizers. Working good so far. I am using 500ml nalgene containers to mix and store solution it. Leaves are being produced so fast now i can cut off any leave that is damaged without feeling bad. The tank is 24 inches tall and the swords are getting over half way on the left side. I will probably get rid of the jungle val in the next few days. The e. tenellus and the swords are also producing new plants like crazy.


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## ~Silly~Spy (Mar 12, 2005)

wow looks really good man!


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## BigChuckP (Feb 9, 2004)

Tank looks awesome! I'm glad your getting good growth results! Can you get a full tank shot?
Do your rbps uproot a lot of plants or are they pretty mild with them?
Remeber to stay on top of the algae!


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

It is really hard to get a good shot of the whole tank. I have trouble reflections with a flash and problems with clarity without. The rbp don't see to uproot anything. At first they did while plants were developing roots.

My nitrates are a little high right now which i think is causing the algae. I started the cucumber method to get rid of the snails today. Hope it works.

I work out of town more about 50% percent of the time. I am in town right now for a few weeks. So this is a good chance for me to iron out a few problems and post some picture. I know you are probably wondering how i take care of this tank while i am out of town. I pay one of my firends who is into aquariums comes by twice a week to do a small water change and balance the ferts. $20 a visit. He is in school so he is happy and i am happy cause my tank stays nice.

Thanks for the interest and the help.


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## benJii (Feb 17, 2005)

Awsome tank, divine, although, lose the loser piranhas, and get yourself some real fish, like discus. like 12-24 Discus in that tank would be the shiznit!


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## Winkyee (Feb 17, 2003)

That is a sweet looking tank .. Nice job


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## Round Head (Sep 26, 2005)

WOW!!! What a great improvement. I like it alot.
What types of plants are you stocking bro.?
I am in progress to start on up now.
Do you have any snails or cleanup crew?
Does your p's harrass and trim the plants at all?


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## pyrokingbrand (Nov 30, 2004)

Your tank looks fantastic! I think you have made some excellent improvements over what you began with! Keep up the good work!


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

looking great!! nice growth!

~sweet


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## Wussola (Jan 25, 2006)

Beautiful tank!!


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

the RBP leave the plants allow for the most part. They taste the leaves of the swords sometimes. I got some algae eating shrimp a while ago. half of them were snacks due to the fact that they like to swim across the surface. The other half ended up in the sump. I have a snail infestation which i am trying to cure but i seem to be loosing that battle. Tried the cucumber method, but not a lot of success, I was told to try zuccini, It was also suggested to remove all plants and use copper sulfate, but I don't want to uproot all the plants. There are 2 2" plecos which seem to be happy and hide in the plants. As for plants: mainly Amazon swords, some java moss on the drift wood, e.tenellus which i am trying to use are a carpet, Some Jungle val that is doing very well lot of new runner, two hydgos, some anubius, and two of the same plant but i can't remember the name. I am not sure the Piranhas like the plants cause they are getting thick and taking up their swimming space. I have been thinking about thinning out the shoal a little or maybe getting 4 or 5 serra. geryi. Don't know yet. Going to do some work tonight. I will post some more pictures tonight or tomorrow.


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## BigChuckP (Feb 9, 2004)

divine said:


> the RBP leave the plants allow for the most part. They taste the leaves of the swords sometimes. I got some algae eating shrimp a while ago. half of them were snacks due to the fact that they like to swim across the surface. The other half ended up in the sump. I have a snail infestation which i am trying to cure but i seem to be loosing that battle. Tried the cucumber method, but not a lot of success, I was told to try zuccini, It was also suggested to remove all plants and use copper sulfate, but I don't want to uproot all the plants. There are 2 2" plecos which seem to be happy and hide in the plants. As for plants: mainly Amazon swords, some java moss on the drift wood, e.tenellus which i am trying to use are a carpet, Some Jungle val that is doing very well lot of new runner, two hydgos, some anubius, and two of the same plant but i can't remember the name. I am not sure the Piranhas like the plants cause they are getting thick and taking up their swimming space. I have been thinking about thinning out the shoal a little or maybe getting 4 or 5 serra. geryi. Don't know yet. Going to do some work tonight. I will post some more pictures tonight or tomorrow.


Raphael catfish eat snails, are nocturnal, have heavy armor, and bark when attacked which makes them awesome with piranhas


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)




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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

nice growth







plants are doing great..

I personally would replant the tank, and do a nice big waterchange after I was done.. I would put the tall plants towards the back, and smaller ones more up front, but that is how I would do it

Isn't it about time you snipped those reproducing swords, and planted them? LOL


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

Some new pictures. I know my ghetto light fixture needs to go . . . And well maybe the chair too. Plants are still doing well. I never really planned anything when planting them so they are kinda all over the place. When i get the motivation I am going to net out my rbp and put them in Rubbermaids along with my plants and kill all the snails with copper sulfate, then change the water in the main tank and i replant with some thought (I have the ability to run water over my bio media with the main tank off line so i can take my sweet time and still have 54 gallons of old water and a cycled filter).

Edit:

Dippy you beat me at the second part of my reply which was basically the same thing you are thinking. Ohh and the new swords. I am waiting for a buddy to come and pick them up for his tank. There are about 20 right now.


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## Round Head (Sep 26, 2005)

Very nice improvement.
Oh oh, what type of snails are you having problems with?
Are they eating your plants or what?
Were they purposely put in the tank or carried through by the plants?


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

I don't know what kind they are. The biggest one in smaller than a dime. Must of had a few snails or an egg sack ride in on the plants. They don't do anything just annoy me. They don't eat the plants and they don't seem to clena the glass either.

you can see them on glass in some of the pictures.


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## BigChuckP (Feb 9, 2004)

I'm jealous of your jungle val propogation! I have 7 or so j vals and none of them have propogated even though all my other plants are growing like weeds! Is there anything special your doing to them?
Do your ps ever swim around in the plants? 
Your tank looks like it is doing amazing, keep doing what your doing!

EDIT: Some of the leaves on the Jungle vals are turning red which looks pretty cool, I didn't know that happened with them, have yours shown any red?


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

I am not doing anything special with the Jungle Val. It grows like crazy. inches per day. Noticed about a week ago the runner on both sides of the tank. All of the plant have runners of some kind.

Basically I change the water 10% twice a week. I used to test parameters twice a week but now I test less often. I dose twice a week N-K-P, CSM+B (makes the water a little cloudy) from greg watson. I have them premixed in 500 ml bottles with a known strength per ml for the volume of the tank.

Yes my rbp swim in the plants. two of them hang out on the left side next to the drift wood. seven of them next to or under the drift wood on the right side and one in the plants most of the time on the right side. When they get scared they all get together under the drift wood.

they kind of have a two toned color. My lights are off right now so i can't go check. thanks for your interest. Thanks to everyone for your posts.


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## 2PiRaNhA~2FuRrY (Nov 1, 2005)

very very nice growing plants. i love your tank dude! great job.


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## divinelawyer625 (Dec 12, 2005)

I wish that was my tank. Keep up the good work.


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## Xantarc (May 25, 2004)

oh man your big pimping now


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

ya, the snails are not hurting anything that is for sure.. they actually do eat algea, but you really cant notice too much.. I personally would not remove them, but that is me.

Ya, glad to see your plants doing very well!! Post new pics after you rearrange!! -that should look great


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

A little bit about my lighting schedule:

Dawn: 75 watts of 5000k florscent, 75 watts of 8000k florscent for 1.5 hours
Day: 75 watts of 5000k, 75 watts of 8000k, 525 watts of 6500K MH for 9 hours (CO2 injection is also on during this time)
Dusk: 75 watts of 5000k florscent, 75 watts of 8000k florscent for 1.5 hours
Night: 1 watt of blue Moon light for 12 hours.

Nothing else to new and exciting right now.

Are my RBP big enough/old enough to breed? They are a litte over a year old.


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## divine (Jan 3, 2005)

Full tank shot just before i started










People have asked if my piranhas hide in the plants. They don't unsually do this. Only when i am working on the tank










New amazon swords i cut for mature plants. After I picked through them and only kept the ones with good root there were other 30. Planted ten on the right side and gave 10 to a friend, and i have ten more to plant on left side.










The jungle val was getting a little too long. 42"










I took out all of the jungle val and kept the ones in the small pile. I replanted them on the right side behind the swords. I started with about 8 of these plants. There are lot now. I kept about ten










Rearranged the right side. the e. tenellus is starting to take off. I took out the driftwood because it takes up a lot of space the piranhas were staying mainly on one side of the tank. It is a lot more open now and they are fighting less. Also they hide under the driftwood and have created crater in the substrate. I am going to buy two or three more bags to fill it in










I am going to Saint John, New Brunswick tomorrow for work for a little bit so my buddy will be taking care of the tank for the next week or two. Ohh I put 10 algae eating shrimp and two 2" plecos in the tank a few weeks ago. I could only find the one pleco until yesterday. 4 shrimp living in the tank. 4 in the sump. One pleco in the tank.

Enjoy!


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## DiPpY eGgS (Mar 6, 2005)

You need to invest in a chainsaw










Glad you are harvesting


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